Requesting an easier level of game play...

MithranArkanere

MithranArkanere

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Nov 2006

wikipedia.org/wiki/Vigo

Heraldos de la Llama Oscura [HLO]

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by thedeadlyassassin
Dunes of Despair.
Ah... the problem here is that you have to face level 20 enemies with level 17 henchmen in parties of 6, in Timed Missions.

Without the timers, they would become quite easy.

Parties of 8 and level 20 henchmen should start from Amnoon Oasis.

the_jos

the_jos

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Hard Mode Legion [HML]

N/

Quote:
Originally Posted by mystical nessAL
If someone has hard times doing something, HE should be the one to change, not the world change for him. Improve yourself, learn your mistakes and counters, dont just cry to anet that you arent bothered in been focused on the game.
I think your comment is too harsh, Myst.
For some people, normal mode is hard. Because they don't know external resources or just play the game 'roleplaying' and not fully using the character's skills to maximum effect.
For example, take Brutus in our guild.
He has enabled Hard Mode for some time now, but he played W/R most of the time. With a bow and a pet.
It will get you through prophecies, perhaps with some help on certain missions.
Yesterday I cought him using FGJ without having adrenaline skills on his bar.
Meaning I'm probably going to take him to battle island to have him experiment with some skills.

Since he does not play as often as we do and most certainly does not use wiki or community sites, he will never learn fast unless someone tells him how to play a warrior right. Or build a ranger if he wants to play with a bow and pet.
From someone that uses community sites and wiki often this is/should be common knowledge, but for others around it's not.

I do understand that some people struggle and just saying 'learn to play' is not going to work.
From their perspective, the game is too hard and they don't know why.
When no-one tells them, they will not learn.
Implementing some 'Sandbox mode' could help those players learning to play.
Because the information they have to absorb in the battle is just too much.
It's hard to focus on what's happening around you when you get beaten up.
Most people only think: 'need to stay alive'.

It's with a lot of things.
I've seen players kite towards me when I was playing bonder.
Players with a build that consumes too much energy. Or one that could work, but only when they don't spam their heavy energy/exhausting skills.
Players spreading attribute points all over. Or using the wrong weapon sets.
Recent example from a dungeon by someone: "Wtf earth scroll?". Ofc they player did not get the hint, so we pointed that with his set he did not get full energy benefit when playing fire ele.

It's only when people explain others what can be improved in understandable language that they will become better players.

mystical nessAL

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2006

DDrk

W/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_jos
I think your comment is too harsh, Myst.
For some people, normal mode is hard. Because they don't know external resources or just play the game 'roleplaying' and not fully using the character's skills to maximum effect.
For example, take Brutus in our guild.
He has enabled Hard Mode for some time now, but he played W/R most of the time. With a bow and a pet.
It will get you through prophecies, perhaps with some help on certain missions.
Yesterday I cought him using FGJ without having adrenaline skills on his bar.
Meaning I'm probably going to take him to battle island to have him experiment with some skills.

Since he does not play as often as we do and most certainly does not use wiki or community sites, he will never learn fast unless someone tells him how to play a warrior right. Or build a ranger if he wants to play with a bow and pet.
From someone that uses community sites and wiki often this is/should be common knowledge, but for others around it's not.

I do understand that some people struggle and just saying 'learn to play' is not going to work.
From their perspective, the game is too hard and they don't know why.
When no-one tells them, they will not learn.
Implementing some 'Sandbox mode' could help those players learning to play.
Because the information they have to absorb in the battle is just too much.
It's hard to focus on what's happening around you when you get beaten up.
Most people only think: 'need to stay alive'.

It's with a lot of things.
I've seen players kite towards me when I was playing bonder.
Players with a build that consumes too much energy. Or one that could work, but only when they don't spam their heavy energy/exhausting skills.
Players spreading attribute points all over. Or using the wrong weapon sets.
Recent example from a dungeon by someone: "Wtf earth scroll?". Ofc they player did not get the hint, so we pointed that with his set he did not get full energy benefit when playing fire ele.

