Say this word out loud:
"EULA"
What does this term mean? You may recognize it. It resides in the world of Guild Wars that we all love and enjoy. It is called the "End-User-License-Agreement".
Ring any bells? It should, for you see, every piece of software you have installed on your computer comes with this neat little document. It has a purpose beyond eratta. It actually has meaning. Check it out sometime.
What the EULA is, in essence, is a legal letter of information for you the "user of a software program" that, while you purchased a license to use, access, and install, uninstall, reinstall the program, you DO NOT own the god damn software. No, sorry, it may stick in your craw to hear it, but you are not the title,deed, or shareholder in Ncsoft's property. You are basically a lease-holder on permanent software rental. You have permission to use THEIR software, not own it.
I bring all this lovely lore to the limelight because, it seems that at LEAST 50% of posters on these and many other forums cannot grasp what the EULA means in legal, and common sense terms.
The arguments range from "I bought the game I have the right to bot" to "I bought the game, so why am I banned for using it how I see fit?"
YOU DO NOT OWN YOUR COPY OF GUILD WARS, YOU OWN THE RIGHT TO ACCESS THE CONTENT IN THE BOX.
They spent millions of dollars on thechnology, the staff, the dev team, the paperclips, the marketing, the executives, the previews, the E3 spots, the website, and it goes on and on and on. You spent roughly $60 or so. You, my friend, are not special. You are simply a guest in their playground.
Yes, the EULA is a LEGAL, BINDING DOCUMENT that states what your rights as a user ARE. It is legal. So no, buying the game does not mean you own it. It means you own a responsibility as a consumer, gamer, and human to follow the rules.
"Field Dressing Mass Misconceptions"
SOT
Sereng Amaranth
Thank you.
/signed (fwiw)
/signed (fwiw)
Damon Windwalker
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
The arguments range from "I bought the game I have the right to bot" to "I bought the game, so why am I banned for using it how I see fit?" |
In fact, the only coversations I see that are close to either of these are the (far too numerous) conversations about buying eBay gold. Everything else I see is discussion/debate about the direction of the game, and how various people think it can be improved.
Aracos79
Off-topic: The first thing that jumped in my head after reading that was Tyler Durden from "Fight Club". "You are not special... we are the all singing, all dancing crap of the world". 
On-topic: While the EULA may govern all activity in the game world, it still can't stop botters/farmers/average joe's from doing things outside the game world like sell gold/items on eBay. Sure the transfers take place IN the game world, and if ANet catches them they can ban you. But that ain't going to stop the eBay gravy train any time soon.
On-topic: While the EULA may govern all activity in the game world, it still can't stop botters/farmers/average joe's from doing things outside the game world like sell gold/items on eBay. Sure the transfers take place IN the game world, and if ANet catches them they can ban you. But that ain't going to stop the eBay gravy train any time soon.
SOT
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Damon Windwalker
I don't believe I've seen either of those arguments presented....
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Aracos79
Off-topic: The first thing that jumped in my head after reading that was Tyler Durden from "Fight Club". "You are not special... we are the all singing, all dancing crap of the world".
|
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Aracos79
On-topic: While the EULA may govern all activity in the game world, it still can't stop botters/farmers/average joe's from doing things outside the game world like sell gold/items on eBay. Sure the transfers take place IN the game world, and if ANet catches them they can ban you. But that ain't going to stop the eBay gravy train any time soon.
|
Teklord
Non issue with me. As I play the game the way it was meant to be played, through and through. Means I don't spend worthless in game money to have someone run me to the end so I can become all powerful and cake walk the rest of the game.
And that's all I gots to say about that.
As for an above comment, no it won't stop botters (etc.) from doing what they do. However, just because it doesn't stop them it still doesn't make it legal. They are selling virtual items, which they don't own, for real profit - quite simply illegal.
And that's all I gots to say about that.
As for an above comment, no it won't stop botters (etc.) from doing what they do. However, just because it doesn't stop them it still doesn't make it legal. They are selling virtual items, which they don't own, for real profit - quite simply illegal.
