I'm having a lot of fun... but I'm having it by myself.

Is it just me? Am I doing something hellishly wrong? Or is the vast majority of the player base comprised of greedy, stupid, attention-deficit *children*?

Every time I head back to a lower-level town with a bag of goodies for newbies I remember why I stopped trying to play Santa last time. You literally cannot get anyone's attention long enough to *give* stuff away. When you can, they bug you for more, or sneer that their other avatar has something better. Know how many simple 'thank you's' I've gotten? One. Precisely one.

Every time I try to assemble a group for quests or missions, or join one, I remember why I stopped grouping last time. The NPC henchmen are weak, true, but they don't dash off and attack things themselves, and they don't leave the group without notice -- a major no-no in every other online game I've tried my hand at. It's SOP in GW. Know how many groups I've been with that completed the mission/quest with its full compliment of members? Two. Precisely two.

Every time I try to start a conversation in town -- not heavy-duty RPing, just shooting the bull about local quests or personalities -- I remember why I stopped last time. You know how much vital information I've been able to garner about what lies ahead, or how many times my patient, repeated offers to help out others have been taken up? Zero. Precisely zero.

The game is a mechanical marvel -- smooth-running and graphically rich. It has an storyline that allows you to star in your own personal epic. Several times a week I figure, oh, I must have just hit that town at a bad time, or was in the wrong instance, or maybe that was just the time all the LeEt HAXXorZ were on before they had to eat dinner, and I try to give something back and be sociable...

...and I remember why I stopped trying the last time.

Is there a guild of halfway-functioning adults out there that will have me?

Just gotta search.

Check pms in a sec.

This is the utter and sad truth. I hate the fact that this is the way things are, but what can you do? People are going to be people and for the most part people suck.

Look me up online sometime and I can get you into a small, but helpful and friendly guild.

Online name: Zintinix Blessmore

To be honest, I usually play with friends I have in real life. They are the best to play with. We get together every once in a while at the LAN cafe to play together and share strategies and learn them so we can pull them off without having the other guy yelling it to you from across the room.

However, when I pick up teammates online, I look for people who know what they're doing. People who type with punctuation are normally great party members, although very rare. Other good ones are the ones who know the jargon.

If you would like, you can look me up, normally at Slade Carter. I can't guarentee I'll be available, but I can try to help.

hence the reason why i created [Solo]. Its just easier soloing, and being social when you want to, imho anyhow. Send a whisper to Augustus Jenk if you're interested in joining. I also made a post in the guild forum with a little more detail.

Seriously, I've seen games with a large population of idiots, but this game, for some reason, really seems to be over the top in sheer number of completely inept players. Mabye its because it actually requires some thought to use a character effectively? Thats part of it Im sure, but I only ever quest with people who I know aren't retarded, non english speaking, ADD, farmer, etc. Thats a very small number, I hope as more people hit 20 the average level of proficiency goes up. Its literally like trying to herd cats when I lead a mission.

I noticed the same thing.

Really, it's ridiculous, but I've found soloing to be very rewarding too...

I knew it would be like this the moment they announced that there would be no monthly fee. The more popular a game is, the more idiots that are drawn to it. The lower the price, the more immature ***holes playing.

I find that in the post 20 game doing missions, most people are intelligent, know what they are doing, never leave early if they can help it, and are generally nice. The missions at that point are really hard and still kick your ass though(henchmen are pretty much out of the question for many of the missions), and getting to level 20 (the ascension missions) will force any idiot to become good at the game or quit playing. I think what your saying is true at lower levels but is less and less as you go up in levels, especially considering that since there is no real uber loot type things you don't have a whole lot of elitism "I have da uber item joo sux" type thing etheir, and if those people exist they wouldn't be doing missions post 20 because for them there probably wouldn't be a reason to.

