Why optional Character Slots are bad for Guild Wars

Many people seem to have ignored your MAIN ARGUMENT. Although I'm not bothered by this because 1. The community asked for this. 2. If they implemented this for free, The whole point of merging/not merging the chapters would be pointless.

I can't say I agree with you, but I completely understand where you're coming from. Albeit that's not a reason to quit a game :P Breaking a promise is a huge thing, I understand that, but compare ANet/NCSoft with other companies in regards to broken promises and you'll see ANet/NCSoft is doing a pretty "ok" job of keeping their promises.

@Zui
Interesting that i am now being attacked, i thought this was about the OP's views? You understand where he is coming from? ok then, talk about HIS points. My points are GENERAL to a large extent and are obviously not the Universal truth.

1. More character slots do NOT equal in game advantage! Your arguements are based solely on FARMING in PvE. If you bought GW simply to farm and be "rich", then why are you complaining? For PvE, oh noes! A group that doesnt want my Mesmer, fine, its easy enough to simply make a guild group, or just jump to another PuG. Having less character slots does NOT mean you have to hench everything. Cmon, this argument is being ridiculously overdone.

2. Again, more character slots does NOT equal better success in PvE. Your arguments are arguing purely for farming purposes. Every statistic is cheaply available to the poor. Items that sell at high values do NOT equal success in PvE, it simply means you can amass a lot of in game wealth; again, FARMING!

3. When i talked about PvP, did i say high end PvP? No! It was a general statement, and would pertain to the 4v4 arenas and often HA. GvG is THE highend PvP, and yes i know that most high end guilds use PvE charas, not just for looks, but for the FEW bonuses that PvE items get. I am NOT clueless. My credibility comes from a year of GW where the last 8 months i have done TONS of different PvP and the last 6 months lots of GvG. I have GvG'd for everything from unknown guilds to War MAchine International (of course i will be called on this one). Don't call my PvP knowledge into question, kthx.

And just so you know, the PvE characters playing in PvP from the top tier guilds know that PvE items get the SMALLEST amount of advantage, and when a class is needed that they dont have, they simply roll their PvP slot without worry. The PvE items get such a minimal bonus that it is laughable to use that argument. I can honestly say that 95%++ use their PvE characters in PvP simply for aesthetics. They wanna look how they like...

4. In order to attain all the Elite skills through PvE you have to take the time to GET to the bosses and cap, and in the latest chapter, you are required to buy ALL ur skills, meaning it is a must to utilize some form of farming for gold to attain all skills for a single class. Even in Ch1, getting through the game and doing all the quests that you can in order to unlock skills takes a hefty amount of time. My argument stands, in that same hefty amount of time you can take a PvE, or PvP character in Random arenas and farm faction to unlock skills and get a huge amount unlocked...Equal to, if not faster then PvE. 10-20k faction a day is nothing to a person who does RA or TA a lot or even HA a lot... So more slots does NOT give advantages in PvP.

5. Again, you are simply talking about farming. Being poor in game doesnt mean you can't beat the PvE game, and it doesnt mean you cant get JUST as good gear as the rich farmer who has 10+ character slots. That statement is just ignorant and elitist.

6. LMAO! LOL! ROFL! Again, you are simply arguing for better ability to farm. Refer to to point #2.

7. On this point, it is a bottomless argument. I digress, in that i see that it can be considered an upgrade as characters arent actual in game additions. HOWEVER, it is NOT essential to enjoy PvE, it is NOT essential to succeed in PvP, and it is NOT essential for farmers. Additionally, it is a COMPLETELY optional charge. So who cares if its an upgrade or additional game content?

All in all, you succeed in attacking me with badly supported points AND you still admit you are not against the purchasable character slots AND will be buying them? So if you understand the OP's points, why the crap did you talk so much about what I had to say?...

/endrant

Sorry that was rantish, but i dont take outright attacks and ignorant remarks lightly.

Lol there not mandatory

You and Zui are now and have been digressing into an argument for FARMING success. The game isn't based on farming. Its based on enjoyment of PvE and PvP. Farming is a player based and created aspect, and if that is all you enjoy in the game, your arguments become completely moot.

