Now its been about half a year tat for me the whole leaver issue has started. Before that people would nearly never leave and if they did they would warn people be4 or at least tell them when they where about to. Instead now its like people leave left and right all the time, some because theyre bored, some because of err7 and some because they want to get the survivor title.
So its been half a year now that in every pug ive been with leavers people complained about them, and in around 90% of the cases someone would come up with the solution to this problem: henchmen.
Since most of the times a mission/quest gets to be impossible after a couple people leave (even if its a good team with experienced players) people started thinking that its better to replace the leaver by a henchman of his class then to play with less players.
How many times was the mission/quest going really good until 2-3 people decided to leave and let the other players loose because of that. And how many times did the only monk in the team leave and every1 died even thought they wouldve been better off with alesia? Its like if anet is punishing us because of people leaving. And since its becoming an always bigger problem i think its time for a solution.
Lets say a lvl15 w/mo leaves durning the mission/quest (it doesnt matter why), then he gets replaced by a lvl15 w/mo henchman. Its that simple. Of course the henchman will never be as good as the real player but at least he will help in the mission/quest and it will be less difficult for the other players to accomplish the mission/quest.
SO ANET, REPLACE LEAVERS BY HENCHMAN COPIES OF THEM!!!
The solution to leavers: henchmen!
Dj Tano
Raiin Maker
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dj Tano
Now its been about half a year tat for me the whole leaver issue has started. Before that people would nearly never leave and if they did they would warn people be4 or at least tell them when they where about to. Instead now its like people leave left and right all the time, some because theyre bored, some because of err7 and some because they want to get the survivor title.
So its been half a year now that in every pug ive been with leavers people complained about them, and in around 90% of the cases someone would come up with the solution to this problem: henchmen. Since most of the times a mission/quest gets to be impossible after a couple people leave (even if its a good team with experienced players) people started thinking that its better to replace the leaver by a henchman of his class then to play with less players. How many times was the mission/quest going really good until 2-3 people decided to leave and let the other players loose because of that. And how many times did the only monk in the team leave and every1 died even thought they wouldve been better off with alesia? Its like if anet is punishing us because of people leaving. And since its becoming an always bigger problem i think its time for a solution. Lets say a lvl15 w/mo leaves durning the mission/quest (it doesnt matter why), then he gets replaced by a lvl15 w/mo henchman. Its that simple. Of course the henchman will never be as good as the real player but at least he will help in the mission/quest and it will be less difficult for the other players to accomplish the mission/quest. SO ANET, REPLACE LEAVERS BY HENCHMAN COPIES OF THEM!!! |
Bhaaltazar
I would suggest they leavers would be replaced with hencman which is the same class as leavers primary class ( with default skill set.. same as if u pick henc in town ).
Ristaron
/signed for Bhaaltazar's suggestion
Xenex Xclame
At the current state i dont believe this is possible , simply because as soon as you go into a area/mission everything is loaded , and people/mobs dont get loaded in a map after your already in,So they would have to change the way the game is before being able to do that,it might be possible when you go tru a zone ,but besides that not.
However when/if they add the recconects then this might be possible.
However when/if they add the recconects then this might be possible.
Kai Nui
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Originally Posted by Raiin Maker
only problem is if they copy the skills, then it means arenanet will have to program massive amounts if AI into these coppy henchmen, if this were added, it would have to be one of a set build/or AI that was the same class as the leaver.
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As for the issue of replacing people, I'd have to say no. Namely because all I do is FoW and UW where henchmen aren't allowed and even in HA if someone leaves they are replaced with a random henchman.
tyche7
/signed
this sounds awesome.
especially now with the skill templates - it could simply save that template and use it on the hench added to the team to replace the dropped one(s).
this sounds awesome.
especially now with the skill templates - it could simply save that template and use it on the hench added to the team to replace the dropped one(s).
Nemo the Capitalist
/shoots petition down
too much data and work for the dev team they ave their hands full like all games GW is imperfect but its imperfections make it enjoyable.
What is good in life Conan?
