Who should carry the rez - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Sofonisba

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2005

Tucson, AZ

The Black Hand Gang [BHG] and The Black Helm Gang [BHeG]

13 Oct 2006 at 20:48 - 81

Quote:

Originally Posted by arcanemacabre

... you cannot risk a 'useless' skill slot.

Except in PvP, I am, like others, wondering what magical superuberskill is so important that it cannot be replaced with a res?

Somehow I manage to have enough room in my healing skillbar for condition/hex removal, big heal, little heal, energy management, and a prot skill (and vice versa in my prot skillbar)...... AND still room for the res in emergencies.

If I'm monking and the tank (for example) is aggroing too much, baddies get by him, and the situation looks grim, me sticking around surrounded by those sin monsters in Urgoz with my supercalifragilisticexpialidocious one extra non-res skilll is NOT going to save the day.

A judicious and timely running-away and a res just might, though.

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

13 Oct 2006 at 20:49 - 82

Why are most referring to W/Mo since there are a lot of them in the PVE side of the game but you will see just as many other /Mo in it as well for eg.R/Mo,No/Mo,Mes/Mo and Ele/Mo they can all bring rebirth as well.You never know you could end up with W/x not a /Mo.I will say this monks shouldn't bring rebirth only restorelife or res chant.

saphir

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

doa

Mo/

13 Oct 2006 at 21:01 - 83

i wonder how long pugs in uw/fow/elites would last if the monks never bothered w/ rebirth. when a group has a serious near wipe, you never know if the ones who make it out alive will even be /mo, have a res sig, or has wasted their sig already.

As a monk I stay back, make it out alive of a wipe 99% of the time while keeping healed any others still alive, so I bring rebirth because I know I will most likely be doing the extraction of the dead. Wipes can be quite common an numerous tackling high end areas, and can often be worse in a good high damage team - since in good groups you're steamrolling through the mobs taking on much more aggro than your regular groups. You clean house, but then when something goes wrong you can wipe real hard due to the huge aggro.

In any timed mission/quest w/ key npc's, or areas where mobs are only lvl 20 of course something like res chant would be a better choice.

TheSonofDarwin

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

The Black Hand Gang [BHG]

Mo/

13 Oct 2006 at 21:42 - 84

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

If there is a last man standing, you've already failed as far as i'm concenerned :/

Thank god for guildies, that's all I have to say after that.

IMO, monks should have rebirth as they'll be standing in the back and are most likely to make it to safety if there is a need to run. Atleast 1 person should have res chant, preferrably a mesmer, to keep people up during battle if someone drops. The reason most wipes happen is because the body count keeps piling up. If you have someone that has a GOOD rez (res chant being the best, IMO) rezzing the fallen, then there isn't usually a need to run unless you overaggroed. I hate being rezed midbattle with rebirth. I just want to take my monk's katana, shove it through the person's eye, and twist until I swirl the person's brain into the correct working setup.

LouAl

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

13 Oct 2006 at 21:51 - 85

I have heard a lot of people say that monks don't have to carry res, I say that is a load of crap. If you can't keep your team alive with 7 skills you have chosen the wrong 7 skills. Same goes for all other classes, if you can't do your job with 7 skills you chose the wrong 7, start over. I don't even care what res you bring just bring something. I don't even mind if you want to mid battle rebirth (as long as it is done properly), I do it all the time...pull someone to the back and out of reach from baddies, let the monks heal em, up and keep going. If it is PvP, you should think more on what res you bring, but still, bring something. Also, in PvP it is more acceptable for a monk to not have a res, but in PvE there is just no excuse...

Sofonisba

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jun 2005

Tucson, AZ

The Black Hand Gang [BHG] and The Black Helm Gang [BHeG]

13 Oct 2006 at 22:02 - 86

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheSonofDarwin

Thank god for guildies, that's all I have to say after that.

Amen to that, Perp.

Skuld

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Sep 2005

Thousend Tigers Apund Ur Head [Ttgr]

A/

13 Oct 2006 at 22:09 - 87

Heh, don't get me wrong, i'll stick around if its just a mistake and the quest can be saved, but if the team steps into mineral springs (if it gets that far) and dies, instantly.. do we res up and die again? These things don't happen with hench or guildies.

