1UP.com Guild Wars EOTN review

Reviews don't really concern me.... but on the whole I'd be inclined to agree. Eye of the North was a botch-job, primarily as a result of A-Net trying to listen to a large population of players who don't understand how the game works and can never agree on anything.
The whole dungeon system might appeal to some.... but in my opinion it is a step in entirely the wrong direction... taking the plot feel out of the game and turning into a mindless dungeon-crawl. The main plot for Eye of the North itself feels disconnected and pointless... the protagonist's position has become ever more absurd.... and most of the content is just rehashed versions of old stuff. Only the actual explorable areas themselves and their general-purpose prettiness is worthwhile throughout....

BUT.... it is still better than nothing, and I intend to get all I can out of it.... even if that means grinding through what I really don't like doing.


...... And you constantly chanting that doesn't count as a grind?
Drop the hypocrisy already.

(And for the record... the French use the term "little death" to refer to Orgasm. Take from that what you will.)

OK, got to ask. What Hypocrisy? Just curious why you don't like my sig.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

.-.

I think the reviews are fair.

GW:EotN is more of the same. It IS an expansion after all. It doesnt really offer any new concepts, it takes existing concepts and makes more content out of it.

If you like GW, there you go. If youre getting sick of GW, well...then youre screwed.

The review is completely correct.

The point I was trying to make that you seem to have missed was that if I took just 1 line and disagreed with it, then discounted you opinion completely because of one line, I would be foolish. You and I disagree a lot, but I still value your opinion. I can respect a healthy debate on a subject without discounting a whole opinion on just one line.

So, with that statement, I was explaining that discounting a whole opinion on one line in a large article would be foolish.

Now, as for making gold, what you did in 2 weeks I can do in a day or so. It is just we do different areas. Is one player better then another, I DON'T THINK SO! We both like different challenges. Mine are just at higher levels of challenge.

Are either wrong? NO. But very different game play style.

If you read in another post, I actually have found something I can do in GWEN that is funny to do. It is not solo and has me laughing my butt off with alliance/guild.

Do I make any real $$ with it compared to the other areas I frequent? No.

Do other players in the guild/alliance think they are? Yes. It is the best they can do for themselves and thier level of play at the moment. I am happy for them.

So, for the record and to keep things completly straight for the future:

1. I do value your opinion and like a healthy debate.

2. We will probably disagree on most things regularly as we play a different style of game play.

3. I hate grind, and you seem to enjoy it.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Well, if you have actually found content, please share it with the rest of us, because I have really looked hard to find it.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

QFT.

Grind is nothing new. Padding out Campaigns is nothing new (most of Prophecy is below level 20 content; Factions was laughable making you go back and forth all the time to make it feel longer, then stop and "grind" for 10k Faction to progress; Nightfall: desert, desert oasis, more desert).

I've actually enjoyed Eye of the North the most since first playing Prophecy. I don't see much difference between it and the Chapters, except it moves at a MUCH faster pace. A good thing, IMO.

10k faction less then an hour of play.

7500 SS points about 2 hours.

GWEN title farms, endless.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

??? You can't find any content?

Maybe your definition of content differs from mine. I found 4 engaging story arcs, great voice acting, a decent plot, and some great scenery.

BTW, the answer to your query: your sig is annoying because it's so repetitive.

It's longer than some of your posts. You hate grinding, we get it already!

Get over yourself, grind is NOT new to GW (or RPGs in general), and I don't even define the measly faction you need for LOOKS as grind.


EDIT: regarding the 10k "grind" in Factions, note the " ". I don't consider it grind, anymore than killing monsters for armor. It's actually fun in GWEN to get multiple point rewards going and seeing how many points you can get in a run... it's like, oh, I don't know, a video game?

BTW, you've already established you don't mind "grinding" 2-3 hours for Sunspear points. So, your not against grinding at all, just against GWEN.

lord dragon, your mantra is an insult to Buddists and Sikhists everywhere.

KNOCK IT OFF.

It took me only 4 days with 2 hours of gaming each day (I come home from work around 7 PM) to get my level 5 Vanguard title for my Dervish armor. Thats hardly a grind. Plus not to mention the TRUCKLOAD of runes i got from the Charr. PLUS not to mention its so much FUN using the Siege Devourer.

Does that reviewer really think he's smart because he uses a big word every 3?

Well, you can read past the sig. You can't do that with grind. A couple of hours of grind is bearable to a degree. When you take a bad idea of grind and extend it, it just extends the pain. Grind is true pain.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

How am I insulting a religion? I have not stated anything about religion here.

