Policing of Local Channel...very Orwellian

Well it seems that 1984 has come to GW. Big Brother has determined that we are unable as a community to use the chat feature as we feel is necessary or effective.

Players will now be "account marked" for trade in local chat and I, for one, beleive this is a mistake on ANets part. A gaming community should be molded and built by its players, not governed by arbitrary regulations enforced because some people dont like something.

Whats next?

Players should no longer look for groups in local, as we have a Party Searcch option.

Players will no longer recruit for their guilds in local, again theres a tab in the party search box.

etc.

Lets face it folks, the MOST COMMON conversations seen in ANY local chat in towns that arent considered "market" towns are all arguing, flaming and often quite immature and offensive. Rarely is there ever any real conversation between friends or associates as this tends to occur in PM's or team chat once people find each other.

Please feel free to "light me up" if you dont agree but I have heard from my relatively large guild and alliance that this change has just gone too far in policing our community. I dont feel that those of us that use local channel in large commerce centers for trade need to be "spanked" for doing what evolved as a common practice in the community WE developed.

Come on ANet, this isnt the war on terror, let US determine how we want to use the game resources that are available to us. We dont need a GW Patriot act to make us behave to the standard of the players that want free run of all local channels to spam their guild messages and call each other "noobs"

Regards
SANG

Uhm, we did determine how we want those channels used. ANet wouldn't have taken the time to put code in place to monitor those chat channels for spamming if there wasn't overwhelming support to get spammers out of them.

How extremely melodramatic.

Spoken like a true trade spammer.

I can't say enough bad things about your logic, so, remembering what my momma always said, I'll say nothing at all.

Well, nothing other than, THREE CHEERS FOR THE NEW ANTI-SPAM POLICY!

I will say this : Spammers get out!

And don't make this look political, because its just funny, spammer.

Why can't people accept that this was the way they designed this game to be? There is a trade channel for a reason. That's where your trade messages go. It got to the point where you couldn't use the local channel for it's designed purpose because it was essentially hijacked by trade spammers. Anet put their foot down and said enough is enough, use it as it was intended and stop disrupting those who wish to converse in local, which is why it's there. I'm getting more than tired of all this hogwash from trade spammers with this convoluted logic. This isn't a case where you don't know right from wrong, you just want to pretend you don't because otherwise your argument is exposed for the baseless bellyaching that it is. Enough of the orwellian comparisons, the conspiracy theories, and everything else.

And for the record, if people want to use that channel for arguing, as long as they're not violating the ToS, then SO BE IT. That's their right to do. Trade spamming local is NOT anyone's right to do. Want proof? People are now facing consequences for it. There's your proof. You can always put 2 or 3 people arguing on your ignore list. You can't put 50 million trade spammers on ignore.

Um...I have never spammed ever and I think the rule is retarded. The trade system is crap, so might as well punish players instead of making a better system?

Well WE as a community did repeatedly say we wanted something done about the spamming (not just the trade) in the local chat. Obviously the local chat is for finding groups, asking questions, etc... But you can't if after you hit enter your message is 20 screens back so no one see's it let alone you see their response.
I think there could be a middle ground in this. Just not allow repeating a certain % of the past sentences for a while (30 secs, 3 mins, whatever). That would have gone a long way in stopping the scrolling IMO and still allowed for the trade and other things in all chat.
Most don't really take notice that there is or use the trade tab, so trading in the all chat is the only way to sell something. There are those that say they don't buy if someone puts it in all chat, but that is a VAST minority of the overall users.
I'm kinda in the middle here, I love that you can carry on a conversation in LA d1 now, even though some haven't gotten the message and try and spam until they are removed. But I think that there could have been a better way of controlling the spam by limiting the ability to repeat text, since there is no valid need for it.

just disable copy/paste/up arrow in local chat = problem solved.

The best kinda spam is spam in a can and thats even icky at best. Trade channel is for trade the local channel is for some convo, it isn that difficult.

I think the major issue addressed in the original post is not an issue of the trade spamming coming to an end but a question of whats next. I think we can all agree that no trade in local is fine, but what happens when ANET decides that we can no longer search for a party in local because there is a party search feature. Are we then going to be punished for spamming in local for party members?