Mimi Miyagi
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
Say this word out loud:
"EULA" What does this term mean? You may recognize it. It resides in the world of Guild Wars that we all love and enjoy. It is called the "End-User-License-Agreement". Ring any bells? It should, for you see, every piece of software you have installed on your computer comes with this neat little document. It has a purpose beyond eratta. It actually has meaning. Check it out sometime. What the EULA is, in essence, is a legal letter of information for you the "user of a software program" that, while you purchased a license to use, access, and install, uninstall, reinstall the program, you DO NOT own the god damn software. No, sorry, it may stick in your craw to hear it, but you are not the title,deed, or shareholder in Ncsoft's property. You are basically a lease-holder on permanent software rental. You have permission to use THEIR software, not own it. I bring all this lovely lore to the limelight because, it seems that at LEAST 50% of posters on these and many other forums cannot grasp what the EULA means in legal, and common sense terms. The arguments range from "I bought the game I have the right to bot" to "I bought the game, so why am I banned for using it how I see fit?" YOU DO NOT OWN YOUR COPY OF GUILD WARS, YOU OWN THE RIGHT TO ACCESS THE CONTENT IN THE BOX. They spent millions of dollars on thechnology, the staff, the dev team, the paperclips, the marketing, the executives, the previews, the E3 spots, the website, and it goes on and on and on. You spent roughly $60 or so. You, my friend, are not special. You are simply a guest in their playground. Yes, the EULA is a LEGAL, BINDING DOCUMENT that states what your rights as a user ARE. It is legal. So no, buying the game does not mean you own it. It means you own a responsibility as a consumer, gamer, and human to follow the rules. |
You're NOT going to jail for selling gold/items on ebay. Breaking the EULA means you can get SUED, but that is a civil matter, not a crimminal one. You can only go to jail (very remote chance) if it crosses the line between civil and crimminal. Warezing the software is a federal copyright law offense, not a EULA civil offense. Selling a fellblade on ebay is a civil matter.
Selling items on ebay = civil issue = Banning accounts, getting sued.
Warezing, Hacking, DDOSing, = Crimminal matter = Jail.
Please note, again, the likelihood of getting sued or being sent to jail is very slim possibility, in 99.999% of the cases they will either ignore it, or ban an account. Just illustrating a point here.
SOT
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Mimi Miyagi
I'd like to clarify another misconception as well.
You're NOT going to jail for selling gold/items on ebay. Breaking the EULA means you can get SUED, but that is a civil matter, not a crimminal one. You can only go to jail (very remote chance) if it crosses the line between civil and crimminal. Warezing the software is a federal copyright law offense, not a EULA civil offense. Selling a fellblade on ebay is a civil matter. Selling items on ebay = civil issue = Banning accounts, getting sued. Warezing, Hacking, DDOSing, = Crimminal matter = Jail. Please note, again, the likelihood of getting sued or being sent to jail is very slim possibility, in 99.999% of the cases they will either ignore it, or ban an account. Just illustrating a point here. |
Jailtime? you brought that one to the fore, not I. Point is, it is a civil matter, you can be sued, which makes it a legal document. Peroid. Semantics that shoot you in the foot are only proving my point further.Thanks for the clarification....to yourself
Mimi Miyagi
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
And yet, that is my argument restated FOR ME. Thanks
Jailtime? you brought that one to the fore, not I. Point is, it is a civil matter, you can be sued, which makes it a legal document. Peroid. Semantics that shoot you in the foot are only proving my point further.Thanks for the clarification....to yourself |
Please be more considerate when attempting to flame someone. Or at least do a better job next time.
SOT
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Mimi Miyagi
Ummm...just where is your original post did you mention the distinction between a civil matter and a crimminal one? You did not make any argument other than the EULA is a legal document. I simply expanded on your point. I didn't refute it, I simply expanded on it. I've read in several threads people talking about going to jail for breaking the EULA and I thought I would be kind enough to clarify the difference, since you didn't.
