Ok, i have been wanting to post this for a while now since i noticed i jsut cant run certain good build or run certain classes with my heroes because they just do not use some skills properly. So the point of this it is to show at witch part the heroe's ai fail.
So please post what skills you know your hero doesnt use properly and why.
Ill start (obviously):
Warrior:
*Bonetti's Defense: Hero activates stance but uses skills after using it.
*Crude Swing: Hero used only if there are 3-4 enemies in range, but hardly ever uses with 2-3.
*Crusing Blow: Doesnt use it at k.d. targets as often as it could.
Ranger:
*Throw Dirt: Even when not in attack mode, hero runs to the front line to blind a target and stays there:
Monk:
*Healing Touch: Even in avoid combat mode, hero runs to the front line to heal and doesnt priorize as self heal source.
*Shield of Regeneration: Hero doesnt use this skill to heal allies when in danger, only uses it when they are taking damage.
*Zealous Benediction: (Everyone knows) Hero uses it to heal and ignores the benefit of health beein below 50%.
Necromancer:
*Vile Miasma: Hero uses it without considering the benefit of target having conditions, even if hero has skills that only applies conditions.
*General Touch skills: Even when not in attack mode, hero runs to the fornt line, uses skills and stays there.
Mesmer:
*Arcane Echo: Hero uses at a random skill.
Elementalist:
*Aftershock: Hero doesnt priorize k.d. targets.
*Chain Lightining: Most of the time hero uses this skill more than any player would like to, causing too much exhaustion.
*Dragon's Stomp/Earthquake: Hero uses only when there are more then 3 targets.
*Glowstone: Hero uses this skill randomly. Does not priorize targets with weakness. Ignores its conditional benefit.
*Glyph of Lesser Energy: Hero doesnt priorize skills that have a high energy cost after activating it. Sometimes hero uses it when the energy is full. Sometimes hero doesnt use it when energy is low.
*Invoke Lightining: Hero does not priorize the use of this skill. Ex: uses Lightining Orb or Chain Lightining insead of this one.
*Savannah's Heat: Hero only uses this skill when there are 3 or more targets close to each other, if there is only one target, hero wont use it.
*Shell Shock: Hero doenst use this skill to cause cracked armor and deal more damage as a consequence. Hero ignores its benefit.
Assassin:
*Black Mantis Thrust: Hero uses this skill at target reather he is hexed or not.
*Critical Defenses: Hero does not activates this skill before entering combat like Critical Eye or any Dagger spell. Hero only uses this skill when taking too much damage during combat (wich is not its objective). Hero ignores the constant block benefit. Hero should use this skill when enetering combat and at half normal range from target.
*Death's Retreat: Hero can use this skill to "retreat" to a nearby melee ally.
*Disrupting Dagger: Hero uses this skill when entering combat, ignoring the beneft of interrupting.
*Falling Lotus Strike/Falling Spider: Hero doesnt use this skill at k.d. targets as much as it could.
*Golden Fang Strike: Hero uses this skill even when not enchanted. Hero ignores the benefit of beeing enchanted. Hero does not use enchantments to optimize usage of skill.
*Shroud of Distress: Hero doesnt keep this enchantment up as much as it could. Hero usually uses this skill during combat, when taking heavy damage and when health is already below 50%, making it easy to interrupt and putting hero at risk.
*Way of perfection: Hero doesnt use this skill as a source of constant heal. Hero uses this skill during combat, when taking damage. Hero ignores the benefit of using it when entering combat.
*Way of the Assassin: Hero doesnt use this stance as much as it could. Hero uses stance even when not enchanted. Hero ignores the benefit of beeing enchanted.
*General Assassins combo: Heroes usually dont use combos as fast as it could, usually uses lead attacks, attack once or twice and then continues with the combos. Heroes also dont know how to use combos with more then 4 attacks, like using a lead, off-hand, dual and using other skills that would continue the combo (falling spider and continue).
ps: assassins are bad heroes because they hardly ever know how to use their skills.
Ritualist:
*Attuned Was Songkai: Hero doesnt use this skill as much as it could. Hero doesnt cast this spell before using other skills and therefore ignores its benefit.
