I am sick and tired of this mission. In the old days, it was somehow managable and until recently I could usually master the damn thing, but now there are so many bugs that have resurfaced on this closed up hellscape that it's beyond repair.
Menhlo and Master Togo constantly get stuck, so getting Master's is actually just pure luck. If the party traveling with Menhlo is made up entirely of the AI, they fight in the first area, the cinematic plays, and then they go off into a corner or wall and stop moving. And with an overwhelming amount of afflicted attacking me from all sides, I get devastated because the second party is stuck in the first area.
Other times, the enemy itself does the wall hugging trick, so they don't even attack. ArenaNet has not paid attention to the most grevious glitches in this game. Bridges will still make enemies invisible, you can attack enemies thirty feet below if you're on a bridge in certain areas and recently quest important NPCs no longer show up on your ally party tab like they used to.
It's time ArenaNet did some spring cleaning. They should either revamp the Viz Square mission or get rid of it entirely. It is a plague bigger than all of the afflicted. A tumor. A disgusting sore.
So either fix it or delete the damn thing.
Thank you.
(Oh yes, I am definitely angry right now.)
Viz Square Mission: Please Delete. Seriously.
Government Flu
Ludo
Hmm, unless there are some very recent bugs in the mission then I don't see exactly where you're coming from. Vizunah Square happens to be my pet mission, I do it a couple times a week for fun. (Ok, I'm odd maybe).
I've seen Togo and Mhenlo get stuck once, completely stuck to the point that it required a /resign. They do go slowly once in awhile, not to the point that it kills Masters, maybe a few times but not very often. So it's not bug free. It sounds like you've had some really bad luck.
I've never seen allies (Togo and Mhenlo) vanish off the party tab.
I've probably done this mission over fifty times. Since HM was introduced the groups I go with (and I take any invitation, it's part of the fun) have gotten Masters probably 1/3 of the time. Good groups, bad groups.
But don't delete it! ;p I don't know why, but I really love this mission.
I've seen Togo and Mhenlo get stuck once, completely stuck to the point that it required a /resign. They do go slowly once in awhile, not to the point that it kills Masters, maybe a few times but not very often. So it's not bug free. It sounds like you've had some really bad luck.
I've never seen allies (Togo and Mhenlo) vanish off the party tab.
I've probably done this mission over fifty times. Since HM was introduced the groups I go with (and I take any invitation, it's part of the fun) have gotten Masters probably 1/3 of the time. Good groups, bad groups.
But don't delete it! ;p I don't know why, but I really love this mission.
Lafayette
That mission is one of the best in Guild Wars in my oh-so-valuable opinion.
I do notice sometimes enemies hug walls without attacking, but the only annoying problem I notice is Mhenlo's (and later Danika's) insistence on healing minions which slows down the procession markedly. I've never found Masters on that mission to be particularly difficult, even if I'm the only human playing - and despite the above issue.
But some bug and glitch fixes would be nice.
I do notice sometimes enemies hug walls without attacking, but the only annoying problem I notice is Mhenlo's (and later Danika's) insistence on healing minions which slows down the procession markedly. I've never found Masters on that mission to be particularly difficult, even if I'm the only human playing - and despite the above issue.
But some bug and glitch fixes would be nice.
upier
Yep - it could use some fine tuning.
I'va had Togo stuck, then yesterday I moved through the part after the first defend on the way to the second too fast and I missed on normal foe that later morphed into afflicted an since Togy and Menhy were feeling a bit slow they turned around at the sight of the monster and ran back towards the start!
That was extremely annoying BUT the mission by itself is insanely sweet! It is in fact my favourite mission in GW!
So - yay for fixing, nay for deleting!
I'va had Togo stuck, then yesterday I moved through the part after the first defend on the way to the second too fast and I missed on normal foe that later morphed into afflicted an since Togy and Menhy were feeling a bit slow they turned around at the sight of the monster and ran back towards the start!
That was extremely annoying BUT the mission by itself is insanely sweet! It is in fact my favourite mission in GW!