Please be more considerate when attempting to flame someone. Or at least do a better job next time. |
The thread was not started to scream about witch hunts and jail time and what miay or may not transpire, should an asshat decide to ignore the EULA. It was to get it into the thick skulls of a large crowd what the document IS.
SJG
IANAL, but as I understand it EULAs have yet to be tested in court, so there is every chance that they are just useless bits of unenforceable legalese.
I'm just playing devil's advocate, here.
I'm just playing devil's advocate, here.
SOT
I truly wish Arenanet Had Forums on-site. They would have more sound moderation than goes on here.
Mark my words, my own posts will be singled out here, as always, but the flamers will keep on a goin.
I think I will logout and not return. Good luck lasherdragon. This place needs it.
*sigh*
I admit defeat. You people are hopeless.
Mark my words, my own posts will be singled out here, as always, but the flamers will keep on a goin.
I think I will logout and not return. Good luck lasherdragon. This place needs it.
*sigh*
I admit defeat. You people are hopeless.
MuKen
1) EULAs are not legally enforceable to minors (a huge portion of the players).
2) EULAs are not criminally enforceable to anybody, they are contracts, not laws.
3) It is questionable (I've seen it debated many times) whether EULAs for video games hold any water at all, since you can't read them until you've opened enough of the box to not be able return it and get your money back.
4) At a minimum, no video game company has ever gotten an EULA enforced against anyone in a court of law or even to sue anybody.
Companies put EULAs in video games for one reason and one reason alone: so THEY cannot be sued for the actions or the results of actions by people who are breaking the EULAs.
2) EULAs are not criminally enforceable to anybody, they are contracts, not laws.
3) It is questionable (I've seen it debated many times) whether EULAs for video games hold any water at all, since you can't read them until you've opened enough of the box to not be able return it and get your money back.
4) At a minimum, no video game company has ever gotten an EULA enforced against anyone in a court of law or even to sue anybody.
Companies put EULAs in video games for one reason and one reason alone: so THEY cannot be sued for the actions or the results of actions by people who are breaking the EULAs.
Mimi Miyagi
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT And yet, that is my argument restated FOR ME. |
Quote:
| Thanks Jailtime? you brought that one to the fore, not I. |
Quote:
| Point is, it is a civil matter, you can be sued, which makes it a legal document. Peroid. Semantics that shoot you in the foot are only proving my point further. |
Quote:
| Thanks for the clarification....to yourself |
Third Quarter
If you suppose, simply for the sake of argument, that EULAs are not legally binding and are just pretty words used to scare people, you still need the right to connect to Anet's servers to do anything.
This access, naturally, is restricted in certain ways. (primarily things like not botting, scamming, hacking, and so forth) These rules are usually documented as the Terms of Service. As long as you obey, Anet agrees to offer their service to you.
Disobey, and Anet no longer has any obligation or reason to allow you to continue using their service.
This access, naturally, is restricted in certain ways. (primarily things like not botting, scamming, hacking, and so forth) These rules are usually documented as the Terms of Service. As long as you obey, Anet agrees to offer their service to you.
Disobey, and Anet no longer has any obligation or reason to allow you to continue using their service.
Algren Cole
/not signed.
remove your reference to "legal binding contract" and your post is flawlessly perfect.
remove your reference to "legal binding contract" and your post is flawlessly perfect.
Teh Azman
Very well put in the first post, SOT. And by the way, to you ebayers and such out there, I have honestly begun to believe that no matter how well written of a post to defend yourself you can put up...
Your willingness to spend real money just to maybe get ahead in a game makes you look like too big of an idiot for me, and hopefully others, to take you seriously.
/signed
Your willingness to spend real money just to maybe get ahead in a game makes you look like too big of an idiot for me, and hopefully others, to take you seriously.
/signed
Damon Windwalker
Why are people /signing this? it's not a sugestion o petition - it's a rant...
Hooray!! We're hopeless!
bah - what a worthless thread.
