Anet Nerf= Smite tombs only
xChaoSx
This is hilarious! Past two days ive been tombsing and just about every single pug ive joined or group ive played in tombs has been smite minus the r6+ groups who actually make there own builds. I dont care much because we rock smiters but its just lame how EVERYONE is now running smite builds..lets have some diversion guys
wolfy3455
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Originally Posted by xChaoSx
This is hilarious! Past two days ive been tombsing and just about every single pug ive joined or group ive played in tombs has been smite minus the r6+ groups who actually make there own builds. I dont care much because we rock smiters but its just lame how EVERYONE is now running smite builds..lets have some diversion guys
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One and Two
Do you really want to know how to own those smite group? I shall tell you the magical secret~
pst....invite a mesmer to your group.
There. Bam. One mesmer and anything else will take out the entire smite group.
pst....invite a mesmer to your group.
There. Bam. One mesmer and anything else will take out the entire smite group.
Sleet
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Originally Posted by One and Two
Do you really want to know how to own those smite group? I shall tell you the magical secret~
pst....invite a mesmer to your group. There. Bam. One mesmer and anything else will take out the entire smite group. |
And the fact is that 90% of tombs groups use smite, because its faking powerful (and imo imba) since renewal was nerfed.
xChaoSx
i never said i needed a counter..im saying EVERYONe and there grandmothers is running them. Seeing that Anet likes diversity and most ppl do..its getting boring and lame fighting the same build over and over..we used to have spirit spammers, air spikers,conditions builds ect..no very few are actually using non smite builds..i.e boring
wolfy3455
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Originally Posted by Sleet
Well not realy. I agree with that mesmer is helping a lot but this is not a solution.
And the fact is that 90% of tombs groups use smite, because its faking powerful (and imo imba) since renewal was nerfed. |
Sleet
As i said. Mesmer is the key but if its so simple why the hell there are so many smiters teams ? Oo
wolfy3455
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Originally Posted by Sleet
As i said. Mesmer is the key but if its so simple why the hell there are so many smiters teams ? Oo
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Person A make an "uberleet balanced group" with 2 wars (paladins of course), 3 eles (godly aeros that are too 1337 for energy management) , and 3 monks. He gets owned and thinks to himself, "I can't beat that!". Next time he plays he makes his own craptastic version of it.
Person B thinks, "Wow, why isn't every group bringing diversion? I guess since no one is countering it... free faction!" Person B goes and makes a carbon copy of an effective build he saw once.
Theos
Everyone does it because its so brain dead easy, throw zealots on a compitant warrior and just spam and button mash. Very hard... lol. My personal favorite counters to it are necros and mesmers.
Mesmer: Diversion/Backfire works wonders, so many people never realise backfire is on them and smite themselves to death. Fun times.
Necro: Rend those enchants. Fun to see those warriors drop like flies.
Sad thing is, that these counters are rarely seen. Plus the pure over powered smite line is just insane. Things will be stagnant until thats fixed or when the masses figure out how to use simple counters like diversion.
Mesmer: Diversion/Backfire works wonders, so many people never realise backfire is on them and smite themselves to death. Fun times.
Necro: Rend those enchants. Fun to see those warriors drop like flies.
Sad thing is, that these counters are rarely seen. Plus the pure over powered smite line is just insane. Things will be stagnant until thats fixed or when the masses figure out how to use simple counters like diversion.
Mitsu Bishi
Backfire is not the best counter IMO. Well, at least not if you don't time it right. Backfire during a period of Ether Renewal won't hurt at ALL. It heals so much, the Smiter won't be damaged too much (if he's damaged at all) from casting through it. So you've got to wait a bit to apply it - but I'd go the Diversion route all the way.
Theos
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Originally Posted by Mitsu Bishi
Backfire is not the best counter IMO. Well, at least not if you don't time it right. Backfire during a period of Ether Renewal won't hurt at ALL. It heals so much, the Smiter won't be damaged too much (if he's damaged at all) from casting through it. So you've got to wait a bit to apply it - but I'd go the Diversion route all the way.
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Leddy
Yeah, i knew this would happen. NR+Spirits gets nerfed and then people bitch about the next HoH build, this time as easily counterable as 1-2-3.
