OK, I see more often than not people recommending Tiger's Fury for the increased attack speed.
Why?
For Tiger's, non-attack skills disabled for 5 secs, for 5-10 secs attack speed increased by 33%. OK, adequate... but why not use Lightning Reflexes instead?
LR - 5-10 secs, 75% to dodge or evade attackes, attack speed increased 33%.
Thoughts?
For those that know Rangers only...
MSecorsky
AceSnyp3r
Because LR has a 60 second recycle time.
Terik Stoermshade
Recharge time on TF is 10 seconds, Lightning Reflexes is 60 seconds.
The Ages
60 Second Cooldown vs 10 Second Cooldown, While Lighting reflexes is a better skill when it is up it will be down more than oftain unlike Tigers Fury.
MSecorsky
Ah ha... now that makes sense.
However, I tend to always carry SQ and QZ with me... I don't have points thrown into Beast, looking for the benefits without having to do so.
However, I tend to always carry SQ and QZ with me... I don't have points thrown into Beast, looking for the benefits without having to do so.
Thanato
well all you really need is ~4 in BM for it to be effective. that will give you 7 seconds of increaased attack speed, to get to 8 seconds you need to boost it to 7 i believe
Xellos
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
Ah ha... now that makes sense.
However, I tend to always carry SQ and QZ with me... I don't have points thrown into Beast, looking for the benefits without having to do so. |
If you do more complicated math, it's plain obvious Tigers Fury is better, but don't take my word for it, go to other forums, because something as simple as TF vs LR is beneath Gurus sadly. I don't think the majority of players here can argue that effectively even though alot argue really silly things.
Moltov joss
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
OK, I see more often than not people recommending Tiger's Fury for the increased attack speed.
Why? For Tiger's, non-attack skills disabled for 5 secs, for 5-10 secs attack speed increased by 33%. OK, adequate... but why not use Lightning Reflexes instead? LR - 5-10 secs, 75% to dodge or evade attackes, attack speed increased 33%. Thoughts? |
A ranger who uses tigers fury is a dps ranger so most of thier skills will be attack skills or at least one they can spam while QZ is up making TF only a 5 second recharge.
Diomedes
Quote:
| Even with QZ and serpents going Lightning reflexes has something like a 20 second recharge. |
-Diomedes
Kishin
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
Ah ha... now that makes sense.
However, I tend to always carry SQ and QZ with me... I don't have points thrown into Beast, looking for the benefits without having to do so. |
Having 33% attack speed for 7 of every 10 seconds is a lot better than 10 of every 20-30 (And that's with recharge buffs).
Serpent's will act on Lightning if you kick it up while LR is in recharge, I believe. I should test that, though.
Xellos
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Diomedes
Correct me if I'm wrong, but as Serpents and Lightning are both stances, one cannot effect the other, correct? Or does Serpents act on lightning right before ending?
-Diomedes |
MSecorsky
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Xellos
So you use SQ just to use LR? What a waste. Second, You put up QZ, which then requires you to waste 5 seconds and be somewhat immobile in the field of battle. And even then, your LR costs more because of it.
If you do more complicated math, it's plain obvious Tigers Fury is better, but don't take my word for it, go to other forums, because something as simple as TF vs LR is beneath Gurus sadly. I don't think the majority of players here can argue that effectively even though alot argue really silly things. |
Xellos
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
No, no... I got used to carrying it (the SQ) in trapper mode (comes in real handy there) and found that it can be quite useful with some of the bow skills that are a tad slow to rewind. I just never really considered TF because ... well, I never really considered it. Might be reconsidering, but won't admit that here. Actually, in trapper mode, LR serves me well for there are few times I really need it in a trapper group. Well, a good trapper group.
|
MSecorsky
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Xellos
Trappers don't use TF, because they trap. Hybrid Jack of All Trade Rangers use TF because it gives a bigger damage boost then any other single skill. As a trapper in PVE and sometimes PVP, you will never take TF. The best move is not LR, rather Whirling Defense, for at 14 exp, you get the whopping 19 seconds of 75% block. That is more then enough to secure you most of the traps you lay down in the face of a monster. LR serves no real purpose because your not going to attack when your trapping. A trapper relies on traps to kill, not their bow.
|
Diomedes
Quote:
|
Use SQ first, activate TF. It'll take away SQ, but it'll recharge the TF 33% faster in theory. Stack that with QZ, thats 66% faster. Sadly that's still 20.4 seconds, which is 10.4 seconds more then Tigers Fury. A lvl 14 exp LR is only 11 seconds, so that's 9.4 seconds where you aren't hitting faster. The simple math not including the DPS math just plain goes against LR. |
Perhaps I should sit down with a stopwatch today and make sure that I'm clear on things. Someone else suggested that SQ works and skills that are currently recharging. I'd like to try and test that one too.