2 hours of grind is a bad idea. 8 hours of grind is grueling. You are lucky you got yours done in 8. I still know people that are grinding away to get the stuff they want. I am not one of them.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Then don't do it.

Unlike Factions or Nightfall, GWEN does not require ANY "grind" to progress through the story.

Grinding for armor has existed from Prophecy... or are you aware of FoW armor?

Hell, try getting Elite Cantha, Luxon, Kurzick, Elite Sunspear, Vabbian Ancient or Primordial armor at the beginning of the game. You can't. GWEN does nothing that has not been done before, just slightly different mechanics to do it.

Then blame Frank Herbert. It's from DUNE. (dragon just swapped the word fear with grind) Chill people.

That doesn't excuse Lord Dragon from spamming.

Grinding is an unfulfilling rote motion repeated excessively... right?
That about sums up the repetition of your "signature" there.
There is no standardised signature function for ordinary members here to the best of my knowledge. I can only assume you're copying and pasting that every single time or have some sort of Firefox add-on (or whatever) to do it for you....

Right?

I.... along with several other people here I notice..... kindly ask you to remove it and not post it again, as it is starting to get on several peoples' nerves.
Can you honour that request?

Seems the reviewer is Ryan Scott. Isn't this the same Ryan Scott that threw a tantrum and said he was quitting GW because he couldn't hack it in the Realm of Torment? I believe it is...

Anyway, I see some people are still saying GW:EN is short... yes, it is... if you only do the primary quests. However, you seem to be forgetting all the dungeons and side quests, which take many hours to do. Adding those in to consideration makes this expansion much larger than you seem to think. If you only played the primary quests and decided you're a GW:EN expert... well, I'll just say you really have no clue.

Anyway, the only problem I have with GW:EN is the grind. Grind is annoying... I hate it. I feel that if you do the primary quests, you should be able to go back and get any armor/weapon/consumable you wish, rather than having to grind for a stupid title. It's just as annoying to me as playing Factions and finding out I can't use an NPC in town because my guild is Kurzick rather than Luxon. My response is "Yea, but I saved your butts from Shiro... let me use the merchant dammit!"

Even if we have very different playing styles, and even if joe blogg does too. Its still not hard for any player to make enough gold to buy armor. Which is the reason I cant take that writers review seriously.

I read the entire thing, but that one line stuck out at me.

If he honestly thinks its grind to buy armor, then (sorry but) hes a moron! Armor is extremely easy to purchase and compared to games like WoW, its a walk in the park.

Elite armor in WoW cost litterally millions to buy!

And hes complaining about making 70k for armor! That just makes me laugh. We get alot of stuff basically given to us in this game, including in GWEN. Armor is relatively cheap and easy to buy, and weapons are either given as rewards or just as cheap to craft.

Even greens are all around 5-10k now.

I accept there is other grind, but not for armor. This is why I dont think that reviewer has a clue what hes talking about. I would even question whether hes played comparable MMOs like WoW, because he would know how easy we have it.

And I dunno why you have the impression I like grind! I dont.. and you should have realised that.

I dont like/love grind, I dont like farming and I really dont like bounty hunting for hours. But I dont mind doing it, because nothing we grind for is critical (as I keep saying). I wont die or loose out if I dont get it.

Im currently working my Vangaurd title to rank 7 and its not exactly fun, but ill get some gold from it for destroyer cores. It keeps me busy too! But im playing halo 3 at the same time.

Actually, he's complaining armor costs 50k. (10k each in GWEN).

Armor that, as a level 20 from a previous campaign, you don't need.

ie, no justification for complaining at all.

Good point actually, i forgot about it only being 10k. That just makes me laugh even more at the reviewer!

Especially if (I would assume) this reviewer had a lvl20 char, experience and actually plays GWs and still wasnt able to make 50k for armor! *scratches chin*

I think that the review was fair. 1up editors in most cases do not grade up for "more of the same". And a 6 is average, its not like he's saying that its complete crap.

He still does have that chip on his shoulder from Nightfall too. But they rebalance RoT a bit partly because of that rant he made.

I will see what I can do with coming up with a new one. You are correct that my browser is set to put it automatically. Will look around this weekend, just for you.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

You said 'can't afford to buy' and left it at that. I'm supposed to guess that you're saving up for destroyer cores based on that? 'Can't afford' means you have no spare gold for a 3-4k item, period. Next time, I suggest you use 'don't want to buy' instead.

