Yes I justed wanted to know what people think is the Most useful and useless Dervish God Form.
For me i'd say Avatar of Melandru because of complete immunity to conditions, useful for so many situtions.
Useless? I'd have to say Grenth form due to the fact rending sweep + hex can remove alot more enchantments than a grenth form ever could.
Post if like you just PLEASE don't flame and spam..
Most useful and useless God Form?
Solus_the_Deadly
Dragannia
Grenth's is overpowered. It makes targets impossible to prot, forcing people to resort to using good but limited skills like Gift of Health to keep someone alive. Not to mention skills like Dark Escape won't work because Dervishes frequently carry Wild Blow.
Kijik Oni Hanryuu
hmm I think most useless..wow, hard to decide, they all are very strong and synergize very well with whatever builds they use... I say they are all equal..
Servant of Kali
Wow one more of these threads.
"Solus_the_Deadly
Join Date: Dec 2006"
New forum members shouldnt start creating threads as soon as they register. They should look around the forum a bit to see if perhaps, just perhaps, tons of people complained about Grenth being overpowered
Right now Lyssa is by far the least used avatar.
"Solus_the_Deadly
Join Date: Dec 2006"
New forum members shouldnt start creating threads as soon as they register. They should look around the forum a bit to see if perhaps, just perhaps, tons of people complained about Grenth being overpowered
Right now Lyssa is by far the least used avatar.
ensoriki
in terms of beating spell casters
Id say Lyssa, the +46 damage is evil...
Enchantments:grenth
hexes
wayna
Running:balthazar
Conditions: Melandu/dwayna
Im saying Balthazar is worst
you can get running speed from other sources while having melandu or Dwayna on
Add Fiegned neutrality if your doing a runner and your set
Best
Grenth is great against Monks, Dwayna beats n?me hexes
Lyssa pwns anything that is dazed
melandru is just...there
Lyssa/Dwayna and Grenth are the best
Id say Lyssa, the +46 damage is evil...
Enchantments:grenth
hexes
waynaRunning:balthazar
Conditions: Melandu/dwayna
Im saying Balthazar is worst
you can get running speed from other sources while having melandu or Dwayna on
Add Fiegned neutrality if your doing a runner and your set
Best
Grenth is great against Monks, Dwayna beats n?me hexes
Lyssa pwns anything that is dazed
melandru is just...there
Lyssa/Dwayna and Grenth are the best
Skuld
Dwayna, lol, dwayna, lol.
Melandru and Grenth on top :]
Melandru and Grenth on top :]
Muk Utep
For PvE:
1. Avatar of Balthazar - the effects are all great, fantastic tanking tool
2. Avatar of Melandru - would be number 1 if it didn't cost the dervish's entire base energy pool
3. Avatar of Dwayna - the life gain can be quite useful
4. Avatar of Grenth - constant enchant removal isn't overly useful in PvE
5. Avatar of Lyssa - not particularly good all in all
For PvP:
1. Avatar of Grenth - simply devastating, the enchant removal is frightening
2. Avatar of Melandru - synergizes amazingly with wearying strike, and the hp/condition immunity is always good
3. Avatar of Balthazar - I don't know... decent in RA?
4. Avatar of Lyssa - never seen it used in PvP (although the extra damage could be good)
5. Avatar of Dwayna - never seen it used in PvP
Edited to add:
Quote:
Useless? I'd have to say Grenth form due to the fact rending sweep + hex can remove alot more enchantments than a grenth form ever could.
1. Avatar of Balthazar - the effects are all great, fantastic tanking tool
2. Avatar of Melandru - would be number 1 if it didn't cost the dervish's entire base energy pool
3. Avatar of Dwayna - the life gain can be quite useful
4. Avatar of Grenth - constant enchant removal isn't overly useful in PvE
5. Avatar of Lyssa - not particularly good all in all
For PvP:
1. Avatar of Grenth - simply devastating, the enchant removal is frightening
2. Avatar of Melandru - synergizes amazingly with wearying strike, and the hp/condition immunity is always good
3. Avatar of Balthazar - I don't know... decent in RA?
4. Avatar of Lyssa - never seen it used in PvP (although the extra damage could be good)
5. Avatar of Dwayna - never seen it used in PvP
Edited to add:
Quote:
To remove an echantment with Grenth, you must:
Be affected by Avatar of Grenth
Use an attack skill on your opponent
To remove an enchantment your way, you must:
Use an otherwise useless skill, with a recharge time, every time you want to remove an enchantment
Your opponent must be hexed. Are you going to be D/Me or something?