-Diomedes
MSecorsky
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Diomedes
Gotcha, I wasn't 100% sure on the mechanics of that one as the text is not perfectly clear.
Perhaps I should sit down with a stopwatch today and make sure that I'm clear on things. Someone else suggested that SQ works and skills that are currently recharging. I'd like to try and test that one too. -Diomedes |
Xellos
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
Well, perhaps I'm not doing it right then, but I like to keep Pin Down in the skill bar in case the aataxes break through the trap line just to keep 'em slowed down so others can lay the traps (as do I...) as you said. I suppose with this specific concept in mind, LR works OK, but I can definitely agree on the whirling idea as well.
|
Quote:
| Perhaps I should sit down with a stopwatch today and make sure that I'm clear on things. Someone else suggested that SQ works and skills that are currently recharging. I'd like to try and test that one too. |
MSecorsky
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Xellos
If the Aataxes break away from Spike trap and Barbed Trap, your team is doing something wrong in the first place.
|
Then there was the one guy using pin down while the other guy was pulling... that spread them out nicely...
It happens all to often, but I tend to do mainly PUGs.
Xellos
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
Invariably, somehow the pull gets hosed and an aatax or two lags behind and shows up after most of the traps are popped.
Then there was the one guy using pin down while the other guy was pulling... that spread them out nicely... It happens all to often, but I tend to do mainly PUGs. |
ElderAtronach
If people are bringing pin down to a UW trapper party they are doing things wrong. Barbed trap has a much longer cripple time than pin down anyways. Bring something actually useful vs aatxes, like throw dirt and whirling.
And I completely agree with wards. They will save your ass when you have them up, especially the uber ward vs harm against those annoying terrorweb dryders.
And I completely agree with wards. They will save your ass when you have them up, especially the uber ward vs harm against those annoying terrorweb dryders.
MSecorsky
So with throw dirt and whirling... I trust the effects are cumulative, but how much does it actually reduce the chance of being hit?
Frankly, I can't take too many hits from an aatax.
Plus... does throw dirt outlast Dust trap for blindness? Need to check that...
Frankly, I can't take too many hits from an aatax.
Plus... does throw dirt outlast Dust trap for blindness? Need to check that...
Xellos
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by MSecorsky
So with throw dirt and whirling... I trust the effects are cumulative, but how much does it actually reduce the chance of being hit?
Frankly, I can't take too many hits from an aatax. |
So in game mechanics, with whirling, aegis, and melee, this is how it goes.
Dice roll for Aegis, 50% chance.
If it rolls past Aegis then:
Dice roll for Melee Ward, 50% chance.
If it rolls past Melee Ward then:
Dice roll for Whirling Defense, 75% chance.
My math sucks, and it'd be nice if someone could explain how you calculate the total, but let's just say it's less then 25% by a significant amount.
MSecorsky
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Xellos
It doesn't stack, but it goes consecutively.
So in game mechanics, with whirling, aegis, and melee, this is how it goes. Dice roll for Aegis, 50% chance. If it rolls past Aegis then: Dice roll for Melee Ward, 50% chance. If it rolls past Melee Ward then: Dice roll for Whirling Defense, 75% chance. My math sucks, and it'd be nice if someone could explain how you calculate the total, but let's just say it's less then 25% by a significant amount. |
Hmm, me likey.
Diomedes
Quote:
|
Dice roll for Aegis, 50% chance. If it rolls past Aegis then: Dice roll for Melee Ward, 50% chance. If it rolls past Melee Ward then: Dice roll for Whirling Defense, 75% chance. |
Blind is 90% and whirling is 75, so:
1/10 * 1/4 = 1/40 or .025 -> 2.5% chance of hitting.
That said, bladeds seem to hit me more often than that, so I'm not sure if they've got some special, "see sorta well in the dark" property going for 'em.
-Diomedes