So - yay for fixing, nay for deleting!
-Loki-
That mission is an absolute blast to monk. Seriously.
the Puppeteer
It's a fun mission. Maybe it needs a fix here and there but to delete it - God forbid! 
lutz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by -Loki-
That mission is an absolute blast to monk. Seriously.
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In my experience, I've never had Togo/Mhenlo stuck (the 15 times I've done this), and for the problem of minions, yes, I do experience it, but you just move the MM towards Togo, and Mhenlo will eventually progress (okay, so it takes 30 seconds to do so, but it's really no big deal).
It's not such a bad mission. It's actually kind of fun, and innovative of ANet to do something like this.
ryanryanryan0310
Haven't seen an bugs in Vizunah Square mission. Got masters last weekend. My girlfriend with heros/henchies and I with heros/henchies. First try and no problems.
sir lockt
I played this mission at the first day of Factions release as foreigner. I cursed this mission since I didnt notice there wasnt a proper human team to defend the other side.
Until i noticed i just was to slow... Problem is with stuck NPCs is that they try to save either mhenlo or Togo and want to take a short-cut and stick in the walls. There is also a bug that if you trigger the cinemetic to early mhenlo wont move. I believed these bugs where dealt with in several updates.
I really loved the mission, like said, especially as a monk with no second team left
But there where some nasty glitches in it. Maybe it can be adressed to, did you file a report about the bugs you encountered?
EDIT: typo Factions is the appropriate campaign
Until i noticed i just was to slow... Problem is with stuck NPCs is that they try to save either mhenlo or Togo and want to take a short-cut and stick in the walls. There is also a bug that if you trigger the cinemetic to early mhenlo wont move. I believed these bugs where dealt with in several updates.
I really loved the mission, like said, especially as a monk with no second team left
But there where some nasty glitches in it. Maybe it can be adressed to, did you file a report about the bugs you encountered?EDIT: typo
Factions is the appropriate campaign
Miral
i wouldn't want it deleted, but wouldn't mind seeing it be made optional to the main storyline...
Destinyy
That mission is really cool, It's action packed and so much fun to play at...
Whenever I help guild/alliance peeps on that mission I always take my MM... Huge fun!!!
Whenever I help guild/alliance peeps on that mission I always take my MM...
Huge fun!!!
Spazzer
Solution: Do Vizunah Square in hard mode.
Normal Mode Vizunah Square is next to impossible to complete. However, Hard Mode fixes many of the bugs and also gives the full AI party a real chance at winning.
Normal Mode Vizunah Square is next to impossible to complete. However, Hard Mode fixes many of the bugs and also gives the full AI party a real chance at winning.
Navaros
Getting Masters in most of the missions with NPCs is pure luck due to bad NPC pathfinding combined with an inability to control NPCs via flags.
I've lost Viz Square by 26 seconds, 20 seconds and all sorts of things like that due to the NPCs getting stuck. Eventually I got Masters on it by pure luck of them not happening to get stuck as much that time.
What they should do is put in flags for NPCs that must survive and/or are needed to open gates on timed missions. That is the only way to take the "luck" out of the equation.
I've lost Viz Square by 26 seconds, 20 seconds and all sorts of things like that due to the NPCs getting stuck. Eventually I got Masters on it by pure luck of them not happening to get stuck as much that time.
What they should do is put in flags for NPCs that must survive and/or are needed to open gates on timed missions. That is the only way to take the "luck" out of the equation.
Government Flu
Well, after several bouts of bad luck, I mastered the mission with my newest character, found a sapphire off of an am fah assassin and managed to get master's with two minutes to spare. Now that I've blown off some steam, I can further reflect on the mission.
The main problem with Viz Square is its level design and the current AI pathing issues. The fact is, there's too much detail (stairs, pits, walls, turns) crammed into an enclosed area for the henchmen to properly navigate. Citizens turning in afflicted to distract the two NPCs that operate on simple triggers, am fah falling from ropes into battle, and the like.