*Boon of Creation: Hero doesnt use this skill as much as it could. Hero doesnt use this skill before using binding rituals, ignoring the benefit of having it and using binding rituals.
Dervish:
*Avatar of Melandru: Hero doesnt priorize the usage of this skill. Sometimes hero can stay the whole combat without using this form.
*Convition: Hero doesnt use this skill as much as it could. Hero use this stance only during combat and when health is reaching 50%.
*Faithful Intervention: Hero only use this skill when health is below 50% and going down. Doesnt keep it up as much as it could in order to put it to a good use.
*Reaper's Sweep: Hero doesnt use this skill as much as it could. Sometimes hero priorizes other attacks, even when target is below 50% or about get to 50%. Sometimes hero doesnt even use this skill to give the final blow.
*Signet of Pious Light: Hero uses this skill even when not enchanted, making a very bad use of it. Hero doesnt use other enchantments on itself before using this skill.
*Vital Boon: Hero doesnt use skill skill as much as it could. Hero waits for his health to drop below 50% to use it. Hero could use this skill to heal itself with Signet of Pious Light, but he makes a bad use of both.
ps: i havent been playing with paragons so i didint noticed any bad AI =/
Post your Hero AI fail here.
Gregslot
Alvarez
Uh that's quite a nice list there. I should start paying attention to how and when they use skills, hehe. I know for a fact that my Koss is scared of using Heal Signet... not sure why...
Somewhat a different note on hero A.I; they seem to not follow as well as they once did. They drop behind when I engage in combat sometimes and don't move at all... next time it happens I'll take a screenshot. It's rather annoying when you need a hand and everyone is behind you an entire aggro circle and not moving.
Somewhat a different note on hero A.I; they seem to not follow as well as they once did. They drop behind when I engage in combat sometimes and don't move at all... next time it happens I'll take a screenshot. It's rather annoying when you need a hand and everyone is behind you an entire aggro circle and not moving.
Shadow Spirit
There's a lot of things heroes won't do. One of the ones I laugh at a lot is [card]Splinter Weapon[/card].
If you give a hero /Rt as a secondary for this skill, they seem to refuse to use it on themselves, so Splinter/Barrage heroes are out.
It takes some experience to figure out which builds you don't need to Micro on heroes.
But if you run a [card]Jagged Bones[/card] MM hero, you can roll most of PvE anyway...
Also, Heroes are scary good at interrupting. You just have to figure out what they excel at and use them that way.
If you give a hero /Rt as a secondary for this skill, they seem to refuse to use it on themselves, so Splinter/Barrage heroes are out.
It takes some experience to figure out which builds you don't need to Micro on heroes.
But if you run a [card]Jagged Bones[/card] MM hero, you can roll most of PvE anyway...
Also, Heroes are scary good at interrupting. You just have to figure out what they excel at and use them that way.
gnome
i have seen the arcane echo thing...2x energy tap (on a mes dw =P) when sh is right nxt to it -.-
also the heal sig thing...they only use it on abt 100hp and then seem to die anyway
problem with wards...will only cast vs elements without some prompting, stability will be cast abt half the time, but melee...even if the warder has some monsters beating the crap out of him from melee range he will not cast the ward most of the time without me telling him to.
seen the random stopping thing too
also the heal sig thing...they only use it on abt 100hp and then seem to die anyway
problem with wards...will only cast vs elements without some prompting, stability will be cast abt half the time, but melee...even if the warder has some monsters beating the crap out of him from melee range he will not cast the ward most of the time without me telling him to.
seen the random stopping thing too
Brianna
Uh.. with Arcane Echo what the hell do you expect, them to read your mind and know which skill you want them to activate it for? Common sense people.. Disable it and click/use it when/on which skills you want.
Eh, I could go on forever with this, some of the stuff you posted is just a complete no-brainer, I mean they can't be perfect and play the game like human players do.
Oh and PS: Hero monks FAIL. Their AI just seems completely borked in general.
Eh, I could go on forever with this, some of the stuff you posted is just a complete no-brainer, I mean they can't be perfect and play the game like human players do.
Oh and PS: Hero monks FAIL. Their AI just seems completely borked in general.