I know exactly what you mean. I haven't really had to deal with these problems much since I made certain to get a guild of good friends (online and offline) together long before the game was ever released. I'm having a good time as a result, but it's sad that I have to block out the rest of the population in order to avoid being overwhelmed by the incredible number of idiots out there. The few times I've found myself online when no one else in my guild is on, pick-up groups, chatting in town, or anything other than soloing has proven to be a complete waste of time. I still love Guild Wars, and plan to continue playing for a long time to come, but I'm not loving the post-release community.

yep i agree, all online rpgs give u the best experience when u join a guild, not too small so that no ones ever on and not too big so that you dont feel a community. But join a medium sized guild- you will see your problems lessened by a lot.

Example:
People who type thusly: "D00d I wunt tu find the cristal ball soo I can geut the skil pnts 4 this qeust"
... Are not worthy of questing with you. However, If they type in this manner:
"Excuse me, sir, but I am seeking a monk for a party I am throwing together. We are about to attempt the "Crystal Ball" quest, and any help would be appreciated." are very capable players, and you should add them to your freind list ASAP.

Ah, and I have solved this mystery. Anyone remember a free online game called Diablo 2? Remember all of the fools that practicaly ruined the game? Well, imagine if you will, that those buffoons are similar to the aliens from "Independence Day", traveling from game to game, absorbing all that is good in that game, and leaving it a hollow shell of what it once was while they seek out new victims. For future reference, we shall label these creatures as "fun-locust". Those idiots that you speak of are but a small infestation of fun-locust.

Which is why I desperately hope that the fun-locust stay with WoW. So long as WoW remains the popular MMORPG, guild wars is safe.

Correction, Deaf, Mute, Blind, Retarted cats with only 3 legs.

Honestly the comunity isnt that bad. Here are the problems I see

1. Experienced players turning off the main chat, ive seen newbies screaming about a part of a quest they cant figure out because no one will help them. I try and help all I see, but I am only one man.

2. Players (Ive seen this happen many times) do something extreamly foolish like running off into 5 lvl 22 hydra alone(wich of course means death), and then proceed to cuse every other member out, call them noobs and leave.

Thoughs are the only real problems I see; however, it could just be me.

Yeah it is getting increasingly worse, I know that in towns i constantly have the Local chat turned off, its just plain annoying most times, and finding a good group. Good decent players are hard to come by, even tho i dont buy into this punctuation thing, i rarely use apostrophe's(yes i know i used one there this is a forum im alot more careful on here) But its not the way they speak that i look for, its the way they present themselves. When i enter a group or create one of my own i usually start with "hey" or "hiya" and those who reply i know ill be able to have a decent discussion with during the mission, those who dont reply at all i generally just treat as NPC's and expect them to know how to at least follow orders(alot of the time im let down here).

any of you feel free to look me up sometime, i play on 2 different characters, either

Tanik Roshar or Tanik Zelpher, if you ever see Tanik in a town, its me as far as i know no one has stolen my name on this game... yet

Honestly, I intend to continue soloing straight up till level 20 unless I'm with guildies or friends.

I'm praying that by the time I get there, people will have learned to play and be courteous. I'm sick of that stupid E/W that sprints straight for the largest group of mobs he can and dies.

But, in all reality, the only thing you can do about it is find a good group of folks and play with them only. We can't make the fools go away.

I basically solo as well, unless I need to have a co-op mission. One guy actually cursed me out because I was looking for more members. I'm trying to find a good guild which isn't just pvp focused.

Too true.

If anyone uses the follwing 'words', they are one of these idiots:

y, i, u, suk, skil, missin (mission), loser, or (my favorite) idot.

Exactly. I've been using the Henchemen because I'm just not finding the friendships ect. It doesn't seem to have a very established community. At least not yet.. but it is new so that could change. I remember making a lot of friends and stuff on FFXI.. but it was also because we were in the same "realm" so we'd run into the same people.. which doesn't happen as often in GW because of the different districts.

Actually, you're not far off. I don't add them to friends, though.

