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trelloskilos

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Guitarring Adventurers Society

R/N

01 Sep 2005 at 17:09 - 43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blackace

Oh ok, I see what your saying now. I thought this was a team that like, once they engaged just used WD/Traps and oath shot would be better. But if you dont wanna pull I see where the QZ comes in, but no reason for EW.

QZ stacks well with EW, and with Serpents quickness, makes the most of your energy.

The technique is simple. Drop EW, then QZ, then Serpent's Quickness.

EW reduces your recharge costs by 33% but slows down your recharge. QZ+Serpents counters this by speeding up your recharge.

The result is a significantly faster recharge on your skills with less energy cost. With a trap's life running at 90 secs, that allows you roughly 1 minute or 90 seconds to lay as many traps as possible before you need to pull. For a single ranger with a beefed up energy pool, that could mean up to 10-15 traps before creatures have to be pulled. Multiply that by the number in your team, and you have a lethal amount of traps, with no need for Oath Shot.

Sandman Uk

Banned

Join Date: May 2005

Uk Leicester

N/R

01 Sep 2005 at 17:18 - 44

AHH I see part of the confusion. Energy Storage=Energy levels srry

Not sure what the highest energy level you can reach.

ElderAtronach

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

Mo/Me

01 Sep 2005 at 17:35 - 45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinsei

Keyword here people: Energy Storage

i do not understand why you are all so close minded and ifnorant of things. Open your eyes.

Shinsei, it was a typo or miswording. Let it go, man! lol

Divinitys Creature

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Somewhere between the Real World and Tyria ;P

The Gothic Embrace [Goth]

01 Sep 2005 at 17:46 - 46

ROFL at the whole energy storage thing.

zehly

Sunshine

Join Date: Jul 2005

The Wired

Daughters of Ananke

Mo/E

01 Sep 2005 at 17:49 - 47

This has never happened to me, because I never give up my power as being the leader. If they have to have their own party, let them find their own party.

Aracos79

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

The Great Southwest

Shadowstorm Mercenaries

E/

01 Sep 2005 at 18:08 - 48

Eh, that's why I never bother with trying to lead parties. It's such a hassle to recruit people, get them to follow the gameplan, etc. I just look for intelligent GLF requests and respond to them. It might take a little longer, but it's worth saving the headache. And if I don't get a response in a reasonable amount of time, I just go do something else.

Theos

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

River Dancing

Eternal Treachery [TimE]

Me/E

01 Sep 2005 at 18:17 - 49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aracos79

Eh, that's why I never bother with trying to lead parties. It's such a hassle to recruit people, get them to follow the gameplan, etc. I just look for intelligent GLF requests and respond to them. It might take a little longer, but it's worth saving the headache. And if I don't get a response in a reasonable amount of time, I just go do something else.

Its no fun to lead pugs, but when your a Mesmer you can't help but form pugs instead of waiting for someone to finally say "Looking for a mesmer to do something in UW or FoW". Its easier to just form the group than to look for it. Once you form a group never give up leadership.

nailz

Banned

Join Date: Aug 2005

01 Sep 2005 at 18:23 - 50

not that I have much experience playing a mesmer...but I can't imagine they are very helpful in UW....I'd imagine they'd be alot more help in FoW.

Theos

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

River Dancing

Eternal Treachery [TimE]

Me/E

01 Sep 2005 at 18:56 - 51

They find use, good support character to have. Mesmers can also counter the evil mesmers in UW, damn those Mindblades. With high enough domination you can literally make mindblades kill themselves. You also can destroy dryders with a mesmer. So I would say yes. Though this is from what I have manajed to do, I do not know about mesmers in general.

octaviancmb

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2005

Me/

01 Sep 2005 at 19:25 - 52

A Mesmer would probably be a terrible idea for a trapper group in the UW.

Other than that one mode of UW farming: kill all casters 10x faster and tanks take 1/10th damage. Yeah, you'd think most groups would find room for a Mesmer.

...but they don't. And the woeful ignorance of what Mesmers are capable of accomplishing continues.
cmb

Mandy Memory

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2005

USA

Xen of Sigils [XoO]

W/

01 Sep 2005 at 20:43 - 53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman Uk

Had to laugh yesterday and just want to make you all aware.

Europe had favor and America was winning in the Halls. I quickly went to Temple of Ages and started building a trapping team for UW.

