If all MMOs were subscription-free ....

Yes. Pirating is fun. I camp small ships, blast them, then steal any cargo. It's all well within the rules. I've had it done to me before.

Had a bounty on my head at one point. Being chased my merc's is funny, and quite difficult.

EVE isn't supposed to be balanced. EVE isn't for carebears who love balance. You either be a wolf, or get eaten by the wolves.

I'd probably play Diablo 2 again or World of Warcraft.

But I don't think I'll quit guild wars until GW2 comes out. I want to try fill out all my HoM's

Yeah, but unforunately, the writer's strike has put the concept on hold. I do hope it doesn't just get canned, since it sounded like a pretty interesting concept, and anything by Joss Whedon has got to be good. The only thing I am unsure of is that he's working with Fox again, and I'm worried they'll screw with the show, just like they did with Firefly (played episodes in the wrong order, aired it in one of the least popular time slots, had almost no advertising for the show).

I find it interesting that a small subscription would prevent someone from playing a game. The majority of mmo subscriptions are around 15ish dollars a month. I hate to come off as total jerk here but if you can't afford 15 dollars a month then you have some serious issues. You probably should be avoiding video games. If you are struggling to get by, how will you get by when, you get in a car crash? Get injured? Get laid off? Get fired? Etc.

As for me, I would keep playing what I currently play Guild Wars, World of Warcraft, EVE, and soon Warhammer. Subscriptions don't really influence my decision. If you enjoy the game, then you will obviously play it. MMOs and video games in general are cheap entertainment. Look at movies they cost 10 dollars for 2 hours of entertainment. I have gotten thousands of dollars of entertainment value out of my games. I have over 3,000 hours in Guild Wars alone. I have over 2,000 hours in World of Warcraft. I don’t feel like number crunching right now, but when I did my total cost per hour of video game entertainment was like one hundredth of a penny, which is pretty cheap in my opinion.

Myself, and I'm sure many others, would have no trouble paying for a subscription (although I go to uni and only work a handful of hours a week, so it would definitely cut down on my already limited social life. Damn my friends having full time jobs, and therefore are only free a couple days a week). It's the principle of it. I refuse to pay rent on a game I've already bought. If I didn't have to buy the game in the first place, I might consider paying for a subscription if it is really good.

You have to consider that subscriptions give the company additional revenue, which leds to a bigger budget, which leds to better servers, support, and more content updates. Guild Wars is an enjoyable game, but I feel that their business model limited them. They lack the funding to expand the Guild Wars franchise due to finical constraints. Guild Wars disappoints me in the content section as well, there is only so many times one can do a dungeon and handbooks.

I think a subscription sets certain expectations about a game. If you're paying each month, then you expect something for your money. If I pay the $40 or $50 for a game, then I'm satisfied if I get a month or 2 of enjoyment out of it. So GW has been quite a value for me.

The problem i have w/ subs is not that I have to pay them, but that the fact that they exist makes me feel obligated to play as much as I can, otherwise I feel like I'm throwing the sub away. As such, I get bored of the game more quickly, and end up moving onto something else. On the other side of the coin, have no fee to play gives me an incentive to try as many different fee-free games as possible.

As long as I'm having fun, then it doesn't matter if there's a fee to play or not, but I don't think having or not having a fee determines if I'll play. Having a fee or not will be a deciding factor if the game is ok, but not great, or what my alternatives are.

Aren't they making a starcraft MMO now?

Yes. But, the Koreans will pwn your ass

Rumor has it that a starcraft mmo is Blizzard's next gen mmo that they are currently hiring for. Go check it out on their website under jobs.

In all fairness, there really are no good quality MMO's out right now besides WoW and GW. I probaly would still be playing GW even without fees.

My friend loves EVE. He tried to get me to play it with him so many times. I even tried a trial account. He likes it because he thinks it makes him seem smart. What a wierd reason. Its way to slow for me. Not nearly enough action. The skill process i like though. Being able to develope skills and talents in real time is a great feature.

Looking forward to Age of Conan and Aion. Not going to overhype myself on AoC though. I learned my lesson twice last year with the dissappointments of GWEN and Hellgate. arghhh

Lies, it's Diablo 3.

This is my philosophy as well. I refuse to pay RENT on a game I already bought and have the publishers tell me I don't own any rights to the game. Hell, I don't even own my own characters if you read the EULA carefully. All you own when you pay that $50 bucks is a license to play the damn game and I think that's rather silly when you addon $15 a month as well.

Nope, there's no game that's worth $15 a month besides its initial cost. You're paying for a fantasy looking AOL actually. The ability to chat and play with others online. You realize how many games are FREE that you can do this very same thing? Diablo2, Neverwinter Nights 1 and 2 to name a couple. And there's even more indies out there that offer up the same stuff these WOW and EQ games offer up except for the graphics. Is it worth $15 a month to pay to play for some graphics? lol Not for this cat.