Quote:
|
Im saying Balthazar is worst you can get running speed from other sources while having melandu or Dwayna on Add Fiegned neutrality if your doing a runner and your set Avatar of Balthazar isn't about the increased speed. It's fairly obvious that the main force of this skill comes from the unconditional, long-lasting +40 armor. Unless you judge skills simply by their value for a runner? Even if you did, wouldn't a runner benefit more from a +40armor/+33%speed that lasts over a minute, than from just about anything else? gavin456
simply all forms are good depending on the situation ur in and how u place ur char peace.
ensoriki
Quote:
Originally Posted by Muk Utep
1. Avatar of Balthazar - the effects are all great, fantastic tanking tool D/E can tank better due to earth skills and NOt use an elite 2. Avatar of Melandru - would be number 1 if it didn't cost the dervish's entire base energy pool 3. Avatar of Dwayna - the life gain can be quite useful 4. Avatar of Grenth - constant enchant removal isn't overly useful in PvE 5. Avatar of Lyssa - not particularly good all in all I disagree, its very effective against a spell caster with if you have an IAS For PvP: 1. Avatar of Grenth - simply devastating, the enchant removal is frightening 2. Avatar of Melandru - synergizes amazingly with wearying strike, and the hp/condition immunity is always good Except against a fragility mesmer....then pray theres no one conditioning you 3. Avatar of Balthazar - I don't know... decent in RA? Not really, you have +40 armor, but theres alot better skills to get higher then +40 armor, and a sin using moebuis horns of the ox will keep you from running anyways 4. Avatar of Lyssa - never seen it used in PvP (although the extra damage could be good) It can do just aswell as grenth for 2 reasons, if you have IAS and daze opponent casting spells (which theres alot of in pvp) is genocide 5. Avatar of Dwayna - never seen it used in PvP Decent against N/mes Edited to add: Useless? First of all, it's the most commonly used avatar in PvP. Borderline overpowered, and capable of shutting down builds entirely. And how do you figure that Rending Sweep + hex can remove a lot more enchantments than Grenth? To remove an echantment with Grenth, you must: Be affected by Avatar of Grenth Use an attack skill on your opponent To remove an enchantment your way, you must: Use an otherwise useless skill, with a recharge time, every time you want to remove an enchantment Your opponent must be hexed. Are you going to be D/Me or something? Avatar of Balthazar isn't about the increased speed. It's fairly obvious that the main force of this skill comes from the unconditional, long-lasting +40 armor. Unless you judge skills simply by their value for a runner? Even if you did, wouldn't a runner benefit more from a +40armor/+33%speed that lasts over a minute, than from just about anything else? To bad there are better ways to get nice armor without Balthazar, and if your tanking taking damage is what you want so everyone else on your team can support and kill, your not running away -_- but maybe im just crazy Kijik Oni Hanryuu
dude, lol +40 armor is aesthetic.. that +40 armor is incredibly useful tanking, reducing a normally 200 damage attack to a manageable 50 or 60 damage, also in a PvE group the +33% run is great for running away in CASE the rest of your party goes down, then you can get away and come back and rez to prevent a party wipe.
ensoriki
The way I see it , I rather keep the elite slot free, instead of balthazar
and if your D/A running isnt a issue cus you can shadow step or D/E bring earth armor and conviction ( make earth armor cover all enchants) when your ready to run pious assult and run -_- but thats just me crucifix
Lyssa: probably the best form next to mealndru and grenth. grenth is like having a constant OoA that never sacs life and doesn't cost 25 energy to use. Melandru: immunity to conditions...+200hp...have any of you ever even TRIED wearing strike with melandru? If you think its meh, go kill yourself. Lyssa on the other hand is possibly the most raping form I have ever seen. some things to know bout it:
-there is no damage conversion, you still deal phys damage. this means that if you have, oh, and orders nec(or an orders derv) backing yup up you hit even harder. -each hit, on top of the damn near insta kill that is a scythe, you are going to deal so much damage to a target when activating a skill that if you crit with an attack like lyssas assault (just an example) then you will probably hit for 200+ damage in one shot. as far as shit forms are concerned: dwaynas is not completely useless, just almost. It more or less comes down to it that there are simply better elites to use. balthazar is just complete shit in general, useless elite. who cares, +40 armor, +33% run buff. there is no use for this, especially in pve. why bother taking an elite that bad when you can use another elite that does something better (wounding strike for example) and enchants/ stances taht achieve the same thing that the form does. there just is no point. Xethrion
I'd also like to mention, that Lyssa is particularly useful in the Realm of Torment.
Call to Torment anyone? 5 second activation skill + double damage + Avatar of Lyssa dmg + attack skill dmg = madness. NinjaKai
Lyssa is definitely my most used avatar form. I mean considering that there is never a lack of spellcaster enemies in PvE. Fun being a D/Me in AB, makes killing groups of ele and such fun.