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
I admit defeat. You people are hopeless.
|
bah - what a worthless thread.
Meeker
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
Say this word out loud:
"EULA" What does this term mean? You may recognize it. It resides in the world of Guild Wars that we all love and enjoy. It is called the "End-User-License-Agreement". Ring any bells? It should, for you see, every piece of software you have installed on your computer comes with this neat little document. It has a purpose beyond eratta. It actually has meaning. Check it out sometime. What the EULA is, in essence, is a legal letter of information for you the "user of a software program" that, while you purchased a license to use, access, and install, uninstall, reinstall the program, you DO NOT own the god damn software. No, sorry, it may stick in your craw to hear it, but you are not the title,deed, or shareholder in Ncsoft's property. You are basically a lease-holder on permanent software rental. You have permission to use THEIR software, not own it. I bring all this lovely lore to the limelight because, it seems that at LEAST 50% of posters on these and many other forums cannot grasp what the EULA means in legal, and common sense terms. The arguments range from "I bought the game I have the right to bot" to "I bought the game, so why am I banned for using it how I see fit?" YOU DO NOT OWN YOUR COPY OF GUILD WARS, YOU OWN THE RIGHT TO ACCESS THE CONTENT IN THE BOX. They spent millions of dollars on thechnology, the staff, the dev team, the paperclips, the marketing, the executives, the previews, the E3 spots, the website, and it goes on and on and on. You spent roughly $60 or so. You, my friend, are not special. You are simply a guest in their playground. Yes, the EULA is a LEGAL, BINDING DOCUMENT that states what your rights as a user ARE. It is legal. So no, buying the game does not mean you own it. It means you own a responsibility as a consumer, gamer, and human to follow the rules. |
I am sorry but you are 100% completely wrong. There have been several recent court rulings that have basically stated that an EULA means nothing.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/11...ixes_software/
"Specifically, the ruling decrees that software purchases be treated as sales transactions, rather than explicit license agreements. In other words, consumers should have the same rights they'd enjoy under existing copyright legislation when buying a CD or a book. They can't make copies, but they can resell what they own."
As other people have mentioned there are also ruling in courts that cover the ground that you can read an EULA until you have already bought the game at which point you can not longer return it and therefore an EULA is not legally binding.
While A.Net will continue to ban accounts and no one will stop them, in fact I agree to most but not all of the bannings, they can not claim they have the right because of a EULA. In fact if a botter who was banned decided to sue A.Net and had the money to do so he would have the law on his side.
Thank you, come again.
Algren Cole
Meeker...you are forgetting that ArenaNet owns the servers...they CAN dictate what you are allowed to use THEIR servers for...the Law would not be on ArenaNets side in that particular case.
though I agree...EULAs are fluff and have no legal precedence or contractual backing.
though I agree...EULAs are fluff and have no legal precedence or contractual backing.
Diomedes
Quote:
| While A.Net will continue to ban accounts and no one will stop them, in fact I agree to most but not all of the bannings, they can not claim they have the right because of a EULA. In fact if a botter who was banned decided to sue A.Net and had the money to do so he would have the law on his side. |
-Diomedes
Meeker
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Algren Cole
Meeker...you are forgetting that ArenaNet owns the servers...they CAN dictate what you are allowed to use THEIR servers for...the Law would not be on ArenaNets side in that particular case.
though I agree...EULAs are fluff and have no legal precedence or contractual backing. |
However you would have to have a lot of money to waste just to prove a point.
I currently work for a law firm that specializes in corporate law so I feel have a decent take on this.
Damon Windwalker
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Diomedes
There's a difference between having a copy of a cd or book and using areanet's servers and bandwidth (which I'm fairly certain they have the right to deny anyone for any reason).
-Diomedes |
I'm not sure I would completel agree that there is no implied right to use, considerin that the software works ONLY when associated to an ANET server, and ANET has made the statement that they will never charge a fee. That clearly establishes an implied contract for services - and could negate the "anyone for any reason" arguement.
