The rank system is really simplistic right now. It is just an indication of experience, and not player skills, and even more so since many people ranked up via IWAY. I would suggest the following change (applies only to Tombs btw).
1) Each player has a rank. When a match begins the average rank of each team is calculated. The outcome of the match affects everyone's rank...
-if you lose to a really high rank team, your rank goes down very little
-if you lose to a really low rank team, your rank goes down a lot
-if you win against a really high rank team, your rank goes up a lot
-if you win against a really low rank team, your rank barely goes up.
This way, fame is still your measure of experience, and your rank is more of a measure of player skill.
Change to Rank System
Del12
glenn_rolfe
ummmm, Tombs isn't GvG you know
The Purple Pants Guy
What if you could only get fame by holding the Altar?
What does that have to do with anything?
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Originally Posted by glenn_rolfe
ummmm, Tombs isn't GvG you know
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mortalis doleo
the rank system is ok the way it is...
if you have problems finding good players, and you have a hard time evaluating them with questions and what not, play with guildies. it never fails
if you have problems finding good players, and you have a hard time evaluating them with questions and what not, play with guildies. it never fails
Del12
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Originally Posted by mortalis doleo
the rank system is ok the way it is...
if you have problems finding good players, and you have a hard time evaluating them with questions and what not, play with guildies. it never fails |
I don't have problems finding good players. Basically, when one of my PUGs does well, I add people I think contributed to this to my friends list. When it goes not so good, I don't add anyone, and sometimes remove people. For the most part, I have a lot of skilled players on my friends list and make consistently good PUGs. There is a lot of guesswork involved, as you can't pay attention to whatever everyone is doing while playing. Right now, rank means nothing to me. The only reason I look for rank3+ is for experience in general with maps and what not. Rank3 or R45 makes no difference to me, hence I feel its broken.
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Originally Posted by glenn_rolfe
ummmm, Tombs isn't GvG you know
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mortalis doleo
what if you are rank 2, and are stuck with rank 0 noobs in your team, since you cant get into a team?
you come up against a r3+ pug and get owned.
this way it will be even harder for good players to rise up in the ranks.
imo, it would be a bad idea.
you come up against a r3+ pug and get owned.
this way it will be even harder for good players to rise up in the ranks.
imo, it would be a bad idea.
Navaros
Not signed.
The current rank system is a pretty darn good indication of player skill and certainly as good as can be expected given the nature of PVP combat in Guild Wars.
This suggestion seems like a sneaky way for unskilled players to try to leech off the backs of good players by acquiring more fame than they have actually legitimately earned and trying to hold good players back simply because they are skilled. That must never happen, or all the good players will (rightfully) quit.
The current rank system is a pretty darn good indication of player skill and certainly as good as can be expected given the nature of PVP combat in Guild Wars.
This suggestion seems like a sneaky way for unskilled players to try to leech off the backs of good players by acquiring more fame than they have actually legitimately earned and trying to hold good players back simply because they are skilled. That must never happen, or all the good players will (rightfully) quit.
darkdragon99
change rank system no no remove it how the hell can you gain fame or rank if you can't even get in a group cause you don't have the famein rank it's total bs
glenn_rolfe
The endless threads about fame and rank are making me sick. The only suggestions seem to be some way of reducing experienced players to the level of inexperienced players, and vice versa because new players to PvP aren't willing to do the hard yards that experienced players have already done.
Well some people have worked hard for their fame and rank, and in the process have built up a friends/guild list sharing the same objectives.
Just do it yourself, quit whining, and go start a group. Stop your lame excuses about not being able to find a group and just start one. It ain't hard.
Here, I'll even give you your line.
"Starting group for players less than R3, whisper what you can play"
And for god's sake download vent and TS and get a headset with a mic. It's as important as a graphics card.
****so angry at these threads***** (oh yeah, I've got rage issues. I think I need to see a proctologist)
Well some people have worked hard for their fame and rank, and in the process have built up a friends/guild list sharing the same objectives.
Just do it yourself, quit whining, and go start a group. Stop your lame excuses about not being able to find a group and just start one. It ain't hard.
Here, I'll even give you your line.
"Starting group for players less than R3, whisper what you can play"
And for god's sake download vent and TS and get a headset with a mic. It's as important as a graphics card.