For all your other rebuttles to my statements you have highlighted or any other questions, refer to my latest post before this one.
enjoy.

useless rant

char slots (not equal to) new content

If you're really set on wanting to have PvE chars for PvP then I'd recommend that you not make an Assassin, and if you buy Nightfall, don't make a Dervish(maybe :P). Those two classes will be the least played in PvP. Then you've got 8 slots for chars that will be used most in PvP. If you still want a PvP slot, you'd just have to take this as a lesson in prioritizing and choose which of the other classes is least useful to you.

As far as content, I still don't see an optional slot for those who are more obsessed with the game as having any relation to the promised new content. Content would be the extra storage you recieved if you bought factions, the new dungeon in Tombs, the new explorable areas of Grenth's Footprint and Sorrow's Furnace, the addition of many new greens every month or so.

Well I'm off to mow the lawn. Good luck with the thread.

When Factions came out there were two reasons why there would not be 8 character slots on merged accounts: 1: the fuzzy math argument that merged accounts were already getting more access or equal access to content in the game that non-merged accounts would get. And 2: they couldn’t afford to give all these merged accounts 8 slots; it would be too much strain on the servers.

3 months later, with the price of GWP and GWF lowered from $50 to $40 at my local retail store…they can give you the slots you asked for. All you need do is upgrade your account, an optional upgrade that will have no effect (suddenly) on the content or access. Through no skill of your own and no purchase of an expansion/standalone your account becomes better at farming, trading, gains 90 extra storage slots, increases its flexibility for builds, the list goes on.

In a previous thread, I called Anet and NCSoft to account for this, but the thread only entered its third page before a mod deleted it. I will not give up this issue however. I think what Anet is doing is wrong, and I don’t like what this bodes for Guild Wars as a whole if they succeed with it.

I see this as an addition of content, as noticeable by the fact that you cannot access content without character slots. I believe it an imbalance to the game, an addition of player power that is not gained through skill or purchase and expansion of your account.

More important, I see this as a very bad sign for the future of Guild Wars franchise.

The people in favor of this upgrade defend it because it’s optional and does not increase the content that they have access to. It just improves the way in which they can access it. It’s something they asked Anet to do 3 months ago and—finally—they are getting what they’re asking for.

But where does this all lead? Normally, I’d reserve this for the final stroke of my argument. Since the deleted thread handled most of the other issues, I’m revising my normal thread tactic to make certain the most people get a chance to see the ramifications this action by Anet can cause; actions the we—the players—are putting into their hands by condoning this optional update.

I’ll tell you where I think it goes. Take a look at a few hypothetical scenarios this latest action by Anet opens up for the company:
Says Anet: we know a lot of people have been asking for pure roleplaying servers in Guild wars but we’ve had no idea how to get them. We weren’t able to afford the monitoring required to make these safe havens for RP fans and could think of no way to keep PvPers out, protecting the RP community from the Chuck Norris spammers of the world…until now. That’s right; for the low price of $10 your account can have access to these optional servers where out of character chat is monitored and controlled. No worry for trade spammers in All Chat; we ban the jerks in RP d1. Players who don’t upgrade still have access to all the content in the game; they just don’t have access to this server feature. This will keep the people who don’t want to roleplay out.

Next month? $10 Jump function in PvE, though only in towns. Sorry folks, we can’t add it to PvP; it would represent an imbalance. But wait! Next month we can. That’s right; for the low low price of a 10$ upgrade you can gain access to an optional (remember; its always optional to upgrade) PvP server that works just like the new Roleplaying server upgrade, only through purchase of THIS upgrade, your character gains the ability to jump in town, out of twon, in mission or HoH and GvG. Choosing not to upgrade? You still have access to the same PvP as the new Jump servers; all the maps, all the content. You just don’t have access to this optional function.

Next month: All the new faces available for any character on any campaign: the whole smash! We’re sorry we can’t offer this upgrade as streaming content; its only available for purchase but rest assured, it will have no effect on players who choose not to upgrade; they still have access to all the content, all the quests and missions in the game and you can still choose to get these new faces (actually old faces) by making a Tyrian/Factions/Nightfall character in Tyria/Factions/Nightfall. This is just an optional upgrade of the existing choices for people who have all the games.

Don’t like locked doors? We hear ya For ten dollars, we can let lvl 20 non-Factions characters run right through. If your character is just passing through a mission for a farm, run on by and Godspeed to you.

Later that year? All players still have access to all maps, but for those people who opted to upgrade their account with the new jump junction (found only in the optional PvP/Roleplaying servers) we are pleased to announce that you can purchase a new upgrade that allows you 100% access to any area of the maps. You can go anywhere now; isn’t that great???

