And here we have a gold sink

I disagree with your analysis. Some classes, the female Ele being one example, simply don't have enough distinct choices, especially in the early to mid game in Nightfall. I don't agree with Fitz's assertion that there should be no gold sinks at all (working towards what you want is part of the game, and there are other ways to get platinum in a hurry if you really need to - chest runs, for instance) but it would be nice if there were greater ranges in the non-elite versions rather than, say, Nightfall, where the 2-3 nonelite armours available to each class were only subtle variations on the same theme, with a couple of exceptions such as the Warrior.

Incidentally, to an earlier poster: saying 'go get collector armour' has never really been a viable option except when the collector armour was better than the crafters due to the lack of insignia - it doesn't even work for headgear any more. You can say it about weapons, but if you get collector armour you WILL be at a mechanical disadvantage.

I was really into Primeval Elementalist armor. Planned on buying it myself. Then someone mentioned it looks like she got in a fight with an umbrella and lost. Now I can't even look at that junk...

I always thought they look like they'd wrestled a windmill. Hey, it worked for Don Quichotte...

So if it is really that big of a problem for you, go find another game to play. I play ele as my main and no I don't prefer the slutty attire either. Kurzick 15k and Flameforged really are not bad.My favorites are Kurz 15k and Stormforged and they look quite nice.

Sounds to me tho like your true issue is you want it all and you want it now!

Who the hell outfits everyone of their hero's? I outfit the ones I use and the others get shoved aside, no need to mess with them. Collectors are around for a reason nice weapons and hero's don't need anything more! As for rune's they get what gets dropped for me and they do just fine.

Instead of complaining look at the ways to play that don't cost money!

At least it's shiny.

Ah, yes. The *Love it or leave it* suggestion which originated with a Jewish Philospher (Spinoza) as his people were being butchered by the Inquisition.

The words really are not bad by no means compare to *Really Jazz me out to the max man!*

There is a difference between wanting it all now and wanting to be able to see reasonable progress. And no I will never believe people claiming to make 100k a day are anything but liars or in violation of the Eula.

That's right. Troops are expendable and should be given the shoddiest crap possible if anything. Afterall, we don't really support employees. It is an international past time to treat them like doll dependent what-nots to collect dust on a shelf. Serioously, who would ever think about establishing and maintaining flexible teams or supported employees. That kind of stuff went out with the Robber Barons - o, excuse me, I meant to say the evil and insidious trade unions. Why have we no prisons, no work houses, etc? Let the poor sods get their support there.

There is no way to play the game which does not cost money. Even if you merely devealuate the personas expressed as characters to mere meaningless tools about which you do not give a rats-ass, you still must at all times expend money.

Spending time making money instead of playing is all you do. My ranger is right now farming, farming, farming, farming, one k at a time to buy the skills for her class. Then she will have to farming, farming, farming, one k at a time to buy the skills for builds. Then she will have to farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, to buy an elite set of armor for HoM. Then there is the farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, farming, for the weapons and mods that never drop. They should drop the wars out of the title and call if Guild Farming-zerg.

You must suck at the game, or have terrible drops. Playing GW:EN, I made 160k just playing all quests and all dungeons once, and exploring the full map. There's hardly any need to farm for things like skills and even most of the elite armor.

People making that much money tend not to be making it via farming, but rather via trading. It's quite possible, but I sure don't have the mindset for it.

You might have a point if heroes were real people, but, you know...they aren't.

If you're intent on buying every single skill for every character, then of course you're not going to have much money left over. It's evident you need to address your priorities--everything costs money. That's not Anet's fault, it's not a problem with the game, it's merely how things are. You have to decide whether you would like to save up for this prestige armor first or continue to spend money on skills you will likely never use.

heh always reminded me of aluminum sidings and rebar :P but the umbrella thing works too.

So what your saying is, after playing the expansion with the absolutely highest value of drops in the entire set of games all the way thru you had made less than 60% of what it takes to by one set of Vabbian Armor. Gee!, that is not overpriced.

Yeah, trading cash for gold, that is what they are trading. And assuming this could be true all you have stated is that a bunch of used-car salesman are workaholics and still not making money by playing.

The moral position one takes in practice is the fundamental position one takes when it is real. You might have a point if gold was real money--O, wait 1300k is about $103 on a Google sponsored website; ! It Is Real money.

However, it is not supposed to cost money. It is supposed to be entertaining rather than a grind fest for workaholics.

And one does not know what skills one is likely to never use. I was attempting to help a Derv today with a Solo mission he couldn't survive because he did not have the right skills to do so. If you have the library at hand you do not have to abandon the PUG because you neglected to get a book. This should Never come in the way of being able to get that image (ie. Video, as in a sight based game) which entertains you while you play for entertainment.

Well I only read 3 pages to watch it deteriorate into a classic Fitz post full of pseudo-intellectual content and loud protestations of personal political views.

You are getting a bit more subtle in your approach(as it did take a whole 3 pages to degenerate to this state) but in the end its still you restating the same arguments so that you can deliberately antagonize people into answering you (and hence vent your apparent frustrations at the world)

Plain english: you're a troll reusing a tired provocation.

/please close if this goes much longer

But that's just my two cents

But they are making money. That's the point. Whether they're "playing" is rather subjective--if they enjoy making money via buying and reselling items ingame, that's certainly playing the game to them. Purchasing gold has nothing to do with any of this.

Yeah, subjectivity is totally a false concept.

Heroes aren't real people. They do not exist outside of the game. They do not have actual personalities and feelings, and they aren't going to get upset and quit because you don't use them or give them equipment.