It's only when people explain others what can be improved in understandable language that they will become better players.
I guess it's abit too harsh, but I never liked those "too hard " attitude. The only fun in this game is the challanging. However on brutus's case, he hasnt complained about the game been too hard, he has played it and enjoyed it, eventought he isnt playing effectively.
From what I got with reading Scarlet's comments is that she rushed the game. You will have to prepare yourself for higher challanges, as you may see anet cant really make NM easier.
:P

Amy Awien

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

From what I read she assumed that EotN was the follow-up to Prophecies and thus it would make sense to play EotN after Prophecies.

GW just wasn't designed to support different difficulty levels.

The only general advice I can give is to ask here - or on other forums - if you're stuck on a mission or quest.

Kanyatta

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Guildless, pm me

R/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_jos
For example, take Brutus in our guild.

Since he does not play as often as we do and most certainly does not use wiki or community sites, he will never learn fast unless someone tells him how to play a warrior right.
But, if someone is on guru posting about this, they obviously use community sites, and probably play Guild Wars fairly regularly

Although I realize that is not a majority of the community, if you want to be successful at the game, you probably have to play it a little bit. Fatal1ty didn't learn how to be the best FPSer ever overnight.

MMOs have never been known to be "pick up and play" like other games. Ultima Online, EQ, D&D, Diablo, and many others have been known for the player base that really dedicates themselves to the games and gets good. I realize Guild Wars is kind of a breed all its own, but it still falls under the "MMO" category, which has traditionally been games that are difficult to jump into and be good.

But, the community shouldn't have something forced on them because a small percentage of players don't want to get better. I realize we were all at a point one time in our GW careers, where we ran R/Mos with Power Shot and W/Mos with Mending, and such, but most of us that stuck with it got past those phases. Just because someone doesn't want to adapt, they shouldn't be given a free ride.

Ama Seraphim

Ama Seraphim

Academy Page

Join Date: Apr 2007

War Torn [Torn] - Guild Leader

D/R

I don't think she or her husband are looking for a free ride, I think they are just stating what they think would improve their game play and others like them. Unless people play constantly and have learned to adapt or where shown the error of their ways does not mean they are demanding/expecting any special rights in the game. They are CASUAL players, meaning they get on to have fun, if I was in their shoes I wouldn't want to purchase a game that I expected to have fun and kill a little time, only to not be able to complete some areas because the 'difficulty' level. The people that are posting negatively need to take a step back and realize that not everyone can play a game and immediately adapt. Some players need longer to adjust and she already mentioned that she is guildless so the help (ie, information, strategy, skills ideas) isn't that readily available to a guild member unless someone is willing to take a random person and offer help.
This is a community, and sorry but as of late the leetness of some players makes the newer/casual play players shy away from asking help. Prime example look at some of the posts in this thread. I applaud those that have offered advice/help to Scarlet and her husband, but for those that are blunt and rude need a reality check. IT IS A GAME, get over yourself and play the game as a community and not about you. (flame me if you want, but damn it be nice to ppl when they are directed here by ANET.)

Skyy High

Skyy High

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: May 2006

R/

"Sandbox" mode, as you say, won't help anyone improve. It'll just lead to people continuing to use crappy builds and tactics, but instead of being occasionally challenged by NM, they'll just assume that they must be doing something correctly, because they're getting through on the easy mode. And then when they try NM, they get destroyed, and then we have an entire new batch of PUG-ers who are even more horrible than the current batch....it simply cannot be beneficial to anyone involved. NM is easy as heck if you play the game with a modicum of sense (and even that is optional in many areas). Making an easier option does a great disservice to both the players who are struggling, and everyone else in the community who may eventually party up with one of the "easy mode" players inadvertently.

the_jos

the_jos

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Hard Mode Legion [HML]

N/

Quote:
But, if someone is on guru posting about this, they obviously use community sites, and probably play Guild Wars fairly regularly
Play GW regulary? Probably. Post on guru? When A-net support says to do such a thing, they will learn about such sites.

When I started playing the game, one of the first things I did was looking for information on the internet.
However, when others have difficulty, they contact the supplier. And the supplier points them to community sites.
"I simply put this here as instructed by a GW support agent." post #5

Normal mode being hard is also not a very uncommon complaint, people do struggle on normal mode.
There are/were some parts of the game that were notorious for this.
I still hear people that hate THK or Hell's. Same for some Canthan missions (Gyala, Eternal, Palace). Not to speak about the comments on the Realm of Tornment.
Then A-net introduced EotN with dual-profession foes that hit hard.