Before criticizing my methods, ask yourself, "Would I want to adventure with my first example?" As of now, I just aim for people who can spell and use grammar. You'd be surprised how difficult it is to find someone who capitalizes their sentences and/or uses periods. However, one must take other things into consideration. Even if he is using perfect English, I won't let the naked female Elementalist selling purple dye for 1000g join my party.

Please note that I'm currently lvl8 in Fort Ranik. I have yet to reach Ascension and hope that the society there is a little more mature. Until then, I'll continue to play with people I know personally.

I have been solo'ing (new word) since I started for all the reason's mentioned above. I just hit level 8 and traveled to Post-Sear. I'm a BIG time roleplayer with lots of background and I easily get irritated by a lot of the people playing this game. The whole "thank you" part bugs me a lot. I try to be as helpful as possible to anyone who wants/needs it, but rarely get a thank you. So I choose to travel alone or with the help of my mute henchmen and pet . I have been looking for a guild but don't want to join a real big one. I prefer a smaller one because I think you get to know them better. Kind of like a small town or office atmosphere. I don't get to play everyday (even though I would maybe like to) so a guild that "requires" you to be on at this time on this day wouldn't work for me. I have to go to work and my wife and kids actually like spending time with dad (believe it or not), so some things have to come before the games.

Anyway, if there are any smaller guilds around that is looking for more members throw it out to me. I would like to link up with some more mature people who enjoy roleplaying and getting into the game instead of just trying to hit level 20 in the fastest time possible. Good thread!

WoW is $15 a month, which is why you'll be hard pressed to find many (for lack of a better term) Bnet kiddies playing it. There are a ton of idiots who can make it to the level cap and still not know how to play the game, but most of them are at least decent people. But I digress, this isn't about WoW.

Guild Wars is the perfect recipe for the worst community ever. First, and this is actually the most important ingredient, is the game's basis on PvP. If you have ever played a game with PvP in it, you probably noticed the kinds of people actually participating in it (not all, just a majority of them). Just browsing the PvP forums for these games is enough to know what I'm talking about. Gankers, griefers, and people who just basically don't care about anyone but themselves and hide behind the wall of anonymity known as the internet. It's not the same kind of PvP in GW, but it's still the same kind of people. The next two I already mentioned, the cheap price and popularity. I was going to expand on this, but I've lost the will to do so. At any rate, I saw it coming, I knew this was what I was spending my money on, and I don't regret it. Despite the other people playing it, this game is pretty good as a single player game.

I would have to disagree with you here. I understand that having someone who knows how to play their class can be, at times, hard to find. However, when I join a group I will say hi and reply with greetings to everyone who has one. Then when the mission starts I am more focused on my job (as a primary monk) to complete the mission with the least amount of casualties as possible. Though I may not speak much during a mission or quest I do get the job done.

I do agree that finding someone who types out full sentences and such can be nice if you do want a conversation during the mission. One thing that I can't stand is when people use "i", "u", "1337", and such. This becomes annoying very fast.

Yes but dear zai, remember that we have the advantages of GW as well, which counterbalance the extreme amount of morons. Live with some evil, and remember that kiddies have short attention spans in general. ^.^

Side note: If ANYONE ever wants a decent partner for a mission, you are welcome to ask me for a few minutes. I DONT mind going back into low level areas to help, as long as I get a poke at the chance for a few salvage materials I do it anyways, so helping you out is not a problem. I also use TS and have ventrilo as well, so if you use VoIP I dont mind hopping on your server [For now, mine's down. Maintenance ]

Ranger/Mesmer [currently level 18], farthest area is ventari's refuge. Yeah I know, I'm slacking. In game name: Celoladur Varilon

I feel like most of you feel here. Lately, I'll I've been doing is questing solo. I have thought a few times about joining into a party and so fourth but in all honesty, after coming into certain towns and seeing rediculous spamming of the global chat by immature people, it just drives me bonkers and just makes me pick up the henchmen I need and head out again.

I understand that not everyone is like the majority out there but at the same time, I don't want to find myself in a group where nobody knows how to play or draws aggro like crazy cause they think they're hercules. I have come from World of Warcraft and I have been in one too many groups there where this has been the case. This game has a greater aggro range then WoW does so I want to know I can trust certain people.