That’s right guys and gals, there’s nothing Anet can’t include in their game…for a price. Anything is optional if you think hard enough. And none of it has to be content if you accept it as a feature.

And this isn’t talking about what they “forget” to include or can’t afford to include in Guild Wars Nightfall, Ch4, Ch5; the list goes on with the series.

But I’m not finished with my hypothetical peek into the future. What tends to happen to those accounts that do not upgrade in time with the others? Put differently; what tends happen in other Pay to Upgrade games:

Hypothetical Anet representative says: We know that a lot of players who opted not to purchase the new mini-pet upgrade are having problems being in the same zone with those who have it. Rest assured, we are working very hard and we should be able to solve the problem and keep your games from crashing very soon.

Next month; the same hypothetical representative: I’d like to announce that a lot of customers seem quite pleased with last months upgrade; a record number of players bought the new optional in-town mini-pet feature. On a side note; we have fixed the player-side crash issues that this upgrade to the mini-pet was causing and non-upgraded accounts now have no trouble running in the same district as the NPCs or the players.

Now we know a lot of people don’t want to buy all these upgrades separately when they get into the game. That’s why we’re pleased to announce the new guild Wars Ext-U package for the price of $130. Every upgrade (to date) for any account can be found on this collectors DvD set with a real cloth map of Tyria, steel display case, a CE user manual for Ch6 and an I <3 Charr t-shirt…

THIS???! Is not the game I bought.
It is not the Guild Wars I wanted to play.
It’s a lesser version of EQ/WoW at EQ/WoW prices.
It’s pay to upgrade, something Anet said they’d never do.

At the moment, this is conjecture. But why do I think we’ll be seeing something like this? Because I’ve seen it before with other games. Some of you have seen it too; that’s why you moved to Guild Wars in the first place.

Don’t say they can’t do it. They already are. None of this “adds content” to the game. They’re all features. None of this restricts the types of games or quests you can play (though the jump function hypothesis, I admit, is stretching it) only the manner in which you can access it.

And before you say they won’t in the future ask yourself: why wouldn’t they? If it gives them more of your money, why wouldn’t they do just that?

You obviously put a lot of time and effort into your post, and so for that I am sorry that you probably won't find many people that agree with you.

My outlook on the issue is that adding more slots to an account doesn't actually give anyone an advantage. The closest advantage it might have, is some Ecto farmer can store thousands of more ectos then they could before. Although, if they're farming that much, they can probably afford to just buy a separate mule account - which is the same idea you're already presenting.

Your extrapolations over time are honestly pretty ridiculous. Ever play that "game" in school where you had to do the same thing?

If I don't go to school today, I might take a walk outside.
If I take a walk outside, I might get hit by a car.
If I get hit by a car, then I might die.

SO THEREFORE, IF I SKIP SCHOOL, I WILL DIE.

You're story is a possibility, sure. But so far removed and unlikely it sounds ridiculous.

A new game account costs $50, and provides the same - if not more new slots then buying Character slot upgrades would. The character slots are so people can try more characters, and play the game like they want. It gives no one an advantage and SHOWS NOT SIGN OR CONNECTION to the ridiculous upgrades you have presented.

EDIT:

I mean really, when you get down to it you arguement might make sense - EXCEPT then you'd have to say things like,

"You have to get rid of Obsidian Armor, too, because it's too hard to get, and makes players look cool which is an unfair advantage."
"You can't have rare greens, because that means not everyone can have the best weapons."

You're obviously not that stupid, so why pursue such a closed-minded and ignorant chain of thought?

You're reading too much into nothing.

I don't get your point...

Additional character slots mean I can have one character of each profession and a pvp slot... How is that creating a imbalance in any way? Alternativly, I could just use 2 accounts, but.. that's inconvenient when account a) picks up a nice item for a character on account b). Did I miss anything?

This was something the community as a whole requested. It is not required, nor is it even necessary.

From a financial perspective, people buy extra accounts for more slots. A new account gives 4 slots for 50 dollars. That's 4 Unmerged slots for 12.50 a pop. This gives merged slots for 10 dollars each. Forgive me if I fail to buy into your "evil empire out to get us and steal all our money while the good, God-fearing folks at WoW go poor because their fair business practices ran them into the ground" conspiracy theory.

Seriously, this is the worst can of delusional paranoia I've seen in a while.