Sir Skullcrasher

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

California

15 over 50 [Rare]

W/Mo

13 Oct 2006 at 22:18 - 88

It's funny how if you rebirth too fast in battle, you'll instantly get yelled at. But if you res too slow and everyone dies, than we'll have a round of blame game where peoples try to blame the monk or the tank or whatever for the failure.

I usually have rebirth on my tank and only res peoples when the battle is almost done or when there isn't alot of enemies on screen. But i found that sometime peoples prefer to get res after the battle since they want to clean up the area first. I haven't tried vengence yet. Maybe i should go out and cap it tonight?

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

13 Oct 2006 at 22:27 - 89

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sir Skullcrasher

It's funny how if you rebirth too fast in battle, you'll instantly get yelled at. But if you res too slow and everyone dies, than we'll have a round of blame game where peoples try to blame the monk or the tank or whatever for the failure.

I usually have rebirth on my tank and only res peoples when the battle is almost done or when there isn't alot of enemies on screen. But i found that sometime peoples prefer to get res after the battle since they want to clean up the area first. I haven't tried vengence yet. Maybe i should go out and cap it tonight?

You don't need to cap Vengence that is is Unyielding Arura iirc.Vengence is not an elite.

NJudson

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

13 Oct 2006 at 22:29 - 90

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

I'm very surprised to see so many monks who bring rebirth instead of for example res chant. My rebirth days were over after the first few months this game came out. I prefer res chant or resurect almost every day. Some missions I will use unyielding aura, like when we killed Glint. I was just bringing people back very fast and Glint didn't have a chance.

Everybody can bring a rebirth, but certainly not the monk who should bring one of the other hard res. I'm willing to give you a full view on the spell but I'm counting on the fact that you're smart enough to figure it out yourself one of these days.

Unfortunately I don't have Factions so I'm unable to try out Resurrection Chant. In my opinion monks should rarely have to rez during battle because they should focus on healing those that are still alive. The monk should be the most attuned person on the team with respect to the outcome of the battle. A good monk generally can assess the battle and determine whether or not the enemy's damage output is or will be greater than his healing. With this in mind he should direct on the compass map and also to shout out to the team to retreat if necessary.

Since you generally shouldn't rez during a battle (unless you've assessed the situation and feel it's ok to do so) then when the sh*t hits the fan and you run away it is SOOOOO much easier to bring your team back to life with rebirth than to run in and aggro enemy to rez your teammates.

That's just my style though and have found it to be more useful to carry rebirth than other rez skills. To each their own though as long as it works for them.

Sir Skullcrasher

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2005

California

15 over 50 [Rare]

W/Mo

13 Oct 2006 at 22:30 - 91

Thanks for the tip ..... but i thought peoples hated it when you used vengence on them?

NJudson

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

13 Oct 2006 at 22:33 - 92

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skuld

Heh, don't get me wrong, i'll stick around if its just a mistake and the quest can be saved, but if the team steps into mineral springs (if it gets that far) and dies, instantly.. do we res up and die again? These things don't happen with hench or guildies.

I agree. I was doing the Titan quest in Shiverpeaks a little while back and shortly into the quest the retarded team I was with kept rezing people right in the middle of a bunch of enemy. My God, as soon as a person was brought back he'd instantly get whacked again. Some people just don't understand the concept of retreating, regrouping and waiting to re-attack at full strength(not including DP).

Ismoke

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2006

Fullerton, Ca.

CDXX/THE420TH.COM

Mo/Me

13 Oct 2006 at 22:39 - 93

all should carry a rez or rebirth, if you have 2 monks 1 with and one without the monk without the rez sac's for the life of the monk with a rez! how our guild operates when there are 2 healers>! !! I as a monk never bring a rez, if you die you either overextened or your not a priority heal! all other should have a rez OH we never PUG anyway!

Rera

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2006

13 Oct 2006 at 22:44 - 94

You only need a hard res on a monk in something like FoW. If your party is near-wiping anywhere else, seriously consider /ragequit.

Monks don't res in battle, period. That's what res sigs are for.