****so angry at these threads***** (oh yeah, I've got rage issues. I think I need to see a proctologist)
lishi
yea THIS(losing fame) will give a big boost in trying funny,new,original build in tomb and will definitly help low raked pug get in some ranked group(i will never really on pug at all)
Clusmas
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Originally Posted by Navaros
The current rank system is a pretty darn good indication of player skill and certainly as good as can be expected given the nature of PVP combat in Guild Wars.
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Just to point out the blatantly obvious (which is probably very necessary for someone who made a statement like that):
That was sarcasm.
Anyway, this idea is straight out of another thread Del (I know because I wrote it). So you may like to see the responses there.
Hannibel
/not signed
this has no way of showing how good a player is, there's no way to show it,, anyone can be good the more experience you have, the easier it is for you to understand crap, and Del your system won't show anything for experience since it's a team based arena it won't show jackshit, and it would just make people angry about the fame/rank system, you making a suggestion with these kinds of change shows that your really not a person who really cares about tombs at all, and if you suck at tombs then it'll backfire on you and it will drive new people away because they'll be stuck doing same thing over and over again, the fame/rank system is fine, it doesn't really indicate whether your good or not from rank 1-6, but if your rank 9 you probably didn't earn all that doing iway unless maybe if your in Your Math Teacher.
this has no way of showing how good a player is, there's no way to show it,, anyone can be good the more experience you have, the easier it is for you to understand crap, and Del your system won't show anything for experience since it's a team based arena it won't show jackshit, and it would just make people angry about the fame/rank system, you making a suggestion with these kinds of change shows that your really not a person who really cares about tombs at all, and if you suck at tombs then it'll backfire on you and it will drive new people away because they'll be stuck doing same thing over and over again, the fame/rank system is fine, it doesn't really indicate whether your good or not from rank 1-6, but if your rank 9 you probably didn't earn all that doing iway unless maybe if your in Your Math Teacher.
Epinephrine
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Originally Posted by Navaros
Not signed.
The current rank system is a pretty darn good indication of player skill and certainly as good as can be expected given the nature of PVP combat in Guild Wars. This suggestion seems like a sneaky way for unskilled players to try to leech off the backs of good players by acquiring more fame than they have actually legitimately earned and trying to hold good players back simply because they are skilled. That must never happen, or all the good players will (rightfully) quit. |
TGgold
I personally don't think rank is good, especially with how discriminatory it makes everything. Personally, I don't do organized PvP because nobody wants anyone rank 3 or less. So, I just random arena, where nobody can listen or coordinate even a simple spike.
Yes, try having a little bit of skill and beign Rank 0. Most people who already have thier Rank at 3+ don't get how hard it is to find anyone good. Especially with a non PvP oriented guild.
On the other hand, to the people who said that this would let experienced players mooch off of others: If you take the average rank of the team, it's hard to mooch off higher skileld people, no?
Yes, try having a little bit of skill and beign Rank 0. Most people who already have thier Rank at 3+ don't get how hard it is to find anyone good. Especially with a non PvP oriented guild.
On the other hand, to the people who said that this would let experienced players mooch off of others: If you take the average rank of the team, it's hard to mooch off higher skileld people, no?
Del12
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Originally Posted by Navaros
Not signed.
The current rank system is a pretty darn good indication of player skill and certainly as good as can be expected given the nature of PVP combat in Guild Wars. |
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Originally Posted by mortalis doleo
what if you are rank 2, and are stuck with rank 0 noobs in your team, since you cant get into a team?
you come up against a r3+ pug and get owned. |
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Originally Posted by Clusmas
Anyway, this idea is straight out of another thread Del (I know because I wrote it). So you may like to see the responses there.
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Originally Posted by Hannibel
/not signed
and Del your system won't show anything for experience since it's a team based arena it won't show jackshit |
I doubt this idea would ever happen anyways, it's just an idea. Still, the current rank system tells nothing of player skill. Rank could have been gotten by riding along with a good guild, playing a farming build, or just playing A LOT more than someone else. If someone gets 700 fame in say 700 hours, and another gets 700 fame in 300 hours, who would you say is better? Currently they'd both be rank5, and you have no way to tell.
Theos
Rank is currently garbage to be farmed by IWAY or other FotM builds, I wouldn't mind the entire thing disapearing but having a way to show actual skill would be nice... if possible.