God forbid they want to make money! Surely they made the game purely for our enjoyment and they are forking the money to keep it running out of their one pockets!

o.o hmmn.....let me see...the community asks for more slots, even if they have to buy it. Anet says yes. you seem to think Anet making money is a bad thing.

Thats just...bizarre.

I think Anet should indeed capitalize on optional "pay-only" things to sustain their franchise.

My idea for more "pay to get" additions:

Upgrade an existing account to collectors edition - $15

Add pre-order weapons from chapter 1 - $10

Add pre-order weapons from chapter 2 - $10

Add GOTY weapon pack for - $10

That would rock

They NEED these things to keep the server running. Is it mandatory? No.

That's my stance.

A-Net saw a win-win situation here. That's the bottom line and implementing a win-win deal is just good business. The players wanted a way to get more character slots without the hassle of having to buy another account which makes it a pain for players to transfer items from one character to another. A-Net saw this as a way to generate revenue while providing a much sought after product - at a savings to their customers! They also saw that in no way does this handicap people who do not opt to buy more slots.
Now, let's look at the forest instead of just that tree:

1. They provided additional content for FREE on 2 occasions. Namely the Sorrow's Furnace area and the Battle Island PvP area.

2. They hosted three holiday events for the benefit of their customers, for FREE.

3. They have responded very well to customers' reports concerning bugs and jerks.

I personally find it odd that someone could even use up the slots we have now, but plenty of people need them. If they charge for them, it's a great way to get money from those who place the most strain on their servers, the hardcore pvers.

For most casual to regular players, they're giving us plenty of slots, and extra slots for those who shell out the money gives no competitive advantage in pvp or pve, only possibly in farming.

I saw this a lot in the old thread. If they "need" these things to keep the servers running, then they needed them a year ago when they realeased Guild Wars Prophecies.

I bought a game that promised no pay to play, no upgrade purchases ever. Anet was going continue to make money off me through expansion/standalone content delivered on a bi-annual basis.

Pay to upgrade is not the game I bought. Its not the game I wanted to buy then, and its not the game I want to own now.Before I get another boatload of Upgrade supporters calling for a close, this is not trolling, this is not bad math, this is not anything more than a player voicing his concerns about the game he plays. I don't call for lock/deletes unless its troll infested; I will kindly ask you to keep your comments on topic and related to the argument. If you can't, I ask you not to post.

On Topic: Hypothetical because it hasn't happened here yet. But feesable because this has happened to all too many games I (and you) have play. Updates become mandatory to people who wish to continue playing through. ANY updates. Look at EQ2; if you don't purchase their online updates, you're left behind on the leveling curve and cannot gain access to certain items that, through balancing, your character needs to survive. Look at Knight Online, an actual Pay to Upgrade game. If you don't regularly upgrade your account IT WILL CRASH. You can't play because your older account has not been set up to properly deal with people in zone with you who have this stuff.

You don't see Anet doing this. Its your right to say they won't. When I see Anet implementing 1 Pay to Upgrade, I see them doing it with dollar signs flashing in their eyes. Once what is and is not Content becomes a murky water subject, anything they add beyond maintenence patches and quests can be construed as "other than content". Then we could be paying for everything twice.

Check my posts with search function. I get most of my 15 minutes around here submitting builds, fan fics, and strategy guides. As suggested previously; if you can't keep your comments on topic and are only here to to make libelous comments about my motives, I ask you leave.

The point that you fail to acknowledge is that you have always been able to buy extra character slots. All the option to buy extra slots gives you is the conveniece of not having to unlock skills and gain fame accross two accounts.

Eh, I see where the OP is going. There are other games out there right now that I can think of where you get to play for free...but for the really good gear, you have to pay cash for it.

However, additional character slots are a far cry from that, and so is the RP server thing. Just like an xpac, if you don't buy it, you don't get access. If it becomes a situation of paying RL cash for items, movement enhancement, or things of that nature, it would definately be a real problem. Still, allowing people to purchase more slots isn't that, or close to it.

You can get more slots for the low low price of purchasing the game, the same one that all of us are already playing, a second time. This merely allows people to break off a piece of that purchase, so to speak, and add it to the one they already have.

Thanks for keeping an eye out, Minus, however it's too soon to be reaching such conclusions, imo. Like figuring a math sequence with only one number:

3, X, Y, Z. Define X, Y, and Z.

