my pet peeve --- "getting hit points back"

a friend of mine liked casinos, and would tell me that there is no such thing as 'playing w/the house's money'.
which is true.
once it goes in your pocket, it becomes your money.

so, I always see people talking about 'getting hit points back' from major/superior runes by using fortitude mods, or maybe vigor runes.

??????

if you don't use the major/superior runes, you'd have even more hit points.

your hit point level is completely arbitrary --- how does anyone figure they 'get hit points back'??

use the runes, don't use the runes, use the mods, or whatever --- just don't try to tell yourself that you're getting anything back.

Um if i read that correctly I think they are talking about useing a vigor rune to cancel a major or sup rune's hp loss.

example: major rune+ major vigor= only a loss of 9 hp, so your "getting" those hp points back.

Does it bother you that much?
You are pretty much trading the bonus that you get off your Vigor rune for more attributes.

this is exactly what I'm talking about.

think about what you're saying.

Arguing about semantics is fun!

it's not semantics.

tell me how many hit points this character should have:

a) 200

b) 250

c) 300

semantics would be if I made the case that, rather than negating a rune penalty w/a fortitude mod, you were actually negating a fortitude mod w/a rune penalty.
that's what semantics is.

which, if you notice, I am actually not doing because it would be equally stupid.

Technically it's your body, so yes, you'd be getting your health back, since you never lost it, just in game terms you've become more vulnerable to short term death without losing protection. It's an equivilent to in the real world, putting on armor but becoming slower, reducing your chances of surviving in most kinds of modern conflicts.

Not a good example, but you get the idea. You're not actually losing anything perse, just trading its limits off for another change in limits.

actually, I have no idea wth you're talking about.

True. You wouldn't nescessarily need sup runes, you could have higher hps by not using them, but from experience I'll tell you, the better your attribute line, the more damage inflicted/healed/interrupted/etc.. This is why people use Superiors/Majors.

The vigor runes + mods cancel the the -75 hp on sup runes, that the talk about "Getting those hp's back" so in essence, you've never lost them. Say you takea +60 hp on mods, and a sup vigor. You effectively cancel the -75 hit you took from the sup runes, so it's like you got an extra 3 skills levels, for nothing. This is what people refer too.

I hope this cleared it up for you.

--The Shim

no, you're mistaken.

the penalty on the maj/sup rune just cancelled the benefit you got from the +health mod.

if you want to derail into semantics.

ps

I don't remember ever coming out against increased attributes.

edit:

you can use any fortitude mod you want, but a -50 penalty will always be a -50 penalty.
it doesn't stop working when you add another mod.

When the other mod cancels out the -HP, yes it does stop working, until the other mod is removed, then the stalemated -50 is returned.

I didn't come out against it either, I was merely suggesting. Don't get critical, get knowledgeable. That's my motto!

It's true the -50 remains, but the mod "stalemates it" effectively erasing it until said mod goes away. It really does work this way.

--The Shim

that's completely wrong, and a perfect illustration of my original post.

as I just said, -50 is -50 whether you add +0, +10, or +100.

Um, it's just an expression. Get over it.

Honestly I don't see anything happening here.

If it's something that bothers you because people say it then well.. sorry. But this isn't much of a discussion, just one guy disagreeing with every poster for conflicting reasons.

-50 is -50, that's right. So it really is semantics now. Shimus has provided the reason as to why people refer to it as gaining hp 'back.' Whether you agree on it being justified as a term is your choice, but there's no discussion involved in it, more of a personal rant.