Crush your enemies,
See them driven before you,
and hear the lamentations of their women!
too much data and work for the dev team they ave their hands full like all games GW is imperfect but its imperfections make it enjoyable.
What is good in life Conan?
Crush your enemies,
See them driven before you,
and hear the lamentations of their women!
nekopowa
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Raiin Maker
only problem is if they copy the skills, then it means arenanet will have to program massive amounts if AI into these coppy henchmen, if this were added, it would have to be one of a set build/or AI that was the same class as the leaver.
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Why would they have to write a complete new AI? You do remember there are heroes which have customizable skills and professions? The AI is already made.
stealthslicer
/signed, BUT how many hundreds of times has somthing like this been sugested??!! Please can an admin close this. Please!
Frazzy
/notsigned
I just do everything with heroes, they are better than humans. Just unlock a few elites and gogogogo! A lvl 5 Koss with any Warrior elite in the game or a lvl 5 monk who tries to heal you with Troll Unguent...
Or possibly a human who attacks a Warrior when there is a Monk in the enemies group or a Henchmen who follows your targets. Just use the original henchmen in the town/outpost you are going to start your quest from...common sense.
I just do everything with heroes, they are better than humans. Just unlock a few elites and gogogogo! A lvl 5 Koss with any Warrior elite in the game or a lvl 5 monk who tries to heal you with Troll Unguent...
Or possibly a human who attacks a Warrior when there is a Monk in the enemies group or a Henchmen who follows your targets. Just use the original henchmen in the town/outpost you are going to start your quest from...common sense.
creelie
/signed for a "Ghost of X" replacement henchman using the leaver's template.
Lydz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Frazzy
/notsigned
I just do everything with heroes, they are better than humans. Just unlock a few elites and gogogogo! A lvl 5 Koss with any Warrior elite in the game or a lvl 5 monk who tries to heal you with Troll Unguent... Or possibly a human who attacks a Warrior when there is a Monk in the enemies group or a Henchmen who follows your targets. Just use the original henchmen in the town/outpost you are going to start your quest from...common sense. |
tenshi_strife
yea /signed.... i dont see the harm in this at all, this would be great in RA too. lol it would solve lots of complaints all in one fell swoop.
MithranArkanere
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Raiin Maker
only problem is if they copy the skills, then it means arenanet will have to program massive amounts if AI into these coppy henchmen, if this were added, it would have to be one of a set build/or AI that was the same class as the leaver.
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Do you actually think that Gorem and Koss have different AIs?
No, they use the very same AI.
I think that even the different classes use the same AI.
Don't you beleive me?
Put a Gr build to a monk and a monk built to a gr hero, and you'll see that they act accordinlgy to thei buiñd, not to their classes.
Even if you use the same build a henchman has, an Hero will act EXACTLY as the hechmans usually does.
So I'm positive than all heroes and henchman use the same AI, that just considers the skills and weapons they have.
A Gr leaves, a copy of him that will act EXACTLY as
Currently, when you leave a party, your heroes stay behind.
Why not a 'shadow' version of yourself?
You leave, and your model becomes and empty shell controled by the AI.
I an see only one problem about this:
This will allow friends to give you up to 7 heroes, by entering with you and then leaving. So you could use completely personalized builds without real help of others, although you won't be able to completely control the 'shadows', that's true.
But it would be definitely a good idea, thet would prevent in most cases a domino effect when one player laves, then other do, and the mission goes to hell.
Lexxor
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bhaaltazar
I would suggest they leavers would be replaced with hencman which is the same class as leavers primary class ( with default skill set.. same as if u pick henc in town ).
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vergerefosh
/signed for bhaaltazar's solution, seems clean quick and easy
TigMagick
/signed for Bhaaltazar's suggestion
Or just being able to a a hero if someone has an extra one
Or just being able to a a hero if someone has an extra one
genofreek
What do you do if someone loses their connection with the server thanks to lag, but rejoins the team about 5 minutes later? Does their NPC replacement vanish when they reappear?