I think that I will be waiting it out till I reach ascension or close to it before I decide to group with people or put my trust out there.

Feel free to add me to your friend's list. I'm a Mo/E11 (almost12), I'm on evenings after work. I would be more than happy to quest with some other like-minded adults.

Sum Tin Wong Mo/E11

It's interesting...

Though I've participated in many online team based games, crpgs and role-playing communites, this is my first semi-MMO experince. I'm here because of there not being a monthly charge, and because it's the first ORPG I've come across that doesn't require several hundred hours of playtime to just keep pace with everyone else. I'm 35 and simply not able to invest 25 hours a week into a video game anymore.

While I've witnessed much of what you guys talk about so far, and it can be very annoying, I've also met some really nice people in the early stages of the game, and virtually all of them new players. Most of those that I whisper help to or trade with are polite and courteous. In local chat, it's not that hard to tell who is ok and who isn't.

On the other hand, there's been several times that I've witnessed apparently experienced players berating or talking down to new players. Much of the time it does feel like the people I'd really like to be interacting with couldn't be bothered and have already given up on public interaction.

While I respect those who are experienced mmorpg players, as well as those who participated in the beta cycle, there does seem to be a farily prevalent elitist perspective in regards to new players in general, and it's not very subtle. One can spend just a little time reading through the online forum communities and guild manifestos to pick that up. From those readings, one would surmise that PUGs are a four letter word, worthy of only disdain and ridicule. For the longest time I thought it was synonym for noob, until I figured out what it meant.

Maybe it's just the nature of the beast, but I was really hoping for a little more adult interaction with experienced players in this game, and am still hopeful that it could happen more frequently. Yet that isn't going to happen if the majority of experienced players won't interact.

Not everyone just picking up this game is some young punk or moron. Adults who have always shied away from MMOs due to finanical and time commitments will possibly be arriving as well. In the same manner, there are many who can't offer or invest the time into meeting the requirements that most 'experienced' guilds demand, and so are going to look for more casual group play. Many simply aren't familiar with the game's dynamics or with popular rpg ettiquette or don't frequent forums like this, yet are willing and excited to learn.

Sometimes the best thing for a new player is to party with a seasoned player. One leads through example. It will be unfortunate if the majority of seasoned veterans avoid new players, snub their noses at them and don't give them a chance. Much of what you guys are suggesting could very easily lead toward the inadvertent creation of elitist social clubs disguised as guilds, which is just as high school as those whoz l33t skillz pwns u.

Patience, compassion and understanding of others can go a long way toward making this game more enjoyable for not just those others, but ourselves as well. In reality it's not always that easy to reach out a helping hand to those in need, and many of us can't just start handing out $20 bills to the homeless. But in a game world, we can be whatever we want to be...

When we empower others, we empower ourselves and the whole world around us - whether in reality or fantasy. That's my experience anyway.

I'm an E/W and tend to charge into battle alot. I'm quite aware that I ain't gonna last long, so I usually follow my party into the fray, throw some powerful spells off from a distance then charge in and offload my spells that do the most damage up close before high tailing it out of there. (with this method, there aren't many mobs that can take me down if I have a decent healer when I decide to be stupid and charge in)

However, if anyone wants some help, I too offer my services. Our guild the GST (Giga Squad Team) usually is willing to help around and I don't mind going out of my way to help someone. Add "Sekkira Nendedaga" E/W15

As a Ne/Me I'm not in high demand for goups :P
Not like a monk or so.

As for the original post - I can say that my experience have been allmost the opposite. Perhaps 10% (max) of the people I have PUGed with or traded with have been yerks...

But then again I don't trade much (anyone wants monk runes or staff wrappings?).

And as for missions and maps I allmost allways try them out with henchmens first to know what they are about so I don't totally kill my PUG later.

With the new hench AI tho I've found I finish lots of missons with them... for example I did Dunes of Despair with henches, rather easily.