Can't be done, need more information before they become apparent. Same here, we'll see when we get more information if you're on the right track, or just shooting in the dark.

ArenaNet knows (or at least should know) going to far with pay to upgrade WILL kill the game. WE asked for this. We ASKED to be given more slots even if we had to pay for them. ArenaNet agreed.

No, there's no need to close this thread. Those who disagree with the OP's rather extreme speculations have no need to resort to flaming. While I disagree with him, I don't see why he should not be allowed to express his concerns about the future of this game that we are all so fond of. Let's try to be polite and rational, please!

OP I bet you think that the moon walk was staged and the FBI shot JFK.

You are really streching things.

Besides I would be happy to buy more faces, promo weapons, $10 so I would not have to put up with morons or spammers, where do I sign? I can buy as many slots as I want now, but I can't transfer faction from one account to another.

Besides we already have these things, Collector's Edition, Special Edition, Pre-Order Edition, Game of the Year Edition.

Thank goodness....

Yes; thats the big problem. I can't prove Anet intends to do this without a look at their release schedule. But think back to 3 months ago. There was no way the servers could handle the strain of all these merged accounts running with 8 slots. In only 3 months we've gone from can't do it to here you go...for an extra $10 please.

Also...Asking a game company to stop at just the one Pay to Update hit to your wallet is a little bit like asking the kids to behave when you lock them inside the cady store unsupervised. By the time we know for sure, it will be too late to do anything other than:

A. Live with it.
B. Sue them.
C. Go elsewhere.

This company is not here to give you a killer game. Their primary focus is to get your money. The more of your money they can get, the more of your money they will grab for. Frankly, I doubt (based on the evidence available now) that there was ever a server problem with 8 slots on merged accounts. I think the 6 for merged accounts was a way to get players to hollar for this update; an excuse for Anet to start breaking its own word. The really sad part is, we've thanked them while they're doing it to us.

I wouldn't be making a stink about this if they were just adding this to a Special Edition game pack. I won't complain when someone pays more than I do and gets more content be it mini-pet, focus item and weapon, glowing hands whatever. But purchaseable--standalone--updates that exist outside the game supplied is a change of the rules mid-race. Its dirty pool plain and simple.

I think paid character slots are bad for people who want free handouts...

I fail to understand why the ability to have more characters than other people should be free.

Please tell me how this is any different than what I did back in September and many I know did some point along the way already: bought a second account. Four more slots for ~$40-50. Woo. The only real difference from this is Anet is giving us the option to buy that in 25% increments merged onto our existing account. Means a guildie doesnt need to be on to transfer items etc between them and most importantly unlocks carry over. Completely BEYOND me how this affects someone in any way adversely. Tons of people already paid to get more slots. Anet simply streamlined the process and did something nice for us.

Add to that, as Markaedw said, we also already have some additionally paid for premium content. Nothing Earth-shattering, but the aforementioned special additions. I fail to see any problem with that either.

Personally myself i had to buy another acc, but if given the option i would buy extra slots. since its such a hassle xfering between both my accs. i currently am only able to have 5 pve chars and 1 pvp char on 1 acc and on my other acc its just a hassle to switch stuff to it so its just mules. so i will happily buy more character slots if anet were to sell them

This is pure speculation, you have no proof that these were the actual two reason as to why Anet did not implement this feature earlier.The fact that it would be too much of a strain on servers is a weak argument, you might as well have said that they predicted that they would get 2 million copies sold, because their servers haven't crashed yet.

Im not sure if you already know this, but this happens to all games. Called depreciation or something.

This is purely based on perception, most people will say that it does not add content to the game, when it obviously does. In actual fact, it takes a simple minded person to realise that it in no way grants you an advantage in the game... Advantage to farmers? Purchases can reach into the millions, but it's dumb to think that a person with 10 accounts with 1.1million will be able to purchase anything from a person who has 6 accounts, and no physical way to store the additional cash. So, no advantage to farmers there. And advantage to PvPers? Compare that to someone who has to reroll, the only advantage is time.

Oh, and making the comparison between 'skill' and 'additional character slots' is a bad idea. I only have one Mesmer that I am truly good at, and all 5 of my other slots I use to train myself so that I can properly use my mesmer against them. 'That' is skill.