Stolen Souls
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianna
I have to agree. >.>
And yeah, a lot of those things can be solved by micromanaging. :/
Kusandaa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brianna
Monks also heal/prot pets and minions, sometimes over party members.
And glyphs in general, they won't use it much. I loaded a build with Heal Party and GoLE on a hero monk once (not gonna do this mistake again) and he ingored GoLE quite often, resulting in Dunk running out of energy fast. I had to eventually micro-manage him and Masters to give him BRs every now and then.
Same thing with hero eles and Glyph of Sacrifice. See story below.
And a little story on how heroes fail for me - related to AI in particular, not really skills:
I was doing Rand/Thommis with a couple friends, and we had 2 or 3 heroes, one of them being Zhed. When we reach Thommis, we wiped by over aggro and had to res at the closest shrine. While we discussed pulling over Vent, we saw a little green dot in Thommis' mob... we highlight names.
Zhed Shadowhoof.
He's hard-casting Meteor Shower on Thommis, in his 20-man mob. He died before getting the spell off. We were laughing SO HARD on Vent, it was hilarious and I'll NEVER forget that. But IMHO that's one of the most stupid thing I've seen a hero do.
Another like this applies with the targeting function ("I'm targeting..." and not "I'm attacking...") I was capping skills with another guy, so we both had heroes. We didn't want to overaggro so we were standing back, trying to figure out if we could get the boss only. He targets the boss, and his heroes rush the mob.
I don't know why targeting an enemy in particular makes them rush for it. I'd understand the "I'm attacking <enemy>!" function (can't remember the keyboard shortcuts, I do those without thinking...) but TARGETING...
zwei2stein
Maybe heroes can recognize bad skills and misuse them to make you remove them from their bars... Get a hint.
Clarissa F
Gotta chose to disagree with hero monks failing. The problem is with people giving monks a wiki build and getting pissed they aren't awesome sauce, not knowing AI mechanics. Keep to simple, low-cast skills, and they do well. Never make them strict heal or protect. Hybrids do much better. They do condition removal very well. I'd much rather have Dunkoro than most of the human monks.
As for sins, give them a simple Flashing Blades/1-2-3 build. Anything else they can't handle well, and it will give them a bit of durability, considering their Naru-tard tendencies(damn j00, Zenmai).
Give Koss a simple axe build with cleave(once again, stick to low cost.) ,steady stance, FGJ, and endure pain, believe it or not, and he has great survivability. I farmed Norn in the Fells with that build, and in clearing the area he never died. Lol, I even forgot he had no shield until 2/3 of the way through one clearing session.
Gwen is a better PB mesmer than any human, as your ping will never be as good as she is. I love all the profanity my enemies have when she uses a Dom build.
Remember to treat your heroes as newbie players whose builds you can outfit. Low energy, spammable skills are perfect, as are builds that don't rely on crazy mechanics to make them a success. The fact that people can vanquish most areas of the game with H/H shows they can be effective.
There's a reason most people H/H instead of pug.
A lot better than a pug wammo with 5 monk skills on his bar.
As for sins, give them a simple Flashing Blades/1-2-3 build. Anything else they can't handle well, and it will give them a bit of durability, considering their Naru-tard tendencies(damn j00, Zenmai).
Give Koss a simple axe build with cleave(once again, stick to low cost.) ,steady stance, FGJ, and endure pain, believe it or not, and he has great survivability. I farmed Norn in the Fells with that build, and in clearing the area he never died. Lol, I even forgot he had no shield until 2/3 of the way through one clearing session.
Gwen is a better PB mesmer than any human, as your ping will never be as good as she is. I love all the profanity my enemies have when she uses a Dom build.
Remember to treat your heroes as newbie players whose builds you can outfit. Low energy, spammable skills are perfect, as are builds that don't rely on crazy mechanics to make them a success. The fact that people can vanquish most areas of the game with H/H shows they can be effective.
There's a reason most people H/H instead of pug.
A lot better than a pug wammo with 5 monk skills on his bar.
Mitchel
Heroes remove Cracked Armor when you are using Aggresive Refrain.
blakecraw
Necro heroes don't use Icy Veins as a normal nuke, they only cast it on enemies that are about to die (as in less than 33% health), in which case the enemy often dies before they finish casting. It has a 30 second duration, so they should just use it as a normal nuke, because pve mobs won't last 30 seconds.