I have friends who have played through all 3 campaigns and are unable to afford a single set of elite armor. I have farmed and quested through 5 titles in GWEN to get 5 sets of armors, and not come close to getting 50k based on drops and rewards. Most of my gold comes from trading, definitely not from merching and definitely not from enemy gold drop. Plus, Anet has always claimed that players should be able to play GW casually, so don't expect all players to know the game and gold earning techniques inside out. The rich-poor divide in guild wars is real and obvious if you pay attention in major towns like kamadan.

Based on your own 'argument', I find your entire post laughable because of your single statement. Sounds familiar?

Another example of a Lord Dragon post where the sig is longer than the actual post....

Sigs are not allowed for a reason. Just lose the sig, and I think you'll have more luck.

I find it hard to believe people can go through 3 campaigns and not get 75k. What are you spending your gold on?

The free chests in Nightfall will give you a nice bonus if nothing else. Also, try selling mini-pets (if you want the armor more).

Remember, Anet has set up that you don't need 15k armor to be successful. The rewards for "grinding" are appearence. That seems fair in my book.

I have read the forum rules. There is no mention of a sig in it. I have noted that hijacking a thread is a violation though, sort of like the signature discussion that we are having.

If there is somewhere else that this is noted, please show me so I may read it. If the moderator lets me know they do not like it, I will of course not have a sig at thier discresion.

With that said, how is the signature so annoying when all it is stating is that GWEN is a grind as the reviewer noted? I know you may not like DUNE. Fair enough on that. You many not like my posts, also fair, you can skip them.

But, until such time as I can find a new sig, you are stuck with this one if you choose to read one of my posts.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Spoken like a true grinder. I guess I am for the average player who can't do DOA, UW or FOW well. The game mechanic is setup so that if you do high end areas you reap the rewards. If you are not able to, you don't get them. You comment of 75k is not a true representation of the cost of the elite armors. They are much more if you are not able to obtain the materials needed through game play. This does not effect me at all, as I can. It does effect a lot of players.

So, with your 15k armor in place you think it is fair for others not to be able to attain it. I think different.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

Quite honestly I dont even see why your bothered about that, but ok.

Im sorry if this sounds condisending, but are you serioues? Your have friends who have played all 3 campaigns and never been able to afford elite armor? What are they spending their gold on! Do they not know how to save up?

Im not saying you will get 50-70k from selling drops to the merchant in about 10 minutes. It takes a few weeks - a month to save up that amount. But gold is not hard to make. I honestly think your friends and yourself are just bad at handling gold.

This isnt about gold being hard to makes, its about you and others being bad at handling gold and not being able to save it for more important stuff.

I also never said anything about trading in towns or outposts, or needing to know the latest prices for items. I never trade because I find it impossible unless you known stuff to stupidly low prices. I have made all my gold (99% of the time), from just picking up drops during quests and missions and dungeons and bounty hunting and exploring, and selling it all to the merchant.

Why are you talking like thats rocket science?

I just cant believe a player who has done all 3 campaigns, wont have atleast saved up 70-50k by the end of atleast one campaign, let alone all 3. You're talking about nearly 100 missions in this game, and 10000s of quests. Some which give gold rewards and endless opportunities to pick up drops and sell them.

That is more then enough chance to sell alot of drops and earn gold from quests!

I appreciate you need to buy progressively higher armor as you go, and upgrade weapons. But even so, after you play through one campaign and get used to that mechanism, you should learn how to handle your gold better.

You basically just save up as you go!

You dont make off-hand buys, and buy useless stuff on the side. I expect most of your friends have been blowing gold on useless stuff like ale, or dyes or expensive weapons. Stuff they dont critically need, while they should have been saving up.

Just learn how to handle your finances ingame better.

You dont have to be a trading expert, or rich to make enough for armor ingame and Im very worried about your friends playing technique if they cant. I dont mean any offence, but are these friends old enough to understand the concept of saving? or are they teenagers or children?

Also, which elite armors are they aiming for?

Because if their trying for the ones which need really expensive and rare materials, then its going to take longer. Vabbian costs around 100+ gold, and luxon or Kuzack is probably around 80-90+ gold. They should stick to buying endgame elite armor, if they really are finding it that hard.

Dont aim for the more expensive elite armors. But even so.... after playing all 3 games, they should have alot of gold saved up. Otherwise where has it all gone?

Plus

Why do people always pull a line like this...