People who think these online games only cost pennies per hour aren't adding in all the costs of external hardware, electricity, cable bills, internal hardware, wear and tear on your eyes, body, furniture (computer desk, chair) haha They look at one thing the cost of the game an/or the monthly fee and that's it. Obviously they have no economics or accounting 101 sense of mind.

And as I said, I have no problem with paying a subscription if I don't have to buy the game first. If the game is worth it, then I'd be happy to pay $10-15 a month to play it. Sure, I prefer other business models, like the one that I suspect GW2 will adopt (that you pay once for the game, and have the option to pay for small upgrades that are similar to the BMP). This way, I actually feel like I'm getting my money's worth, since I'm paying for actual content (on a subscription-based system, you won't get new content every month).

I understand that company's have to earn money to pay for maintenance and keep the servers running. I just don't agree that charging a subscription is the best way to do it. To me, a company that releases a game with a subscription-based payment method, as well as an initial charge for the game itself, is just hungry for money, and nothing else. I don't believe for a second that WoW needs as much money as it gets to run. I also don't believe that Blizzard produced WoW for any reason other than the money they would make off it.

I look at Anet, and what they tried to do with GW, and I see a company that actually wants to produce I game that will be truly enjoyable, while proving that the subscription-based model isn't the only way to go. I look at Blizzard, and I see them wanting to keep their subscribers happy and/or grinding away their lives simply so they can keep raking in money. I know which company I would choose, and have chosen, to support.

Which is why I have hope for the industry when I see new business models emerging. Ones that try to cater to all individuals. Such as Hellgate: London and Sword of the New World, both of which offers free play, but you can choose to subscribe to get more content. I'm looking forward to GW2, since I am quite happy to pay a one off fee for additional content. If they can keep releasing these upgrades once a month or every couple of months, then they'll be doing quite well for themselves (assuming GW2 is a success, and gets enough players).

The only thing WoW has going for it, in terms of its business model (nothing to do with its game content) is that the Warcraft brand is so widely known. Gamers who are just introducing themselves to MMOs will see WoW and recognice the title, and that's what will influence them to pick it up. But once a player is introduced to the market, and can start identifying other titles that offer a better business model for similar content, at least some will switch to that. It used to be that there was little else on the market that offered as much as WoW did (it is a very large game world) for the subscription-based model. Maybe soon we'll see an MMO that will offer as much content, but with a better payment system.

Feel free to disagree with anything I have said. I am in no way an expert in MMO business models, so please enlighten me.

Ive tried wow and lotro and both are really good. The grind is the exact same thing in GW, except in GW you dont level from killing things again and again so people view it as not being grind - lol. I stopped playing wow for lotro because it was too outdated, and I will move onto AoC when it gets released.

If all the other MMO's were free too, I can't help but think GW would be a better game for not having attracted grind monkeys.

I'd still be here.

Probably EVE. I know some people that play it, and I'd consider it as well, if it weren't so darned expensive.

Well, that and I really shouldn't, because MMOs eat too much time if you play too many.

As it is I occasionally play (I know it's old) Diablo 2 instead, since GW doesn't have a lot of things I still want to do.

I came across a couple of other MMOs in development, one sounds like it's "kinda, sorta" based on (according to some) the horror novel "The Ring" called The Secret World and another that has a James Bond/Secret Agent kind of spin called The Agency.

Both look interesting to me, although I'm guessing 2009 on either one of them, from the sound of it... . It's hard to imagine all of these subscription-based games trying to coexist and survive financially, but maybe there is enough money to go around .... just not mine, however.

Once again, just want to say I have no objections to paying a monthly fee if a game is worth it, it's more that I think very few are. Moreover, if you have kids (like I do) and want a couple of accounts -- or if you are a very casual player -- monthly fees work strongly against you, in terms of value.

I finally did renew my kids' account for City of Heroes/Villains, but I find that game pretty dull. (My kids seem to enjoy it, however).

If there were no fees, I'd probably check out LotRO, but WoW is not an option: I tried it, and the turn-of-the-century graphics hurts my eyes. Yeah, I know it's shallow of me, but ugly graphics just makes it impossible for me to play WoW.

No other present MMO really tickles my fancy either. I tried EVE, and jeez! what a boring game. The combat model literally is "click on enemy and watch the autocombat". If combat had been like in, say, Elite, then I'd have been interested, but as it is it basically is a trade simulator.

Age of Conan might be something. I'll definitely check it out when it nears release.

As for GW2... I don't know. I don't like where GW is going at the moment (see my avatar), and the more I hear about GW2 the more I think it's going to be exactly what I don't want. Well, I'll check it out when it nears release too, I guess.

