A big disappointment

QFT.

I believe that is why ANET used PvP type of arenas in PvE so much. Its quick, requires nearly no story, and provides as a time sink for players. And in Nightfall there are quite a few of them compared to other chapters.

I would disagree with this statement. People are running paragons in gvg builds.

I almost won halls with a previous guild in a ritualist based team too. Our only problem was mobility, ofcourse, which is why we didn't take the cake in the end.

I will close this thread if you continue to make it a PvE vs PvP bashing thread.

Perhaps in the future:

In any case, sadly this thread and like many are started because of the need of PvP skill balance that makes the PvE less fun. Theres no real way to go around this if we want to actually discuss this.

Not all of us find playing PvE in godmode fun.

There are a huge number of skills I would nerf for PvE, just to add a little more challenge in it.

Though for the record - I don't think rits/paras are useless. Rits are great in some of the new areas

LOL Thall, that is kinda sad but funny because it is true, it made my day though.

4 skills got changed up for the Paragon in the last update and now you can't play your Paragon effectively? You've played for 10 months and you can adapt around such a small change? Judging from this I doubt you're any good in a PUG anyways nerf or not.

umm...what? That was a question, hence the question mark. I know people run paragons in gvg. I didn't think the poster knew it so I asked him a question.

http://www.blizzard.com/diablo2

That's GW without PvP (and without a few other things, most notably the ability to rebuild your character on the fly). Uberweapons that do 300-500 damage? Sure. Oh wait, we'll come out with new mosnters 50 levels higher so you don't slaughter them with your uberweapons. Well, I guess we'll release the expansion that has new uberdoomweapons that do 500-2000 damage. And make your level 20+32 spells insta-kill everything 3 screens in front of you instead of 2. But that's kinda unbalanced. So we'll give all monsters 5 random immunities and you must have a new uberdoomweapon that ignores those immunities. What? Pfft, dictionaries are for pussies, immunities mean what we say they mean. Nothing is immune to my hacked 20000-50000 bow of pwnage.

Um, yeah.

You should be glad GW is balanced around PvP. Or you'd be walking around with ether renewal and its cousin energizing finale under prot spirit/spirit bond with constant shadow form (+300% enchanting mod) farming lvl 50 stuff for that new green sword with 100/100 sundering mod.

Dude, relax! Everyone thought that MMs were dead after the big MM nerf. OH NO!! I can't raise a bazillion minions. The goods one adapt and find different skills to kick a$$ with. If you like playing the Paragon, you'll figure it out and be better for it.

omg !!!!! ARE YOU SERIOUS ok i have a solution to allthos who hate the nerf and dont always get gold drops .. and dislike the constant changing of the game (Diablo 2) same crap every time you play nothing is changed on the skills etc.. u want that go to that game .. anet has brought a diverse game here to challange and to make the players constantly think and evolve in there game play .. i mean come on who really wants to play the same thing every day for months on end ?

No one does .. Comming from my point of view i would rather have anet change things up a bit keep me on my toes challange me to push forward and find new ways to get gold .. good weaps items.. etc.. ^_^ its fun it''s wut i like most about gw .. every mopnth it's somthing different

Now think how many other games offer the options you have here on gw .. i mean they throw in new weaps when they feel it is time .. they offer contest .. championship tournaments for those who like pvp ... they offer elite missions realms that drop rare materials etc.. its never ending ... there is a crap load of things to do on gw

see i played d2 for a year after a few months i got board i had every char typwe .. all godly things weaps large ammounts of gold etc.. but nothing ever changed day in and day out same thign every time i played .. and here you all are complaining about a diverse game that challanges you to evolve and move forward .. here is what i got to say ... if you don't like it evolve and move on or go else where ^_^

lame complaints...

that is exactly what a lot of people have done, you can have this game all to your fanboy self.

nothing more irritating than expressing an opinion and then getting told to move on, shut up, get out, go away. right. such is the attitude that destroys communities.

mark my words, this game cannot continue with its current business model if it's developers are too arrogant to realize that their creation, precious as it may be to them, is NOT what the community wants.

Ah if that was the case all we would have is Warriors running around around the place and hardly any mesmers! hang on a sec lets rephrase that . Well it there haddnt been any nerfs it would be even worse than it is now, all u would see is warriors of every sort and denomination and the other classes would only be used by people who actually know what there doing but wont be able to get into a group since there not a W. There would be no elitism there would only be warriorism (where warriors hate all other classes especially mesmers or necros).

Bravo! Bravo!

You'll have to forgive me as I'm having a hard time parsing your.... Writing. Are you seriously pointing to Diablo II, one of the longest-lived and most successfull video games in history, as an example of a bad game?

Oh, and skills did change in DII, several times. Mind you, nothing like Anerf... err... Anet seems to prefer, but there were several changes. Enough to render the skill listings in the original game guide almost as useless as the game guides for Prophecies and Factions were before the ink was even dry.

If you want an example of a game where skills never change, try chess. Not a single change in over a hundred years, what in the world are they thinking?