I'll have to watch what I say. ok, first of all, we would really like RP Servers. Thats like the biggest ask out of all of the senarios you have listed. But if there is no way they can do it, then that's just tough luck for us. (Note that Anet is fully capable of adding in more character slots, because we 'know' it would be possible since we were able to merge our accounts. RP districts however...) A simple solution (which Anet should really push) is to simply create your own RP with your own friends, and there would be no need for RP districts.

Having all faces for any campaign is just stupid. I hope that people agree with me on this, but having a Tyrian born character with Canthan features is just wrong, and GW cannot comprehend the possibility of half-breeds, which is actually a better idea. (If I offended anyone im sorry^^)

"Don't like locked doors??? Tough Luck!!" That's what Anet would say. It was a move to prevent runners from skipping the whole game, and though it failed harshly from the responses of Factions players, it will be hopeful that Anet will not do the same thing to up and coming chapters... But charging players $10 to bybass the areas that only apply to ONE game (Factions)... I think you're over your head on this one.

For the 100% access to get to any part of the map in the game... is just a waste of time.

---

For all of those hypothetical situations... all that you have done is made sure that these ideas wont happen... seeing them hypothetically will allow me... and hopefully others to think and protest against such ideas... because they remind me of a thread I once saw, asking to have the skill frenzy stack with infuse health...

Oh I love this following quote... its 100% contradictory

Line 1: YOu're absolutely correct, as nothing you have said in your thread has even come into fruition.
Line 2: Refer to line 1
Line 3: How dare you compare us to EQ and WoW!!! lol
Line 4: Based on perception, otherwise you're completely wrong

I said that I love this quote above because you've made an attempt to use hypothetical situations as your summary to say the quote above... flawed... completely flawed.

Because as much as you would like for this to happen. Why wouldn't they? Because Anet has made such a goddamn excellent game, coupled with the famous worldwide Guild Wars Championship, along with their business outline "NO FEES" answers why they wouldn't need to add in paid content. The reason for the character slots was answered by the peples needs, and their ability to do so. (All of you hypothetical situations are either non-possible, or unwanted) I mean... prophecies is so awesome... the scenery is something to die for. My favourite places are the Ice Cave, The Statue of Lyssa in Mineral Springs, and The Falls. I go visitng those places all the time... oh, and Serenity Temple is awesome too. In factions, I like the Falls (forgot the name) located in Kinya Province, I really really love the Divine Path... getting all of those applauses... so cool.

But you know, your first thread was closed for a reason, opening up a thread that is very similar to this means you're trying to dig a wound and hoping someone else would fix it. You either need to back up your hypothesis with better comparisons to other games... or you should just leave the wound, and let me fix the worriful damage you are trying to cause.

Pure speculation... this thread should go to the Nightfall forum.. no offense.

EDIT: I have a really nasty habit of getting into arguments, so I'll try not to post in here agian^^.

This arguement falls flat on it's face because you can only play one character at a time on any account, any server lag issues were the result of the release of Factions, not the amount of people playing. (Tyria runs smooth as silk & Factions is getting there - except the city)

You pay to update with every new chapter that comes out. I do not consider this an update, as that there's nothing new here and it's not something that people HAVE to do to keep playing the game. I don't buy a character slot, I keep playing anyway. As I said, it's a win-win situation for A-Net and the people who WANT to exercise the option, without hurting those who don't!

Um, yup. We know this process as capitalism. Been around for a while, too, I think.

Point me to where an actual A-Net representative said there was, please. To my recollection, the only people that said this were players speculating or rationalizing during the whole 6 vs 8 character slot controversy. And, even if there was, and I'm not saying there was, $10 per slot goes a long way toward solving any server issues, I'd wager.

How is this Special Edition example you mention any different from what's happening now? I mean, outside of some different verbage. You prefer they call this "Guild Wars: Factions; Extended Edition"?
- Yes, with this new version of Factions you will get 5 character slots and 3 if you merge with your existing Prophecies account. It all comes for the low low price of $59.95! -
Difference? I see none. Not to be reiterative, but as many people have said before, this option was already available in allowing the purchase of a 2nd account, though there was some hassle involved in making those two accounts cohesive. Now A-Net is eliminating that hassle.

To put this in mathematical terms, you're attempting to extrapolate a line using a single point. Doesn't work. So, I would preach patience before sounding the Doom and Gloom Alarm™ (that seems to be going off rather frequently as of recently) again. If you don't like the idea of purchasing another character slot, then don't. But, counter to your argument, you will not have some corner of the map, some aspect of the game, some great uber skill cordoned off away from you because of it. Each of your 4 or 6 or 8 or however many slots has the same options and access as everyone else's, regardless of how many character slots are on the account.