Buisnesses try to make money, that is the only goal.if W.O.W. only made as much as it needs to upgrade and maintain, it would be out of business already.

Bingo! I'd have no problem paying the subscription fees IF I could still play for hours on end as I was able to when I first started with GW almost 3 years ago... But time, and life obligations, have made it so that I can't. I do enjoy jumping on for an hour or two for a mission or dungeon or what have you, but I don't feel obligated to play because I'm not paying. I'm sure many people are fine with the concept of paying and not playing often, and that's cool, just not me

SOOOOO I'll keep doing what I do now.... play GW for a few months (sometimes like an addict ) then get bored and "take a break" for a month or two, logging in just to say hi and check on friends. Then, when I come back, I'm interested again

i myself am waiting for star trek the mmorpg due hopefully year end.
if starwars galaxies was free i'd be there inna heartbeat tried it at my moms couple years ago.

Don't get your hopes up too much over the Star Trek MMO. It's had a rough development cycle and it will be a miracle if it's decent when it finally comes out.

LotRO was pretty decent, but it honestly struck me as a much smaller version of WoW with updated graphics but poorer art direction. "Kill 10 vengeful boars" or "Collect 10 brutal boar tusks" for 15 levels didn't do it for me.

My problem with monthly fees is that I can't always play very much. Some busy months I get 5-10 hours of total game time. That for 15 bucks seems like a waste. It's not Blizzard's fault. I'm just too busy to make it seem like a good deal. If WoW had a pay-by-the-hour approach up to 15 dollars for a month, I might consider going back. I'm sure they would lose huge dollars switching to a system like that because many, many players hardly play at all.

I'll probably just keep playing GW until #2 comes along. I'll sprinkle in the occasional Orange Box, BioShock, Sins of the Solar Empire until that time.

If it has any required Grind I'll not touch it. GW seems to be the only one that even has a clue how a game should and should NOT be made.

I was thinking the Appalachian Trail MMO(T), grab a bunch of RL friends and and family start hiking it, a few days at a time.

With any other MMO you don't have these kinds of options to spend time with friends and family, you sell your soul to it, and sacrifice too much of your life.

Though I am interested in Age of Conan, lets just hope that Funcom does not make the same mistake they made with Anarchy Online (which is also a good game).

Only if you let it, that is.

Oh noes, everybody! Balan and Bryant in the same thread.

In any case, I think Guild Wars 2 will have a serious edge over most other MMOs with their subscription-free business model. It's a wonder (to me, anyway) how some of these pay-up-if-you-want-to-keep-playing MMOs survive.

For example, I tried EQ2 once on a free trial and thought that -- at best -- it was a poor relation to WoW. After playing EQ2 for several days, I just could not imagine buying it, let alone paying a monthly fee to play it, though, of course, many people do.

I, too, am hopeful regarding the Star Trek MMO in concept, but my confidence in Perpetual is at a low ebb after they shelved the Gods and Heroes (ancient world/mythology-themed) MMO project which, in my opinion, had real promise (and henchies!!!).

I am really crossing my fingers for Warhammer: Age of Reckoning. Even though they have a hell of a lot of cheesy-as-*#%^ promos, I'm a huge fan of the Warhammer universe.

...Of course, it's being watched by EA Mythic, so my hope isn't too high.

My chief misgiving about Warhammer is that it looks very PvP-oriented, which is not my thing at all. But they are saying it is "solo-friendly", so we'll see.

Of all the MMOs in production (and I am always on the lookout for new ones), the four make-or-break issues for me are:

(1) Subscription -- If it's there, it better be worth it!
(2) Soloability -- Grouping is fun as an option, but "let there be AI or scaling" as an alternative when you want to solo
(3) Decent story and/or a decent world/lore environment
(4) Combat style -- PvP and/or FPS are out, as far as I am concerned (I just don't like either one); GW1 and WoW both have good combat systems

What is so promising about GW2 (or at least what sets it apart from the rest of the MMO herd) is that I am fairly confident it will pass all four of my litmus tests within a single game.

In a market with (mainly) WoW as its chief competitor, GW1 has "lost"; but in a more hotly contested market with umpty-zillion new MMOs coming online over the next 6-12 months, I could see GW2 pulling past WoW.

Bryant is my favorite Debate Buddy. And WoWs greatest most Epic champion on these forums. No arm is stronger, nor Armor thicker than Bryant's Epic love of WoW.

I know and wholeheartedly agree. I keep expecting you guys to resolve the one great question of the Modern Age -- which is better, WoW or GW? It's like watching Mothra and Godzilla go at it (while the city gets mashed to a pulp and people run screaming in every direction). I love it!

(Of course, we all know GW's far superior... but shhhhh... the GW/WoW debate is just too much fun. ).