Spirits were actually hard to counter.
Spirits were actually hard to counter.
Tactical-Dillusions
Choking gas, incendiary arrows, distracting shot, savage shot and punishing shot...dead smiter. 
Eonwe
People run smiting because it's effective and rolls over stupid pugs.
Sainte
Yea, I was in HoH alot these past few days, and 90% of groups we met were Smites.
My Guild doesnt run smite mainly because its overused, and we like being unique. Not like smite gives us much problems though, we tend to kill them all and get a Flawless win in under 3 minutes
My Guild doesnt run smite mainly because its overused, and we like being unique. Not like smite gives us much problems though, we tend to kill them all and get a Flawless win in under 3 minutes
T RAND
What is a smite group?
Tactical-Dillusions
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Originally Posted by T RAND
What is a smite group?
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They use spells and enchantments (and some skills) so can easily be countered if you have someone on the team who possess the right tools for the job.
xChaoSx
im not whining about countering them..but the bore factor of tombs with pure smite builds..its like running pure warrior builds with empty skillbars
Sainte
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Originally Posted by xChaoSx
im not whining about countering them..but the bore factor of tombs with pure smite builds..its like running pure warrior builds with empty skillbars
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Yea I know. We ran a anti-smite build a few times, and 5/6 teams we faced in that run were smite. Meaning free Flawless wins =S
Its just boring, hitting HoH and going "Hi Smite team."
Sunman222
now think of how to stop the signet smiting teams.
Sainte
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Originally Posted by Sunman222
now think of how to stop the signet smiting teams.
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Ensign
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Originally Posted by Tactical-Dillusions
Choking gas, incendiary arrows, distracting shot, savage shot and punishing shot...dead smiter.
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Originally Posted by Tactical-Dillusions
A group of monks or monk secondaries that use SMITING PRAYERS to deal damage upon the enemy or reflect damage back to the enemy.
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Smiting is an El/Mo build that uses Draw Conditions / Reversal of Fortune to power Zealot's Fire, and uses Ether Renewal to run with effectively infinite energy. Toss in some Balthazar's Auras and Judge's Insights and you have the biggest damage machine in the game.
It's vulnerable to a few specific kinds of hate (Rend Enchantments and spammed Diversion in particular) but is otherwise remarkably robust, and the damage it dishes out just rolls over unprepared teams.
Peace,
-CxE
Brother Andicus
Sainte, it will change. Once the slightly dimmer players cotton on to the counters, smite will become ineffective, and there will be a new flavour of the month.
Personally, I would like to have 2 people put spiteful spirit on the E/mo key mashers, and watch them blow up their entire party.
Personally, I would like to have 2 people put spiteful spirit on the E/mo key mashers, and watch them blow up their entire party.
Amused Observer
I played a bit yesterday at tombs, and we ran into 1 smite group, 1 air spiker team, and the rest knockdown groups. Playing as a Mes, I had a difficult time joining groups. :/
Ensign
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Originally Posted by Brother Andicus
Personally, I would like to have 2 people put spiteful spirit on the E/mo key mashers, and watch them blow up their entire party.
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2) The AoE on Spiteful Spirit really isn't that impressive. It really only works on Warriors who bunch up on the same target.
3) Smiters heal themselves for a sizable percentage of what Spiteful Spirit will deal with each cast.
4) No one carries Hex Removal, right?
5) You're running Spiteful Spirit in Tombs.
Peace,
-CxE
Warskull
Smite is popular for a couple of reasons. Builds can be designed to beat it, however it means you have to develop your own build. From my expeience most players aren't capable of developing a build and/or understanding the interaction between the players of the group. The smite build is a predesigned group that is easy to do and effective. It can be countered, however the many of the teams running smite win much more than they would have without it. Additionally everyone is happy in the smite build. Everyone around the warriors dies so they feel big and tough. Tons of yellow numbers pop up on the e/mo screen so they feel great for doing a lot of damage. They monks feel good because they see how much they are healing people.
Smiting is quite simply the PvP version of PvEs Tanks, nukers, and healers. Easy to do, everyone knows their role and feels good because they are recognized for what they are doing, and it works (not necessarily the best way to do things, but it works good enough.)