I think Anet should divide PvE skills and PvP skills. I mean the day I step into RA and have to fight 6 Lvl 28 monsters hitting me for 360^ dmge a hit...
I realize that Anet will never do something like that but it would be nice.
The extra storage space would be reall nice as well but imagine the amount of extra memory Anet would have to add? Thats $$$ out of their pocket which I doubt their willing to spend on our behalf...

And look at how that works out. There's NO reason to roll any other piece but Queen, they are totally unbalanced. Don't get me started on Kings, if you die as a King your whole TEAM loses. Lame.

ummmm........

they have the hour by hour day by day logs of how the COMMUNITY plays not a tiny forum splinter group *vocal minority*

you do not speak for the community as to what the overall community wants.

instead of *the community* say *i* want this or that as you (and i) have no idea what the greater community is doing

First to the OP, 10 hours a day and no PvP, I dunno how you are not bored and I'm stunned you have a cash flow problem.
Second you say you want your monies worth, yet you only play half the game to begin with. Try some PvP, you'll be surprised. The game was ment to be PvP, Guild Wars, battles between guilds.

I don't PvE anymore, NF killed that for me. I never like the Faction farming needed in Factions (10k need to get to the next mission deal) and now the promotion point farming, bah. "We need you for this mission Orange Milk, but first go kill plants and mosters for 4 hours until we make you a General" I guess those plants need dead more than Elona needs saving.

Heros are kinda killing team play aswell, I'm polite by useing "kinda"

GvG is chess. positioning and stratagy, and when the Guild Lord(aka King) dies so does the whole team. Plus hs got his little support guys there to protect him, ya know, the NPC's(Pawns)

Thats about all I got

Ahh, but that is why I posted my complaints, I want to see if indeed I am alone or others in the community have the same complaints, if they do then perhaps we have a voice.

Very bad example. Chess is nothing like GW. In chess both sides have exactly the same pieces. So even if one piece is overpowered (aka The Queen) it's still balanced because both sides have it.

In GW, you have different professions, different skills. Not everyone has access to the same skills depending on what profession they are. It is NOTHING at all like how chess is set up.

Besides, different builds and different uses of skills are the fun of this game. It seems so many of you overlook that and instead complain when your favourite cooking cutter builds and skills get nerfed. Half the fun is experimenting and thinking up new builds.

Seriously, I dont understand all the crying about nerfs and changes. Every game has them. Even professional sports changes some rules every so often. Can't handle change? Then go play chess then.

Umm... It would only be a bad example had I claimed that chess was like GW, I didn't.

Are the fun of the game for you.

Perhaps they "overlook" that because for them it is not half the fun? Could be...

In the far too many years I've been gaming I have never played a game whose fans were so very fast -- Nay, eager! -- to tell others to go play something else.

That aside, I have far more respect for a good chess player than I will ever have for anyone because of their GW '1337ness', so perhaps that's not such bad advice.

I don't think it's right for some of you to tell the OP that the game is still fun and he/she should try this or that (pvp or whatever). Peoples are entitle to say what they want about a game and the op bring up some good points. Guild Wars in definition is losing it's appeal as a MMORPG. I mean look at WoW, Flyff, hell even Runescape. Those games are getting ton of peoples playing on it. Guild Wars is essentially PvE and PvP aspect for anyone who want to try it. What is lacking with Guild Wars i could tell you this is sense of being truly MMORPG. Where can you find peoples in the game? Oh go to those different towns and you get thousand of peoples waiting there. But is the game really massively mulitplayer. Not in PvE when you only get around 8 real peoples on the team. In PvP and AB is where you see more real players fighting with each others. I think A-Net don't want to change the formula that made Guild Wars great. Rather, they're adding new classes along with new storyline and items for us to collect in each of the new chapters.

About whinning or crying about skills changes. Some peoples like the existing skills they got like AoE spells back than when enemies stand still for you to nuke them to death. But what gives us the right not to complain about it. It's a game that we paid for and peoples got right to voice their opinion that they're favorite skills or classes got nerfed.

As Sherlock Holmes would say, "So many have claimed that, and yet here I stand."

Seriously, if you want to complain, that's fine. If you want to claim that this business model isn't going to work... Prophecies and Factions are Games of the Year. The verdict isn't quite in yet on Nightfall as far as sales go, but seriously... The People(tm) speak loudest with their money.

There's a word for bringing up totally irrelavant points just to get a reaction out of people. It's called trolling. Don't do it.

Unien... where you been dude haven't seen you in a while!

I think Nightfall is better than Factions and i enjoy the storyline and improvement that A-Net did. Althought, i wish there is more upgrade to the original game formula but hey, i can wish can i?

Why did you bring up the subject of chess then? As Unienaule said, don't bring up irrelevant topics.

And you know why people are telling you to play something else? Well why not? If you don't like the main characteristics of a game then you should play something else instead of demanding that they change what the game was all about in the first place. In this case, GW is all about balance, if you can't handle constant change to maintain that balance then find some other game.

It's like asking to change the game of basketball because you don't like running so much. If you dont like running then play some other sport.

That's kind of depressing.