Zeek Aran
You forgot PS as a source of healing with DF bonus.
Very good list. Hopefully ANET will notice.
Very good list. Hopefully ANET will notice.
Hollow Gein
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarissa F
Gotta chose to disagree with hero monks failing. The problem is with people giving monks a wiki build and getting pissed they aren't awesome sauce, not knowing AI mechanics. Keep to simple, low-cast skills, and they do well. Never make them strict heal or protect. Hybrids do much better. They do condition removal very well. I'd much rather have Dunkoro than most of the human monks.
As for sins, give them a simple Flashing Blades/1-2-3 build. Anything else they can't handle well, and it will give them a bit of durability, considering their Naru-tard tendencies(damn j00, Zenmai).
Give Koss a simple axe build with cleave(once again, stick to low cost.) ,steady stance, FGJ, and endure pain, believe it or not, and he has great survivability. I farmed Norn in the Fells with that build, and in clearing the area he never died. Lol, I even forgot he had no shield until 2/3 of the way through one clearing session.
Gwen is a better PB mesmer than any human, as your ping will never be as good as she is. I love all the profanity my enemies have when she uses a Dom build.
Remember to treat your heroes as newbie players whose builds you can outfit. Low energy, spammable skills are perfect, as are builds that don't rely on crazy mechanics to make them a success. The fact that people can vanquish most areas of the game with H/H shows they can be effective.
There's a reason most people H/H instead of pug.
A lot better than a pug wammo with 5 monk skills on his bar. Definitely agree with this. As mentioned, unless you micro-manage your heroes, they'll never perform as well as a human player (Though there times when even that is questionable..LOL!!)
As for sins, give them a simple Flashing Blades/1-2-3 build. Anything else they can't handle well, and it will give them a bit of durability, considering their Naru-tard tendencies(damn j00, Zenmai).
Give Koss a simple axe build with cleave(once again, stick to low cost.) ,steady stance, FGJ, and endure pain, believe it or not, and he has great survivability. I farmed Norn in the Fells with that build, and in clearing the area he never died. Lol, I even forgot he had no shield until 2/3 of the way through one clearing session.
Gwen is a better PB mesmer than any human, as your ping will never be as good as she is. I love all the profanity my enemies have when she uses a Dom build.
Remember to treat your heroes as newbie players whose builds you can outfit. Low energy, spammable skills are perfect, as are builds that don't rely on crazy mechanics to make them a success. The fact that people can vanquish most areas of the game with H/H shows they can be effective.
There's a reason most people H/H instead of pug.
A lot better than a pug wammo with 5 monk skills on his bar. Definitely agree with this. As mentioned, unless you micro-manage your heroes, they'll never perform as well as a human player (Though there times when even that is questionable..LOL!!)
makosi
2 Paragon heroes both with "It's Just a Flesh Wound!".
They spam it on eachother until their energy runs out.
They spam it on eachother until their energy runs out.
RSGashapon
Greatest Hero AI fail? That's an easy one...
Zhed.
I have lost count of how many times that idiot centaur has run off, while flagged even, to go play with a group of level 28's a quarter mile away. Skill choice is irrelevant in his case.
Zhed.
I have lost count of how many times that idiot centaur has run off, while flagged even, to go play with a group of level 28's a quarter mile away. Skill choice is irrelevant in his case.
netniwk
Quote:
Originally Posted by RSGashapon
Greatest Hero AI fail? That's an easy one...
Zhed.
I have lost count of how many times that idiot centaur has run off, while flagged even, to go play with a group of level 28's a quarter mile away. Skill choice is irrelevant in his case. Yup,Leeroy is his middelname.
Zhed.
I have lost count of how many times that idiot centaur has run off, while flagged even, to go play with a group of level 28's a quarter mile away. Skill choice is irrelevant in his case. Yup,Leeroy is his middelname.
Peter Panic
idk if it happens with rits too, but n/rt given life will spam it as much as possible when out of combat (even stops running with the group to cast) and then almost never uses it when in combat. its really annoying
~ Dan ~
What's the point in this thread? A list was made ages ago - ANET know how fail they are. They just chose to do shit all about it, as usual.