If you look at the history of the common tombs PvP builds they all have a few things in common.
#1) Easy to do
#2) Each player has well defined roles
#3) The interaction between players is fairly built in so even the most retarded person can do it.
#4) They are effective (not necessarily the best build, but it works even in the hands of idiots)
Smiting is quite simply the PvP version of PvEs Tanks, nukers, and healers. Easy to do, everyone knows their role and feels good because they are recognized for what they are doing, and it works (not necessarily the best way to do things, but it works good enough.)
If you look at the history of the common tombs PvP builds they all have a few things in common.
#1) Easy to do
#2) Each player has well defined roles
#3) The interaction between players is fairly built in so even the most retarded person can do it.
#4) They are effective (not necessarily the best build, but it works even in the hands of idiots)
Theos
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Originally Posted by Ensign
1) Multiple copies of Spiteful Spirit on the same target do not stack.
2) The AoE on Spiteful Spirit really isn't that impressive. It really only works on Warriors who bunch up on the same target. 3) Smiters heal themselves for a sizable percentage of what Spiteful Spirit will deal with each cast. 4) No one carries Hex Removal, right? 5) You're running Spiteful Spirit in Tombs. Peace, -CxE |
In recent playing I have discovered that NR is a slight (but not very effective) counter to Smite. The addition on casting time is nice and all but it seems that it just not cutting it. Diversion has worked great and can totally obliterate a players 7-8 skills quickly. I may want to try Soul Leech on such a build, Spiteful Spirit is too weak but perhaps Leech may cut it. Other real problem is there isn't much in the way of semi-large removal being used, PUGs totally neglect it. All necro chilblains with plague sig/sending/touch... must try this out ><.
Red Sonya
Well at least it's not spirit spammers so I wouldn't go complaining about something you say you can beat so easily. Seems to me one would be happy with the socalled easy faction. I'll take a smiting team any day vs that silly spirit spamming that used to go on.
twicky_kid
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Originally Posted by Sleet
As i said. Mesmer is the key but if its so simple why the hell there are so many smiters teams ? Oo
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no nerf to stop smiting like NR. NR shut down mes to just be dead weight which made a shortage of mes players. not to mention mes is the hardest class to play and takes some one with real skills to use it effectivly.
you will see this balance out in the next few weeks more peole will make meses to stop the uprising of monks, but i do foresee balth aura running wild because NR was suppressing it where as not there is nothing to stop it.
btw, life bond builds are much more effective than smite builds anyday. i was doing 10-15 flawless victorys in a row in random pvp with just 1 monk using life bond.
Freyas
Smites are running rampant because among most teams, enchantment removal is pretty much nonexistant. People are used to not having anything in the way of enchantments or need for enchantment removal due to the previous prevalence of Nature's Renewal and it's "remove all enchantments" effect. Some well-placed enchantment removals will destroy a smiting-based build. A good mesmer can do the same as well- Kill renewal or zealot's fire, and you've eliminated a significant portion of the other teams damage. Add in some additional anti-caster stuff, and you should have no problems. If all else fails, spread out and cripple the enemy wars- keep away from them and Balths aura/zealot's fire is wasted- it's all PBAoE.
Quebec Osti
Smiters are so easily countered, I cant believe many ppl think its overpowered. Sure the damage is big, sure it has infinite mana with zealot/aura/boon/ether when you let them do what they want.
BUT:
Lingering curse, shatter enchant, diversion, rend enchant, drain enchant, ward of foes, strip enchant, healig seed, shielding hands, life barrier, chillbains, backfire(not the best), runing away, separating so smite hit just 1....and more.. are all counters. Not much to complain about if you ask me.
Its just an easy to run build that everyone is using atm... ppl will get smart... start bringing counters... and smiting is gonna suck.
BUT:
Lingering curse, shatter enchant, diversion, rend enchant, drain enchant, ward of foes, strip enchant, healig seed, shielding hands, life barrier, chillbains, backfire(not the best), runing away, separating so smite hit just 1....and more.. are all counters. Not much to complain about if you ask me.