If you defend this current rank system you a) are an IWAY farmer, b) are very attached to a number, c) know very little.
If you defend this current rank system you a) are an IWAY farmer, b) are very attached to a number, c) know very little.
{IceFire}
/not signed
Amn_En_Tarsath
- Remove "Rank".
+ Implement "See Skillbar".
+ Implement "See Skillbar".
Lucifer
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Originally Posted by glenn_rolfe
The endless threads about fame and rank are making me sick. The only suggestions seem to be some way of reducing experienced players to the level of inexperienced players, and vice versa because new players to PvP aren't willing to do the hard yards that experienced players have already done.
Well some people have worked hard for their fame and rank, and in the process have built up a friends/guild list sharing the same objectives. Just do it yourself, quit whining, and go start a group. Stop your lame excuses about not being able to find a group and just start one. It ain't hard. Here, I'll even give you your line. "Starting group for players less than R3, whisper what you can play" And for god's sake download vent and TS and get a headset with a mic. It's as important as a graphics card. ****so angry at these threads***** (oh yeah, I've got rage issues. I think I need to see a proctologist) |
Do u think everybody that is r3+ atm started out with minimum 180 fame?
NO, we also had troubles finding groups and all the stuff r3- has problems with now.
Either u keep whining and it will never improve, or u start your groups and do something about it
Chev of Hardass
As long as there are;EoE bombs, IWAY, Minion Factories, and builds of these sorts that can beat a good team purely based on the oddity of the build your system is completely screwed up.
Besides part of the fun in Tombs is having a place to go and try new builds that may seem stupid after you realize how bad you got owned by n00bs. If you take that away from the game.......bla.
Then people will either become very Elitist and never allow anyone that they do not get a personal recomendation from.
Terrible idea!!!!! I think somepeople need to learn to just play tombs for fun. If it is not fun to you because of your rank, it will never be fun.
Besides part of the fun in Tombs is having a place to go and try new builds that may seem stupid after you realize how bad you got owned by n00bs. If you take that away from the game.......bla.
Then people will either become very Elitist and never allow anyone that they do not get a personal recomendation from.
Terrible idea!!!!! I think somepeople need to learn to just play tombs for fun. If it is not fun to you because of your rank, it will never be fun.
Chev of Hardass
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Originally Posted by Theos
Rank is currently garbage to be farmed by IWAY or other FotM builds, I wouldn't mind the entire thing disapearing but having a way to show actual skill would be nice... if possible.
If you defend this current rank system you a) are an IWAY farmer, b) are very attached to a number, c) know very little. |
This is a bold faced lie!!!!!!!
I played IWAY a little bit. My guild even ran some IWAY groups and we met some nice people there. However, I never imagined how fast the fame would come after I started playing highly symbiotic balanced builds.
The poster obviously has no idea of what he is talking about and only repeats what others have said.
Evidence:
-I have played tombs off and on since I ascended my first character (one week after realease). Those builds were unorganized at best. I got about 110 fame that way. (over several months)
-I gave in to the IWAY craze when finding balanced groups became nearly impossible.
-I farmed the rest of the way to rank 3 with EoE bombs and MInion Factories (p.S. watching the footbal game while playing the dead guy is a sweet deal, lol)
-I played with someone that inspired my own Tombs build.
-In one month of playing balanced synergetic builds I have gotten over 600 fame, where IWAY was much harder to get fame with.
IWAY is good for farming fame for one reason:
It is easy to make/get in groups.
Because of that people drop from IWAY grops all the time, and no one really takes it seriously, unless a guild group is running IWAY.
Do not give into the hype!!! IWAY is fast for farming fame, if you have not learned the ins and out of the Tombs, yet. Most players will outgrow it, because 10 fame in one run is not that good of a number. I had never seen a 100 fame run until I gave up on IWAY completely.
IWAY is still a good way to releave that Hack-and-Slash syndrome that I have burning inside of me left from the lack of farming, but not what I do to farm fame.
Music Baby
i think the rank system is ok the way it is. sometimes it depend on luck also. what if u die because of lag? and lose to low rank team? will u be angry? like in the army, u win the war u get promoted. what if u lose? the army is not going to demote u...
Clusmas
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Originally Posted by Amn_En_Tarsath
- Remove "Rank".
+ Implement "See Skillbar". |
But then you get the problem of people just copying skill bars from places like GWG forums - without understanding how they work.