Shame that they can work so much on monster AI in eotn yet we get this fail crap.
Shame that they can work so much on monster AI in eotn yet we get this fail crap.
Crom The Pale
Warrior Heros often fail to utilize fully charged adrenaline skills.
I ran a Dslash build on my Koss with only FGJ and Dragon Slash, once Dslash charges up he only uses it every 4th attack when it could be used ever attack.
As for hero monks they are fantastic healers with the right skill set, just don't expect them to run any kind of split build. ie: prot/healing or healing/condition/hex removal.
Heros in general do have certain builds they run better than others, it takes some time to figure out what skills they will use and what combos simply fail on heros.
Also note that some heros work well with eachother and hench while others seam to couter each others. example - Razah + Lina, if Razah has Brutal Weapon Lina will cast an enchantment upon every char Razah casts the weapon spell on canceling the effects of the weapon spell.
I ran a Dslash build on my Koss with only FGJ and Dragon Slash, once Dslash charges up he only uses it every 4th attack when it could be used ever attack.
As for hero monks they are fantastic healers with the right skill set, just don't expect them to run any kind of split build. ie: prot/healing or healing/condition/hex removal.
Heros in general do have certain builds they run better than others, it takes some time to figure out what skills they will use and what combos simply fail on heros.
Also note that some heros work well with eachother and hench while others seam to couter each others. example - Razah + Lina, if Razah has Brutal Weapon Lina will cast an enchantment upon every char Razah casts the weapon spell on canceling the effects of the weapon spell.
Nevin
I think I've run into every problem you've had, thats why I stick to very basic PvE builds.
MM's
SF's
WoH healers
Sometimes if I feel like spicing it up, bring some interrupters just for kicks. What I really love doing though is giving my MM jagged bones and death nova, he can micro it like nothing.
MM's
SF's
WoH healers
Sometimes if I feel like spicing it up, bring some interrupters just for kicks. What I really love doing though is giving my MM jagged bones and death nova, he can micro it like nothing.
Yanman.be
<insert any non LOD assassin combo>
Exhausting Assault never gets used, ever.
Exhausting Assault never gets used, ever.
Wildi
hero monk standing in traps and healing himself over and over, instead of moving out
cosyfiep
hm, my sosuke will use savannah heat anytime he has the energy to use it...even on a ranger spirit!
Vekk is my biggest woe....even when FLAGGED he still runs into mobs (on guard mode)....and zhed has already been mentioned.
I taught my dunky to use heal party....we had all just gotten smacked with rising bile and he starts to heal everyone separately...I stop him, click heal party and the next time we get smacked with it...he actually used it without me clicking it for him!! I was impressed. (have since replaced it with divine healing I think).
Vekk is my biggest woe....even when FLAGGED he still runs into mobs (on guard mode)....and zhed has already been mentioned.
I taught my dunky to use heal party....we had all just gotten smacked with rising bile and he starts to heal everyone separately...I stop him, click heal party and the next time we get smacked with it...he actually used it without me clicking it for him!! I was impressed. (have since replaced it with divine healing I think).
Ruby Lightheart
This is not a shot at any posters or the author of this posting string. It is mearly my observations and input.
First thing you must rememeber is that Heros were never designed to run like live players. They are merely NPCs you can take along with the exception that you choose whta skills and weapons they carry. AI means Artificial Intelligance so dont expect the programing to think like a live player.
Second, you have to do some kind of skill activation management. If you dont want your Hero Ele to use metor shower every chance its available, deactivate the skill till you are ready for it to be used
Third, never put touch or short range skills on any hero you dont want running onto the front lines. This is especially crucial when dealing with Monk, Ranger and Assasin heros. Skill such as Throw Dirt and any touch healing skills could spell doom for your hero.
Fourth, be prepared to manually activate your heros skills, stances etc. If your hero is gonna be casting alot of wards, stances or other simular buffs, be prepared to activate them yourself before a big fight to ensure a more favorable outcome.
Fifth, before going into combat with other live players, if you are brining along a hero make sure your team knows what skills your hero has. They may have valuable tips that couldhelp you improve your hero.