Its just an easy to run build that everyone is using atm... ppl will get smart... start bringing counters... and smiting is gonna suck.
ElderAtronach
First, crippling of their warriors won't do much as the E/Mos will just draw conditions off them, while doing damage with zealots, and healing themselves in the process. Second, spot removals recharge slower than Balths (which is 15 seconds), and Balth's gets covered up by other spammables anyway. Between Rend and drain/shatter/inspired you need to pick and choose what enchants get stripped off who, and sometimes you can strip a cover enchant if using a spot removal. Teams with multiple E/Mos fueling multiple W/* with multiple monks to back everyone else up is very hard to stop. You can't stack Balths on a single target, but you can spread the pain on each friendly warrior.
Third, you can regularly get hit with 80-120 damage with a Rend, which hurts quite a bit. Fourth, Lingering Curse costs 25 mana, so good luck getting that off regularly and/or on time. Maybe if you had an N/E using glyph of lesser energy. It gets even harder when their warriors are playing e-denial with Fear Me.
Third, you can regularly get hit with 80-120 damage with a Rend, which hurts quite a bit. Fourth, Lingering Curse costs 25 mana, so good luck getting that off regularly and/or on time. Maybe if you had an N/E using glyph of lesser energy. It gets even harder when their warriors are playing e-denial with Fear Me.
Sammiel
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Originally Posted by ElderAtronach
First, crippling of their warriors won't do much as the E/Mos will just draw conditions off them, while doing damage with zealots, and healing themselves in the process. Second, spot removals recharge slower than Balths (which is 15 seconds), and Balth's gets covered up by other spammables anyway. Between Rend and drain/shatter/inspired you need to pick and choose what enchants get stripped off who, and sometimes you can strip a cover enchant if using a spot removal. Teams with multiple E/Mos fueling multiple W/* with multiple monks to back everyone else up is very hard to stop. You can't stack Balths on a single target, but you can spread the pain on each friendly warrior.
Third, you can regularly get hit with 80-120 damage with a Rend, which hurts quite a bit. Fourth, Lingering Curse costs 25 mana, so good luck getting that off regularly and/or on time. Maybe if you had an N/E using glyph of lesser energy. It gets even harder when their warriors are playing e-denial with Fear Me. |
Morganas
Drain enchant won't fuel crap. It's got a crazy long cooldown, and a 10 energy cost.
Quebec Osti
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Originally Posted by ElderAtronach
First, crippling of their warriors won't do much as the E/Mos will just draw conditions off them, while doing damage with zealots, and healing themselves in the process. Second, spot removals recharge slower than Balths (which is 15 seconds), and Balth's gets covered up by other spammables anyway. Between Rend and drain/shatter/inspired you need to pick and choose what enchants get stripped off who, and sometimes you can strip a cover enchant if using a spot removal. Teams with multiple E/Mos fueling multiple W/* with multiple monks to back everyone else up is very hard to stop. You can't stack Balths on a single target, but you can spread the pain on each friendly warrior.
Third, you can regularly get hit with 80-120 damage with a Rend, which hurts quite a bit. Fourth, Lingering Curse costs 25 mana, so good luck getting that off regularly and/or on time. Maybe if you had an N/E using glyph of lesser energy. It gets even harder when their warriors are playing e-denial with Fear Me. |
Sainte
With 3 Balth Going off at the same time, and a Signet spike thrown in, chances are you will drop extremely fast.
If you fall to like 60% HP, a signet spike will wipe out almost your whole party. Smites are extemely powerful, and due to the fact that Enchant removal is indeed non-existant, or slow and horrible vs such fast casting skills, Smite rules supreme.
I rarely see people playing anything other than smite because anyone cna do it. Even morons can click 2 buttons.
There are no minor AoE Disenchants.. meaning 1 by 1 is hard, since you also need to strip enchants to kill people.
If you fall to like 60% HP, a signet spike will wipe out almost your whole party. Smites are extemely powerful, and due to the fact that Enchant removal is indeed non-existant, or slow and horrible vs such fast casting skills, Smite rules supreme.
I rarely see people playing anything other than smite because anyone cna do it. Even morons can click 2 buttons.