I still wouldn't mind seeing this mission replaced with something more efficient, but even if ArenaNet just did a small overhaul and crushed these nasty bugs, it wouldn't be half as stressful. But let's face it...
...even getting bridges to stop cloaking enemies and characters alike is wishful thinking. :P
On that note, let's examine the Naphui Quarter mission. There are elevated and ground levels in that map but once again due to poor AI pathing and targeting behavior they'll get stuck on bridges trying to attack enemies that are on the lower areas, aggroing too many groups at once.
This is especially evident if you go and take out the kirin celestial first. If you linger on the first bridge for too long, you'll end up fighting two to three groups at the same time.
And so perhaps the best way to minimize the problems with Viz Square would be to increase the AI's intelligence regarding their pathing. And if ArenaNet managed to do that, they could make massively detailed maps with lots of twists and turns without frustrating the solo-minded player in future projects.
Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter for now.
The main problem with Viz Square is its level design and the current AI pathing issues. The fact is, there's too much detail (stairs, pits, walls, turns) crammed into an enclosed area for the henchmen to properly navigate. Citizens turning in afflicted to distract the two NPCs that operate on simple triggers, am fah falling from ropes into battle, and the like.
I still wouldn't mind seeing this mission replaced with something more efficient, but even if ArenaNet just did a small overhaul and crushed these nasty bugs, it wouldn't be half as stressful. But let's face it...
...even getting bridges to stop cloaking enemies and characters alike is wishful thinking. :P
On that note, let's examine the Naphui Quarter mission. There are elevated and ground levels in that map but once again due to poor AI pathing and targeting behavior they'll get stuck on bridges trying to attack enemies that are on the lower areas, aggroing too many groups at once.
This is especially evident if you go and take out the kirin celestial first. If you linger on the first bridge for too long, you'll end up fighting two to three groups at the same time.
And so perhaps the best way to minimize the problems with Viz Square would be to increase the AI's intelligence regarding their pathing. And if ArenaNet managed to do that, they could make massively detailed maps with lots of twists and turns without frustrating the solo-minded player in future projects.
Anyway, those are my thoughts on the matter for now.
Cacheelma
Agreed. Delete it (this thread, that is).
DarkGanni
Vizunah square is an easy mission IMO, Minions and a Edge of extinction make the mission a breeze, It requires nothing but preparation. No way in hell I would delete that mission.
/notsigned Seriously!
/notsigned Seriously!
SotiCoto
Joke... right?
Vizunah Square is one of the most satisfying missions in the entire game. If it were removed, I would stop playing... no doubt about it.
And why should I give a toss if enemies sometimes appear invisible on bridges? Why should I even care if the NPCs get stuck in Vizunah Square? ... All that are needed are Mhenlo and Togo... and they usually don't get stuck (only happened once with me). It is still easy to complete for masters with a team of 8 in normal mode... (and by that I mean me, three heroes and four henchies).
This thread just seems to be a lot of bitching and whining over nothing.
I mean... if you're playing in Hard Mode then maybe it is a bit more of a problem...... but otherwise... no. No way.
If you're having difficulty doing Vizunah Square or Nahpui Quarter in normal mode.... it isn't because of wall glitches or dodgy pathfinding; it is because you suck. Try harder.
Vizunah Square is one of the most satisfying missions in the entire game. If it were removed, I would stop playing... no doubt about it.
And why should I give a toss if enemies sometimes appear invisible on bridges? Why should I even care if the NPCs get stuck in Vizunah Square? ... All that are needed are Mhenlo and Togo... and they usually don't get stuck (only happened once with me). It is still easy to complete for masters with a team of 8 in normal mode... (and by that I mean me, three heroes and four henchies).
This thread just seems to be a lot of bitching and whining over nothing.
I mean... if you're playing in Hard Mode then maybe it is a bit more of a problem...... but otherwise... no. No way.
If you're having difficulty doing Vizunah Square or Nahpui Quarter in normal mode.... it isn't because of wall glitches or dodgy pathfinding; it is because you suck. Try harder.