And Finally, dont be afraid to ask on the forums for help creating a hero's template.
First thing you must rememeber is that Heros were never designed to run like live players. They are merely NPCs you can take along with the exception that you choose whta skills and weapons they carry. AI means Artificial Intelligance so dont expect the programing to think like a live player.
Second, you have to do some kind of skill activation management. If you dont want your Hero Ele to use metor shower every chance its available, deactivate the skill till you are ready for it to be used
Third, never put touch or short range skills on any hero you dont want running onto the front lines. This is especially crucial when dealing with Monk, Ranger and Assasin heros. Skill such as Throw Dirt and any touch healing skills could spell doom for your hero.
Fourth, be prepared to manually activate your heros skills, stances etc. If your hero is gonna be casting alot of wards, stances or other simular buffs, be prepared to activate them yourself before a big fight to ensure a more favorable outcome.
Fifth, before going into combat with other live players, if you are brining along a hero make sure your team knows what skills your hero has. They may have valuable tips that couldhelp you improve your hero.
And Finally, dont be afraid to ask on the forums for help creating a hero's template.
Deadslap
Vekk and Zhed continuously use [skill]Meteor Shower[/skill] on a group of 1 or 2 enemy's. I can't tell you how many times I'll see this in 1 quest.
In the Jokanur Diggings mission, whenever I equip any touch skills on my monks, they always stand under the stomper and get crushed to death.
In the Jokanur Diggings mission, whenever I equip any touch skills on my monks, they always stand under the stomper and get crushed to death.
Torqual
Great thread.
Building AI is an art. What humans have that AI doesn't is the ability to anticipate. You can take preventative action and prioritise use of skills based on the tactical situation. You can discriminate between types of opponent, using your skills that anticipate or negate theirs. Humans however, have a problem that AI doesn't: crappy reactions - and lag. I've seen the AI interrupting 1/2 second cast skills. The AI owns at interrupting.
I'd like to add a few to the list which demonstrate what I am saying:
AEGIS:- A human will pre-cast this just before the melee and missiles slam into the party, whereas AI prot monks will wait a good 3-4 seconds before they decide it's a good idea. Not bad programming really, there's just no way to give the AI the predictive insight that a human has.
BACKFIRE/EMPATHY:- AI is totally indiscriminate in the use of these hexes. Backfire goes onto warriors and Empathy onto monks. A waste of energy.
Does this mean that AI Prot monks and AI Mesmers fail? Absolutely not.
Just know when to micro (like with Aegis) and know what skills to give to heroes that either don't require discrimination or do require reactions.
I use Norgu quite a lot with Conjure Phantasm (which he spams) and a load of Inspiration Magic-based interrupts for energy. The thing is, if you give him spell-interrupts, he can't use these on people that ... er.... don't use spells. But giving him Backfire is baaaaaaaaad. :-)
Same applies to an AI Necro. Spiteful Spirit works on everything... Reckless Haste, Price of Failure, Soul Leech.... these are just asking too much of their pitiful brains.
A couple more things I look out for with AI hero builds....
Skills with high(ish) cost and very short recharge are not a good thing. Give your AI Prot monk Spirit Bond and he'll spam it to death, spending 10e every 2 seconds.... energy pool doesn't last long. I tend to give them things like Shielding Hands, PS, SoA that take longer to recharge... just to give a more balanced bar.
Also, I tend to find a monster that I really cannot abide, steal its build off wiki, and give this to my equivalent hero with a few tweaks. The reason for this is that I know the AI is using the skills well, based on how much I hate that monster. For example: Sandstorm Crag + Stoneflesh Mandragor + Warden of Earth would be a real supermonster from hell. A monster that rips through your team with AOE, can't be killed, and keeps knocking you down. So, that's why my Zhed runs Sandstorm, Churning Earth, Stoneflesh Aura, Ward Against Melee and Stoning/Ebon Hawk. I don't have Stone Daggers though because I find that without this, the AI alternates Stoning/Ebon Hawk a lot better.