So, since A-net pointed Scarlet here, it's up to the community to 'decide' if such a change could add value to lesser experienced players.
If that's not the case, A-net support should not point people with these kinds of surgestions here, but just say no (hope I see this right, Gaile).

And I do see value, as long as it ensures that a player can 'try' the mission on easier mode but still has to finish on normal mode to progress.
It would give them the oppurtunity to look at situations without the risk of being killed instantly by the first group of foes.
No drops, no xp, no gain except viewing the mission area and the foes.
Tune down the foes and remove DP so players can see if a team build is working. Tune down player weapons/skills to 2/3 damage.
Put in a large red warning text "This is easy mode, foes will hit twice as hard in normal mode!".

The thing I would not surgest is this as a way of progressing through the game. Normal mode is the way to progress and is doable as far as the story lines are concerned.
The only exception might be the true 'solo' players with H&H, that have a hard time at HoS and missions/quests like those.
A sandbox should be enough for players to tell if their approach has a fair chance of success or is just doomed.

However, one thing I'm not certain about is to include dungeons or not.
It might be a good way to experiment with certain less common team builds.
Or to see if a certain build is up to the final boss
For example, it sucks getting at Fendi only to find out the team can never beat him.
On the other hand, that's the risk on entering a dungeon.
You never know what lives beneath the earth.
So while I see value on the missions and perhaps harder main quests, I keep mixed feelings about dungeons.

mrmango

mrmango

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2006

Southern California

Charter Vanguard [CV]

Me/Rt

Keep failing, smart people see how to not fail the right ways, and they do so. Then the fail goes away. Repeat as needed.

Skyy High

Skyy High

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: May 2006

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_jos
So, since A-net pointed Scarlet here, it's up to the community to 'decide' if such a change could add value to lesser experienced players.
If that's not the case, A-net support should not point people with these kinds of surgestions here, but just say no (hope I see this right, Gaile).
Honestly, she probably wasn't pointed here by a person; every ticket opened sends back an automated message, including, "please post any ideas on community fansites".

And, by the by, ANet has incorporated the /wiki and /help commands into the game for a reason. Ignorance of outside sources should not be anyone's excuse; if you're in an outpost for a mission, you type /help and click on the mission name. Trouble on a quest, type /help; all your logbook's contents are displayed. It's all there, all easily accessible.

I'm confused how a sandbox easy mode could ever be useful to anyone as a, "will this build work," tool. Make it easy enough, and EVERYTHING will work; how will you know when you transfer from easy to normal mode that your build will still work?

Amy Awien

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_jos
... No drops, no xp, no gain except viewing the mission area and the foes. Tune down the foes and remove DP so players can see if a team build is working. Tune down player weapons/skills to 2/3 damage.
As a sort of blessing:

You and your party are under the effect of Vision Quest. While Vision Quest is active you can not progress through quests or complete missions, your party receives no xp and no treasures, but all party-members and allies take 50% less damage from foes, deal 50% more damage to foes, are healed for 25% more, enchantments cast on them last 20% longer and hexes and conditions expire twice as fast.

Witchblade

Witchblade

Polar Bear Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

instead of playing with that blessing, just watch an ingame video on Youtube ^^
(not very different imo)

Angelica

Angelica

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2006

Aussie land

Me/E

I found the game a bit too hard when I started to play for the first time!
Now after more than two years and lots of practice I find it ok.

I wouldn't mind having three choice as per: Easy Mode - Normal mode - Hard mode.
After all we have had the H/M add not long ago, so why not an easy mode too?

/Angelica

Mineria

Mineria

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2007

Denmark

Dragonslayers Of The [Mist]

W/Mo

As long as new players can get protector of Tyria with henchmen only, and not even much trouble, I don't see why there should be an easy mode at all.

The thing that really makes a difference, is if you have been reading a guide or not.
http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Category:Guides

mrvrod

Guest01

Join Date: Jul 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by S_Scarlet
Maybe you guys will see something that throws up a red flag.