DrunkenPheonix

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Sep 2006

TCP [The Chosen PT]

W/Mo

13 Oct 2006 at 22:54 - 95

Everyone should bring res with him/her, everyone has a res signet. I dont like people in my team who dont have it equipped.

Monks shouldn't res when they the party is in combat. But as they have unlimited res they should be the first ones to res their party.
But for PvP purposes the monks normally don't need res, they there are cases where the monk has to do that job, I mean what is a monk worth without a teammember to heal?

Voltar

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

My dog let's me crash at her place.

POB

R/

14 Oct 2006 at 00:25 - 96

everyone should bring a rez in pve. for healing monk i know you can put together all the skills you need with like 6 slots. i can see why you'd want to bring a hex removal but half the hexes out there are degen or low damage that can be nullified with breeze. at one point i actually brought rebirth and sprint so i could stay and keep healing until i was the last one standing but thankfully i only had to do that once and decided it was impractical to bring it all the time (groups need to have suicidal eles and weird stuff like that to get that far). when i bond, i always bring rebirth since i can bail from a fight early and still keep doing my job.

i wouldn't fault any monk that didn't bring a rez and certainly wouldn't expect a monk to rez mid-combat. that's just asking for more people to die. my warrior tends to adrenaline-spec so i have plenty of energy to put a combat rez (not rebirth) that's one of the 6 sec casts when she's monk secondary.

oh, ab is the exception to the pvp-rez rule

and i've never seen hate with vengeance but i've rarely seen it used. unyeilding aura is the one that i've seen used. people kinda joke about it and go, "aw man," and stuff but not get mad. it seems to be a lot of fun for the monks who use it too but i'm too greedy with my e regen to do that.

Paperfly

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2006

14 Oct 2006 at 07:37 - 97

Voltar, please change your "characters" entry. It's warping the forum for some of us.

Quote:

I have no idea what you're trying to say here.

In fact, you might say that the subtlety went over your head?

Sorry, that was cheap. So I'll break it down for you!

I was alluding to the popular expression that if something "looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck," then it's probably a duck. However, in your case the "duck"'s (your post's) quack didn't sound like subtlety - it sounded like something a little more blunt and unweildly.

...Hence, a duck that sounds like a crowbar. If in fact it was a duck, 'cause it sure didn't sound like one.

Quote:

I'd say the team could stand to learn a bit more about the game if that res skill is the difference between success or failure, and I'm no teacher.

So we're talking about different circumstances, because I'm quite willing to teach. I also think your standards are higher than you think they are - because near-wipes are quite common in PuGs. Especially during weekends.

(Guild groups aren't a guarantee of competence either, mind you. I've PvE-"guested" in the eighth slot for some casual guilds in missions, and the average playskill hasn't ever struck me as higher than what you'd get from blind invite spamming. In fact, sometimes it's worse because everyone's distracted by the continuous chatting...)

...And I'm still curious as to what monk build people are running where space is so tight that they can't afford the res slot.

Ghozer

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Sheffield, England, UK

Super Cute And Fluffy [scF]

E/

14 Oct 2006 at 09:44 - 98

Res?? in PvE??? :O

wait.... hold on... your DIEING in PvE??? :O

Ensign

Just Plain Fluffy

Join Date: Dec 2004

Berkeley, CA

Idiot Savants

14 Oct 2006 at 12:01 - 99

I feel that if I'm Monking in PvE and my entire team manages to get themselves killed, I'm better off finding a new group than trying to be a ninja with Rebirth.

Peace,
-CxE

Mr_eX

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Dec 2005

Ice Tooth Cave

Opt and Niho Private Chat [lulz]

N/Me

14 Oct 2006 at 14:03 - 100

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sekkira

Everybody who believes this is an idiot.

Gotta love sarcasm on the internet.

Paperfly

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2006

15 Oct 2006 at 06:06 - 101

Quote:

I feel that if I'm Monking in PvE and my entire team manages to get themselves killed, I'm better off finding a new group than trying to be a ninja with Rebirth.

