R.I.P Spiteful Spirit

Azaril000

Azaril000

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

London

Afk Mac n Cheeze Dun [LOOL]

N/Mo

Just to inform everyone of the latest updates, SS scatters enemies, and SV (sympathetic visage) makes the enemies stop attacking/scatter.

Disappointed how useless SS has become now in PvE

Good fun until it lasted.

Edit: These tests werent listed on the updates, this was tested by me and my guild in underworld.

Edit2: Desecrete/Defile Enchantments and Feast of Corruption, Icy Veins now also scatter enemies.

Edit3: Tried using Spoil victor in UW, makes you receive aggro the second it gets on a aataxe, still testing. Unrelated Famine bomb also scatters. Also I'm not sure if its a bug or permanent, but all your Green, collector staff have missing enchants, like my ghials has no more +5 energy. Kaolin Staff has no more +30hp +1 Curse at the moment, pretty sure its a bug.

Ok I followed Celains advice and went outside Droks to get the mobs there, they did not scatter from SS, Desecretem feast at all, even at low health, so i think this is aimed at the UW/fissure dungeons?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hvPZfAroiY

Sauron the Evil

Sauron the Evil

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

The Lost Haven

E/Me

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo oooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo ooooooooooooo

Mistermagoo

Mistermagoo

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Dec 2005

In my computer room.

The Noob Elite [TnE]

N/Me

... Now FoW armor is going to be rare again, and ecto's are going to skyrocket in price :O I guess trapping will still work...




Spoil Victor: increased damage to 25..100 This looks pretty friggin tasty now :O

Celain

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

I saw no scatter from SS while taking on Mursaat in Abaddon's Mouth mission. Possibly just a UW nerf?

Pick Me

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Thornill, ON, Canada

THE CANUCK MONKS (TCM)

W/R

I read the update and it says AoE scatter will only affect monsters who are not healthy (near full health) or those who don't think they are close to killing their target (where you are near full health I guess).

So if they scatter on the first hit, then yeah, that sucks big. If it works as it supposed to be stated, then perhaps they were not near full health when they scatter.

Zamochit

Zamochit

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jul 2006

N/A

Ectos will not go up in price dramatically.

Not while dual smite still works anyway, I can imagine no reason why it shouldn't. Anyone done a dual smite run since the update to confirm this? Otherwise i will run one when i get home to make sure.

Malice Black

Site Legend

Join Date: Oct 2005

You have to take into consideration that they are still working in the AI and it has already been posted that some of the AI is bugged.

Give Anet a few days before you start crying.

DJJD2006

DJJD2006

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2006

[CASH]

R/Mo

You could just do Famine Ranger/55?

Sertu

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2006

yes that would be an option. But it doesnt work as well as 55/SS did.

Sir Mad

Sir Mad

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2006

Moe's Pub

Pigs Can Fly [Pigs]

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by DJJD2006
You could just do Famine Ranger/55? Apparently AV/SV also make monsters scatter. I'm still downloading the new update (I really shouldn't have used the -image trick ) so I haven't tested yet, but it seems my favourite UW build is kinda dead too :x

EDIT - Oh and Sertu, I don't want to have another argue about SS vs famine, but it really depends on the players - with a semi-good ranger and monk that's possibly even faster.

EDIT 2 - That was*

R.I.P

I can't believe now the monsters are smarter than half of the players

Cebe

Cebe

The 5th Celestial Boss

Join Date: Jul 2006

Inverness, Scotland

The Cult of Scaro [WHO]

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Mad
I can't believe now the monsters are smarter than half of the players Hmm, I can believe that myself! You don't see the enemy's healers leaving mid-way through a battle!!

Aaanyway. Even is SS is less effective...Hello Feast of Corruption...my new favourite Necro Elite. The OP claims it now scatters enemies as well...how? I don't understand...once you have cast it that's it...there's nothing to scatter for! Also I don't notice it having been updated in the Guild Wars support website.

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

Wow, is SS nerfed throughout the entire game? If so, I'm not kidding when I say I am not playing this game anymore. AndI'm glad I realized this before I went out and wasted my money on Nightfall. I've played every profession, and many builds, and playing SS in PvE is BY FAR my favorite. If that's gone, I have no reason to continue on in this game.

Pick Me

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

Thornill, ON, Canada

THE CANUCK MONKS (TCM)

W/R

SS scatters monsters so you can't have reckless haste + ss and have 3 monsters dead while you are laughing because they can't hit you.