The haters here also seem to be forgetting that you have access to all of your unlocks when you buy new character slots, something you most certainly do not have access to when you buy a second account.

One point, paying for extra character slots is different than paying for extra content - factions is extra content, character slots are, well, character slots. We're not being asked to purchase nickel-and-dime content and I'm certain that there will be plenty of people screaming if we are asked to do so. You might want to save your eRage for a time when it's sensible, otherwise people might stop listening.

A-Net: Let's see...one year of providing server access without monthly fees, a somewhat steadily growing base of users, a third chapter about to be released that will further tax servers...and our initial budget only covers certain things. Damn the utility companies for wanting us to give them money, and those freaking developers for wanting paychecks! Well, we can still give the players extras they want, we'll just have to charge them for it.

OP: OMGWTFBBQ!!ONEELEVEN! Ebil capitalists trying to actually make some sort of profit somehow! THEY'LL BE CHARGING FOR THE AIR WE BREATHE NEXT, MARK MY WORDS!

Get a grip. There are these really fun things you might have heard of, called trees and flowers and grass. They're in this magical place called 'outside', which does happen to be completely free to go to.

Okay, being serious now. Guild Wars, like WoW and EQ, is a franchise. They are a business. Businesses have costs, and usually do not make quite the amount you think they do. For one, a business or company usually prices its product at 50% of the shelf price, and sells it to other companies for this price.

So, at 2 million copies, A-Net most likely did not make $100 million, provided that you assume every copy is the equivalent of $50. A-Net sells its 2 million products to EBGames, Babbages, CompUSA, BestBuy, etc., for about $50 million.

So, we have $50 million dollars in the bank. Prophecies got, I believe, a full year of development before the team was split in two, so that means once we hit October or so the development teams will have been working for two years. So we need to pay two years worth of salaries to designers, developers, programmers, artists, testers, producers, etc.

Let's say each of these people makes a base 50k a year. Factions had (going by the credits in the manual):

3 Executive Producers
15 Designers
31 Artists
11 Environmental Artists
18 Programmers
5 Writers
2 Producers
6 members of the business team
3 Community Liasons
3 IT workers
3 man Localisation team
4 Web and Virtual Designers
4 Contractors

That's 108 people, we'll times it by 2 to include the team working on Nightfall thus far to give us 216. 216 x $50k = $10,800,000.

Now remember, they've been paying these people for two years, so that's $21,600,000. That's not including benefits, profit shares, and all that other good stuff you generally need to keep your employees happy, so we'll round that up to $22.5 million over two years.

$50 million - $22.5 million = $26.5 million.

COSTS:

Let's say it costs about $1.00 just to store your data on the server per month, for the basic four slots that come with each game. So for each copy of Guild Wars: Prophecies and Guild Wars: Factions, it costs A-Net $1.00 a month before you even play.

2 million copies x $1.00 = $2 million per month. Multiply that by two years (24 months) and you get $48 million.

$26.5 million - $48 million = ....uh oh.

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Now, obviously the Guild Wars franchise isn't going to be that far in the hole. They would, of course, have the initial investments and all of their employees would not be bringing in $50k a year necessarily. So, balancing costs out to zero would mean I have a margin of more than $20 million for error, and I don't doubt there are errors since I suck at math.

Originally A-Net wouldn't need the excess income, because they wouldn't have had 2 years worth of employees to pay for, nor 2 years worth of information storage for 2 million units at that point. They no doubt had original investments as well, which covered basic costs of original development and probably evened out that $20 million error I have up there.

Quite frankly, A-Net's decision to make new character slots available for a price has nothing to do with an interest in whether or not you feel like shelling out an extra $10-$20 to 'play with the big boys'. It has to do with paying salaries, server upkeep, new campaign product manufacture, and generally all of the things you want that it is not free to provide you with over a prologned period of time, during which the costs add up to far more than they originally started with.

The Guild Wars original vision was a one-time-purchase game with outstanding features, great content, and a continuously expanding world. To continue providing that, they have to keep current players happy and buying new chapters and available 'features' such as the new character slots.