Then you probably shouldn't be playing in PuGs (OK, you probably aren't)... Inasmuch as you're being time inefficient with that attitude. Picking up a goup and bodily carrying them through a mission generally takes a lot less time than assembling a new PuG would.

(admittedly, it doesn't help that my timezone allows me online only at off-peak hours for both European and American servers)

...On a slightly different topic, people seem to be ignoring the importance of a set number of hard resses in groups, simply to cover incidental deaths without exhausting the team's signet supply. And in a PuG, the only person guaranteed to have access to one is the monk. Obviously, that doesn't require Rebirth over any other hard res, though.

(LOF)CozmicD

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2005

Chicago

Lethal Old Farts

15 Oct 2006 at 06:55 - 102

This thread should be broken down into a few different topics:

1)Who brings Res in Pve
A)in PUGs
B)in guild/organized groups

2)Who brings res in PvP
A)GvG
B)PUG

After scamming thru most of this inSANEly long thread, I have come to some conclusions.

1)Who brings Res in PvE?...Everyone
A)in PUGs...Aboso friggin loootely everyone
B)in guild/organized groups...you can plan before you start who is going to do what

2)Who brings res in PvP
A)GvG..you should have already figured this out...what works for your Guild build works.
B)PUG...abso friggin loootely everyone

There is not a solo build that works 100% of the time given the human factors in this game.

If there was, we would all be soloing ThK.

Ensign

Just Plain Fluffy

Join Date: Dec 2004

Berkeley, CA

Idiot Savants

15 Oct 2006 at 08:09 - 103

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paperfly

Picking up a goup and bodily carrying them through a mission generally takes a lot less time than assembling a new PuG would.

I'm playing a Monk. Do you actually think I'm going through the trouble of *assembling* a random group? If I want a true, random pickup, I'm joining a group that's almost full and ready to go.

Teams that manage to wipe themselves thoroughly only very rarely have the ability to clutch up and actually finish a mission. More often, they continue the stupid behavior that wiped them in the first place, only this time with DP.

That said, sometimes I'll bring Rebirth after I'm done capping everything, as I'm used to functioning on six skills in PvE and that slot really isn't all that valuable. The number of times that it's proven valuable is rather low, however - more often than not, when a group does wipe thoroughly, there's no real way to get them back up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paperfly

...On a slightly different topic, people seem to be ignoring the importance of a set number of hard resses in groups, simply to cover incidental deaths without exhausting the team's signet supply. And in a PuG, the only person guaranteed to have access to one is the monk. Obviously, that doesn't require Rebirth over any other hard res, though.

Yeah but there's really no reason to run any hard res other than Rebirth on a Monk. I sure as hell am not about to stop casting mid-battle to res some dead guy - the fact that he died almost always means that my energy is bad, or he did something stupid. Out of combat, Rebirth is just the best res, so if you're going to bring one it might as well be that one.

But, as I said, if you're the Monk and your team has wiped so thoroughly that you're the only way that the group can get going again, the group you're in is probably doomed.

Peace,
-CxE

Jessyi

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

Mo/

15 Oct 2006 at 08:18 - 104

Yay, Ensign agrees with me. Eat it everyone who didn't.

-Jessyi

Ensign

Just Plain Fluffy

Join Date: Dec 2004

Berkeley, CA

Idiot Savants

15 Oct 2006 at 12:00 - 105

...

Are you seriously saying that in situations where people are dying, you're perfectly content to stop healing for almost 9 seconds (and possibly more to run into position) for a combat reschant? Fast cast gear? What do you do if you don't get the fast cast, burn the energy and keep restarting until you get it?

My view is that any Monk who's plan is to stop healing when someone dies to hardcast an 8 second res is getting cut for a henchman at the first opportunity. Please describe the situation where people are dying, but it's ok to stop and res for 8 seconds. I have never encountered it.

You know, I don't know why I'm even bothering to reply to you, since you didn't even bother to read the paragraph you quoted.

Peace,
-CxE

Paperfly

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2006

16 Oct 2006 at 11:49 - 106

Quote:

I'm playing a Monk. Do you actually think I'm going through the trouble of *assembling* a random group? If I want a true, random pickup, I'm joining a group that's almost full and ready to go.