Each time SS is triggered, monsters will scatter (I believe). I don't know how this will affect my game play with my N/Me, but if it works the way it is described (monsters won't run if they have lots of health), then I don't care. It won't affect me because I'll be able to kill them with hexes anyway.

This gives WW more abuse power. Make them scatter when they are low on life, cast WW. If they don't use a skill (stances, attack skills, healing, etc.) they get hit with more damage. SS + WW, then when they try to heal, CoF. Damage for if you stand and fight, damage if you try to heal, damage if you use a skill, damage if you don't use a skill. Running means you get damaged by WW.

I guess this affects UW and FoW mainly. Not a real threat to PvE or PvP (unless people start taking cues from henchie AI ).

Effigy

Effigy

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Aug 2005

Illinois, US

Heroes of Talia [HoT]

Mo/

If I had known this I would have held onto my ectos.

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

I'm going to do some experimenting after work and see how effective SS actually is in PvE outside of UW and FoW. I want to know how effective it is in groups and solo.

Azaril000

Azaril000

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

London

Afk Mac n Cheeze Dun [LOOL]

N/Mo

Like i said, these tests were only done in UW on aataxes. They did scatter (also transfer aggro to you) when SS was on, FoC, desecrete, Defile. SV/AV made them scatter/stop attacking. Spoil Victor made me gain aggro immediatly.

I tried Fissure with a 55 monk, and for some reason when the 55 got the aggro, the second I put on SS they didnt scatter, but went straight for Rastigan( Ghost at the beginning of Fissure) and attacked him, needless to say fissure ended quickly. We brought along another monk, and did the same thing. 55 got aggro, I cast SS, they ran to Rastigan (sp?) and the normal monk (who was next to rastigan and never got aggro) kept healing rasti. I cast SS on them while they attacked Rasti, and they continued to attack through SS (yes, i did put SS on shadow beasts and shadow warriors to be sure) both regardless of any hp, attacked through, and died from SS/desecrete/defile.

We went left up the little hill and 55 aggroed a shadow warrior, and a shadow beast, and kept aggro, as rastigan, was a bit further back then where those spawns were. Anyways while they were attacking the 55hp monk, I put reckless/SS on one, and SS on another, neither scattered, high, low or medium health. We tried this also on shadow monks, eles etc and neither scattered. However i did notice i gained aggro pretty quickly through SS, than before, had alot of Shadow warriors coming at me.

The last part of the fissure test was SV/AV. The 55 went and aggroed a Abyssal, and as soon
as I cast SV on 55 monk he scattered (deaggroed on monk) and came straight for me, and the other "normal build" monk. Tried it again with the same effect of SV scatter. Then lastly, when I got aggro from a shadow beast/warrior, I cast SV on myself and they did not scatter, loose aggro. So me and the 55 went back to UW, he brought along SV aswell, got aggro from aataxes, and cast SV on himself and they didnt seem to scatter.

Edit: Oh yeah I forgot to mention I went outside droks with some henchies, to fight some Grawls, got some of them in a ball around the tank, cast SS, they didnt scatter, cast desecrete/defile they didnt scatter (regardless of hp). I didnt test FoC but im guessing the same effect?
Also in my opinion, I won't be making such a big deal out of this, Im happy SS and the other necro AoE's is still as viable in PvE area's other than the underworld/FoW. I think theres always gonna be ways to overcome the farming restrictions in Uw/Fissue with new builds etc, necro's are in my opinion still valuable to any team.


If this all sounds confusing many apologies

Carinae

Carinae

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2005

Inside

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

The scattering on SS/SV might be a bug. Give them time, there were 'tuning' issues on the last AOE update as well.

Also....Does ths really seem like an insurmountable issue? I can think of about 4 ways to adapt off the top of my head, so it doesn't seem too bad....

Kusandaa

Kusandaa

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

N/Mo

I'm very disappointed... necro's my favorite profession, and they had to go nerf the thing I live for: farming to get cash to get different armor -.-. Guess it's me, my minions, a monk and 3 b/p's in SF, then 8-man FoW.

Azaril000, I didn't find your post confusing, but pretty useful... nice studies. Maybe the new enemy AI isn't always that smart, since they only "see" the one that uses SV/AV (as probably the attacker?) or go aggro a third person or NPC without any scatter, thinking they are safe? A possible 3-man UW and FoW farm? (one that makes it scatter, another that gets aggro, and the SS?)