Both excel amazingly at what they aim for. Probably the most notable part of GW's development system is the lack of skill trees (like in Diablo 2): Yes, they're cool in WoW, but goddam they're getting old. I don't recall a single new MMO that does not use a skill tree system.

It would be GW. I could play wow for free right now on a friends account but the amount of suckage involved with playing that game is monumental.

Seriously WoW, 1998 wants you back.

GW is not much better but at least I can strategize and always think of new builds and not grind respawning mobs until my eyes popped for one silly quest.

Well in the end fee doesn't matter for some people.
Sure i can play WoW FFXI or whatever has a fee but i refuse to buy a game for 40/50 euro's and ontop of that pay a tax ea month of 15/20 euro's

GW has cost me 150 euro's ATM if i played WoW for the same time i played GW i would be broke ATM and trust me a friend of mine has big money prob course of WoW ATM.

I would be playing wow right now.
But I am glad I am not cause I will probably be addicted =p
its hard to not log onto GW already... so yah.

i wish wow was free, had map travel and less noobs.

eve is fun if you like putting mounds of time in

tabula rasa is the best mmo ive ever played since i like the cartoony graphics and weapons

gw is boring after a year

wow had its moments

only play TR for 3 days but still insanely fun to bad it costs a bunch which i dont wanna pay

I have played WoW and got to lvl42, for me it was very time consuming & I felt GW was more, friendly? In my opinion I'd play GW alot more than any other MMO, the subscription fee is annoying with other games, that's just one reason why I prefer GW over WoW, LOTRO etc.

i'd probably not be as bored of GW if i hadn't made the switch from GW --> WoW before Factions came out.
I look back on it and when i stopped GW, i stopped because I was crappy and didn't know how to play and no one wanted to teach me... but if i had just stuck it out and finished the game, then tried to fix my playing, I could of had fun. Then would have made the transition over to Cantha and had more fun there...
But I went to WoW, and had my life sucked away for 1.5 years.
I then came back right before EotN, and regret my 1.5 years of WoW fully.
I would of probably had fun making all those friends and living the transition experience if I was there for it.

anyways. WoW is a good game, imho. Yeah my server had idiots, but all games/servers do. I've heard LOTRO is crappy because it takes 5 minutes to get to a place that took 4 days in the movie/books.

Well, I started out playing WoW when it first came out, and then bought Prophecies and played both simultaneously. I ended up playing World of Warcraft longer because of the non-linear storyline, better lore, and to me better community. I stopped playing Guild Wars 3 months into getting it and I stopped playing WoW 18 months after getting it. I am not a hardcore raider so when WoW required me to spend hours at a time on raiding. I left it.

Over the past year though I went back to WoW, because of the Burning Crusade and the fact that I could be a Shaman on the Alliance side. I played my Shaman to Lvl 70 and 4 months later I got bored as hell of the game again and I went to a whole bunch of other MMO's.

First was LotRO, and Initially I liked it but the gameplay got so boring. I played as a Hunter and as a Champion and got both characters up to level 30 and then just lost interest.

I did Beta for Tabula Rasa, and I liked the concept but it was too much like a FPS for me to really get hardcore into it.

Then I bought Nightfall and let me say I love Nightfalls. Whatever I hated about Proph, I ended up loving about Nightfalls. Being able to Customize my Henhies (Heroes) and the storyline really intriguing me. (Thought the jump from Charr, to White Mantle, to Ascension, was really not too well developed for me in Prop). Also The two new classes The Derv and the Paragon to me are a ton of fun to play.

The point being is that if you are a hardcore gamer, what I would do for the time being is play WoW, or wait until April or May for Warhammer Online (which to me looks to be a REALLY fun game)

I for one have tried the MMOs out just now like .9dragons,2moons 12sky,sihala lost chaos ect ect free to the extent that hit say level 40 and its 0.05 per kill..buy coins to progress your char..so def not free any of them.

double exp they cry lol so it means 0.1 per kill geeze

I think G/W has been the best MMo I have played and that inc wow just in case someone cries wolf.

These guys not only have forthought by giving you a game no catch in game ..buy game and play casual or whatever

Grind will ensure some guys who wish titles can get what they wish for if they so wish.

So dont say if all were free plenty out there if you look for free online games.

For myself personally as everyone is different (what people forget)suits some not all.

I will puchase gw2 asap as soon as it becomes pre order as the Team are not only looking at future but all the market and deciding gameplay /cost/production ..retail end cost.

As some have missed the statements where they think servers will close ..not so it has been stated as long as people play gw1 the servers will not close.

So keep up the good work Anet, Btw mission pack is cool also

If all the MMORPGS were free all of a sudden, I'd probably still play Guild Wars, I'd spend most of my time in WoW (even if its cartoonish) and I'll be one hell of a pwner on LOTRO.