Aniewiel
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
I truly wish Arenanet Had Forums on-site. They would have more sound moderation than goes on here.
|
Quote:
| Mark my words, my own posts will be singled out here, as always, but the flamers will keep on a goin. |
Quote:
|
I think I will logout and not return. Good luck lasherdragon. This place needs it. *sigh* I admit defeat. You people are hopeless. |
On moral and ethical ground, I agree with you 100%.
Don't go. We need and want all viewpoints here.
Spartan2
EULAs would hold up more in court if customers were asked to agree to an Pre-purchase Agreement as they exited the store. Most gamers know what these EULAs and ToC will be stating and agree to them, but what about the grandparents or parents that are just trying to please their (grand)children? A lot of this "But I didn't know what I was doing was wrong" crap would end the second electronic stores had a huge record of EULA behind the counter.
Employee: "Hmm... Maximum Carnage Fighter XLV? This game is rated Mature for maximum amounts of carnage, can I see your ID? Ok, you're 17, you can purchase this, but, you need to take a look over the EULA before you may leave."
Customer: "Why?"
Employee: "Well, because the game has online features and the game creators want it to be very clear that no cussing, spitting, or hitting below the belt is allowed online. They want to make it very clear that they can end your ability to access their servers if you abuse this agreement."
Customer: "Oh, alright. That sounds fair, thanks!"
It would also be great if they could take out all of that innane legalese and just make it an easy to read document spanning only one to two pages. I know they are trying to cover themselves from being sued, but if you can get your customers to be aware you mean business in a very easy to understand way, then no one is at fault but those that choose to push the limit.
Employee: "Hmm... Maximum Carnage Fighter XLV? This game is rated Mature for maximum amounts of carnage, can I see your ID? Ok, you're 17, you can purchase this, but, you need to take a look over the EULA before you may leave."
Customer: "Why?"
Employee: "Well, because the game has online features and the game creators want it to be very clear that no cussing, spitting, or hitting below the belt is allowed online. They want to make it very clear that they can end your ability to access their servers if you abuse this agreement."
Customer: "Oh, alright. That sounds fair, thanks!"
It would also be great if they could take out all of that innane legalese and just make it an easy to read document spanning only one to two pages. I know they are trying to cover themselves from being sued, but if you can get your customers to be aware you mean business in a very easy to understand way, then no one is at fault but those that choose to push the limit.
Tactical-Dillusions
Does it allow me to use my disk as a coffee mat?
Algren Cole
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Tactical-Dillusions
Does it allow me to use my disk as a coffee mat?
|
7.72A-C: The purchaser of this product assumes the role of ownership of the physical materials used to deliver the product, while ArenaNet maintains proprietary ownership of the servers, the code, and the means with which to deliver content, it is ultimately the end-users right to use above reference physical material as a coaster.
Phades
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Meeker
I am sorry but you are 100% completely wrong. There have been several recent court rulings that have basically stated that an EULA means nothing.
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2001/11...ixes_software/ "Specifically, the ruling decrees that software purchases be treated as sales transactions, rather than explicit license agreements. In other words, consumers should have the same rights they'd enjoy under existing copyright legislation when buying a CD or a book. They can't make copies, but they can resell what they own." As other people have mentioned there are also ruling in courts that cover the ground that you can read an EULA until you have already bought the game at which point you can not longer return it and therefore an EULA is not legally binding. While A.Net will continue to ban accounts and no one will stop them, in fact I agree to most but not all of the bannings, they can not claim they have the right because of a EULA. In fact if a botter who was banned decided to sue A.Net and had the money to do so he would have the law on his side. Thank you, come again. |
Mimi Miyagi
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Spartan2
It would also be great if they could take out all of that innane legalese and just make it an easy to read document spanning only one to two pages. I know they are trying to cover themselves from being sued, but if you can get your customers to be aware you mean business in a very easy to understand way, then no one is at fault but those that choose to push the limit.
|
And working in a law firm doesn't make anyone qualified to interpet US laws. That would be like saying "I'm a janitor at a hospital, thus I should be able to perform brain surgery". Even law firms can't interpet US laws except when it's their particular field of specialization. A family doctor can't perform open heart surgery, but can tell if you have the flu - at least I hope so. A law firm that deals mainly in divorce and property damage claims isn't suited to battling corporate legal fights. In other words, just like anything else, all lawyers (or firms) are not created equal.