That seems like an awful lot of work. Yes, it's irritating when a key player decides to leave (screw you, survivor monk in ZD the other night), but then you get over it and press on without them or start over. I don't know how the dev team would even begin to implement this.
That seems like an awful lot of work. Yes, it's irritating when a key player decides to leave (screw you, survivor monk in ZD the other night), but then you get over it and press on without them or start over. I don't know how the dev team would even begin to implement this.
MithranArkanere
It would be very easy if the system made this:
1. Create copies of the players when the game loads. Copies do not ned to look like them, thy could look like PvP generic Zaishen hencmen.
2. When one of the players suffers from disconection, the copy receives the same effects and damege in energy and health, and is teleported to where the original was.
If the original reconnect, he can't go back in PvP, but he will replace the original again in PvE.
That should do.
1. Create copies of the players when the game loads. Copies do not ned to look like them, thy could look like PvP generic Zaishen hencmen.
2. When one of the players suffers from disconection, the copy receives the same effects and damege in energy and health, and is teleported to where the original was.
If the original reconnect, he can't go back in PvP, but he will replace the original again in PvE.
That should do.
Komradkyle
This is a great idea but I can see too many clones being made by exploiting, those a holes showed their abilities with the armbraces
Quru
Doppenganger is bad example. It just spams skills from 1-8.
KairuByte
/signed for empty shell controlled by AI
Faer
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/showthread.php?p=3095214#post3095214
Locking this thread, and all the other "Fix Leavers" threads in Sardelac, for the time being. When the new system is revealed, we'll look at it, look at these threads, and see if they need reopened or not. Until then, let's all be patient and see what we get.
EDIT: Shayne Hawke: The anti-leaver system referenced in the linked thread is likely the Dishonor system. As this suggestion seems to be more PvE-focused, this thread is no longer closed.
Locking this thread, and all the other "Fix Leavers" threads in Sardelac, for the time being. When the new system is revealed, we'll look at it, look at these threads, and see if they need reopened or not. Until then, let's all be patient and see what we get.
EDIT: Shayne Hawke: The anti-leaver system referenced in the linked thread is likely the Dishonor system. As this suggestion seems to be more PvE-focused, this thread is no longer closed.
miss_d_evil
Perhaps there could be an option of adding a hero if someone leaves
vandevere
I'm all for something replacing a leaver. I don't care if it's a Hero, a Henchy, or even the ability to replace a leaver with another player.
All these years people have been proposing all sorts of ideas to "Fix" pugs. Most of these suggested "Fixes" have come in the form of nerfs to one skill or another.
But, the thing that will truly FIX pugs has never been done.
What's my greatest fear when I Pug in an Elite area? That someone indispensable to the group-a Monk, maybe?-will leave, thereby dooming the group to failure.
Fixing THAT would be the single greatest fix to Pugs ever.
All these years people have been proposing all sorts of ideas to "Fix" pugs. Most of these suggested "Fixes" have come in the form of nerfs to one skill or another.
But, the thing that will truly FIX pugs has never been done.
What's my greatest fear when I Pug in an Elite area? That someone indispensable to the group-a Monk, maybe?-will leave, thereby dooming the group to failure.
Fixing THAT would be the single greatest fix to Pugs ever.
Zahr Dalsk
Quote:
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Originally Posted by vandevere
But, the thing that will truly FIX pugs has never been done.
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Mintha Syl
/signed but only if the henchmen is standard and doesn't copy player's skills, other way it would be like having a full hero party
MagmaRed
Thread Necro strikes again.
/unsigned
Yes, leavers can cause problems, but HOW would you replace them? So, for example, if you have a Monk on your team, and it leaves, do you get a Monk? Makes sense, but what about if you have a Ritualist leave? Was it running a spirit build, a Restoration healer build, a Spirit's Strength melee build, a spell casting nuker build, or something else? And RA already replaces people, so that leaves the spots where team build is more important and used. I just don't see this as being an easy fix, and getting a crappy AI hench to replace a player may make things worse than playing short a person, or of starting over.
