Loot scaling... Helping casual players...?
ValaOfTheFens
Loot scaling is better for the game than I thought it would be. My newer toons are richer than my older ones were at the same point and I always have platinum in storage now. Solo farming is still rather lucrative though and worthwhile to do. The only problem I have is getting enough crafting materials. I'll prolly just start salvaging all my white drops. Problem solved.
IslandHermet
I pritty much said screw solo farming since I dont net the same cash as I used to before loot scaleing. I pritty much said screw all kinds of farming for gold. If I want money I just get some guildies togeather and do a Quad run in DOA takes around 2 and a half hours and nets me easily 200k+, Solo farming does not even cut it close to the money I make from DoA same for UW farming, I used to farm every day for a set time. thoses kind of farms never even came close to makeing me the money that a full DoA run does. so instead of wasteing hours and hours for 10-20k during the week I now do about 2 to 3 Full DoA runs a week which brings in anywere from 400k-800k depends on the greens and gem drops. and of course the random primevil armor remnants and chests always give me somethin good.
Crom The Pale
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Originally Posted by upier
Except for the most important thing - skills.
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Actually with the addition of skill tomes even the cost of skills has gone down since most normal tomes sell for 500g, half of the 1K max cost of skills.
Ctb
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| In saying ' preventing soloing ' it doesnt, but if you said ' prevented you from get as good rewards as before ' then that would be correct. |
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| Basically its highley unlikely it will be changed, buy a time machine and play the game 2 years ago when gold was soooo easy to get but noone thought about getting it |
Somebody would find an exploitable weakness in skill sets of a mob, then they would tune a build, then they would abuse the hell out of it until ANET nerfed it, then they moved on. The whole reason troll and gryphon farming was nuked in the first place was because a select few grinders were abusing the weaknesses in those groups and running up their money totals to obscene levels that shot certain items through the roof and left them unattainable by most players. Same goes for realms - they added enchantment strippers to put an end to chest running that was netting a few people ENORMOUS amounts of money.
You seem to forget that "back in the day" builds like an effective 55 monk or 55mancer weren't widely disseminated. Even at that, grindable locations were often guarded secrets that only certain guilds or online communities knew about.
The loot scaling was meant to address that sort of behavior (by both bots and grinders) rather than continuing the game of whack-a-mole to nerf exploitable combinations. You can exploit the weaknesses in certain mobs all you want now, but no more of this collecting 15k worth of saleable merch in 30 minutes and preventing everyone else from getting certain items because you can always outbid them no matter what.
=DNC=Trucker
Why is it that I am more excited to get a decayed orr emblem drop than a gold dead bow?
Arduin
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Originally Posted by =DNC=Trucker
Why is it that I am more excited to get a decayed orr emblem drop than a gold dead bow?
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Dev121
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| You seem to forget that "back in the day" builds like an effective 55 monk or 55mancer weren't widely disseminated. Even at that, grindable locations were often guarded secrets that only certain guilds or online communities knew about. |
2 years ago = Lots of easy oppurtunities
Now = Not so many
I think you have issues.
pablo24
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Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
Actually with the addition of skill tomes even the cost of skills has gone down since most normal tomes sell for 500g, half of the 1K max cost of skills.
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Crom The Pale
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Originally Posted by pablo24
Monk tomes still cost 1,5-2k. And you need to have the skill unlocked to use a tome.
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??
If you have the skill unlocked you can buy it at a skill trader for 1K, if you dont have it unlocked you can pvp and unlock it for free.
Why would anyone spend 2K for a skill they can buy for 1K?
Big_Daddy
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Originally Posted by Crom The Pale
Why would anyone spend 2K for a skill they can buy for 1K?
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creelie
Loot scaling has definitely caused some serious deflation. My first pair of Sorrow's Furnace greens, long after the release of SF, cost me 60k. Those same 2 greens today go for around 5k each, and that's with a dramatic drop in SF farming (and corresponding increase in relative rarity of the items). There is simply less gold sloshing around the economy.
Yes, there are still people with enormous fortunes that they acquired back in the day when it was easier - but they're the kind of people who will amass enormous fortunes no matter what.