WTS GOLD AXE
WTS GOLD AXE
WTS GOLD AXE
WTS GOLD AXE
WTS GOLD AXE

etc, etc. That's all you would ever see in the LOCAL chat, which is meant for chatting to other players. The trade window is for trading. It's now being "policed" because of how badly the spamming had become. They're not trying to control us, they're just fixing problems with the game. It's now possible to go to some of the crowded cities and hold conversations with people, without your messages being flooded away by spam. The only reason you didn't see people chatting like that before, was because it was impossible to do.

I honestly don't see why anyone could think that's a bad thing, unless you're one of the people who kept spamming. Those of us who don't want to see trading requests, now don't have to. Great job Anet.

Thans for pointing out a place i was remiss. I dont consider myself to be a "trade spammer", however I did adapt to what I was met with when i started playing. In larger towns that are well known to be commerce centers I have accepted and conducted myself to what I saw as the existing standard. What I would really LOVE is to see the "noob fights" eliminated (flaming, name calling, et al.). What Im really worried about is whats next. Recruiting? Runners? etc...

We wanted the spam to stop and A.Net listened to us and I'm grateful for that. Today I had a small chat in lions arch, a chat where I actually saw what the others were saying instead of the usual WTB/WTS Stuff, these spammers got what they deserved imo!

- Ganni

It's really more like A Clockwork Orange than 1984, and just like in the book, all those lawless miscreants deserve what's coming to them.

spammers don't belong in a liberal society as they can't coop with responsability to live up to the rules. Has nothing to do with orwellian situations

Well, since we're talking about ALL spam, not just trading, I think any spam should be stopped, but I think disabling the ability to spam is better than punishing those that do it. Saying LFG every little bit isn't spamming, neither is announcing that you're running somewhere every once in a while. But people repeat the same sentence 5 times in 2 or 3 seconds and then rinse repeat. With dozens of people doing that same thing, that is why this all is being done. But again, limiting the ability to repeat like that would have solved it a lot better.

The thought police are gonna get ya - Who is Big Brother? Gaile possibly? - although she isnt male...

Well we can create the Big Sister then

If you, and the people would just simply use the chat responsibly, we would not be in this situation. They gave us a chance to show them that we won't spam the local chat with trade announcments, and we spat in their face. (meteaphorically speaking.) In a way, it's our fault, now, that the local and trade channels are being policed.

No, instaed, you got the bright idea to use local chat to sell your item because the trade chat has a 100 sellers all posting messages in it. This further shows us that if we, maybe, not use LA Dist 1 as the primary selling point. What's wrong with Dist 2, or 5? OH! Ddi you know, the "find player" window' trade system shows district where the seller is? Pretty handy if you ask me. Now, if only they'd add the ability to post longer messages in the player window.

Peronally, I don't buy from poeple who post trades in the local chat. Ever. And neither should you.

I don't know if I'd try to paint Lion's Arch as the dystopia displayed in Orwell's 1984 quite yet. But, I can understand how you'd get the vibe that Big Brother is watching. At any rate, the analogy might be lost on the vast majority of today's Guild Wars crowd.

I know that the spam was annoying. I just think this was far from the best option. It doesn't do anything to correct the problem why people were spamming in the first place. Selling things always has been, and is still one of the worst aspects of this game. I loose quite a bit of respect for Anet when start marking accounts while at the same time Gaile has essentially said an auction house is not going to happen. They're the ones that came up with the brilliant idea to make the entire player economy dependant on a chat window. I mean, free games like Silkroad have better trade systems. This shouldn't be something that Anet takes pride in.

Ahh the good old mob defense.
"But everyone else was turning over cars and breaking windows I just thought I'd help."

You should be thankful that Anet has taken the stance of giving temp bans to the spammers to let them know their actions will not be tolerated any longer, I wanted them all executed!!!
Research shows that executions greatly decrease repeat offenders.

An Auction House really isn't as simple as many people would like to think. It's been said too many times to go over again, but basically, it can't be done without reworking how the entire game works, and that wouldn't take into account how it would effect the entire ecconnemy. In order to sell anything in an auction house, you'd need to make your item as cheap as possible, then the next person who comes along trying to sell the same thing will make it even cheaper, etc, etc. It's simply far too late to add something like that into the game.

