Sour Attitudes of HA

Unranked players ARE noobs 90% of the time. They might be the good guys, but they have no concept of strategy, don't know the popular builds and don't kite warriors who are smashing their faces. Forgive me if I don't want to deal with that.

I somewhat agree on this one - innovation is the only way to improve a build, but the skill in the cookie-cutter build is there for a reason in the first place: it works and it works well because the build has been polished by many players. If you thought of something new, 19 out of 20 times it's not going to work, that's why people might be against changing a build. Also, pugs don't invent builds. Top guilds do. And I find that those groups are usually more open to any changes.

Been there, done that. See point 1.

Not much you can do about this if one idiot thinks he can quit and get into a better group and 2 others follow him.

You're not expected to play perfectly, you're expected to play adequately. More often than not it's people blaming someone else when they screw up to avoid being blamed.

And here's the answer to all your whining: Join a PvP guild. There are plenty that are just starting out and spamming r3+/200k faction. So you don't need to be ranked to join one.

Actually, you only need to win 14 in a row <.<

And don't think that once you get your deer, things are magically going to be different. No. You'll be playing with people who VIM'ed their way to r3 and thought "Hey, I can join l33tpwn4g3 groups now that play something other than W/R and R/W. Let's try monking!" Needless to say, the results aren't pretty. Organized unranked pugs (different from "nubway" and "grab 8 & go") are often better than r3+ because all those are made of people who C-spaced their rank and learned nothing.

Completely with you on that one.

My point is, if you didn't catch it, that pugs are much, much worse than people who play together regularly, regardless of their rank.

I hate this lazy mentality of the pvp'ers. "Let the other groups test something, we'll farm it once it works". bah, be creative! If every group thought like this, there wouldn't even be iway, ranger spike, or almost every popular build.

is this the end of iway / vim is that why there sour.. if so good maby foc spiek will make a come back

I agree with this assessment. I got into a smite group using a KD warrior build and I got flamed to pieces. It was "eviscerate & shock you noob" and stuff like that. I'm not as fragile as some others, but it really annoyed me.
For the most part, in HA you have to play some old worn out and boring build or henchway.

I started playing GW in March. I PvE mostly, not because I was not interested in PvP, but because I wanted to learn the game and figure out what skills synergize. After four months and many hours, I decided I was ready for low level PvP, RA, AB, competitive missions. I played there to get a grasp of how actual players would react to the skills I was using and so on, as well to test build ideas.

Finally, I decided I was ready to take on HA and boy was I disappointed
The community was real bad as far as rank discrimination...rank 3+, rank 6+ and so on. To get a group, you have to use one of the FoTM builds (boring)
I have quickly realized rank is overrated (rank farmers).

I have played with R3+ who took 1:30 to kill Zaisen.
I have played in a group of unranked who killed them in <0:30.

I have nearly stopped playing (time logged in is about 2hrs a week, from around 15-20) because I am tired of PvE and HA (the only PvP that I see an obtainable goal) is not fun to play at all.

Well, when you're in a PuG, being creative is the last thing you want to do. Chances are, you'll have people in your group who think Power Attack is the best skill ever and everyone has different, 90% inneffectual ideas, everyone thinks they're the boss of the group and everybody wastes their time.

When you're with a bunch of guys you know and have played with, that's the time for testing.

It's not much different in PvE, except PvE is not competition so you can afford to be more flexible.

Forgot Spirit Spam, Dual Smite, Air Spike, Ranger Spike, but I dont know if this timeline was only concerning IWAY

So? I've taken halls with a group that took over 1min to kill the Zaishen.

Quite a lot of groups r3/6? Then why don't you have more than 35 fame?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newbie
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noob

I have 0 rank and I'm not close to being a noob. I spend my time in RA and TA. I've tried to pvp in HA, but its so ridiculously hard to get in a group that I stop trying. Everyone wants to see your rank, but that has little to do with my pvp capabilities. What needs to be done(as pointed out by others) the rank system needs to be more individualized. Because right now it bunches so many players in to a few different categories without reflecting the player themself. There could be 100 R8 players, so I guess by them all being R8 that they play just a like?

A ranking system needs to be implemented thats indivdualized not generalized.

I'm assuming that you mean making it character based rather than account based, as just because they're ranked using one specific build which I suspect is the case with the majority of ranked players, doesnt mean they're automatically going to be as good if they start a complete new class but will still use it as a way to blag their way into a team.