Hannibel
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Originally Posted by Del
You don't think that if your a good player, on average, over a whole lot of games, your teams will do better than average against equally ranked opponents? If you say no, then I'd say you are just an average player. I doubt this idea would ever happen anyways, it's just an idea. Still, the current rank system tells nothing of player skill. Rank could have been gotten by riding along with a good guild, playing a farming build, or just playing A LOT more than someone else. If someone gets 700 fame in say 700 hours, and another gets 700 fame in 300 hours, who would you say is better? Currently they'd both be rank5, and you have no way to tell. |
or below. Arena net never said that rank was to show the experience or skill you have in pvp, it's a reward for winning, loosing fame for loosing is one of the stupidest things i've heard on these forums, it'll just keep these new players down from getting any fame, and there will be less and less people quitting pvp because they have nothing to do, there's a reason why they put up the GvG ladder.... maybe you should come up with an original idea. 
Del12
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Originally Posted by Hannibel
the difference between getting good teams and bad teams is a just luck if your doing pug
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But, whatever, there is no measure for player skill in this game, and never will be unless they change something. That, combined with the fact there is no interface for assembling groups (hence it takes 30-60+ minutes), has made me lose interest altogether. Hopefully, in chapter 2, they add something to help the lowly random PUG leaders.
twicky_kid
Rank means nothing and is no indicator of player's skill. I know plenty of rank 9 players that have only played IWAY. Stick them on a mes and see what happens. Skill is for GvG not tombs.
I think the current system is bad but your suggestion will make it even worse. If rewards are based on your avg rank in team the optimal reward would be to have people that are the same rank as you. Instead of a mix of rank players we will have people looking for other players only their rank. That will make things worse.
I think the current system is bad but your suggestion will make it even worse. If rewards are based on your avg rank in team the optimal reward would be to have people that are the same rank as you. Instead of a mix of rank players we will have people looking for other players only their rank. That will make things worse.
Chev of Hardass
Hidden in your last rant is the answer.
If there was some sort of interface to show what a group is looking for or for groups to see what is availble, things would be better.
Frankly, in Tombs, there should be a grouping chat that is strictly monitored and going across your home districts and international districts.
If there was some sort of interface to show what a group is looking for or for groups to see what is availble, things would be better.
Frankly, in Tombs, there should be a grouping chat that is strictly monitored and going across your home districts and international districts.
Kool Pajamas
/not signed
Rank and Fame need to go PERIOD.
Rank and Fame need to go PERIOD.
meneldur
I agree with you, fame doesn't say anything about player skill with IWAY everywhere. I'm sure 90% of the people argueing with you are IWAY noobs themselfs, and don't want any changes like this, because their fame will go down the drain.
Mr.Asdf
Everyone keeps saying how hard it is to become r3+, and what I think Anet should do is create seperate arenas or divisions where only people of the same rank could go. For example, 0-2 ranks would have a seperate pvp area than the 3-5 ranks, and they would never have to face each other in pvp. But when you get to rank 3, you would be moved up to the rank 3-5 division and play against teams with generally the same skill level.
Trelon Burg
No offense, but if you don't like it stop playing. If you don't want to waste your time with bad groups, and occasionally a really fun and good group(hell even some bad ones are kinda fun)...then don't. People seem to think everything in a game should be easy, but they don't realize that not everyone can be the best. So the real thing you should be asking is why am i still doing this if i don't enjoy it? No one is forcing you to play the game and by saying nerf IWAY or FotM is saying you don't have the will or the ability to overcome those fame farming builds. And anyone who has been in <r3 knows that iway loses to well organized teams, so stop your whining and start using your brains.
Chev of Hardass
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Originally Posted by Trelon Burg
No offense, but if you don't like it stop playing. If you don't want to waste your time with bad groups, and occasionally a really fun and good group(hell even some bad ones are kinda fun)...then don't. People seem to think everything in a game should be easy, but they don't realize that not everyone can be the best. So the real thing you should be asking is why am i still doing this if i don't enjoy it? No one is forcing you to play the game and by saying nerf IWAY or FotM is saying you don't have the will or the ability to overcome those fame farming builds. And anyone who has been in <r3 knows that iway loses to well organized teams, so stop your whining and start using your brains.
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Read this again, you may have missed his point.