I have a Necro/Ranger build for the Energy storage. I can also carry Well of Profane maxed Death and then all other attributes into Wilderness survival. This gives me 71 energy with all the traps and a few wells.

Ok I spends the next 15 mins recruiting trapper rangers. Experienced trappers ect (5 Rangers recruited) and then im offered to join my team (5) with another ranger team (3) together to make 8 trappers. With time running out (America two more wins) I accept and the new leader then kicks me immediatley without warning because possibly my build wasnt a primary ranger thus keeping all my trappers I had recruited he then ignored me whilst he recruited another (1)

LOL classic stich up beware.

Im not going to name him he knows who he is I just want you to be aware.

Has anything happened like this to you

I always run a n/r for the energy storage that neither necro or ranger have access too

trelloskilos

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Guitarring Adventurers Society

R/N

01 Sep 2005 at 22:11 - 54

Quote:

Originally Posted by octaviancmb

A Mesmer would probably be a terrible idea for a trapper group in the UW.

Other than that one mode of UW farming: kill all casters 10x faster and tanks take 1/10th damage. Yeah, you'd think most groups would find room for a Mesmer.

...but they don't. And the woeful ignorance of what Mesmers are capable of accomplishing continues.
cmb

One of the best trappers I've teamed up with was a Me/R. Can't post the name (really wish I could though!). Fact is all classes have great potential to be trappers with a secondary ranger proff, including Mesmer. The only thing is that they'd be unable to get their WS attribute up to 16, but that doesn't stop them from laying a large amount of traps from larger energy pools, or pulling mobs to the traps thanks to better armour.

Kamatsu

Moderator

Join Date: May 2005

Australia

01 Sep 2005 at 23:49 - 55

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman Uk

AHH I see part of the confusion. Energy Storage=Energy levels srry

Not sure what the highest energy level you can reach.

Well I believe that 79 is the highest energy level that a N/R can reach. This is with loosing 2 pip's of regen.

The highest without loosing any regen is 52 energy.
Or if they loose just 1 pip of regen (thus become same regen as a ranger) they will have 64 energy.

While the R/x can reach is 73 energy (assuming they use wand/focii & have the attribute points for the focii's main energy) - course this would leave them with only 1 pip of energy regen

The highest without any loss of regen is 46 energy

We all know that an elementalist can reach the highest possible energy level's.. assuming 16 ES...

w/full regen = 93 energy
w/-1 pip = 105 energy
w/-2 pip = 120 energy

Tuoba Hturt Eht

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2005

Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia

Deimos Tel Arin [CCTV]

W/

02 Sep 2005 at 01:27 - 56

Quote:

Originally Posted by trelloskilos

Fact is all classes have great potential to be trappers with a secondary ranger proff

Aye, I don't think a Warrior / Ranger can be a very effective trapper.
Or am I wrong?

20 Base energy
+8 from full gladiator set
+5 henge of denravi long sword

33 total energy with 2 pips of energy regen

+10 from any staff
+5 insightful staff mod
33+15 = 48

So the max a Warrior / Ranger can get is:
48 energy with 2 pips of regen

Is that sufficient enough for a W/R to be a trapper?

Kamatsu

Moderator

Join Date: May 2005

Australia

02 Sep 2005 at 01:44 - 57

Tuoba Hturt Eht - your maths is a bit off...

You can't wield a sword and a staff at the same time, thus you only get the energy bonus from the 1 or the other item. Well you can have them in different weapon slots, but only the active slot will effect your energy pool.

Thus the highest they can get is either 33 or 43. Now the 43 is assuming the staff's energy isn't tied to an attribute.. if it is, then that energy will do nothing :P

They can get more by wielding a wand & focii which has bonus energy, but they will then have nill energy regen.. so the energy is good for that use then they'd have to swap out to get energy regen. This way they could have 58 energy! But with 0 energy regen.

Sandman Uk

Banned

Join Date: May 2005

Uk Leicester

N/R

02 Sep 2005 at 06:53 - 58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mandy Memory

I always run a n/r for the energy storage that neither necro or ranger have access too

Read all the posts dont skip the middle.

I didnt realize ele's could get up to 120 energy.

trelloskilos

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Guitarring Adventurers Society

R/N

02 Sep 2005 at 08:19 - 59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tuoba Hturt Eht

Aye, I don't think a Warrior / Ranger can be a very effective trapper.
Or am I wrong?