...Heh, fair enough. I'll admit that I've recently taken to ignoring requests from groups at fewer than five people, depending on what kind of mood I'm in.

Quote:

Teams that manage to wipe themselves thoroughly only very rarely have the ability to clutch up and actually finish a mission. More often, they continue the stupid behavior that wiped them in the first place, only this time with DP.

I think this is where we're differing... Not on any theoretical grounds, just in what we've observed. Personally, I've seen enough near wipes (and their cousins the half-wipe + retreats) where people've been shaken out of their complacency and played better afterwards that I'm willing to keep putting the effort into those groups. Occasionally the team is actually more enjoyable (defined as a point halfway between its members' collective competence and their agreeability as individuals) after a couple of /ragequits, and it's led to some fun experiences - finishing Tombs with our last three players, for instance.

Quote:

Yay, Ensign agrees with me. Eat it everyone who didn't.

-Jessyi

...Yeah, I can't think of any way to salvage some dignity out of this that doesn't involve comparisons to Nazi Germany. Unfortunately, Quirk's Exception to Godwin's Law prevents me even from doing that with any chance of success.

SpeedyKQ

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2005

E/Me

16 Oct 2006 at 14:33 - 107

The people opposed to bringing a hard-res keep saying that if the party is bad enough to near-wipe, they aren't worth playing with anyways, so you don't need a res.

As much as I disagree with that, for me it is much more common to have a single person drop mid-battle than it is to near-wipe. And a hard res is needed to pick the person up when the fight is over. You don't want to waste a res sig on that, and you don't (usually) want to leave them dead.

Scutilla

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2005

Tyrian Explorers League

R/P

16 Oct 2006 at 17:01 - 108

Everyone should have a rez. I don't care how leet your 8-skill build is, if you're the last person standing and you don't have a rez, you're going to feel really stupid.

All non-monks should have a rez signet.
If you're a monk secondary, a reusable rez like Resurrect is better- never know when you'll end up in the same situation twice.
Monk primaries should have a stronger rez, such as Restore Life or Resurrection Chant, to get the party back on its feet faster.
Obviously, the above applies to Ritualist primaries/secondaries and Flesh of my Flesh.
If you're in a particularly dangerous area such as Fissure of Woe, Rebirth is better. If you have a near-wipe and the monsters camp the party's corpses, it's the only way to get them out without aggroing. Other than that kind of situation though, Rebirth is pretty terrible for a rez.
I'm NOT suggesting that monks should rez in battle. They should only be using their long-cast rezes after battle. Rez signets should be used if an in-battle rez is really needed.
If there are a lot of bosses (such as in Dragon's Lair or Tahnnakai Temple), everyone can just bring rez signet and not bother with monk rezes.
If you're going to NOT bring a rez, PLEASE let your party know beforehand. I can't count the number of times I've failed Imperial Sanctum because Shiro got in a few lucky hits and we wiped because no one had a rez signet.

Note that the above only applies to PvE, I don't know what the general rules of conduct are for rezes in the various PvP modes (other than everyone should have a rez signet in RA/TA).

Akane

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2006

E/Mo

16 Oct 2006 at 17:29 - 109

Rebirth can be effectively managed in PvE, even in mid-battle, by switching weapon sets. I flip to my -5 axe and Forgotten Fan to preserve a healthy 25 point energy pool.

Best done if you're the secondary prot monk (Aegis spamming with Blessed Aura and a Totem Axe). That way the primary WoH monk maintains energy and sticks to healing.

Gun Pierson

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Belgium

PIMP

Mo/

16 Oct 2006 at 18:16 - 110

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akane

Rebirth can be effectively managed in PvE, even in mid-battle, by switching weapon sets. I flip to my -5 axe and Forgotten Fan to preserve a healthy 25 point energy pool.

Best done if you're the secondary prot monk (Aegis spamming with Blessed Aura and a Totem Axe). That way the primary WoH monk maintains energy and sticks to healing.

True but it will never be as effective as res chant. You'll get even more energy when switching weapon sets and can cast the spell a few times in a row if needed, can't do that with rebirth. Also the healer doesn't need to heal him instantly or he might die again.