Building AI is an art. What humans have that AI doesn't is the ability to anticipate. You can take preventative action and prioritise use of skills based on the tactical situation. You can discriminate between types of opponent, using your skills that anticipate or negate theirs. Humans however, have a problem that AI doesn't: crappy reactions - and lag. I've seen the AI interrupting 1/2 second cast skills. The AI owns at interrupting.
I'd like to add a few to the list which demonstrate what I am saying:
AEGIS:- A human will pre-cast this just before the melee and missiles slam into the party, whereas AI prot monks will wait a good 3-4 seconds before they decide it's a good idea. Not bad programming really, there's just no way to give the AI the predictive insight that a human has.
BACKFIRE/EMPATHY:- AI is totally indiscriminate in the use of these hexes. Backfire goes onto warriors and Empathy onto monks. A waste of energy.
Does this mean that AI Prot monks and AI Mesmers fail? Absolutely not.
Just know when to micro (like with Aegis) and know what skills to give to heroes that either don't require discrimination or do require reactions.
I use Norgu quite a lot with Conjure Phantasm (which he spams) and a load of Inspiration Magic-based interrupts for energy. The thing is, if you give him spell-interrupts, he can't use these on people that ... er.... don't use spells. But giving him Backfire is baaaaaaaaad. :-)
Same applies to an AI Necro. Spiteful Spirit works on everything... Reckless Haste, Price of Failure, Soul Leech.... these are just asking too much of their pitiful brains.
A couple more things I look out for with AI hero builds....
Skills with high(ish) cost and very short recharge are not a good thing. Give your AI Prot monk Spirit Bond and he'll spam it to death, spending 10e every 2 seconds.... energy pool doesn't last long. I tend to give them things like Shielding Hands, PS, SoA that take longer to recharge... just to give a more balanced bar.
Also, I tend to find a monster that I really cannot abide, steal its build off wiki, and give this to my equivalent hero with a few tweaks. The reason for this is that I know the AI is using the skills well, based on how much I hate that monster. For example: Sandstorm Crag + Stoneflesh Mandragor + Warden of Earth would be a real supermonster from hell. A monster that rips through your team with AOE, can't be killed, and keeps knocking you down. So, that's why my Zhed runs Sandstorm, Churning Earth, Stoneflesh Aura, Ward Against Melee and Stoning/Ebon Hawk. I don't have Stone Daggers though because I find that without this, the AI alternates Stoning/Ebon Hawk a lot better.
genofreek
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevin
Sometimes if I feel like spicing it up, bring some interrupters just for kicks. What I really love doing though is giving my MM jagged bones and death nova, he can micro it like nothing.
Oh my god, SO seconded. Give him some sort of energy management (I found out the hard way that Consume Corpse is so not the way to go for hero necs, though XD) and watch those bleed bombs drop. It got to the point where I would flag Olias, wait until his minions had aggro, flag him back, then stroll in to mop up the few sad shreds the undead left behind.
They also have some insane interrupt abilities, too. Pretty much my only big irritation with heroes is when I flag them back and they STILL manage to rush something I'm only highlighting. I don't even have to call, just click a foe and feel the wind in my hair as they all stampede to be the first ones at it.
Jora, Koss, and Zhed are HOPELESS when it comes to obeying the flag. I'm thinking it might be a warrior thing, because Talon's not much better.
Haven't had any issues with Vekk or Ogden, though.
Edit: Oh yeah, and I wish they avoided AoE half as well as the enemies.
They also have some insane interrupt abilities, too.
Pretty much my only big irritation with heroes is when I flag them back and they STILL manage to rush something I'm only highlighting. I don't even have to call, just click a foe and feel the wind in my hair as they all stampede to be the first ones at it.Jora, Koss, and Zhed are HOPELESS when it comes to obeying the flag. I'm thinking it might be a warrior thing, because Talon's not much better.
Haven't had any issues with Vekk or Ogden, though.
Edit: Oh yeah, and I wish they avoided AoE half as well as the enemies.
{IceFire}
Meteor Shower is kryptonite for heroes, they just sit and take it...
Kusandaa
Quote:
Originally Posted by {IceFire}
Meteor Shower is kryptonite for heroes, they just sit and take it...
Pretty much any AoE is the bane of heroes. I flag them and un-flag them back right away - they usually start moving on their own.
But notice how some human players won't kite MS anyways...