2 + 2 = 5 brother.


The change was and will remain hypocritical until they put a lock down on;

Guild Recruitment Spam (Press P)
LFG / GLF Spam (Press P)
Running to / LFR (press p)

If those are not governed then the hypocrisy will remain and I will laugh all the way to PvP land.

So wait...now we start conspiracy threads here for ANet doing things we asked them to do.

There is no what if they ban us for this next...because nobody is asking for that. Apparently you missed the reason why they added this in the first place. The players asked for it.

Everyone is sick of people using the wrong channels to sell their garbage. We are specifically talking about people using the Local channel instead of the Trade channel to sell their goods. ANet and everyone else knows you have to stand there for a while, basically spamming your item. But that should only have to be in the channel it was meant for. There is no reason that everytime you enter district 1 of LA, that you have to turn off both trade and local to accomplish anything.

Your silly attempts at an allusion to 1984 is preposterous.

Try commercial zoning enforcement. NO you cannot open Wal Mart in the middle of a public housing tract.

IMO the 72 hour penalties for spamming in local is not enough.. I want 7 day + bans.

That's a little bit of an exagerration. I do agree that those other forms of spam are annoying, but it's no where near the same level. Until they started policing the trade channel it was completely impossible to hold a conversation in a place like Lions Arch, it was completely flooded with trade requests. The occasional "LFP" can be pretty annoying, but it's still managable and easily ignored.

If third party sites like this one can set up half decent auctions for whatever revenue they get for banner ads, it should be well within the capabilities of people who are actually getting paid for the work to get at least some minimal improvements in game. It can be an auction house. It can be something as simple as marking an item for sale, and it would AFK spam the item stats and my set price to the trade channel, accepting people who want to buy (similar to Silkroad for thoes who are familiar). I'll even go so far as to say if they wanted to add it as an upgrade to the Guild Wars store for $10, I'd probably buy it. I'm sick of things the way they are, and if they need us to pony up more cash to actually get much needed improvements into the game, so be it.

Yet another thread....

No, really. The way the game works just doesn't allow for it. If you wish to discuss it further, take it to one of the auction house threads. Bottom line, it isn't going to happen, and it's not simply because the developers are "lazy".

http://www.nickyee.com/daedalus/archives/000895.php

Pretty much sums it up.

Oh please. If you have the source code, you can do it. Nothing is impossible. Difficult perhaps, but not impossible. If anyone tells you otherwise, they're blowing smoke up your kiester.

The issue here is that Anet doesn't see it in their best interest. They probably see it in there best interest economically to put most all of their development resources at the momenton GWEN and GW2. I can understand that as well. I'm just saying if they put such an upgrade in the guild wars store, I'm frustrated enough with the way things are that I'd buy it.

The sellers and buyers aren't the only ones who are getting banned for spamming, they are just the majority of those who are doing it.

I believe I mentioned this in la dist 1 last night: There is now more spam about not spamming than there is actual conversation going on.

People double post about " I'm gonna turn you in spammer!" just like traders once did in local chat. I find it very funny.

No, Guild Wars PLAYERS determined that the ALL CHAT feature can't be used effertively for it's intended purpose. A-Net just responded to the issue.

Which players? The ones that constantly spam in any of the chat channels or the players that would like to have an actual conversation? As for the regulations, they're hardly arbitrary since they're there for a reason: Making game play as enjoyable for as many people as possible. They've been in the EULA from the get-go and the only mistake A-Net made, IMHO, is that they didn't enforce it from the start.

That wouldn't be a big deal if people realized that people actually DO look at it. ) If people didn't look, they wouldn't know how under-utilized the thing is.

Real, decent conversations were forced out of all chat by.... wait for it... SPAMMERS! (Imagine that!) OK,the potty-mouths don't help.

Be careful with the "WE" and "US" The GW community has been barely there for a long time, and WE have been complaining about the inability to hold a conversation in towns for a long time. I'm glad that A-Net finally listened to US and done something that may actually bring a sense of community back to the game. (See how that works?) But you're right about the other types of spam, it's just as annoying. I think they need to crack down on that, too.

Well im fresh in from game and see ive opened a can of worms.