Dione Davore
Mhenlo and Togo are stuck on late-spawning enemies.
Thats because the most groups run through to fast.
Thats because the most groups run through to fast.
Danax
We need more 2 party missions :P I love kaening so don't delete this missioN!
/notsigned
/notsigned
Retribution X
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Dione Davore
Mhenlo and Togo are stuck on late-spawning enemies.
Thats because the most groups run through to fast. |
SotiCoto
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Retribution X
That's because they have to rush for masters...
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Since the Afflicted can't start spawning at the next area until Mhenlo and Togo get there anyway, it doesn't exactly help much to charge on ahead (unless you're a trapper or whatnot).
darkk wound
he cant get masters on vizunah so hes asking for it to be removed lol !
onerabbit
i love this mission! do it for fun alot of the time.
MMs and Massive AoE is soooo fun here!
MMs and Massive AoE is soooo fun here!
majoho
I have had mehnlo stuck one time, but that was pretty early on so it wasn't a big deal.
And with heroes I think it's one of the easiest missions in factions.
And with heroes I think it's one of the easiest missions in factions.
Sophitia Leafblade
I think out of the numerious times ive done this mission ive only ever had it get bugged once! This mission is great for AoE and is a MM's dream come true
Painbringer
I like the mission but recently there have been bugs for me. Last weekend I had to retry it 4 times.
1. After timer counted down the doors would not open to start mission
2. Menhlo got stuck in the environment and would not move.
3. Partner on other side abandoned me got to the last confrontation with my group alone but died.
4. Finally got a partner Necro on the other side we bashed the heck out of the game Menhlo got stuck above the stairs on the last big confrontation We were able to protect him though. Got Masters then I found out my partner was going for survivor as well.
Mehnlo goes heal crazy on Minions so he stops moving a lot. You have to keep an eye on him. This may be why he is getting stuck
1. After timer counted down the doors would not open to start mission
2. Menhlo got stuck in the environment and would not move.
3. Partner on other side abandoned me got to the last confrontation with my group alone but died.
4. Finally got a partner Necro on the other side we bashed the heck out of the game Menhlo got stuck above the stairs on the last big confrontation We were able to protect him though. Got Masters then I found out my partner was going for survivor as well.
Mehnlo goes heal crazy on Minions so he stops moving a lot. You have to keep an eye on him. This may be why he is getting stuck
Eternal Equinox
minion masters/sf auto win come again.
Quaker
Lol! I just finished Vizunah Square (foreign quarter) and got Masters. My team consisted of just me and my Heroes and henchies. The other team was entirely random henchies.
Vahn Roi
Unless togo/mhenlo have started glitching again, I don't see a problem with this mission. In fact I have better luck with a hero/hench team on my side and a full henchmen team on the other side than I do with people and I almost never bring an MM hero.
Two words: Searing Flames.
Two words: Searing Flames.
Toutatis
V Square is a bit of a hellhole at times, I'll admit, but it's still one of the most enjoyable missions in Factions IMO.
The trick is to not aim for masters and rush through. Slow down, take it easy, and focus. V Square does a pretty good job of making players panic and lose focus on strategy and survival; I view it as a training session in mental discipline
The trick is to not aim for masters and rush through. Slow down, take it easy, and focus. V Square does a pretty good job of making players panic and lose focus on strategy and survival; I view it as a training session in mental discipline
AlienFromBeyond
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Toutatis
The trick is to not aim for masters and rush through. Slow down, take it easy, and focus. V Square does a pretty good job of making players panic and lose focus on strategy and survival; I view it as a training session in mental discipline
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OI-812
I've been fortunate enough to never have a problem with Togo and Mhenlo becoming stuck. Vizunah Square IMO is an INCREDIBLY fun mission, and becomes rather funny when your team has a MM and a spirit-spamming rit, and the other team has those as well O.o If your computer can handle the load, it's insane 
WinterSnowblind
I didn't like Factions because a lot of the missions like this. They don't require any sort of strategy, but instead just throw thousands of enemies at you and tell you to fight them off. But that's a problem with all of Factions, and personally I've never had any problems with this particular mission, I went through it just yesterday with my brother who only started playing the game, and everything went fine.