Who are you to say what it's "supposed" to be? Anet knew exactly what the armor set would cost when they designed it--it was purposefully made to be an expensive set of prestige armor that you're supposed to earn--and if you take advantage of the free chests scattered through Nightfall, as well as a couple hours or so of farming, you'll have plenty of money with which to purchase this armor set. That's how I got it on my Warrior, and it certainly didn't take the hyperbolic amount of "grinding" you claim.

Yea I've noticed this as well. Besides the fact that some armour's have become rediculously impossible to aquire... Someone mentioned Farm...

"Farm what fool?" - Drop rates are Shrunk and most of us "normal" people have better things to do than play a silly game all day. I speak for those who work so we can keep paying the internet bill.

Sheesh. There isnt anythin even remotely known as a solo farm anymore since drops are becomming rarer and rarer to acumilate. Besides your regular wurm runs but that kind of grinding becomes boring and demeaning. As for the HM PoV. Aren't Chests and golds supposed to be GOLDS and perfect/Max dmg's?

*sigh. Yea if i was working for Anet I'd bring back the good old days when we had to fight for favor for our country and farm at least half as often to get the gold we needed. I'm sorry but I don't the time anymore since my job requires more time than this program.

Need I say more?

Oh come on, no one else caught the irony? Chest running isn't how you make money to pour down the gold sink, chest running is the gold sink.

Fitz, after scanning other topics on the board it is quite apparent you aren't happy with ANYTHING in this game!

So the question is why the hell do you bother playing it?

As for my comment the ele armors "Aren't that Bad" I was trying to look at it from a prudish angle. Personally for myself there are no ele armors that compare to those two.

As for gold not everyone has it and those that do don't necessarily have to have ebayed for it! I have plenty of money 15 toons and have never ebayed a dime.

So get over it and grow up, they aren't going to remake a game because you hate every aspect about it.

Now, I am truly done with this conversation as your obviously someone who truly just likes to hear himself rant.

wait, what do I hear a troll coming?!?!?!

I don't really have anything to add, just chiming in to say you attributed some quotes to me that weren't mine, Fitz, in your last post.

I work forty hours per week, your average full-time job. I live alone (ie, not in my parents' house). Granted, I don't have children or anything, but it isn't at all difficult to balance work with a bit of farming now and then. I have no problem affording what I want to buy.

There are several Hulking Stone Elementals right outside Sardelac Sanitarium. They are incredibly easy to kill even on Hard Mode with a variety of classes. I've been getting more Sapphires and Rubies from this ten-minute run in the past month than I've gotten since I started playing the game.

i don't like most armors too
i farmed my fow (i never wanna farm like that again...ever)
i don't know if i'm happy or sad that gwen ele armors are crap
i'm probably happy cause i bought the fow before gwen release
and there's nothing in gwen that caught my eye to the point that i want to buy it for her
but since u like dresses..why not get the 15k canthan?
i wore that before fow
it is really nice
if you're bothered by the top piece you can try the 1k canthan top
it matches nicely and dyed black it doesn't make her boobs look like they're gonna pop out of the armor..

Fitz, you are either an idiot or a troll. Likely both. I can easily tell by this one sentence:

I would agree if it didn't have that shiney-Buddha ribon outline around the breast and stomache. I have been trying for three months to find that one acceptable and cannot.
That cannot go into the HoM. So, I would still have to get the 15 k and then lose another storage slot in my charcters already filling up back back - because there has been and continues to be insufficient storage in this game. (And the Monument display system proves that armors could be kept in a wardrobe window which a player could change according to the build they are going to use for the area/event they are going to do merely by clicking on an icon.)

I appologise for the error and corrected it.

I used C&P and attempted to respond to yours also. It must have gotten lost in the shuffle.

I don't agree that one should only have maybe 60% of the cost of an armor by the time one has finished the entire game.

You have 10 characters and you're complaining about the price of vabbi armor? You have to farm to afford it?

I bought a whole set of vabbi armor without paying for one ruby or sapphire, back when it was much more expensive than today. How? Ten characters - went through all the vabbi quests and you get more than enough trade contracts for all the rubies and sapphires you need. I even had enough left over to buy another character chest and leg pieces without having to buy a single ruby. I even had rubies left over to sell after that.

And if you're not willing to put in the effort to farm or do the quests, then the hall of monuments is not designed for you.

You must have really really really shitty luck.

I get about 1:2 or 1:3 i've gotten more gems from white ones then gold jeweled daggers.

What it really comes down to, and I stated it earlier, is that the 15k armor and above is "vanity armor." There is nothing wrong with the 1.5k max armor scattered throughout the game, except for the fact that you personally don't like the looks of it. Vanity comes with a price, and Anet isn't FORCING you to buy it. Your ele can finish the all of the chapters of the game with a set of 1.5k Drok's Stormforged (which mine has,) and some collector wands and foci. Anything on top of that is gravy. The fact that none of the styles of ele armor, except for Vabbian (vanity) don't suit your particular set of aesthetics is immaterial.

Hey, I don't necessarily love the looks of a $150 suit, but I sure as hell can't afford a $5000 Versace. Does that give me the right to demand of Versace that they sell me a suit at $150, because it would take me a year to scrape together enough disposable cash to buy it at their price?

<3 female* ele armor

I never found any of the Elite armour sets to mix all that well in the first place. If I don't like the look of the overall armour, I just look for something better.

Well I'm terribly archaic and think that women should be allowed to wander around in whatever they find comfortable. If a woman finds it comfortable to wander around with no pants on, that's her choice.

Believe it or not, most ancient cultures were fine with women (and men) running around with basically nothing on in public. Then the world got "civilized" by Europeans.

Also, do you have any idea how uncomfortable a dress can be?