Now i actually get to read the local chat and get to see people repeatedly yelling (and I quote)...

"BAM BAM BOOM BOOM BAM BAM"

and

"POOPY POOPY POOPY POOPY"

Yes thats MUCH better than WTS 20/20 Sword hilt - PM

Way to contradict yourself... So rather then have them justify where proper chat should go. (As requested by the majority of players time and time again), you would rather have them eliminate freedom of speech? If some 12 year olds want to flirt and pretend they're dating in Temple of Balthazar, let them. They have every right to. If some ass hat is spamming WTS GOLD 15^50 SEPHIS AXE!!!!!!!!!!!! BUY IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 20 times over in Lion's Arch, Don't let them, because theres a trade channel for that. So now you say, well those local chat conversations can be done in Team Chat or Private Messages? Well, No where is it implied that conversations must be conducted in team chat or private messages, Local Chat is for conversations of any manner. But, it was implied from the very beginning that trade should be conducted in the Trade Channel. Anyways my point of the matter is, what you'd love to see (Noobs and flamers eliminated), is from a political point of view, much more extreme and closer to your 1984 metaphor. Either way, no matter what you say, take a look at the terms of agreement you accepted yourself to before you started playing Guild Wars, the Dev's have supreme power and thats how it should be.

the problem is the large number of players and the limited option to trade. when u force all players to use trade channel, you get a crazy mass spam messages that u can't even read through properly.

the trade spam in local was mainly done in district 1 (american or english). ppl who wanted to talk or quest could just go to lower districts. i never seen the spam in any district 1 as a problem.

and before you label me as an ALL SPAMMER, well i don't bother to sell stuff in game coz i use the forum. but, sometimes i found myself in need to buy stuff in game. and guess what? i managed to find the sellers in all chat beacause it was just easier to read than trade chat.

today i went for fun in kamadan english district1. even though you could see a mass of blue dots, the place seemed to be like a ghost town. nothing was happening except sum1 recruting for guild. i tried to make some conversation with the ppl in the dist and i didn't get a single reply. after 15 mins there i just saw some random person spamming wts in local (he probly didn't read the ban announcement yet).

i think they should just make a damn sellers/buyers district where every1 could spam at will. but what they did is just stupid and dicatorial. it's clear that ppl going to district 1 are not there to chat but to buy/sell. and that's beacuse the sh*t trade system anet has. instead of making a district specifically for trade or just letting the comunity deal with the problem as we did for the past 2 years, they simply throw down the iron fist.

i can't wait to see what happenes when 3 other mmos get released probaly around the same time as GW:EN. i think the competition will shake up things. anet said that a mmo is a "service". well they sure provided a sh*t one since the release of nightfall. i'm not refering just to this recent mess up, but also loot-scale, 6v6/kill count in ha, and other things that soured my experience of the game.

i know that most of you ppl here will not agree with me but i think you fail to see things in perspective. you generally cheer at something but don't see the negative side of it which will eventually backfire on you and then u'll ask yourself: why did this happen to me? now let the flames roll...

/end rant

In my opinion, this hasnt helped a bit. You still get your screen spammed up with Trade Chat, and in the days before this rule I just turned both local and trade channels off. The only channels I use are Team, Guild, Alliance & Whisper. The only time I use Local is to look for a mission group, and no mission is ever being spammed to death with trade that I've seen.

What this has done is create a huge new populace of 10-year-old rule noobs, who threaten to get you banned whenever you try to do ANYTHING in local chat. I've seen numerous people who were saying just saying "LFG to do whatever mission or quest" get reprimanded and flamed & threatend to get reported for "spamming" and "not using trade chat". It's stupid and I'm almost afriad to even use local chat to do anything.

I think this rule did more harm than good.

I agree with Kook that this issue should have been taken care of long ago. If ANet had punished people right from the start, there would not now be this entire group of spammers who have always used All Chat for marketing goods and feel a sense of entitlement. A tight budget and a need to produce the next chapter creates many problems along the way.

And who will be next? I imagine those who use All Chat for conversations/comments that violate the EULA. They will be so easy to spot without having to wade through hundreds of lines of trade postings.

Spamming the same thing 25 times in a row without anything separating it doesn't help you sell it any faster... Get over it.