The Arborstone mission is really the only one that bothers me. We tried that twice today, and both times Danika runs it right at the end, gets caught between all the monsters and dies.. Geez, I don't mind failing the mission because I screwed up, but when the A.I. causes you to fail an escort mission, it's just painful.
The Arborstone mission is really the only one that bothers me. We tried that twice today, and both times Danika runs it right at the end, gets caught between all the monsters and dies.. Geez, I don't mind failing the mission because I screwed up, but when the A.I. causes you to fail an escort mission, it's just painful.
majoho
Quote:
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Originally Posted by AlienFromBeyond
Saying don't go for Master's is not very helpful, as some people do try and go for the Protector title you know.
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The only way to get masters is killing the waves as quick as possible, charging between the places the waves occur won't help anything since you'll just screw up the NPC's
I just did it again with my Paragon and h/h and on the other team there was a Rit (level 13) and henches. We got easily got masters without even trying so it's very well possible to do it, provided you do it right.
countesscorpula
I can verify that togo does indeed get stuck. I might even have a screen shot somewhere. I've also seen Dankia get stuck in Arborstone: We were at the end, and killed everything in the room. We had 3 minutes to sapre for masters, and the cow would not move no matter how much you prodded/pleaded/pestered her. I sent the screen shots in to A-Net, but haven't seen any dev updates mentioning a fix.
Age
I wouldn't say it needs deleting but maybe skipping it would be nice like all mission in Factions.Factions is over a year old there should be a way for those who beat it with one char for eg. if you are there just to cap some elites who wants to do the missions agian for 2 or 3 elites.
When it comes to the mission I never see Mhenlo or Togo get stuck but they die easy in them.I can't not believe a Monk and Rit can't heal themselves up.When I Monked that mission I had to do it for Mhenlo.I found under the star a blast to Monk in.
When it comes to the mission I never see Mhenlo or Togo get stuck but they die easy in them.I can't not believe a Monk and Rit can't heal themselves up.When I Monked that mission I had to do it for Mhenlo.I found under the star a blast to Monk in.
Tactical-Dillusions
Vizunah is like THK. People either like it or loathe it.
I still haven't decided where i stand on it but the OP does bring up some good points and the mission does need fixing.
Just two days ago when i last did it, Togo and Mhenlo decided to stop for a permanent rest and the group had to resign.
If a revamp was voted for, i'd suggest a hold-out style mission, like the whole mission had been rolled into one spot that has to be defended.
Also give us a Vizunah explorable too, that would be nice, so no part is wasted.
I still haven't decided where i stand on it but the OP does bring up some good points and the mission does need fixing.
Just two days ago when i last did it, Togo and Mhenlo decided to stop for a permanent rest and the group had to resign.
If a revamp was voted for, i'd suggest a hold-out style mission, like the whole mission had been rolled into one spot that has to be defended.
Also give us a Vizunah explorable too, that would be nice, so no part is wasted.
Across The Battle
I hate this mission too, but I dont think it should be deleted. I think the bugs should be fixed. Maybe have some better ai on the other side if they dont enter. But keep the mission.
Rod Adams
Only issue is the bugs w/ Togo/Mhenlo getting stuck.
I've done this with AoE eles, with dual MMs, and heck, once I even did it in a PuG with 5 Wa/Mo's, 1 monk, 1 restro rit, and a mesmer.....
Only failures are when the team splits for whatever silly reason, or the healers forget that togo and mhenlo are idiots.
I've done this with AoE eles, with dual MMs, and heck, once I even did it in a PuG with 5 Wa/Mo's, 1 monk, 1 restro rit, and a mesmer.....
Only failures are when the team splits for whatever silly reason, or the healers forget that togo and mhenlo are idiots.
B E A S T
Vizunah for me was one of the easiest missions in factions.
I didnt notice any bugs while doing the mission either.
I didnt notice any bugs while doing the mission either.