Human 1 - Ranger / Monk
* Gwen - set as a Mesmer / monk with 1 healing spell and 1 res spell.
* Jora -set as a warrior /monk
First suggestion I would make is to get rid of the healing & res spells for Gwen, probably even change secondary unless your goal is to create a resmer(can be referenced on wiki if you want to find out more about that build). I'd consider Mesmer/Elementalist for the ele glyphs

Quote:
Originally Posted by S_Scarlet
Human 2 - (varies, but normally Elementist / Monk ~or~ Elementist/ Necromancer
* Ogden - Monk
I played an Ele/Necro when I first started thinking it would be an interesting meld, I never really liked it or found any good skill combo that worked for me. I would suggest Ele/Mesmer especially if you want to be a heavy nuker (massive fire dmg) Skills like elememtal attunement and fire attunement, some heavy dmg fire spells like Searing Flames and Mark of Rodgort, and mesmer's arcane echo to repeat that favorite fire spell.

Quote:
Originally Posted by S_Scarlet
Human 3 (me) - Elementist / Monk - heavy fire spells, P. healing & 1 res
*Vekk - Elementist/ Monk - heavy on fire, set up much like me
*Ogden - normally monk / ele with most of his skills being party healers.
Again with the ele I'd go with the E/Me build, get rid of monk skills on back line dmg dealers for PvE. In PvP dressing up your true monk is a good idea, in PvE let your monks do the monk work.

I hope you find this helpful, and with many posters here, feel free to pm me in-game if you have anything I can help you with. I'm 41, I have a disability (back injury), and have been slow on the uptake with this game (just ask my boys ). Trust me, people are telling you the truth, with just some minor tweaks, you will see MAJOR improvements.

Mark Nevermiss

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2006

Support probably pointed her here with the anticipation that many die hard GW'ers will view this as a blasphemy and flame the hell out of her thus ending the petition "due to lack of popular support". Its like the Pope preaching in Mecca.

Not all players have alot of free time on their hands to read community sites, wikis..etc. For some working people, they need to go to work, do grocery, house cleaning, cooking, schooling children...etc. and in the evening they look forward to an hour or 2 of quality family time to unwind and relax. GW could be an option to do that, or NOT.

GW became "easy" only after countless trials and errors and eventually finding the easy way to do things. For instance for someone who doesnt know that Gayla Hatchery mission can be done in a way that renders hero/henching it for master reward not difficult at all [by running first ahead and clearing patrols and then doubling back to escort the turtles] finishing this mission can be extremely difficult with heroes and henchmen. Imagine when this was attempted with only henchmen back in the days of Factions AND without the aforementioned knowledge.
Some areas in GW are challenging even in NM if attempted with H/H. The various "explorer's League" sub-forums have countless threads to this effect. A good example would be the Catacombs of Kathandrax. Where it seems normal mode can be even harsher than HM.

My conclusion is this: Anet will very doubtfully introduce any major changes into this game now that their efforts are mainly directed at GW2.
GW is a game that requires significant investment of time to learn and perfect your approach. Monsters use probably the best AI in any game out there, using the same skills we do - and some better than we do. For those who like an easy game to sail through without a learning curve, GW may not be the best game out there.

Kanyatta

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Guildless, pm me

R/Mo

Anyone else feel we should let this thread fall to the bowels of what is the Guru ocean of bad threads?

pamelf

pamelf

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2006

Australia

Lost Templars [LoTe]

Me/Mo

no I don't agree Kanyatta, but perhaps the thread itself should be re-opened elsewhere with Scarlet asking the community what she can do to improve her game, and make the most of her builds.

Just a side note to help out...when you're in an outpost or waiting to enter a mission, or have some active quests, just hit f10 and it will give you wiki links to the most important things you have active at the time. You can then look it up immediately without having to spend hours on the wiki looking for the place you're at.

I hope that helped.

Coloneh

Coloneh

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Nov 2006

D/W

I do understand this. a challange is good, but it gets to a point where beating on a mob for 10 minutes just isnt any fun. some of the later game things could use a dificulty decrease.

Zahr Dalsk

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Aug 2007

Canada

We don't need an easier difficulty, all we need is a removal of the hero cap.

StormDragonZ

StormDragonZ

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2008

New York

W/R

Here's a question: Does the AI of monsters say to attack heroes first? If so, now I know why they die so fast.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by StormDragonZ
Here's a question: Does the AI of monsters say to attack heroes first? If so, now I know why they die so fast.
If the heroes are a lower level then you or a supporting class like a monk or elemental then yes, they will attack them first.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zahr Dalsk
We don't need an easier difficulty, all we need is a removal of the hero cap.
Whattttttt? seriously! What? Why?