Nightfall and Factions were made by two different teams. This probably means that all the odd numbers (Prophecies, Nightfall) will be good expansions, and all the even numbers (Factions) will be a big letdown.

That's also why no one should get their hopes up for the new expansion when it nears completion.

QQmore

Some people learn from they're misstakes :O
And I love complain-threads, makes me giggle and think what their point is. I wouldn't stick around in a hardcore/trance bar, and I certainly wouldn't tell them to play hiphop.
And, 10 hours a day over the last 10 months and no good items/runes/cash? Gee, I guess I'm totally 1337 then with only bout 6 hours a day over the past 11 months.

1. All I can say is learn to adapt or quit complaining. If it was all PvE then nobody would care that Paragons were highly overpowered...ok so not "highly" but they were overpowered, so are Dervish in my opinion. This means in the PvP side of the game certain classes unbalance the game. Is it a shame that PvE gets hit by the nerf stick too sure...but as I said learn to adapt. Seriously people complain as much about the Paragon nerf as they did the gale nerf, or the SF nerf (though less complaints and more rejoicing, not that it did alot anyways 15 ene cast whoopdie-do )

2.a)Chests: its a gamble and thats the whole point of it. A-net meant it to be a gold sink NOT a boost for poor players. If you can't afford keys then don't open chests unless you get a key from a drop.

b) Items: First off anyone who thinks purples are useless needs to uninstall. Sure getting a gold is better, but I have found max mods on purple items. Wait whats that I just made 20k off a max sundering mod I salvaged from a purple bow?????!!!!! ZOMG so useless. Sure its rare and usually it isn't the mod you want, but it does happen. Which brings me to the point that you say out of 100's of chests you've gotten 2 good items. You ever think maybe to salvage parts off 2 of the other items and slap them on a 3rd one with a low req? Consider:

i. I open chest and id a gold bow its req 9, 15-stance, 2 crap mods not even max, say a 3:1 vamp (which on a bow sucks) and Armor +4 always.

ii. I open chest and id a gold bow thats req 13, 14-enchanted, 20/20 sundering, and a bow grip of marksmanship +18%

iii. I open chest and id a gold bow thats req 13, 13% vs undead, +30 fort mod, and no bow string.

iv. See where I'm going with this? Salvage the +30 fort, and the 20/20 sundering. Then slap them on the req 9 15-stance (or wait for a low req 15^50 or w/e). Point is just because individual items may not be all that great you can generally make one "good" item out of 2-3 "ok-bad" items.

c) Greens: Not much I can say, the point is for them to drop rarely so that way not everyone and their kid sister has one. If you're complaining about only getting crap greens, then don't farm for the crap ones. Not alot you can do but farm or pay for it.

3. This is really the same as greens, prices are based on supply and demand. If you don't want to dish out 30k for a sup vigor then quite simply don't. Dish out the 5k for a major and live with the -15 health or whatever the difference is.

4. Storage: Finally something in all that I can agree with. Though personally I think they should charge more than 50g for it....

Nice try, but purple items can't drop with max mods.

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Item_rarity

So, yes, purple are nearly-useless because nobody is paying money for anything less than perfect. I use 13^50 purple bows on my heroes and such, but aside from that, purples are merchant fodder. A +28 sword pommel might be useful... you can sell it for ~3k to someone. Other upgrades 2 off max aren't even worth that.

Diablo 2 isn't anything like that. Damage is in the millions, not the thousands.

Guild Wars is, unfortunately, following the D2 Trend. Every expansion they try to make something better than before. It is now possible to kill a level 20 in 2 strikes with a rit or dervish. Back in prophecies the quickest you could drop someone was 4 hits. 180 damage scythe attacks and AoE conditionals for 100 are getting a little overpowered for pvp.

Wiki is great but not perfect. I've gotten perfect mods such as +Axe Mastery 20% on purples.

Also the only people who think max damage/armor purples are useless are the superficial power traders and elitists. I sure as hell dont care if my item is purple or gold as long as it's max and I meet the requirement. And I can always swap mods and inscriptions.

I once got a max dmg sundering Halo Axe 15 in stance, and it was a purple :O. Found it in a chest in Iron Horse War Machine.

What, nobody uses collector stuff? =/

Blues FTW! Unless I can get a really cheap gold, then I'll grab the gold with the skin I like (screw low reqs, high reqs FTW!)

Collector items is the cheapest way you can equip yourself and your heroes in game.

"The various +4...5 Armor upgrades and modifiers can have the maximum value on purple weapons due to their narrow range."

That seems to be a max on a purple, not to mention shocking, ebon, zealous, fiery, and icy mods However I get your point...although I could of swore I did a max before. Oh well, still with a max armor mod and all those prefixes my point still stands purples aren't completely useless...maybe not worth the 1.5k you paid for your fow/doa key but meh.

Pix or it didn't happen.

Max damage purples used to be utter trash, maxing out at 12^50. Now they go up to 14^50, which has an almost unnoticeable difference from 15^50. You can even change that on inscriptionable weapons now. However, purples lack the +epeen that golds have, so many people refuse to use anything less than golds.