"Plus, Anet has always claimed that players should be able to play GW casually, so don't expect all players to know the game and gold earning techniques inside out."

...understand this right! I am not a hardcore player. I am a casual player. Its astounding that when ever someone disagrees with you, the first thing they say is "ah but your a hardcore player, and not everyone is like that". Do you know my gaming style? do you know me personally? do you know how many hours I play every night or week? Nope!

Stop using this "im not a hardcore player" line to try and argue your point.

I am a casual player, and I manage to make enough gold to buy all this stuff and it never involves trading or farming.

Lord Ive bought enough 15k sets, to know on average most cost around 70k. Its only the more expensive ones like FOW, vabbian or luxon that cost more. And GWEN elite armor sets are even cheaper! A player has to be realistic to which one they can afford. If they just want 15k armor they can get endgame gear which is cheaper. If they want something more expensive, then they cant complain when it takes longer to earn.

Its all about choice! If you choose the more expensive ruite then dont complain when it takes longer and required grind to make up the difference. You choose to buy the more expensive stuff! No one forced you.

But Lord you really need to refine you're idea of grind, because you use it to describe everything in GWs and your mistaken about what grind is alot of the time. Sometimes your right, but sometimes your not because your throw that term around so loosely!

If you think its hard to get armor in GWs, try playing WoW and take one look at the price of elite armor there and you'l have a heart attack. Also in WoW you have to fix your armor when it gets damaged and that cost more, depending on its level. Do we have to do that? Nope!

You dont seem to appreciate how much Anet just gives this stuff away to us. GWs is not a hard game to live in, because most stuff is easy to make and earn. There isnt realy anything overly challenging ingame, other then anything connected to elite zones.

Most other stuff is easily affordable if you know how to save up.

Eerning 50-70k ingame for armor, does not require grind. I know ive said this about 3 times now in here, and im sorry for repeating myself. But you can seriously make 50-70k by just playing through one campaign and saving up properly.

If you sell every drop you get after doing a quest or mission, you are looking to make 1-2k easily, if not more.

Concider how many quests and missions are in one game, and that is alot of gold to make easily! Now you seriously cant tell me that is grind! That then worries me, if after playing all 3 campaigns, a player still hasnt earned enough or learnt how to handle their finances properly! What are people spending it on?

Its not grind if you make or earn something by just playing the storyline the first time around! Your not being asked or forced to do anything you wouldnt do anyway in pve.

Also if you earn or make something while doing a task like bounty hunting, exploring, vanquishing or HM it isnt grind either. Because you have chosen to do that.

Weren't you one of those people who got the Norn title pretty high over the preview weekend? Haven't you also earned a Vanquisher title?

I wouldn't really call that totally "hardcore", but I don't think I'd consider you "casual".

I'd also like to say I'm loving how much this thread is derailing, and agreeing with Lyra:

"GW:EotN is more of the same. "

So true. They can only go so far to make the same game more interesting.

Considering Blizzard makes you pay $50 bucks for an expansion + $15 monthly fee I'd say GWEN is a bargain. It's like, buying all three campaigns and saying factions sucks. Well why did you buy it? Yeah, GWEN has problems but what game doesn't?

Yes i did get rank 5 on the preview weekend, but that was only over a 2 day period. But that was one of the few times i've put that much work into something in GWs. Usually I take my time and play casually to earn stuff. Getting rank 5 on the preview event was just to show off by having Norn armor before anyone else.

Which came back to bite me in the ass because it sucked! However, I wouldnt call that hardcore gaming because it was mostly bounty hunting. I might have rank8 Norn and Drawf now, but thats purely from having nothing else to do and it helps make gold.

But thats my choice and if I had anything left in GWs to do, I would.

I dont have any vanquishing titles either, but I do have legendary guardian. But that didnt take any astounding hardcore gaming either. It just required doing one or two missions on HM a night or week.

I do agree though ive made this thread go a bit off track and im sorry!

The grind in Factions and Nightfall was mandatory, there was absolutely no way around in. I actually stopped playing Factions for quite some time because I found it completely unbearable.

I don't approve of it being in GW:EN, but the big difference is that it's completely optional. I find it hard to believe that you have multiple characters that you want to get each of the new armour sets for. Infact, I would be willing to bet money that you're one of the people that have been constantly whining about the new armour sucking.

I recently got the Norn armour for my Elementalist, and it only took a few hours, not a massive amount of time, and it was for something I really wanted, compared to Factions were I was being forced to do something I didn't care about so I could continue with a very bad story..