Yelaeh Arat

Yelaeh Arat

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Jun 2006

Uk, Cheshire eng

Unknown

N/Me

NOOOOOO
Im gutted, im reading this as the update downloads.....
i love(d) SS... i cant believe this and i wont accept it until i have a good go at all the usual areas, just as i was looking forward to nightfall

around

around

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: May 2006

Aussie Trolling Crew - Diplomatic Embassy

I Have Three Pennies [Pnny] - forever in my heart <3

R/

Oh no, you may have to think of your own build now, instead of using exactly the same build over and over again. The horror!

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

"Oh no, you may have to think of your own build now, instead of using exactly the same build over and over again. The horror! "

Ireelevant point you just made. When people buy a game, they deserve the right to play however they feel as long as it was within the rules and did not cause balance issues. I enjoyed playing SS through missions with friends, and I can no longer do that. So naturally I feel robbed. It's one thing to fix something that threw off the balance of the game or was a mistake to begin with, its another to break something that wasn't doing anything wrong just because anet didn't like what it was doing. They dont like farming, so in an attempt to fix it, they just go ahead and ruin legit ways of playing this game. I'm sure if they can just find some people with half a functioning brain, they can figure other ways to fix things without trashing the whole game for some people.

Velath

Velath

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2006

Canada

A/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zamochit
Ectos will not go up in price dramatically.

Not while dual smite still works anyway, I can imagine no reason why it shouldn't. Anyone done a dual smite run since the update to confirm this? Otherwise i will run one when i get home to make sure. Spirit bond got hit with the nerf bat too, Spirit Bond: expires after 10 attacks or Spells. so you'll be recasting it quite often. No more taking quest and kill 8 graspings and 3 aatxes together...you'll take more attacks than the time it takes to recharge.

I imagine it's still doable but it'll be more difficult. 55/sb hybrid will most likely stay as my choice...

Beatrix of Alexandria

Beatrix of Alexandria

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

I'm a bit bothered by the SS thing as well, but mostly since I got into using it without following the cookie cutter SS build that everyone uses. But oh well, I'll just have to play around and find another necro skill set to use since the scatter isn't my concern as the potential for groups never to accept an ss necro again is...

Elorin

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Oct 2006

Me/

I also may go back on plans of buying Nightfall.

I play this game with my girlfriend and an UW run together was one of the most enjoyable things. Really dissapointing

Gigashadow

Gigashadow

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Aug 2005

Bellevue, WA

W/

SS was one of the few skills that didn't get nerfed last year when they did the AOE nerf. Unsurprisingly, scrubs moved from meteor shows and fire storms and became totally dependent on SS to accomplish anything in pve.

Woop Shotty

Woop Shotty

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2006

Ruthless Mafia [RM]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mistermagoo
I guess trapping will still work... Not 6 months from yesterday...

Sir Mad

Sir Mad

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Apr 2006

Moe's Pub

Pigs Can Fly [Pigs]

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elorin
I also may go back on plans of buying Nightfall.

I play this game with my girlfriend and an UW run together was one of the most enjoyable things. Really dissapointing Argh now you will have to find other most enjoyable things to do with her. Too bad

Nah, seriously, get over it. SS is dead, fine. So is firestorm since the 1st AoE nerf. But who cares? There are other skills, other builds.

Azaril000

Azaril000

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

London

Afk Mac n Cheeze Dun [LOOL]

N/Mo

Hmm I'm thinking theres some misconception on SS at the moment. From my previous posts I'd like to reiterate, SS is not dead, yes it has been shot in the foot by a-net regarding UW, and maybe a little with fissure, but in other open pve area's missions, I think it still works the same way SS was before this update. I just went outside the "Market Place" to fight some Jade brotherhood warriors, and they didnt deaggro, scatter or anything when I put suffering + SS on followed by desecrete. I even to make sure, went further ahead waijiin bazaar (sp?) to fight more than 3 Jade brotherhoods, Hench warrior (talon) held aggro for like 4-5 jade brotherhoods, while I used SS, and they didnt really scatter.

So again Spiteful Spirit is not dead (completely), just the UW builds involving SS has been err.. tweaked?

P.s: Yes I realize what i just said now is contradicting to my thread name, but that was made last night at 4 am, when I was in a sleepyWTF mode :P.