Yes, there are still people with enormous fortunes that they acquired back in the day when it was easier - but they're the kind of people who will amass enormous fortunes no matter what.
arcanemacabre
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Originally Posted by creelie
Loot scaling has definitely caused some serious deflation. My first pair of Sorrow's Furnace greens, long after the release of SF, cost me 60k. Those same 2 greens today go for around 5k each, and that's with a dramatic drop in SF farming (and corresponding increase in relative rarity of the items). There is simply less gold sloshing around the economy.
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The loot scaling doesn't really have that much of an effect on prices of things in the player economy - the dilution of other options for the rarest items does.
reddswitch
I don't know why players keep posting prices of things from xx months or years old. Prices of things are bound to go down over time in this game. Things that don't go down are of concern. From what I noticed minor runes, once again the runes that matter, have barely changed pre-loot scaling. I don't like mentioning luxury items in this discussion but GW is in support of wasting time and gain for virtual extravagance. So go on with all the talk of how a 100k +xxectos weapon which did the same as a collector weapon still costs more than a collector weapon.
Again, I question how is loot scaling better than before? Now, you have a worse to same gain as in the past.
Again, I question how is loot scaling better than before? Now, you have a worse to same gain as in the past.
Ctb
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| No offense but you either havent left pre-searing yet or you cant beat your dopple because well |
If this is the quality of your argumentation - idle insults about my in-game ability which you have absolutely no knowledge of - then talking to you is a waste of my time.
reetkever
Wow this thread still lives? :P
I actually don't have alot of problems with cash anymore lately, since GW:EN has been giving me alot of Lockpicks, 6K-each Onyx Gemstones and skills/DP removers as rewards.
However, solo farming is still dead with the loot scaling. Sure, some people can solo UW and FoW, but the regular farm spots (like Undead, outside Sunspear Great Hall, solo-ing Snake Dance, Trolls) are so unrewarding now that it's just not worth it.
(People still think that loot scaling actually brought prices down, lol
Loot Scaling did NOT cause prices to go down. As some of you might remember, the first few hours after loot scaling was implented the prices of stuff went UP.
Not long after that, A-Net made a panic move and implented the Exemption list so that most rare items keep dropping 8/8 of the time. If it wasn't for the Exemption List, ecto's would still be around 10K or higher now, black dyes would still be around 10K now and don't even start on stuff like Crystalline Swords that WOULD be impossible to get...
So thank the Exemption List, without that the loot scaling would be a massive fail.)
I actually don't have alot of problems with cash anymore lately, since GW:EN has been giving me alot of Lockpicks, 6K-each Onyx Gemstones and skills/DP removers as rewards.
However, solo farming is still dead with the loot scaling. Sure, some people can solo UW and FoW, but the regular farm spots (like Undead, outside Sunspear Great Hall, solo-ing Snake Dance, Trolls) are so unrewarding now that it's just not worth it.
(People still think that loot scaling actually brought prices down, lol
Loot Scaling did NOT cause prices to go down. As some of you might remember, the first few hours after loot scaling was implented the prices of stuff went UP.
Not long after that, A-Net made a panic move and implented the Exemption list so that most rare items keep dropping 8/8 of the time. If it wasn't for the Exemption List, ecto's would still be around 10K or higher now, black dyes would still be around 10K now and don't even start on stuff like Crystalline Swords that WOULD be impossible to get...
So thank the Exemption List, without that the loot scaling would be a massive fail.)
absolutionx
Dude I can make about 500g in like 10 mins in HM lol.
Did you forget about treasure chests?
Why not try merchanting your upgrades, golds, and greens?
Did you forget about treasure chests?
Why not try merchanting your upgrades, golds, and greens?
~ Dan ~
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Originally Posted by absolutionx
Dude I can make about 500g in like 10 mins in HM lol.
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3k an hour.. as appose to 30k per hour prior to loot scaling. Hmm..