Warskull
The reason the EULA works is simple, if you were to take Arena.net to court over it the most you would get out of it was your $50 back. The cost of taking them to court would be far greater and the only way it could be done would be through a class action lawsuit.
The EULA is an agreement to license the software to you and depending on the court and instance it can be enforced (Microsoft has pulled tricks with their EULAs being non-transferable before.) The truth is most EULAs are overly restrictive however legally the best point of attack is the shrink wrap arguement. How the EULA is not available until the shrink wrap is open and that you cannot return the product for a refund even though the EULA states you should be able to if you do not agree with it.
The EULA is an agreement to license the software to you and depending on the court and instance it can be enforced (Microsoft has pulled tricks with their EULAs being non-transferable before.) The truth is most EULAs are overly restrictive however legally the best point of attack is the shrink wrap arguement. How the EULA is not available until the shrink wrap is open and that you cannot return the product for a refund even though the EULA states you should be able to if you do not agree with it.
Orochim4ru
Quote:
| "Specifically, the ruling decrees that software purchases be treated as sales transactions, rather than explicit license agreements. In other words, consumers should have the same rights they'd enjoy under existing copyright legislation when buying a CD or a book. They can't make copies, but they can resell what they own." |
Anarkii
EULA : Pretty words meant to scare the gamers, in the hope that they wont do anything that the Company didnt intend them to.
Legally Enforceable? Nay.
Legally Enforceable? Nay.
SOT
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Aniewiel
What type of moderation in this thread are you looking for? There has been no name calling and no really horrendously ugly language. Some 'spanks', several of which were launched by you, to be sure but nothing awful. What is it you would like to see?
Truly. I read every post. Is someone's disagreement with your point a 'flame'? I didn't see anyone flaming you to the degree you are insinuating. I will read through again but I have seen far worse. And, in MY limited opinion, you give as good as you get. That's too bad, SOT, truly. I am sorry to hear that. I hope that you're not running off because everyone doesn't agree with you. There is ample room for discussion on this topic because, and this is the case in every EULA out there, there is a gigantic gray area. The gaming companies need to band together and begin pursuing legal recourse against people who violate EULAs. Until they do, the waters will remain muddied legally. On moral and ethical ground, I agree with you 100%. Don't go. We need and want all viewpoints here. |
As for the person saying this thread is worthless, well you posted in here, so what does that make you?
I have been reading the responses since I skeedattaled. Some of them made more sense to me, and actually fit the damn topic, and not me as a person. As for the morons, oh well. Nothing is new anymore.
I think I should perhaps just post in threads and not start them for a while, as it is always the same cluster of 5 or 6 who feel the need to be important...to themselves or something.
Anyhoo, carry on, or not, I care not. I am done with this thread.
cheers
Yen-lo-wang
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SJG
IANAL, but as I understand it EULAs have yet to be tested in court, so there is every chance that they are just useless bits of unenforceable legalese.
I'm just playing devil's advocate, here. |
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Anarkii
EULA : Pretty words meant to scare the gamers, in the hope that they wont do anything that the Company didnt intend them to.
Legally Enforceable? Nay. |
Anarkii
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Yen-lo-wang
EULA's have gotten much longer, much more detailed, and much more specific. These things are handcrafted by the lawyers of the various firms that represent these companies, and you can bet your pants that they can and WILL enforce the EULAs in a court of law as they see fit.
|
2) In case of a lawsuit, the consumer is likely to win. Why? Because EULAs are so strongly worded that theres always an easy way to circumvent it.
Piracy? Backup!