Ill try post some screenshots soon

Rin

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Velath
Spirit bond got hit with the nerf bat too, Spirit Bond: expires after 10 attacks or Spells. so you'll be recasting it quite often. No more taking quest and kill 8 graspings and 3 aatxes together...you'll take more attacks than the time it takes to recharge.

I imagine it's still doable but it'll be more difficult. 55/sb hybrid will most likely stay as my choice... just use a skill that reduces attack speed by 50% (hint hint)

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

Well if that's the case Azaril, well then I am fine with the current situation, and take back what I said earlier about the recent update. I have not had a chance to try anything out, and all I've been hearing is "SS is dead". So if I can in fact still use SS in most normal PvE areas, then I'm fine with whatever changes they made.

But if you are right, my question is how can they modify the way it works in UW and FoW, but not normal PvE areas? Are only the enemies in the those specific areas programmed to scatter?

If you are right, this is very relieving for me. I just enjoyed using SS with groups in PvE to get through missions, not for farming. So in my case, I dont deserve to suffer by them nerfing my favorite skill when it did not cause any balance issues or anything before. I believe they need to find a way to nerf farming, without ruining other aspect of the the game in the process. That's what I've been complaining about.

Safer Saviour

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2006

No group is going to take anything but an MM in Nightfall, are they? Especially not with Shambling Horrors and Jagged Bones and in truth, I really hate MMing.

Thank you Anet for nerfing the only non-MM build groups didn't mind accepting for PvE...

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

Yeah I hate MMing too. But didn't Azaril just say SS is still effective outside of UW and FoW. Of course I dont have any 1st hand experience I dont know for sure if there's any truth to that.

Elorin

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Oct 2006

Me/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Mad
Argh now you will have to find other most enjoyable things to do with her. Too bad

Nah, seriously, get over it. SS is dead, fine. So is firestorm since the 1st AoE nerf. But who cares? There are other skills, other builds. Well you'll have to admit that in this case an UW duo would beat some PuG group anytime.
And for clarification, we live in different countries, of which, going from your post you were not aware of

Don't see the point though, I thought A-net already put in an anti-duo farmcode. Which I don't mind really it was just a fun thing to coordinate.

Oh well, NWN2 comes out soon...

Epinephrine

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

Yay! SS nerf! about time. Never made any sense that there would be an AoE skill that DIDN"T trigger flight if the others did. Good riddance.

SnipiousMax

SnipiousMax

Perfectly Elocuted

Join Date: Sep 2005

Comeon guys, you knew it was coming!

Beatrix of Alexandria

Beatrix of Alexandria

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by Safer Saviour
nerfing the only non-MM build groups didn't mind accepting for PvE... That's pretty much my concern...don't think I'll be able to get into many groups anymore since I'm not the biggest fan of playing MM.

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by SnipiousMax
Comeon guys, you knew it was coming! I actually didn't because I didn't think it was doing anything wrong or tampering with the delicate balance. At this point, they might as well nerf every remaining skill that's still halfway decent because that's where it's heading. It seems to anet, the only way to achieve true balance in their eyes is to make sure every skill stinks.

I've come to the realization that there are not too many ways left in this game to actually give you the sense of feeling powerful, especially after you hit level 20. And that's when I start getting bored and stop wanting to spend my money on these games. This is how franchises die. Apparently they haven't learned that you actually need to keep people excited for them to want to keep playng your games.

They say this game rewards skill, but if they keep taking away the useful skills, what will we have left to work with?

Epinephrine

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cygnus_Zero
there are not too many ways left in this game to actually give you the sense of feeling powerful, especially after you hit level 20.
Kill stuff in Ascalon? Bet you can make those level 6 Charr cry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cygnus_Zero
They say this game rewards skill, but if they keep taking away the useful skills, what will we have left to work with? Plenty of useful skills exist, just not the ones that make the game pointless. No BFG9000 + godmode for you.

Azaril000

Azaril000

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2006

London

Afk Mac n Cheeze Dun [LOOL]

N/Mo

Sad as it is, I recorded a short footage, just to show that SS is still viable/effective in normal PvE stuff. As seen they dont scatter, but sometimes shuffle about. It looks pretty much unchanged.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hvPZfAroiY

Edit: Oops set the video to public, so now you can watch.

Cygnus_Zero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

N/Me

You set the video to private.