/unsigned
Yes, leavers can cause problems, but HOW would you replace them? So, for example, if you have a Monk on your team, and it leaves, do you get a Monk? Makes sense, but what about if you have a Ritualist leave? Was it running a spirit build, a Restoration healer build, a Spirit's Strength melee build, a spell casting nuker build, or something else? And RA already replaces people, so that leaves the spots where team build is more important and used. I just don't see this as being an easy fix, and getting a crappy AI hench to replace a player may make things worse than playing short a person, or of starting over.
jazilla
clone exploit issues=a great way for friends to join as discorders and then leave and you get discord replacements. No thanks.
Risus
Yes because a henchy could totally do pools/mtns/pits/planes/wastes/chamber/EMo
The Drunkard
Or you could just play with alliance members...
/notsigned
/notsigned
Eragon Zarroc
meh, u lose someone in PvE, start over again. nothing in this game takes more than an hour and half to complete anymore, and that is pushing it.
cruzer
/signed for Bhaaltazar's suggestion
This is a great idea imo ... would at least give you some chance of finishing whatever you started.
This is a great idea imo ... would at least give you some chance of finishing whatever you started.
Neith
/unsigned. as much as i truly hate leavers and wish we could replace them. i've noticed a lot of disconnects lately, not only with myself but with other party members. And at times we've been able to get them reconnected. Not cool if we know the party member can reconnect but if they are copied then there is no longer an open spot where they used to be. I would sign this if the solution was that once the party member's bar is greyed out, it drops off and we can add a hero in their place. but even then that is probably not the best solution.
UnChosen
/signed.
I would say that if someone leaves/disconnect, a menu should popup (for the team leader, maybe?) that enable the remaining players to select skills to make a customized henchie on the spot.
What would be better though is that they should let people from outside join in to help finish the mission, in return for some unique reward for helping but no "completion" of the mission or any end chest rewards. It would be nice if they do something like this for GW2...GW1 is already way too old to waste resource on something like this.
Can't they just make it so that if someone reconnects then the player replaces the AI copy again?
I would say that if someone leaves/disconnect, a menu should popup (for the team leader, maybe?) that enable the remaining players to select skills to make a customized henchie on the spot.
What would be better though is that they should let people from outside join in to help finish the mission, in return for some unique reward for helping but no "completion" of the mission or any end chest rewards. It would be nice if they do something like this for GW2...GW1 is already way too old to waste resource on something like this.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Neith
/unsigned. as much as i truly hate leavers and wish we could replace them. i've noticed a lot of disconnects lately, not only with myself but with other party members. And at times we've been able to get them reconnected. Not cool if we know the party member can reconnect but if they are copied then there is no longer an open spot where they used to be. I would sign this if the solution was that once the party member's bar is greyed out, it drops off and we can add a hero in their place. but even then that is probably not the best solution.
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BoxOfCox
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Neith
/unsigned. as much as i truly hate leavers and wish we could replace them. i've noticed a lot of disconnects lately, not only with myself but with other party members. And at times we've been able to get them reconnected. Not cool if we know the party member can reconnect but if they are copied then there is no longer an open spot where they used to be. I would sign this if the solution was that once the party member's bar is greyed out, it drops off and we can add a hero in their place. but even then that is probably not the best solution.
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Terrible Surgeon
Waste of time. People DC, People have to quit and do something else, its natural and it happens. If someone leaves r party restart the mission or just keep going. Is one person going to make the rest fail? Probably not unless it was a monk or your only damage. If a mesmer or ele dc's the team is fine and dandy.....
Basically, this would require a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing lot of work and would benefit a small amount of people.
/not signed
Basically, this would require a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing lot of work and would benefit a small amount of people.
/not signed
miss_d_evil
well, we were doing urgoz hardmode got to the penultimate room and the bonder left, fairly vital and after nearly 2 hours of playing it was difficult to get the motivation to just restart. Just the option of anyone on the team or the team leader being able to add a hero would have probably let us carry on.
/signed
/signed
MithranArkanere
In any place where the loss of a single character would be really important, henchmen wouldn't make much of a difference.