Ebaying? Selling/Buying a service/time, NOT items.
etc
SJG
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Yen-lo-wang
These things are handcrafted by the lawyers of the various firms that represent these companies, and you can bet your pants that they can and WILL enforce the EULAs in a court of law as they see fit.
|
Just because a lawyer writes something doesn't make it enforceable. In almost every tenancy agreement I have ever signed there has been a number of clauses that are unenforceable, that is to say people have been to court over it and it was found, for one reason or another, to be not legally binding.
It is all just posturing from lawyers, they know they mean nothing but they hope that you don't.
Damon Windwalker
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by SOT
As for the person saying this thread is worthless, well you posted in here, so what does that make you?
|
What did it make me when I posted that?
Bored.
Algren Cole
Quote:
|
Originally Posted by Yen-lo-wang
No offense/flaming intended, but you're both wrong. Ever since the government started their mostly BS case with Microsoft (that's a whole different barrel of fish and ONLY BROUGHT UP AS A TIME REFERECE!), the government and other legal-type industries have started watching the gaming and music industries much more carefully... and as a result, EULA's have gotten much longer, much more detailed, and much more specific. These things are handcrafted by the lawyers of the various firms that represent these companies, and you can bet your pants that they can and WILL enforce the EULAs in a court of law as they see fit.
|
I can take a bag of shit and fill it to double its normal capacity...does that make it anything more than an overstuffed bag of shit?
Saerden
EULAs may be legally binding contracts in country A. EULAs may be totally illegal because they force you to surrender basic human rights (like private property; "you pay for it, you own it", freedom to resell your private property) in country B. If country A has more stealth bombers then country B, EULAs may become enforcable in country B one day, too.
Or as the people in this thread who actually have a clue have said: its a huge grey area.
/moral soapbox - personal opinion and NOT A FACT: EULAS are not only illegal but immoral. They force a mixture between communism and dictatorship. You dont own everything, just pay for the right to use it. There is also no way a car dealer can prevent you from making profit with "his hard work" aka the car. Somehow, software companies think they can.
/end NOT A FACT
Or as the people in this thread who actually have a clue have said: its a huge grey area.
/moral soapbox - personal opinion and NOT A FACT: EULAS are not only illegal but immoral. They force a mixture between communism and dictatorship. You dont own everything, just pay for the right to use it. There is also no way a car dealer can prevent you from making profit with "his hard work" aka the car. Somehow, software companies think they can.
/end NOT A FACT
PieXags
Nobody ever reads the EULA/terms of service anyway. Honestly how many of you go through the several pages of crap before you install the game? Anyone?
And as far as I'm concerned I sure as HELL own my copy of the game, don't even try to say that I don't.
I OWN my copy of the game. When I BOUGHT the game, I wasn't able to read the EULA that says what I owned and what I didn't, I PURCHASED this game from a store, it's mine, plain and simple. I can do whatever the HELL I want with my disk, I can tear up the booklet, I can snap the CD in half. The game is mine.
It would be more correct to say that every person owns his or her copy of the game, but Anet owns the rights to the account online (they can ban it) me thinks.
When I picked up the game from the shelf, brought it to the desk, payed my money, and brought it home. I didn't pick up a bag of "rights" to play the game online, I payed for what I picked up off the shelf, the game. I own my copy of the game, they own the rights to it, really.
And as far as I'm concerned I sure as HELL own my copy of the game, don't even try to say that I don't.
I OWN my copy of the game. When I BOUGHT the game, I wasn't able to read the EULA that says what I owned and what I didn't, I PURCHASED this game from a store, it's mine, plain and simple. I can do whatever the HELL I want with my disk, I can tear up the booklet, I can snap the CD in half. The game is mine.
It would be more correct to say that every person owns his or her copy of the game, but Anet owns the rights to the account online (they can ban it) me thinks.
When I picked up the game from the shelf, brought it to the desk, payed my money, and brought it home. I didn't pick up a bag of "rights" to play the game online, I payed for what I picked up off the shelf, the game. I own my copy of the game, they own the rights to it, really.