You want heroes to exceed lvl20?

Darkobra

Darkobra

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2006

Scotland

Type like an idiot, I'll treat you like an idiot

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by freekedoutfish
If the heroes are a lower level then you or a supporting class like a monk or elemental then yes, they will attack them first.



Whattttttt? seriously! What? Why?

You want heroes to exceed lvl20?
No, he wants 7 heroes instead of 3.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkobra
No, he wants 7 heroes instead of 3.
Oh sorry my bad!

S_Scarlet

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2008

Forgive me for not replying sooner. We had a family emergency and the computer was the last thing on my mind. I will do my best to cover some of the comments and questions that have been tossed out.

Also - I would like to personally thank everyone who spoke up to say that the idea I suggested had valid points, as well as those who offered true support and suggestions.



Quote:
Originally Posted by mystical nessAL
From what I got with reading Scarlet's comments is that she rushed the game.
You couldn't be more wrong. We've just recently beat Prophecies & started on Gw:en. Also to my knowledge I never said anything about rushing through, or wanting to rush through - that was an opinion you drew all on your own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Skyy High
Honestly, she probably wasn't pointed here by a person; every ticket opened sends back an automated message, including, "please post any ideas on community fansites".
Again, someone stating an opinion. Yes - I was directed here by a GW agent, if you need more proof I even mailed them back upon the 1st suggestion stating my concern over doing so, and then e-mailed them again to find out which forums they recommend. So - while that may be in the fine print of their e-mails....it wasn't the fine print that led me to do this.





And, to the many posts that scream wiki...wiki.....you must not be using wiki. YES We do use the wiki, and quite often to make sure we haven't overlooked anything in a mission or area.

Olim Chill

Olim Chill

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2007

USA

DMI

N/

^NM is forgiving enough; there's really no need for an easier level.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmango
Keep failing, smart people see how to not fail the right ways, and they do so. Then the fail goes away. Repeat as needed.
True... and it doesn't take too long to weed out the fail.

Keekles

Keekles

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

Floating amongst the ethereal seas of placating breezes.

Like A [Boss]

Mo/

Erm. The game is plenty easy enough. I can go through normal mode h/h easily, and can survive in hm with h/h.

Amy Awien

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Olim lll
^NM is forgiving enough; there's really no need for an easier level.
But there is, can you not read?


Quote:
True... and it doesn't take too long to weed out the fail.
People that find the the game too difficult or frustrating are unlikely to return for the sequel. ANet might want to consider what truly is in their best interest.

Olim Chill

Olim Chill

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Oct 2007

USA

DMI

N/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amy Awien
But there is, can you not read?

People that find the the game too difficult or frustrating are unlikely to return for the sequel. ANet might want to consider what truly is in their best interest.
Oh stop that...of course I can read. I also read this thread, incidentally.

GW NM welcomes you with open arms. The difficulty level is just right.

Amy Awien

Amy Awien

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jul 2006

R/

It's too cold.
No, it's not, it's just fine.

Kanyatta

Forge Runner

Join Date: Jun 2006

Guildless, pm me

R/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by S_Scarlet

And, to the many posts that scream wiki...wiki.....you must not be using wiki. YES We do use the wiki, and quite often to make sure we haven't overlooked anything in a mission or area.
You must be doing it wrong then, because if you are using the prescribed bars that are given, you shouldn't have a problem, worse players than you have gotten through all campaigns, believe me, I've been in some PvE guilds in my time.

hallomik

hallomik

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2006

The Illini Tribe

N/Mo

I tend to agree that the game should not be made easier, but I think a lot of the people talking about how “easy” NM is are forgetting how each successive chapter makes the game easier and easier.

When each additional chapter was released, it contained skills that provided advantages over those skills that came in previous chapters. For example, Factions added Broadhead Arrow and Spoil Victor (caster shutdown and boss killers, respectively). Nightfall brought customizable heroes and the overpowered Searing Flames. These new skills and the addition of heroes made previously hard areas much easier. As a consequence, the endgame PVE areas of the new campaigns were made comparatively more challenging to compensate.