Rebirth:
pros:
1) teleport thingy

cons:
1) monk loses all energy
2) player comes back with 25% health only
3) player comes back with zero energy
4) player can't cast for x seconds

res chant:
pros:
1) monk keeps energy
2) player comes back with monks current life
3) player has 35% energy
4) player can cast spells right away

cons:
1) spell has half the normal range

Conclusion and on topic: The monk should carry a good hard res except for rebirth. Other players who have monk as 2nd should bring rebirth. The rest of the party res signet. I was all the time talking about pve ofcourse.

saphir

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

doa

Mo/

16 Oct 2006 at 18:47 - 111

while rebirth may not be as effective as res chant, res chant will never be as flexible as rebirth. If you know how to manage your energy correctly you can not only use it as an emergency (talking about situations in which most of the team may be down, but otherwise the fight is stable, and you need more firepower to finish it off), but you can also extract dead party members from hairy aggro areas.

I never cast rebirth in the middle of battle without making sure of a few things: that i have a incoming supply of energy, that aggro is stable (no bladed aatxe is going running around killing casters), that no one is on the verge of death, that the players who have aggro are not going to lose it by dying or running, and most importantly that I will have enough energy immediately after to not only heal that person back up but also to keep anyone one else party from dying as well after the rebirth.

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

16 Oct 2006 at 20:53 - 112

When it come to rebirth over res chant or restorelife it is best for a Monk in PvE to carry res chant ot restorelife and let the other /Mo carry rebirth eg.R/Mo or even N/Mo.These are the one who should carry rebirth.When or if the group get wiped all the Monk has to do is wait for some clearing and res the person with rebirth then let them do the ressing.

Aillas

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2006

16 Oct 2006 at 22:45 - 113

My monk philosophy on this depends on how bad I need the goal (mission, bonus, etc.) If it is something critical, I'll form a guild/alliance group, take rebirth, and work extra hard to "save" a mission from a near wipe. So for these situations I agree with the people who take rebirth/res whatever.

In a PUG, somewhere I'm tagging along helping 1 friend and 6 strangers, I don't give a crap. Especially if I've already finished the mission, bonus, or whatever. Here I agree with the "if the group near wipes, they are screwed" attitudes. I'll take a res, or maybe not, and if the group folds due to incompetence, retreating and rebirth isn't going to make a difference. Putting the time into saving the mission is more wasted time for me.

Kha

Sins FTW!

Join Date: Mar 2005

USA

Angel Sharks [AS]

17 Oct 2006 at 03:49 - 114

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gun Pierson

Conclusion and on topic: The monk should carry a good hard res except for rebirth. Other players who have monk as 2nd should bring rebirth. The rest of the party res signet. I was all the time talking about pve ofcourse.

Your whole argument that monks should bring Resurrection Chant is very one-sided in that it can only be effective in one type of battle: when the party is taking very little damage and the enemy group is small. This isn't always the case and I argue that if someone has died during a battle then 95% of the time it isn't the case (and don't try to use the battle with Kunnavang as an example since it only represents less than 1% of the type of battles in the game, i.e. one target boss battles). And also if this is the case, then the still standing members should have no problem of defeating the enemies, rezzing the fallen member afterwards and recovering easily. If your team needs more damage power or certain skills from your fallen teammate to successfully kill the target, it is counterproductive that the damage dealers still go on while the monk who is keeping the party alive has to rez.

The opposite side is when the foes' power far exceeds the party's power and the damage being taken is heavy. This can be the case with bad pulls, added aggro, surprise spawns, new foes, etc. There's no time here for a monk to rez during battle. If the group is smart enough they will retreat, then they can Rebirth their fallen friend (especially if the enemy likes to camp the corpse) and make a fairly quick recovery. A monk should be the last one standing if the retreat goes well. A full recovery with Resurrection Chant while the enemy camps your teammates' corpses is most likely not going to happen.

Many people that argue the case for not carrying a rez seem to only point out that deaths are caused by stupidity or lack of energy. There are numerous reasons otherwise, like lag, bad spawns, new to the area/mission, etc. If you're in a party where 7 out of 8 of the members get wiped and you think it can only be because of stupidity, then you obviously don't understand that this is a game and it is not flawless. And if you can't tell that you are in a bad group, or that there are some problem members, after the first couple of battles and are kind of shocked and angry that your party gets near-wiped later on, then you only have yourself to blame for not paying close enough attention to your teammates' playing style.