Now I'm in a guild and waiting for them to ascend so we can take on Glint - henchies did not work well here :P

"Patience, compassion and understanding of others can go a long way toward making this game more enjoyable for not just those others, but ourselves as well. In reality it's not always that easy to reach out a helping hand to those in need, and many of us can't just start handing out $20 bills to the homeless. But in a game world, we can be whatever we want to be...

When we empower others, we empower ourselves and the whole world around us - whether in reality or fantasy. That's my experience anyway."

Well said.
My experience has been the same in this game. For the most part right now I am soloing and playing with one other person. I am in the motions of learning to play the game and being a noob again, which i don't mind as I enjoy the challenge of learning the in's and out's of things on my own.

However, I do like to take any request for help as an opertunity to meet new people and share what little knowledge I have with someone. I find this kind of courtesy even from one person can renew others faith in people. It can also be the foundation for a good comunity.

If you need help or just want to team the names Kilrautheus Grea. I'm currently lvl 7.

I think the reason is because the game is largely disposable, and doesn't have any real penalties for failure.

Think about it. In EQ, if you died, you PAID THE PRICE, in blood. Hours of "work" lost. To avoid dying, you absolutely HAD to work together as a unit.

In GW, you can pop into a group, attack whatever you want, and if you die you get rezed, no big deal. If your group wipes, you rez at an altar, no big deal. Sure, you're running around with a -15 to -60, but that's easily cleaned away.

Also, many of the players are apparently new to the genre, even if they have come from WoW or whatever. They don't know how to work together as a team; they don't even realise how important or how much more effective it is.

In every pickup group I lead, I drill in two things:
(1) follow the leader (usually me, though not always)
(2) use called targets, always drop one mob at a time
(3) don't run off to attack something "near" us that isn't attacking us if the leader isn't leading in that direction.

These seem to me to be obvious, simple things. But to the people who hear that GW is like Diablo and they come from D2, they're used to soloing, even if they are "grouping". I had one knucklehead join my group and then go fight off on his own. He got killed and just left. Obviously, I was glad to see him go.

I have noticed since the retail release I've been getting more and more stupid players. During Beta Weekends there were a lot better players per square pixel, lol.

It's like they don';t unbderstand their role in the group. They keep splitting up going off on their own. They charge of into a bed of enemies without giving me a chance to heal the group. It sad.

As a monk I can't heal a spilt up group. I only do Storyline Missions with a pick up group. Most quests I do with henchies. I notice there aren't many people willing to help out in a quest since the release.

Well said! I may start using that. As a monk it's hard to lead, but I think just saying that will help get some losers straight.

Every now and then I get a group who just clicks. You don't have to say a word. Everyone knows their job and just does it.

PM me, I started a guild just to start one. I usually spend a lot of time (not as much since I pretty much "found" everything) in pre-searing. After I complete all the quests (I have 4 on my list, and two to go "get") in pre-searing I'll take my W/Ranger and head to post searing. Betwixt my post-searing m/r and pre-searing w/r I think I've finally found some comfy builds.

I must just be lucky as I do see a lot of spamming "UBER BOW 4-6dmg 90GP" messages sometimes, but for the most part I've gotten thanks for giving relatively good directions on where to find trainers, etc to anyone who asks. I've had plenty of good experiences with the folks I've talked to or teamed up with temporarily. Thank you to all those who made that experience great.

I will admit there are people who play with emote a little too much but I really don't think much of it anymore as the fundamental principle of the game is to have fun. I don't see how someone trying to leet speak or talking on a 2nd grade level would be too bad as all games need their barbarians . Perhaps if there are pressing social issues with GW a faq should be written on GW etiquite. However, since when would the "offending" population read a faq?

I actually like helping people and sometimes I guess I am rude when I answer a question and run off into the woods for another solo trip without waiting for a response. Am I rude for doing so?

The games free.

That means kids just need to steal 40 bucks outta mommies purse and they can play all they want.