I pretty much gave up on PvP because of the unending waves of elitest pricks running around. I'm comming from a background in more FPS games. And I must say, I've seen behavior from people on GW worse than the infamous Counter-Strike community.

It's definitely going to be FASTER to get groups in HA now, which has been my biggest concern there. It just wasn't worth it to stand there and haggle for an hour with jackasses with the "god forbid we lose the first match" mentality.

The clear definition of Noob and Newb should also include- this meaningless and degrading urban internet acronym was summed up by those four year olds; who thought Nha-Nha-Nha and PooP were pretty interesting words.

Anyways I see your point it does get rather repetitive with most of these people who do call themselves pro’s at Hero’s Ascent, snubbing anyone else. However that’s what technically happens in any game, it’s the psychological obsession of winning and completely forgetting about the “fun factor” (it’s a frequent happening in sports as well). The best way to deal with this problem is find the other people who remember it’s just a game, and if the other team starts mocking you, remember you can always turn off local chat. Personally I have been to Hero’s Ascent only a few times since getting GW about four months after the release; but your right it has changed (it always does when people learn the learning curve). All I know is that certain experiences, have taught me that GW is always changing (re-writing the rules); so there is always a chance to become the better GW player by means of adaptation.

RA requires a completely different set of skills. I don't play it very much, but the basic idea of RA is to play a more-or-less self-sufficient build and assume that your three teammates are complete idiots (i.e. not rely on their cooperation and not expect assistance from them). I recognize that it takes skill to play in RA, but that still won't help you much in HoH, which is a completely different ball game.

Oh, I tested out my share of stuff and collectively, my guild tested out our share of stuff. Most of it sucked, but some changes turned out to work. What I was saying is that pugs aren't open to modded bars because most of the time they don't work and its a pug's right to refuse. The group is there to play halls for a couple of hours, not to work on improving the build - that is left to guilds.

I put that in to make a point....the lower ranked team was more effective at clearing the Zaishen than the higher ranked, bolstering my point that rank is overrated.

Good for you winning halls...but yours seems to be the attitude in HA that this thread was centered around.

iway/vimway ARE the avenues which allow new people to get into HA, and always have been. The fotm groups arent all looking for r6+, anyone can find a vimway group today, earn some fame and perhaps meet a few friends, 6v6 instead of 8v8 is near meaningless change in light of all the new profession combinations, I'd still bet theres going to be a new arena coming 'soon' though.

Just like in PvE your drops get nerfed if you farm too much an area, you shouldn't receive any points if you enter too many PvP games with the same build.
Lameway problem solved.

So then why does yourself and others complain about "I can't get into high ranked parties because I'm low ranked". If lower ranked parties are so great why not just join them every time and be happy with that since they are so great?

This is where the "argument" of "Rank elitism is unfair to newbies, nerf rank!" always crumbles to dust.

If low ranked players did not want to unjustly leech off of the skills/abilities of much better (high ranked) players than themselves rather than play with people of their own skill level, then they'd have no basis to say "I can't get a team due to rank elitism!", because there are players o'plenty of their own low rank who could always play with them.

because youre an unranked noob and I dont want you on my team

Yep. I love PvP in general, be it BF1942, Eve, Team Fortress, etc. But the GW Heroes Ascent structure is terrible, I've tried a couple of times, and won't go back, I simply don't enjoy the chest-thumping elitist attitudes and cliques, combined with the pre-teen chat room fascination with profanity mentality. Far too many obnoxious idiots with character names of "Jiggly Boobz Nuker".

I'm straight PvE for Guild Wars.

I don't leech and am intelligent enough to be able to adapt my play to benefit any team I am on.
Me, personally, have no issues getting and sticking with groups.
But shunning someone just because there rank isn't high enough is bad practice, regardless of what anyone thinks.
That rank 1,2 or 3 could be on a second account or just started playing HA after spending hours upon hours honing their skills in other parts of the game.
Now don't get me wrong, inviting a mending wammo in a dual smite group is pretty useless, regardless of the rank. On the otherhand, shunning a Thumper, VIM, B-Spiker (or whatever the FoTM is), who has all the right skills and has a good idea of how to use them, just because they are rank 1 or 2 is, IMO, couterproductive.
Time in, especially the rank farmers, means nothing in GW.
Furthermore, not being able to get into higher ranked groups is not the problem.
It's the people that flame, unneccessarily, at perceived "noobs" that is the problem.

People seem to forget, they started at the bottom too.

But Navarro, I want to thank you for being another, in a growing list of people, that illustrates why this thread was started.

Try contributing something...not a very hard concept.