Antheus
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Originally Posted by creelie
Loot scaling has definitely caused some serious deflation. My first pair of Sorrow's Furnace greens, long after the release of SF, cost me 60k. Those same 2 greens today go for around 5k each, and that's with a dramatic drop in SF farming (and corresponding increase in relative rarity of the items). There is simply less gold sloshing around the economy.
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Today, everyone is running around with torment weapons, wearing FoW armor and with *inscribable* custom skins.
SF greens held their value right up until inscriptions appeared. Then, you could replicate them for a few k.
K-BO
I didn't get a chance to read everybody's post on this subject and I don't care what any one says, loot scaling was a way to try to kill the bots. Unfortunately the only people that it hurts are the people who spend hours in the UW, FoW, Dead Sword,...... you get the point. I know for a fact that NC or Anet or whoever runs programs in the background of the game. I have had many problems with my old computer getting booted out of the game because it was "making simple calculations in the background", it actually says that, of the game to make sure that my system was running ok, or some bs like that. I would rather the game fry my system than tell me it sucks anD INSTEAD, run a background program that looks for bots. But will they do that, NO. That would take time and a little extra work, and lets face it they would rather come out with another big holliday event or festival or some other nonscence that will take an hour to download and doesn't improve any gameplay at all.
They might have actually made a decent start with the player reporting for killing a majority of the bots, but I would rather sign another eula for a program like PB (BUT NOT PB, just like it) to get back the quality of the game before all this loot scaling crap.
They might have actually made a decent start with the player reporting for killing a majority of the bots, but I would rather sign another eula for a program like PB (BUT NOT PB, just like it) to get back the quality of the game before all this loot scaling crap.
reetkever
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Originally Posted by K-BO
Unfortunately the only people that it hurts are the people who spend hours in the UW, FoW, Dead Sword,...... you get the point.`
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Originally Posted by K-BO
They might have actually made a decent start with the player reporting for killing a majority of the bots, but I would rather sign another eula for a program like PB (BUT NOT PB, just like it) to get back the quality of the game before all this loot scaling crap.
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Yeah I agree that the game was way better before the coming of Nightfall. Cash was so easy to make back then and everyone was able to become rich without going through alot of grinding.
K-BO
In reference to the ecto bit, unless you selling it and not saving it for armor, you right. However, I used to be able to make enough money in the UW to be able to farm it with selling all of the items and gold drops. Now I have to dead sword farm for a few days to make enough money to farm the UW for a day. I have 2 characters that used to farm before LS(loot scaling) and 3 after, the 2 got more rare material drops in one run than the three make in two. I don't beleive Anet for a second when they say that the rare materials and 1/2 the other stuff on their list isn't affected by LS.
Kiragi Yagami
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Originally Posted by Painbringer
When A-net throws a curve ball you need to evolve. Farming is still there but you need to go out and look for it. Originally I thought the 55 was going to die with the Hard mode changes going to effect, but it has not. There are some great an easy farming spots out there. You need to pay attention to what creatures/skills are being used in the hard mode areas as you explore. The money is there you will have to work for it. I average 2K per 10-15 minutes when farming.
Tips 1. ID everything before you sell (Always go out farming with a ID Kit and Salvage Kit) 2. If you are running out of space in inventory salvage all armors for Tanned, cloth, and Iron (hope for steel or other rare items) Collect these till you get a stack go to material trader and see what he will give you if it is over 3 gold each sell them. If not you can sell at merchant 3. Always salvage Items that ID Salvageable 4. Take or keep 1 lock pick just in case you find a chest close to you. (sell any that drop for you along the way) 5. Either sell unidentified gold’s to players or Id them yourself (if it ain’t perfect merch it) 6. When your bags are full go to town 7. Limit your down time in towns go to merchant sell and leave. (I waste more time reading what people are saying sometimes) 8. Farm in hard mode. 9. Know your targets (there is a reason the bots are at the springs, the undead take extra damage to holy which speeds up the process) 10. When it gets feeling like a grind quit farming. (you don’t have to hate it to make it) Good luck to you all |
aapo
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Originally Posted by reetkever
What DID happen, is people getting poor. Going from 100K to 5K while just buying needed stuff is just not right. Clearing ENTIRE AREA'S in Hard Mode only nets one about 600 gold, which excludes the bonus cash for clearing, but you still gotta buy ID Kits and Salvage Kits.