EotN is the ultimate expression of this trend. There are very powerful PVE skills, such as Ursan Blessing and Pain Inverter, but GW:EotN also offers some of the most challenging non-elite PVE zones across all games. These areas only seem marginally more difficult to experienced players because they are the proverbial frogs in the pot of hot water not noticing the temperature (difficulty) slowly rise.

The reason I have this particular insight? When I purchased NightFall, the manufacturer accidentally packaged two activation codes in the box (one advantage of not going with the online purchase ). For a long time, I didn’t do anything with the extra game, but one day I realized I could use the Nightfall characters for mules and for their birthday gifts. I created 4 characters on a single day, leveled them a bit, and outfitted them all with 10 slot bags. When the EotN trial came out last December, I decided to take them over to EotN to get Max Armor and to cap Jagged Bones on my Nec.

This was my rude awakening. On my primary account I have 10 characters, one of each profession, with most core skills and elites unlocked. I can create heroes to suit any challenge fairly easily. With my NightFall-only characters, however, EotN was a major spanking ground. Yes, I capped Jagged Bones, but the number of times I wiped on the way was humbling. I had truly forgotten, as have many of the “contributors” to this thread, how difficult the game can be in the beginning.

This disconnect between “too easy” and “too hard” also hit me a month or so after EotN’s original release. There was a major thread on Guru complaining that the expansion was too easy. A lot of experienced players agreed. At the same time, PC Gamer was knocking the game as being too hard. Kristen Salvatore, who did the review, was a serious player for a game reviewer, but game reviewers famously cannot dedicate themselves to a single game, so she, too, found EotN punishingly difficult.

On to my advice….

In order to turn much of the game into Easy Mode yourself, do the following: Skill cap Searing Flames in NightFall for your ele. You can also get this in EotN assuming Nightfall is linked to the account. Cap Ursan Blessing for everyone in EotN. Once you get Ursan, leave EotN for the time being. Complete the other games first, as they are comparatively easier. Unless you want a particular skill or hero, save EotN for last. As others have suggested, make a Minion Master hero. There are plenty of good builds to be found. Rather than use Monk heroes, create two Searing Flames Ele heroes plus the Minion Master. The main skills you will want on your SF nukers are Searing Flames, Fire Attunement, Glowing Gaze, Liquid Flame, and Glyph of Lesser Energy. I like to make the Eles secondary mesmer with energy gaining interrupts from the inspiration line, but that’s optional. The secondary can be modified to suit different situations. I’ve tried /R’s and given them pets. I’ve tried /N and given them blood ritual to keep everyone juiced with energy. Lots of options there.

Next, replace all superior runes with minor ones. The additional health is normally worth more than the added skill strength – particularly if you find your team dying a lot. (The commonly agreed exception to this rule is the Minion Master who should have a Superior Death magic rune for more and stronger minions. Some suggest to put a Sup rune on the tank to lower health so he attracts more attacks, but that is more debatable.) With this kind of offensive firepower, there will be much less pressure on the monks and two henchmen monks will work fine. On the other hand, since you can go with all heroes, make sure at least one of your monks is mainly Protection-based, although hybrid heal/prot can be fine, too. If you want to be even more defensive, replace the SF Nukers and MM with the 3 N/Rt “Sabway” build. In normal mode, it is slower but safer than the SF Nuker approach.

Some of my suggestions are arguable. There are legendary threads on superior versus minor runes, for example. I do, however, guarantee you will find the game easier if you do all of the above.

Many of builds and skills I’ve described are considered “overpowered” by the community because they can make much of the game rather easy. I actually agree, but it sounds like just what you’re looking to do. Who knows? One day you may start a thread suggesting some of these skills be nerfed to bring more challenge back. Good luck.

tmr819

tmr819

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2007

W/Mo

hallomik, that was a well-written and helpful post. I especially liked the part about EotN being a "major spanking ground". And here I thought I was the only one getting spanked!

One of the things the OP had mentioned was going from Prophecies directly to EotN.

For someone having difficulty in EotN, I would definitely recommend playing through Factions and Nightfall before tackling Eye. While EotN may be "easy" for many, I still think it is significantly more difficult than the other campaigns for the reasons you gave.

mystical nessAL

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2006

DDrk

W/Mo

Quote:

You couldn't be more wrong. We've just recently beat Prophecies & started on Gw:en. Also to my knowledge I never said anything about rushing through, or wanting to rush through - that was an opinion you drew all on your own.
Finishing a game doesnt means anything. It takes appromaxi few days to do it so. GW:EN is a VERY higher level of Prophcies.