But notice how some human players won't kite MS anyways...
sagilltwins
SH on 1 enemy with 20% hp...
artay
I am amazed at vekks willingness to run into a mob and die!
Thats why I love him.
Thats why I love him.
Sir Pandra Pierva
Monks rezzing the in crusher in Jokonur diggings.
Thats just classic and its always rebirth.......makes me almost wanna bring any other rez.
Yes I do run my heros with a res, since I mostly just use the old WoH build
Thats just classic and its always rebirth.......makes me almost wanna bring any other rez.
Yes I do run my heros with a res, since I mostly just use the old WoH build
Draikin
Quote:
Originally Posted by dan-the-noob
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Yanman.be
Exhausting Assault never gets used, ever.
It does, but only as an interrupt.
I disagree with a number of issues mentioned here. The AI can't read your mind and know which skill you want them to use Arcane Echo on. They also use Splinter Weapon near perfectly, but apparently some people want them to use it in the wrong way and cast it only on themselves. There's also nothing wrong with the AI using AoE attacks like SF only when they'll hit multiple targets (the only problem here is that they ignore their target lock when doing so). MoriaOrc
I had a new opportunity to witness hero stupidity yesterday while capping a skill in Arborstone.
Situation: While fighting Wardens, Tahlkora has become poisoned and is low on life. Because they were chasing her, she's got some enchantments on her. Battle ends and she has about 30-40 hp left, and at least 20 Energy. Stupidity: She has dismiss condition on her bar. She has enchantments on (this needs repeating). For about a second I just sit there with my heroes in formation and her bar open expecting her to cast it. She doesn't (or anything else). So I check the box for Dismiss Condition. Still nothing. After about 3-4 seconds of sitting there, Tahlkora falls over dead rather then self healing and removing the condition that was killing her. Gah stupid bots. By the way they suck at using Dismiss Condition regularly because they only want to use it to remove conditions.
Kusandaa
I noticed something with Sab's 3 necro build yesterday, while doing HM Destruction's Depth with a friend. Running Olias as my Jagged Bones MM, along with BotM and Prot Spirit...
Olias casts BotM. His bar goes down by a bit, and Livia (my N/Rt restauration) heals him. Fairly normal. His next move? Casting PS on himself (like that's going to prevent the damage from BotM! Yeah right -_-). Then he death novas a minion... before casting PS on the same minion. And this one isn't related to the 3 necro thing, but same tactics as Olias. Tahlkora, set as a prot on my necro, om which I sometimes play MM... uses PS on me after I sac. Erm yeah... I don't need it since it's a SACRIFICE spell. However, I'd need it more than my minion who she casts it right after.
RedStar
So many fails
Dunkoro standing in maelstrom.... Zhed casting Searing Flame before immolate. Master of Whisper killing him self with blood ritual XD. Magrid casting Splinter weapon on me... Talhkora rezzing MoW, the only one that didn't have a rez... And the worst thing they do : watch the scenery....one time they watched me die...evil heroes
Gregslot
I still think they can make a better hero/henchman AI and want to.
So if you post what skills they dont use or use badly it would help a lot to gather information. Some of you are just posting to post. So try to post some or even one, it would help a lot. =]
Kusandaa
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedStar
Dunkoro standing in maelstrom.... Zhed casting Searing Flame before immolate. Master of Whisper killing him self with blood ritual XD And the worst thing they do : watch the scenery....one time they watch me die...evil heroes And that's also what I was saying with minions - even Togo and Mehnlo do the same thing in Vizunah Square, where people usually run 2 MMs. It's awful. They really should prioritize your party and important allies, not pets or minions... Jaceb
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedStar
Master of Whisper killing him self with blood ritual XD
haha, damn. Olias killed himself with Blood of the Master the other day. First he was doing well minions up and all then next thing i know, he's dead. He was spamming it all the time until..
The Famous Zhed leeroy hasn't happened to me  . Melonni on the other hand is stubborn - say i want to attack an melee guy first and leave that non-dangerous caster for last. She runs off to hit that caster once and then - comes back. She did this nearly everytime, needless to say she's my least used hero.
Ashe.
Put any skill on Ogden and it's a fail.
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