20 Base energy
+8 from full gladiator set
+5 henge of denravi long sword

33 total energy with 2 pips of energy regen

+10 from any staff
+5 insightful staff mod
33+15 = 48

So the max a Warrior / Ranger can get is:
48 energy with 2 pips of regen

Is that sufficient enough for a W/R to be a trapper?

The difference of 5 extra en points on a warrior's base en pool is hardly a world of difference to a ranger's 25. Like Kamatsu says, there are ways of boosting this en pool to much healthier levels, and finally, the biggest advantage of having a W/R in the trap party is that you know who is going to be the puller.

Sandman Uk

Banned

Join Date: May 2005

Uk Leicester

N/R

02 Sep 2005 at 08:32 - 60

Quote:

Originally Posted by trelloskilos

The difference of 5 extra en points on a warrior's base en pool is hardly a world of difference to a ranger's 25. Like Kamatsu says, there are ways of boosting this en pool to much healthier levels, and finally, the biggest advantage of having a W/R in the trap party is that you know who is going to be the puller.

Yep the person with the FlatBow,Longbow,Storbow

salja Wachi

Banned

Join Date: Jun 2005

Chicago

the Bleeding Edge

N/Mo

02 Sep 2005 at 14:44 - 61

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman Uk

Yep the person with the FlatBow,Longbow,Storbow

actually running by the mobs and grouping htem up correctly is very important to having a good trapping team. you cannot group them with a bow. you need to run through them to group them the right way

trelloskilos

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2005

Guitarring Adventurers Society

R/N

02 Sep 2005 at 14:53 - 62

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sandman Uk

Yep the person with the FlatBow,Longbow,Storbow

Seriously though, W/Rs are better suited to herding and pulling smites in particular. As many frustrated rangers who have been obliterated by the little b**tards will tell you.

Ataxes, Colds, Grasps and even Dryders are easy pulls, but smites can still be the undoing of a good trapper party....

....and don't even get me started on mixed groups!

Sandman Uk

Banned

Join Date: May 2005

Uk Leicester

N/R

02 Sep 2005 at 15:56 - 63

Yes I Agree Was just messing

Seems everyone has a different way of doing the underworld and Fissure. Traps work best for me. But seems to have been nerfed now. Only seem to get remains.

Even smite runs drop nothing worth having. Lots of non max stuff. Lucky the new areas wil be all the rage and Temple of ages will be empty over the next few weeks.

The frog mentioned about favor for the new area. Maybe it will be open to the other areas who dont have HOH favor. Lets see how many europeans return if thats the case.

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

02 Sep 2005 at 17:06 - 64

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinsei

Starting out with +15/+15 is reason enough to boot someone.

No, I do this routinely on a necro. You get so much energy from soul reaping that you can afford to. Few classes have the energy regen to do it, but since necros don't rely on their 4 pips as much I find that with some builds I can happily have huge starting energy and rely on deaths to feed my spells - then when there is a lull I only have 2 pips of regen, instead of 4, but 2 pips take 20 seconds to make up that energy difference, and my soul reaping can keep me at full. Soul Reaping 11+ rocks PvE.

ElderAtronach

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

Mo/Me

02 Sep 2005 at 18:39 - 65

Ep, Shinsei's from iQ, they don't care about PVE.

Besides, its not like its really hard to carry a backup weapon combo that gives you your full 4 pips of energy regen when you need it (ie when there's no monsters around for some unfathomable reason).

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

02 Sep 2005 at 18:47 - 66

Thanks ElderAtronach, that's why I bothered commenting that it rocks in PvE - they are talking about UW though, which IS PvE, so I am puzzled by the comment that one should boot a PvE player who could easily run that setup.

In PvP it wouldn't always work, but I know that there are builds for whom the higher energy is worth it, rather than pips, but it probably hasn't really been accepted that such a thing could be the case. Heck, some people think primary necros suck...

ElderAtronach

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

Mo/Me

02 Sep 2005 at 18:50 - 67

"Flame Shields Up!"

That should be a skill for the next expansion

lishi

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2005

02 Sep 2005 at 18:53 - 68

actualy a ranger can get exp 16 and wilderness 15 and bow 9

in this way he will able to put down trap without run out mana

Shinsei

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2005

Denmark

02 Sep 2005 at 18:59 - 69

If you're running 15/15, you need to know how to work 3 tiers of item switches, and when running 3 tiers of item switches, you don't start out with 15/15.