Performance Pudding

Performance Pudding

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2007

post ascalon

Over The [Wall]

W/

i found that the fun of the game was coming up with ways to beat the campaigns with random unit combos that didnt work very well but were still fun. 1 time i ran a mission with no healers a few times and eventually beat it. another time i did nolani academy hm and opened the gate right away and it took a few attempts but with good flagging it worked, but one of the funniest parts of it was that one time when i opened that gate all the enemies ran around and into the foothills with all the rocks and then used the back entrace and pwned rurik. my friend and i rofled when we got there just in time to see him getting ganked. anyway i went off topic but im learning how to type faster so i guess this helps. :P also i didnt read many of the posts so i may be repeating this but an easy mode would suck for anet since they have to adjust all the skills and levels and monsters so that they become the lvl 0 river lizard things in pre searing. wow great idea a dungeon with tons of river things and u have to kill as many as possible b4 time runs out. it could be a new challange mission

upier

upier

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Mar 2006

Done.

[JUNK]

I am a bit torn here.
On one side I most definitely wouldn't mind having it in the game - since it would just expand what can be done or who can do it. Especially if the balance rules of max number of minions, armour cap or moronic ideas such as environmental effects would be removed in easy mode. I sure wouldn't mind going to Vizunah with 2 MMs and them being able to have unlimited minions!
It would bring back the insanity of easy fun!

On the other hand - I don't really need it. Which brings up the question - why should they put that much work into something when there are things out there that need much more urgent attention.

But all in all - I don't mind it appearing in the game - so I'll give a /signed!

genofreek

genofreek

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2007

USA

Jenova's Apocolyptic Remains [JAR]

D/

The main reason I like this idea is because a couple of my little cousins love GW and sometimes play on my account (with my supervision, of course :P). They like the endgame areas with all the cool monsters, especially in Nightfall, but they're not quite skilled enough to win there.

Still, it's a HELL of a lot of work to implement, and as upier noted, there are so many real problems already in the game that could use a fix.

mrvrod

Guest01

Join Date: Jul 2006

Quote:
Originally Posted by genofreek
The main reason I like this idea is because a couple of my little cousins love GW and sometimes play on my account (with my supervision, of course :P). They like the endgame areas with all the cool monsters, especially in Nightfall, but they're not quite skilled enough to win there.

Still, it's a HELL of a lot of work to implement, and as upier noted, there are so many real problems already in the game that could use a fix.
I'm not so sure it would be a hell of a lot of work. I'm not saying it would be easy to impliment but I believe the majority of the hard work was done with the introduction of hard mode.

When GW had only one mode, it was a serious amount of work to find every gameplay mechanic that would have to be tweaked to make hard mode a reality, but now that they've discovered what had to be changed to make a hard mode, you just go in the opposite direction for an easy mode.

I'm still not sure if it's necessary, but, while not a nothing addition, I do think it would be realistically do-able.

Master Sword Keeper

Master Sword Keeper

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

Dead Isle

Farmers Of Woe [FoW]

W/

okay first: Everyone needs to show more respect, considering this a female possibly a women in her late 20's or early 30's.

2nd: The game has got a lot of hard areas. Torment for starters.
and third, go out with starter skills, hardly no money and no-one but your best friend. Yea the game's just got a whole deal harder hasnt it?

Yes I agree there are hard areas in Guild War's. Without the proper skills, AI, Non-competent humans. (Looks over to the American district) There are a lot of challenges that will have you going "STUPID !@#%$" made me die again.

But unfortunately there isnt an easier way to over-come every challenge and sorry to say Anet's difficulty rating is a fixed one. Once you get on further and further you'll learn the code and start killing more fast and effective, or finding a secret path to that outpost that was guarded by monsters. EG bone palace ( 4 cavaliers + sig of return = ewwww)

So yea, sorry that you are finding it tough. Just keep your head up and think hard, you'll get it!

Dimitri_Stucoff

Academy Page

Join Date: Dec 2006

After reading all 6 pages in this topic (I know that in itself is strange) here is my take on the topic of easy mode.