Interesting thread. This is my first MMORPG with a long history of RPG dating back some 15 years. Not because of money, but because of the playstyle and people and problems inherent to the games (or so I read) on boards over the years.

So why now? I saw the reviews and liked the ideas of private regions and thought why not.

Overall, it is actually better than I expected. I have been able to team up with an individual each night and explore and travel together. I type out one structured request and if I don't have any takers, move to another server. I do laugh that you can be in a town with 50 players and only 2 people ever type anything. The majority of people seem to like watching emotes more than typing but my bet is that few type well.

I've joined a guild and hope that with time I will develop a group of friends that I can travel with and enjoy the game world with. I think it will get better as time goes on because my friend list is growing and even if the towns continue to be overrun with lame named dudes, there will be pockets of mature players.

At least that is the hope. But there is no doubt that it will have a type of very short attention span, run, click, run majority of players. That said, I think they structured the game to allow both sides to coexist and have fun.

I have had great trouble finding decent groups. Most of the time I find myself questing w/mercenaries solo.

If anyone has a mature clan with members that are helpful and work well together, please pm Light Parrot.

Most people I have found are pride filled idiots, who dash of by themselves and die.... AND IM PAST THE DESERT FOR GOD SAKE!

I always use henchmen because I cannot find a competent group of people to quest with. I hate to admit it, but the henchmen actually put alot of the players to shame.

I've found it easier and easier to find groups that are idiot-less since I passed Lyon's Arch. I just did The Wilds last night, and it was one of the best groups I've had in any game. We beat the mission with teamwork, since we were really too weak to tackle it with brute force. I hope this isn't just because I'm ahead of the waves of n00bs (there were only 3 or 4 districts for the mission, and I was astonished).

Hey dude, I consider myself a very responsible and reliable player. I play with my friends only usually because of the other rude players. We use voice chat and are planning on starting a respectable guild so we will have a good source of people to do guild wars and missions. We will only be inviting the best people we think should be invited, very few outsiders from people we know iwll be invited. We arnt that far into the game yet so we arn't the best people in the world at the game but we put in a good effort. If you ever really need a good buddy to team up with look up Heoki Bladesmen. That's my in game character name. I do have horrificly bad grammer so don't judge me on that. I rarely use any proper grammer at all when talking real fast on the fly in game.

Lol, I find the opposite. I just explain that if they run off again I'm not wasting my energy trying to keep them alive. Yeah, it's rough, but if they won't listen they deserve it. You have limited energy and can't waste it on a guy who's trying to accumulate a 60% DP. As the monk you have more say than anyone else, and you can teach them to play - after all, the threat of losing their monk is enough to get most players to listen to you.

As to the whole hostility thing, small actions help a lot. Every time I am in pre-searing Ascalon city I make sure to take at least one person out for the res signet; they're always asking and it takes 5 seconds. I party up with non-guild members constantly, so I am not a guild snob, but it IS nice to ghave a group of like minded folks with whom you can have fun - they're also incredibly reliable, as they know their roles - I've only ever died twice when partied with my guild in PvE, once as a smiting Monk who drew more than I could handle, once last night when 2 of us went off alone and got a little ****y (Hmm, censored eh? I'll say overconfident then...), drew in too many enemies - but I managed to save my party member by casting a well of blood before expiring, so he just stood in it to finish off the group, then brought me back.

A guild is a nice thing, not a necessity, but it connects you to people like yourself - the guild I'm part of is largely older folks like myself; married, kids, playing after work. I doubt that anyone in our guild is "cliquish" nor would they hesitate to do PUGs, though it's true that if you are trying to get somewhere it's faster and easier with people who know how to play.

On that note, I'm around as Neal Andrei (Mo/Me), Andrea Nile (Ne/Mo) and Daniel Aren (Ra/Me) at the moment, in pre-searing, Borlis Pass and Nolani respectively (and Lana Erenid is my newest, Ra/Wa, but not even level 2), so when I'm on give me a shout and if I can help out I would be glad to.