Free storage upgrade? Free holiday and weekend events? Free to play whenever I want 24/7 against anybody in the world I want to play with? Not to mention the flexibility of choice between an RPG and a worldwide, player vs. player gladiator arena? Contact people who actually read player forums to see what the players want so they can provide it? All of which would pretty much stay the same even if A-net DID start adding purchasable extras willy-nilly, I might add.

The company is here to give you a 'killer game'. Providing a popular game means more users, which means more money, which means more game improvements and profit, which means both company and players win. A-Net is not some kind of parasite, no business is. They have a survival relationship with their customers...provide the customers with what they want, and the customers will provide you with income. Happy customers mean you do better in the long run.

I happen to think they're doing a damn good job of providing what other mmorpgs do not while still maintaining their reputation as a business. Let's not forget that Guild Wars, as a whole, is an entertainment item. It is not a right to play it, it is a privilege. If it changes too much for your liking, then it is a privilege you may choose to no longer pay for.

This is the cost for the feature, period. It is either worth it to you to pay for it, or it isn't. If they implement further purchasable features, those will be the costs, period. Again, it is either worth it to you to pay or it isn't. If they decide to whip off their Friendly Angel mask to reveal horns and a tail and start charging monthly fees, that is their right as a business, it is either worth it to you or not.

It already is no longer the Guild Wars you originally purchased, it has evolved. If this is not the Guild Wars you enjoy playing, stop playing it.

Im not sure if my opinion on this matter counts too much but what the heck:I think you are digging way too much into this,a few extra character slots would be good.But if Anet did start to do the things you described id be against that.For now im excited for the new slots.

Personally I have no problem with Anet offering bonus features for a price, it's their cost model, their game and they can do what they like.

Now obviously we dont want to see a horse armor situation, but I would happily pay a certain amount per month for additional stuff. For example

For $10 per month you get account insurance, in the event of your character or account being hacked, scammed or deleted AN will restore your account/character to what it was before.

You don't need it, and AN don't have the resources to do this in the current cost structure, but a pay per month for an insurance policy would be able to fund this.

Realistically paying for content is against AN's stated structure. Paying for account features, which have no bearing on where and what you can do in game are totally fair enough.

Maybe adding content to older chapters such as continued story line, Id pay for instead we get to chose from t shirts that say I love charr or releases of collectors edition propercies which you pay full price for getting next to nothing in content.

I mean even the releases of the next chapters to half life 3 your paying 30 dollars and although incredibley short you do actually pay for something extra.

I have no problem with paying a little bit of money, although it would be nice if they made content worth buying.

there is always gonna be that one guy moaning about whatever. just dont buy them and suffer whatever consequenses you think itll have on the game. im buying 4. 1 presearing, 1 pvp and 2 more to cover all professions in pve.

you don't really do a lot to prove your argument. Specifically why are they bad? How will they imbalance the game?

I don't have hours to disseminate what you are saying, put it to us in layman's terms please and thank you

To OP.

Your post seems to work on the old "What-if" way of thinking. Why on earth would A.net charge $10 to add a jump command? Not only would they not do that since it makes no sense, but even if they did add jumping in it be a free upgrade for everyone.

A.net has proven time and time again that they aren't that hungry for money by giving us FREE updates... does SF summer update ring a bell? How about the new PvP Arenas? Or the new storage addtion?

Sorry but there is clear reason as to why you last thread was deleted/locked by a mod, this thread is a flame fest, most likely your older one was a well.

GWG has some of the best mods on the Internet, nothing is locked or deleted without reason.

My comment towards the server load issue with the addition of more slots:

A coupel of months ago we weren't able to play for a day because of a server move/upgrade. With this move/upgrade, the servers more than likely became capable of taking on the addition of more character slots.


My comments towards the addition of character slots:

I would like to see another way of purchasing them. IE. a game card. Not everyone has or can get a credit card to make an online purchase. I think we should atleast have one slot for every profession in the game.

One of your arguments is that other MMORPGs have already implemented a "mandatory" pay-for-upgrade system. Are there any other MMOs that do this other that the ones you mentioned?

EQ2 - EQ already has monthly fees, I don't think their situation and reason is close enough to GW to warrant a comparison. But, (as a wild guess) maybe they added that because they were losing money. If Anet started losing money, we're going to lose the game we love whether or not they start adding a pay-for-upgrade system or not!

Knight Online - Knight Online is free to download so their income is from the upgrades. Anet does not give accounts for free, you need to buy it first.