Skuld
[skill]avatar of lyssa[/skill] + [skill]Twin Moon Sweep[/skill] + [skill]protector's strike[/skill] ^^
getalifebud
Protectors strike is a strength skill, so no use for dervishes. Wild blow would work well with lyssa, as it is a crit+lyssa damage. Lyssa would also combo well with those two quick activation scythe attacks, which I can't remember the names of off the top of my head.
gobla
Quote:
Originally Posted by getalifebud
Protectors strike is a strength skill, so no use for dervishes. Wild blow would work well with lyssa, as it is a crit+lyssa damage. Lyssa would also combo well with those two quick activation scythe attacks, which I can't remember the names of off the top of my head.
Look at the cast time.....
ensoriki
Blah in the end
Melandru,lyssa,grenth = pvp awesomeness Lyssa, melandru/possibly dwayna= pve awesomeness How can you not use something that can give you a great damage boost, when pvp IS FULL of Eles Necros, Monks,mesmers,rits Poor Lyssa -_-
Skuld
Bcos melandru's deep wound/anti blind and grenth's rending are more useful than bonus damage.
Evilsod
Avatar of Melandru leads to some massive Wearying Strike spammage (none-elite spammable Eviscerate ftw?). Plus the nice anti-blind effect.
Avatar of Grenth is just nasty if you bring along 2 spammable attack skills and Wild Blow. Avatar of Lyssa + IAS + Twin Moon Sweep + Emerites Sweep = lots of damage. +44 damage on every attack vs spamming PvE enemies wins battles quickly. Avatar of Dwayna... i haven't used. Might be more useful in the Realm of Torment when your constantly hexed with anti-melee, snares and degen. Avatar of Balthazaar, more certain for holy damage than Heart of Holy Flame for the Desolation undead mobs. Good armour too. They all have there uses... but i'd say Dwayna is probably my least favourite.
Shuuda
Oh yes, the healing you get with Dwayna is useless, I mean, Dwayna + Victorious sweap gives you +100 HP and will remove a hex, pretty good news for the parties monk, and melee often get hexed alot in PvE, like SS or empathy etc.
Skuld
Not saying its useless, saying it isn't great for an elite and you can have better options such as; Victorious Sweep, Melandru and Mystic Regeneration for instance.
ensoriki
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skuld
Bcos melandru's deep wound/anti blind and grenth's rending are more useful than bonus damage.
*stares blankly*
*zones back in* Wha-wha.....you crazy?? if you love enchantment rending so much you could just be a sin
Arkantos
Quote:
Originally Posted by ensoriki
*stares blankly*
*zones back in* Wha-wha.....you crazy?? if you love enchantment rending so much you could just be a sin ...I hope your not serious. Venus was her name
Each and every god form has fantastic potential within certain setups. generally speaking i rate them as follows.
PvP Grenth (very popular by nature) Melrandu (immunity to conditions very very popular) Lyssa (excellent potential but i havnt seen it being used...YET) Dwayna (nice vs hex heavy teams which tbh are rare) Balthsazar (armour + is pointless with the excellent enchants you have) PvE Melrandu (immunity to conditions very very popular) Dwayna (health gain per hit) Lyssa (very useful +10 energy) Grenth (personally by fav in pve + pvp but thats just me) Balthsazar (almost useless with the excellent enchants dervish have, only ever consider using for running which is a warrior or rangers job) As you can see i'm not a fan of balthsazar
Solus_the_Deadly
I happen to like Balthazar alot, espically in Pve compared to Melandru due too only 15e cost. But i just i'll start using Lyssa because I'm fighting alot of Margonites in the campaign.
I still think rending sweep + hex > Grenth Form Melandru's Form just has so many strong points though, espically in Pvp. First i think its great to be able to run through fire straight to the backlines of the enemy and cause easy deep wounds Via Wearing strike and a pretty good self heals. O yeh thx all for posting, made me think alot.
Shuuda
With all the A/Ws around in PvP, Melandru is rather valueable, now if we could make a Dervish healer using that avatar, I'd have backup from someone I could rely on, rather than them overrated monks.
Str0b0
Quote:
Originally Posted by Solus_the_Deadly
Yes I justed wanted to know what people think is the Most useful and useless Dervish God Form.