There are no minor AoE Disenchants.. meaning 1 by 1 is hard, since you also need to strip enchants to kill people.
Dead Panda
If you ask me, I'd just wait til a body drops on the floor and cast Well of Profane. Then order your team to stand -inside- it.
Kampfkeks
LOL
This thread is just drop dead funny
Ever read the FOTM letters? Flavor of the month. And this is what we have here. It's just one of those lousy trends that do happen to occur every so often. Remember how everyone whined Aeromancers were overpowered? They weren't. A single spell every semi decent monk should carry anyways could stop it. Weeee.
Now here we have the same. So those folks are heavily running some smiting against you and your first teammate allready dead? PAYBACK TIME!
If you were basically all stacked up BEFORE you're positioning probably is very lousy anyways. That was one of the first things i learned while playing GW PVP. Never ever stand too close to your teammates if you're not defending or running some sort of healing ball (not taking wells and wards into account)
/edit:
A one liner did beat my mighty long post... damnit -.-
This thread is just drop dead funny
Ever read the FOTM letters? Flavor of the month. And this is what we have here. It's just one of those lousy trends that do happen to occur every so often. Remember how everyone whined Aeromancers were overpowered? They weren't. A single spell every semi decent monk should carry anyways could stop it. Weeee.
Now here we have the same. So those folks are heavily running some smiting against you and your first teammate allready dead? PAYBACK TIME!
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| For 8-18 seconds, foes in that area are stripped of all Enchantments and cannot be the target of further Enchantments. |
/edit:
A one liner did beat my mighty long post... damnit -.-
RotteN
non the less it is quite funny to use from time to time for some relaxed pvp 
we played a mesmer team friday and used an axe-warrior (with frozen soil) and an emo smiter for the damage dealing. the mesmers would simply shutdown monks/other mesmers/casters while i (the warrior/smite object) would run around into the biggest pile of enemies and start hacking away at the weakest. it needed very little amount of target calling (mesmers would tell the numbers they were shutting down on TS to prevent overlapping, and i would just do my own stuff) and was realy cool as relaxed gaming
but indeed, there are plenty of counters to regular smiting builds, most have been named already
we played a mesmer team friday and used an axe-warrior (with frozen soil) and an emo smiter for the damage dealing. the mesmers would simply shutdown monks/other mesmers/casters while i (the warrior/smite object) would run around into the biggest pile of enemies and start hacking away at the weakest. it needed very little amount of target calling (mesmers would tell the numbers they were shutting down on TS to prevent overlapping, and i would just do my own stuff) and was realy cool as relaxed gaming but indeed, there are plenty of counters to regular smiting builds, most have been named already
smurfhunter
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Originally Posted by ElderAtronach
First, crippling of their warriors won't do much as the E/Mos will just draw conditions off them, while doing damage with zealots, and healing themselves in the process. Second, spot removals recharge slower than Balths (which is 15 seconds), and Balth's gets covered up by other spammables anyway. Between Rend and drain/shatter/inspired you need to pick and choose what enchants get stripped off who, and sometimes you can strip a cover enchant if using a spot removal. Teams with multiple E/Mos fueling multiple W/* with multiple monks to back everyone else up is very hard to stop. You can't stack Balths on a single target, but you can spread the pain on each friendly warrior.
Third, you can regularly get hit with 80-120 damage with a Rend, which hurts quite a bit. Fourth, Lingering Curse costs 25 mana, so good luck getting that off regularly and/or on time. Maybe if you had an N/E using glyph of lesser energy. It gets even harder when their warriors are playing e-denial with Fear Me. |
so dont dismiss lingering
rend has a sad recharge, ive never gotten more than like 120 from it, and you cant spam it really so it doesnt hurt that much.
rigor, however, is amazing together with warriors. do a rigor/PB and bam those monks start to go into spam heal mode. rend theyre healing seed and its pretty ouchy.
and echo on a n/me really helps out; use it on rigor and even if they do convert you can pop it right back up.
the main deal with necros and not loseing energy is the long casting times. you spen quite a while rending/lingering, which gives you time to regen energy. and putrid costs 0 energy at 10 soul reaping, so that doesnt affect you. overall, necs are fun