-Old 3FL-

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2006

Western Australia.

Crystal Mountain [CM]

W/

17 Oct 2006 at 11:31 - 115

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arkantos

PvE - Monks should bring rebirth. Everyone else, a rez.
PvP - Everyone but monks should bring a rez.

Agreed with Ark.

Lady Lozza

Forge Runner

Join Date: Dec 2005

Oz

Angel Sharks

Me/N

17 Oct 2006 at 13:24 - 116

PvE: All should have res of some sort - NO EXCEPTIONS.

Honestly I can't count the number ot times I've gone into a mission or farming or questing or whatever and someone doesn't bring res. The "I'm not a monk, or part monk" excuse doesn't wash it, especially when it comes from a warrior, as they have the higest lvl of armour in the game and when pulling too much aggro are often the last ones standing, squishies don't stand a chance if you don't pull right!

As for the type of res, really it is up to you. Res chant is great on Me/Mo players with the fast casting, at least one non-monk primary, should have rebirth, at least one monk should have rebirth. Thiese are just very general rules.

Another general rule is for monks to not res in the middle of a fight. Of course I'm not saying that they shouldn't ever, but it is easier and better for another caster/ranged character to atttend to it than the monk who will have to stop healing the rest of the party for the length of the spell.

the_jos

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Hard Mode Legion [HML]

N/

17 Oct 2006 at 15:50 - 117

I agree with all people in earlier postings that (playing PvE, ni PuGs) all people should carry a res.
i cannot think of one skill that is more valuable than the 7 skills of a fallen partymember.

When I play Mo/ I usually carry Rebith. When level has loads of bosses and I team up with a second monk, I also bring Sig. I'll call when I cast sig to let the other monk know he's on his own for a few seconds.
Most of the time other partymembers simply don't see that a partymember is down as fast as the monks.

When playing /Mo it's always a hard res.
I prefer playing casters, so most of the time it's Rebirth. Or Res Chant on my Me/Mo.

Also important is determining which res to use.
When a tank that has aggro goes down, Rebirth is not the best option.
Also chant would not be preferred, except on Me/Mo or the other 'tank' if you have one.
It's Sig or one of the 'keep alive for certain time res'.

I also would like to add that the type of res depends very much on the goal of the team.
When you attempt masters on the timed missions in Factions, rebirthing the whole team is not an option. So rebirth has less value there, other resses that get a player up and running near the battle are better there.

Laughing Man

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Oct 2006

College Park

17 Oct 2006 at 18:43 - 118

To me it's really situation dependent..PUG vs henchies vs guildies? I typically go into PUG groups with the mentality that there's an idiot or n00b in a group. Someone that still hasn't learned it isn't smart to run and agro tons of mobs, get themselves killed and blame the monk. So all my characters (Ranger, Warrior, Necromancer, Mesmer) carry a res when possible. Whether it's hard or soft.

For a while I kept using the Mesmer elite that gives you energy Mantra of Recall I think. I would keep using that before I casted Rebirth. Another reason why I always bring long distance resurrects is because people don't know when they should retreat. So they'll often die right in the mobs camp area -_-.

This topic reminds me of a mission I did with PUGs in I believe Abaddon's Mouth. I had already henched it so I just wanted to go capping but I decided to help the group with the mission. Turns out I was the ONLY one with a resurrection skill. And judging by how often the group died it was a miracle that the mission was finished.

Lena A

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Dec 2005

france

[Ci]

Me/

17 Oct 2006 at 19:14 - 119

I prefer to play with 7 survivors => no rez required => 1 more free slot

Rez is for noobs

Ensign

Just Plain Fluffy

Join Date: Dec 2004

Berkeley, CA

Idiot Savants

17 Oct 2006 at 20:52 - 120

Rebirth is a hard res that you can use in a battle that you lose. Resurrection Chant is dependent upon winning.

Peace,
-CxE