I don't think GW:EN was a perfect game, it does have many flaws, but honestly, some of you guys are just complaining for the sake of complaining.

You can't say that an hour most of ab'ing is equal to c, spacebar. AB'ing is not grind in any way and very easy to get the faction you want without even trying.

As for the story in factions, if you haven't finished it, how do you know?

I did finish GWEN on one character, so I can at least judge the outcome. Without finishing factions, you have no basis for the opinion to compare the 2. I do value opinions, but only when the come from someone who actually has played the game. I did play GWEN. You haven't played factions. Big difference.

As for armors, all my characters have elite armor. I am not complaining for me, I am complaining for everyone else that has to hit C, spacebar endlessly and is being mind warped into believing that is actually an acomplishment.

I listen to the complaints everyday from a huge group of alliance/guild members on this subject. If you believe it is just me that complains, realize that very few people will actually complain. They usually just leave the establishment, then tell everyone they know not to buy product XYZ. If you have any marketing in your background, you know I am correct on this.

Please remember...

I must not GRIND. GRIND is the mind-killer. GRIND is the little death that brings total obliteration. I will face my GRIND... I will permit it to pass over me and through me.

I have finished Factions. I only said I didn't enjoy it and didn't particulary want to continue after being forced to grind.

So by your opinion its grind to get armor in GWEN and its nothing more then c+spacebaring and nothing exciting or worthwhile is involved in the process. Surely getting the armor and all its requires, at the end of playing the storyline is an accomplishment?

Lord, once again you are tarnishing everything with the "grind" brush! Try to be more refined! Lets look at this logically, how do we get armor in GWEN?

1) We need rak 5.
2) We need the gold and materials.

Ok, lets look at how we get those things...

1) Rank5 is attainable from just doing quests and dungeons. I know because I did it on all of them!
2) The cost is actually cheaper at 10k and the materials for elite armor are on the cheap side from my experience.

So the result is...

1) Rank 5 is easy to get.
2) The armor is actually cheaper then 15k armor and you can make that 50k by simply doing those quests and dungeons.

End result = once again Anet is basically giving stuff to us with little effort needed!

...how does that equate to being the same as c+spacebar at all? Your attaining all these requirements for armor and weapons by simply playing the game/storyline through atleast once with a character. How is that bad?

I would assume most PvE players dont have an issue with playing the entire game through if the end result is armor.

I find you hard to understand at times Lord, because you give this impression that you dont like doing quests and missions to achieve things, so why do you play PVe?

I will accept getting ranks over 5 is grind, but its optional to do so after rank 5. But please Lord, do not try and suggest that getting armor in GWEN is grind in the slightest. Just dont PLEASE!!! I will loose what respect I have for you if you do, and I dont want to do that!!!!

I wish people would just accept and realise that the armor in GWEN is achieveable if you just play through the game, and wait until the end. By which time you will likely have rank 5 and all the gold and materials you need. If you enter the game with this "I want the armor NOW" attitude, then you will be disapointed. But tough! Why play pve is you dont want to finish a storyline in a game?

If you also then winge because you want a second armor set, and need to earn more gold and more materials. I would just have to slap you for your sheer lazyness!

But can we get back to the point of the thread. Peoples opinions of the review, which I said I didnt like because the guy was complaining about armor being hard to get. Which simply says to me, that he has no idea what hes talking about.

I wonder what that reviewer would have given the game had it been a WoW expansion rather than a GW expansion? Anyway, 6 isnt average - games that get 6/10 are at the bare limits of playability if you're in to that genre - it's low average at best. Had it been half a point lower it would have been graded as poor. Frankly, I aggree with Freeked, I think this is a case of everyone loves to hate a sequel. I mean, I read the review and the things he's complaining about make me think he shouldnt be playing GW in the 1st place. He doesnt even touch on the real problems with the game, like HoM etc. And if he's a WoW player with even one piece of elite equipment, then he's a hypocrite, plain and simple, because then he has no place to say that theres too much grind in GW.

Without getting into long drawn out arguing over grinding ( ) I'll just add that Freeked... if you got your armour in the preview weekend, it must've been rank 7 no? It was reduced to rank 5 on release as far as I recall.

About the article, some of it rings true, but overall it's indicative of the typical amateurish journalism I've come to expect from a lot of websites - insubstantial and snarky.

Oh and lol @

Minotaur? There was me thinking they were based on big cats, not a load of bull. >.>