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Yeah, and try to pick up the stuff that drops and sell it to merchant. Use collectibles to buy your salvage kits.
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Originally Posted by reetkever
So why the hell is the loot scaling still here? Are we supposed to farm a week just to buy some descent skills? Are we supposed to save our cash for 5 months in order to buy 1,5K armor? Is this the way you keep your people playing, A-Net?
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Originally Posted by reetkever
The ironic thing is that the rich people (1000K and more) stay rich, and the poor people (150K and less) keep getting more poor. PEOPLE ARE NOT LOWERING PRICES, and BOTS ARE ALIVE AND KICKING. Once again, a farm nerf update ruins the economy, and casual players who NEEDED to farm in order to buy skills, armor and keys are screwed.
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K-BO
Ok, how bout when you take away something from the players, like loot, to stop or slow down and small portion of players, like the bots, and you give people a tool to use to seroiusly cut the numbers of the bots, like player reporting: Why not give the players back some if not all of what you origionally took away?
Not to mention, why don't admins login every once in a while to check up on the highly reported areas like, The Granite Citidel, and just start suspending accounts for a week or so and pretty much kill the bots all together. I know what you are going to say, "They just can't start suspending accounts." Well if I can get my account suspended for trading in the mission section of the player party window, I think they should suspend on the suspicion of using bots.
Sorry for sounding so cynical, I have been peaved at this for some time now.
PS. Hope this post lands far out side to the smug cloud of the last post. Sheesh.
Not to mention, why don't admins login every once in a while to check up on the highly reported areas like, The Granite Citidel, and just start suspending accounts for a week or so and pretty much kill the bots all together. I know what you are going to say, "They just can't start suspending accounts." Well if I can get my account suspended for trading in the mission section of the player party window, I think they should suspend on the suspicion of using bots.
Sorry for sounding so cynical, I have been peaved at this for some time now.
PS. Hope this post lands far out side to the smug cloud of the last post. Sheesh.
Kiragi Yagami
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Originally Posted by K-BO
Ok, how bout when you take away something from the players, like loot, to stop or slow down and small portion of players, like the bots, and you give people a tool to use to seroiusly cut the numbers of the bots, like player reporting: Why not give the players back some if not all of what you origionally took away?
Not to mention, why don't admins login every once in a while to check up on the highly reported areas like, The Granite Citidel, and just start suspending accounts for a week or so and pretty much kill the bots all together. I know what you are going to say, "They just can't start suspending accounts." Well if I can get my account suspended for trading in the mission section of the player party window, I think they should suspend on the suspicion of using bots. Sorry for sounding so cynical, I have been peaved at this for some time now. PS. Hope this post lands far out side to the smug cloud of the last post. Sheesh. |
AaronSwitchblade
[QUOTE=Kiragi Yagami]which is hurting anet more, selling in the local channel,QUOTE]
Admittedly though, those rules are in place because it hurts everyone else more than ANET. I remember when they FINALLY started enforcing the rules, it was great.
Admittedly though, those rules are in place because it hurts everyone else more than ANET. I remember when they FINALLY started enforcing the rules, it was great.
aapo
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Originally Posted by Kiragi Yagami
i completely agree with the bolded part. i once got a 3 day account suspension for saying "selling such and such" in the local channel. if they say they cant suspend people for no reason, see previous example. and really, which is hurting anet more, selling in the local channel, or people using programs to play for them?
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Kiragi Yagami
wow, is it flaming in here, or is it just me? im not saying what i did was right, im saying which should be focused on more, silly little things or things that actually have an impact on arenanet? and aapo, just to clear things up, at the time, i had no idea that selling in the local channel was a suspendable offence. so sue me, we were all new once.
Loviatar
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that is why they have a trade channel.
you missed the fun before they finally started cracking down.
picture this.
you are trying to say something to a friend.
you say something and 25 lines of WTS spam hit the screen before the other person can type 3 words.
chat was honestly unusable which is why it seems so warm now.
wolfwing
Well one thing that I've noticed is that it can be pretty hard to some of the titles like skill hunter when you barly make 400 gold if luck getting 1 skill. I remember wurm farming and I could make 10-15k just from whites and such, that was including subtracting cash from the 2-4 chests I was opening with 600 gold each keys.