For me i'd say Avatar of Melandru because of complete immunity to conditions, useful for so many situtions. Useless? I'd have to say Grenth form due to the fact rending sweep + hex can remove alot more enchantments than a grenth form ever could. Post if like you just PLEASE don't flame and spam.. Melandru is good but you aren't immune to conditions. The duration of the conditions is simply set to 0. This can be incredibly bad in some circumstances and a fragility mesmer will anihilate a Melandru using dervish if they are in a situation where conditions are coming in quick. Personally I'm digging Dwayna. With the right earth prayers skills and a spammable attack skill you can heal faster than anyone can damage you. Grenth is pretty useless to me since I'm PvE only but Lyssa takes the cake for most useless avatar. Silk Weaver
Lyssa... uh, the most damage evar?
ensoriki
Lyssa spikes like you wouldnt believe it
Try seeing 108-160 pop up twice due to twin moon sweep and then it happen another 2 times due to aoe of scythe, then add in chilling victory.....Thats huge spikes, you must be nuts if you think lyssas the most useless and the fact +10 energy is enough for arcane conundrum, ^.^
Coloneh
well, they are all horribly overrated and almost useless as elites. The only one i would ever think to use is dawanya, on a 16-mysticism/prot-enchantment dervish.
Kijik Oni Hanryuu
ok coloneh, you don't like the forms, we get it, and you are the one that probably gets destroyed by a Grenth avatar in PvP, and screams "ZOMG GRENTH NUBZORS!" The forms are one of the most powerful elites that the Dervish has, especially when you put them into a build that they have some sort of synergy with.
Shuuda
^heh heh Agreed.
^^^Also agreed, but a lot of people overlook the +energy you get from Lyssa, which as I've seen is rather useful, even if your not spiking. fallot
Most useful: Grenth
Least useful: Tie between Lyssa and Dwayna, but only because Grenth and Melandru are so good.
pedrostrik
people dervishes without avata forms are nearlyu uselless. even the god mode shadow form combo (no output dmg), and each god form have its own strenghts.
i love melandrus, even its the expensive one but it's the far away better one, in atack and defense, use holy veil, reversal of fortune (ie with 15 myst its free), and armour of santicty combo, and you are really the best tank around. thus i made a build to play with my heros, usually i need only to cap meloni's avatar of melandru , i use as my elite:vow of silence, well you know the meaning....you are unstopable D/Me vow of silence (E) arcane mimicry armour of santicty veil of thorns mystic regen heart of fury wearying strike mystic sweep mysticism 11+3+1 earth prayers 9+1 scythe mastery 11+3 all radiant max armour 2 superior runes (myst and scy mastery) a max scythe with +15 dmg^50, vampiric, and 20% enchant you can change one of the enchants for one speed boost i try some bosses and i kick then badly, even the element bosses fly down easily.. keep vow of silence as last enchantment always
Skuld
Quote:
For 20 seconds, Arcane Mimicry becomes the non-Form Elite skill from target other ally.
Uhm, yah. | (extra letters) NinjaKai
Quote:
Originally Posted by pedrostrik
Post
It would be great were it actually true. Either you've never used this build before or you have never used a Dervish before.
@fallot: Don't agree with the Lyssa part. Use D/Me with Arcane Conundrum + Lyssa on a spellcaster and you have a pretty easy kill.
knives
Quote:
Originally Posted by NinjaKai
Use D/Me with Arcane Conundrum + Lyssa on a spellcaster and you have a pretty easy kill.
Wouldn't [skill]Frustration[/skill] be much better than [skill]Arcane Conundrum[/skill] ? It has a shorter recharge time, shorter cast time, longer duration, and does just about the same thing.
NinjaKai
Quote:
Originally Posted by knives
Wouldn't [skill]Frustration[/skill] be much better than [skill]Arcane Conundrum[/skill] ? It has a shorter recharge time, shorter cast time, longer duration, and does just about the same thing.
Avatar of Lyssa doesn't interrupt it only damages foes activating skills. So you won't get the extra damage from frustration. And Dervish have no attacks that interrupt.
crucifix
More on forms. The only application of forms is really in PvP, where you have a good backup when you lie vulnerable (or in grenth/ lyssa/ dwaynas case, you're useless until that form comes back up). Gamewide on the other hand i would like to comment on balthazar. This avitar is absolute trailer trash for an elite skill. the only bonus is +40 armor and a 33% increased run buff. this would be great if it was worth my time but its not. plus, av balth just screams noob, probably even more than a wammo does. lets take a look as to why balthazar is crap.
look at this bar: conviction, armor of sanctity, veil of thorns, pious haste. ok look... thats more or less avatar of balth without the elite, in 4 skills. on top of that, wounding strike, chilling, eremites, res. theres a good bar without the annoying elite occupation of balthazar. It also doesnt leave you vulnerable for another 60 seconds after your form would drop. Its always fun playing around in trash pvp areas like RA, FA, and AB and having a balth derv chase you. ever heard of kiting? when that form falls you can pretty much garuntee that you will inevitably die. |