For this first part please activate your rage inhibitors and realize I am playing the devils advocate. So please do not take offense.

Honestly, I thought the game was easy enough as it was. There are only a few missions that really require another human (and more importantly their heros) to get masters in hard mode, let alone easy mode (edit: mean normal mode... get the two confused sometimes). I can only think of one missions that having another person is required for masters, eternal grove. Granted that, it does help to have someone else to help through arborstone and galya hatchery.

Given the above, I was able to complete all the missions in factions, and prophesies with henchies alone (granted this was before the advent of heros). After heros were introduced it seemed like easy mode all the way even in hard mode (except for ~5-8 missions/areas, Gate of Pain, Eternal Grove, etc.) The only real areas of difficulty are the elite areas, and that is simply because one is unable to use their trusty henchmen and have to find decent help. As for abbrevaitions, I can understand some confusion, I myself do not know every abbreviation, but, as for the really old ones (MM, SS, SB, Etc.) people take it as a given as they are known, as they have been around for years. As stated before, simply just raise your play style, if it is too hard odds are you are doing something to make it harder... with heros the game can practically play itself. The game is already filled with enough sub-par players who road on the coat tails of heros, henchmen, and whatever do-gooder that they happened to run across to advance in the game... one of the main reasons I almost always refuse to pug anymore.

Now that I have that bit done, feel free to dis-engage your rage inhibitors as I have finished with my more harsh part of this post.

I can see how this game can be difficult for the newer players, almost no skills (not playing skills, but skills the spells etc.), small amounts of money, knowledge in regards to the game, and friends inside the game.

Having a good libarary of skills is important in this skill. One might debate it is not, due to the limitation of 8 skills on the bar. However, due to the varying foes, environmental effects etc. it is often needed to tweek ones bar to compensate for a negative vice. Additionally, having the skills allows experimention and thusly one can improve their bars. If you have the money I would suggest gobbling up every skill you can for your primary profession. I would suggest getting the skills that look decent then getting the ones that do not look quite as good.

Again, money is pretty important in this game. True one can get most items cheaply, however, 1.5k here and there adds up. Just simply make sure you have max armor along with the proper inscriptions and runes for your chosen class. As for weapons, collector weapons are extremely good. I am still using a old collector weapon from chapter 1 that I got many a moon ago. Also, money is needed for skills, and the cost of said skills can really add up. I have spent something along the magnitude of a million gold and 1020 skill points on skills... on a single character. But it is really nice having a full pvp unlock as it aids in constructing good team builds, filling the unusual slot for a team, and finding skill synergy.

As with my rant on skills, knowledge of said skills is important. Knowing what works well with what other skills, etc. That and knowledge on missions helps. For instance, Jennor Hoard (Nightfall) is really easy if one knows the foes spawn every 2 minutes and have a stopwatch. As for the stronghold I myself had difficulty with it once. Granted I entered with my the wrong heros and with the wrong builds. A minion master really makes a difference there when one gets to the archer bit. Knowing how to beat something makes all the difference. Wiki can help with this matter however the biggest help is...

Your friends. Having good playing friend really makes a huge difference. 7/10 they make a better reference then wiki and to boot they might even be willing to help. I have helped many of my friends along with their missions, and often they remark how easy it was. (and from a leader point of view is it much easier to have a person who listens and can react intellegently instead of a henchmen... think of them as henchmen plus). Just remember one rule of thumb: Only one person can lead at a time, if more than one person tries to lead in battle, it often means instant death. As for the testiment for the usefulness of friends often when the guild I am in falls apart I will spend months guildless with little or no negative effects simply due to my friends on my friends list. As for getting these friends, unfortunatly about the only way is to survive the trails and tribulations of joining a pug and adding the better players you get along with to your list.

All and all I hope this exposition helps. Just keep in mind, death is not a bad thing, sometimes in this game, it is a matter of knowing where and when to die. Never give up never surrender.

EDIT: As for easy mode, I see no reason why not as long no exp, no drops, no dp, and no mission/quest completion is rewarded. As in, you get nothing for beating the mission, essentially, if your not testing a build your wasting your time. It would give some of these newer players the ability to scout the missions out before trying again. However, I do not see this as a very important thing to add so on the list of priority for anet should be low.