AaronSwitchblade
Not a popular suggestion, but I still think they should make capture signet free. That way, you can either buy skills or you can go get them yourself - it makes more sense with the likes of Factions, where ANET toned down the number of skill-quests from Prophecies.
Kiragi Yagami
coughcoughusewhispersanddisablelocalchatcoughcough . again, we were all new once, some at a later point than others. anyway, were getting dangerously off topic. i agree with the free sig of cap suggestion, or at least make em cheaper. 1k a pop may not seem like a lot to some of you, but what about us poor people?
Zeek Aran
Guide to making money and not whining on GWG about being a poor FAILURE of this game:
Play the game in HM. ID all your whites. Merch. Rinse and repeat. An hour may yield several k, usually 1-2 just from killing things.
Note: Vanq reward is a pathetic bonus, you shouldn't think that is a farming spot for gold.
Also, what is a poor person doing aiming for maxing titles?
Play the game in HM. ID all your whites. Merch. Rinse and repeat. An hour may yield several k, usually 1-2 just from killing things.
Note: Vanq reward is a pathetic bonus, you shouldn't think that is a farming spot for gold.
Also, what is a poor person doing aiming for maxing titles?
Kiragi Yagami
who says its for titles? elites have a purpose other than skill capping titles. wow, im bad at staying on topic. most of your suggestions are valid though, especially the vanqing one. dont waste your time striving for a petty 400g when you could just as easily farm 5 times that much.
Zeek Aran
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Originally Posted by Kiragi Yagami
who says its for titles?
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Originally Posted by wolfwing
Well one thing that I've noticed is that it can be pretty hard to some of the titles like skill hunter
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sagilltwins
loot scaling hurts everyone....
reetkever
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Originally Posted by aapo
- You do realize that there's money has a value, right? If everyone in the world had million dollars, million dollars is a small sum. If everyone in the world had 1 dollar, there would be no difference to everyone having million dollars.
Yeah, and try to pick up the stuff that drops and sell it to merchant. Use collectibles to buy your salvage kits. |
I already used all collectibles a looong time ago, too.
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Originally Posted by aapo
- I haven't saved "5 months" to buy 1,5K armor. I guess some people are just so bad at the game.
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Before this, however, getting 1,5K armor was just very hard and it required you to do alot of questing/killing monsters.
Of course, it depends which armor, but most armors need Rare crafting material that is really expensive (300 gold for a steel ignot isn't much, but if you need 70 steel ignots you really feel it in your storage.)
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Originally Posted by aapo
- You see intelligence, ability to adapt to changing environment stays the same. This is the reason why rich get richer and poor people get poorer. If you had no skill to manage your economy. Clueless loudmouth masses get frustrated when things get nerfed and calm down when one of the intelligent ones posts a new farming build.
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It's like footballing without a ball and then tell people to change the rules. Even when the rules are changed, there still is no ball.
As for the gold items, ecto's etc. - They have been nerfed in a different way. The lack of being able to trade decently makes buying/selling gold items very hard - almost too hard to bother doing it at all imo.
And ecto's... Farming UW is just very expensive. It costs 1K every run and the chance of dying there is large if you don't know what you're doing. To farm ecto's one needs to be skilled and needs the right equipment (which also costs alot of cash). In other words, to farm in the UW you need to be rich already. And even then, getting an ecto in a run is not guaranteed. You might also lose 5K worth of entry cost before you get an ecto.
Savio
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Originally Posted by reetkever
Yes but in a game with fixed prices it doesn't matter how much money is worth.
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Ctb
I think Anet should just delete the game from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
/sick of whiny gold farmers who think storage is a high score counter
/sick of whiny gold farmers who think storage is a high score counter
Keithark
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Originally Posted by Ctb
I think Anet should just delete the game from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.
/sick of whiny gold farmers who think storage is a high score counter |