I didn't want to hijack Mallybum's thread but I note with interest the number of people enjoying a stable Vista 64 installation. On Vista's release, it was taken as read that the 64bit version was pointless for gaming, due to its refusal to allow unsigned drivers and general incompatability.
This situation seems to have been resolved and thus leads to my question: Is Vista64 now a superior alternative to the 32bit version for gaming purposes?
The main advantage to my eyes would seem to be the vastly improved memory access. I want to use all my memory, not just 3-and-a-bit gigs.
All input on this issue gratefully received.
64bit Vista and gaming in general
Snograt
Numa Pompilius
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Originally Posted by Snograt
This situation seems to have been resolved and thus leads to my question: Is Vista64 now a superior alternative to the 32bit version for gaming purposes?
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If you've got new and reasonably mainstream hardware and is willing to risk losing the ability to run some older non-cracked games, then I'd say go for it.
Snograt
Thanks, Numa - speedy response and just what I wanted to hear. Q6700 and a pair of 8800GTX and I've always steered clear of 
Starforce
Argh - except Dreamfall. Had enough problems getting that to run on Vista32. Ah well, sacrifices must be made.
Starforce Argh - except Dreamfall. Had enough problems getting that to run on Vista32. Ah well, sacrifices must be made.
Pleikki
I use 64 and i like it for MMo and racing just not for Frag games.
The Way Out
I still prefer XP 64 bit over Vista 64 bit, however, there are a lot more drivers for Vista 64. Going 64 bit is a good decision. Just do your homework and ensure that you have all the appropriate driver you will need.
Snograt
Is in situ upgrading from 32 to 64 a straightforward and viable option, or is (eek) reformatting and clean install the way to go?
The Way Out
reformat and clean install
Alex Dimitri
Had some issues with Vista64 Ultimate, and memory modules (P35 chipset) whenever i put 4 modules everything goes to hell specialy gaming !!!
When they are 3 modules in (1gb modules) everything works like a charm !!!
Done all updates bios and motherboard drivers, updates for Vista nothing helps not even different brand modules.
Gaming is ok in GW i have just screen black for a second before entering an area everything else works fine!
And yeah FPS games are still much slower on Vista !
When they are 3 modules in (1gb modules) everything works like a charm !!!
Done all updates bios and motherboard drivers, updates for Vista nothing helps not even different brand modules.
Gaming is ok in GW i have just screen black for a second before entering an area everything else works fine!
And yeah FPS games are still much slower on Vista !
The Way Out
Guild wars doesn't run in 64 bit mode. It runs in a 32 bit emulation mode under 64 bit.
Snograt
Thanks, guys 
h9dlb
I not had any probs with vista 64 ultimate which Ive had since day of release. I find it is faster and crashes less often than XP, and is generally far better.
Never had any problems getting drivers either, but in any event, you can set compatibilty so it emulates XP
I could never go back
Never had any problems getting drivers either, but in any event, you can set compatibilty so it emulates XP
I could never go back
The Way Out
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Originally Posted by h9dlb
I not had any probs with vista 64 ultimate which Ive had since day of release. I find it is faster and crashes less often than XP, and is generally far better.
Never had any problems getting drivers either, but in any event, you can set compatibilty so it emulates XP I could never go back |
Right now, I am testing out Vista Service Pack 1 to see if they have improved their gaming support (which they promised). So far, so good, however, XP still runs games better with less crashes.
Snograt
Heh, will the official release candidate of Vista SP1 beat Windows 7 to the press? Seems like Vista's gonna have a pretty short life.
Think I'm set on getting 64bit now - just bought me some memory.
Ballistix Tracer 240-pin DIMM (with LEDs) DDR2 PC2-6400 • 4-4-4-12 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR2-800 • 2.2V • 256Meg x 64
...8 gigs of that. Used the Crucial memory configurator widget, so I know it's compatible with my nForce 680i SLI
Think I'm set on getting 64bit now - just bought me some memory.
Ballistix Tracer 240-pin DIMM (with LEDs) DDR2 PC2-6400 • 4-4-4-12 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR2-800 • 2.2V • 256Meg x 64
...8 gigs of that. Used the Crucial memory configurator widget, so I know it's compatible with my nForce 680i SLI
The Way Out
/Agreed
I am not investing too much of my time in Vista. It sucks that I have to support it here at work... figures
I am not investing too much of my time in Vista. It sucks that I have to support it here at work... figures
Snograt
Hehe - you posted while I was editing ^_^
Matters not, I'll go with what's the best now, then see what Windows 7 has to offer (looks like they're delaying it until at least 2010 to sell as many Vistas as they can! 2010 is a delay? oO)
Matters not, I'll go with what's the best now, then see what Windows 7 has to offer (looks like they're delaying it until at least 2010 to sell as many Vistas as they can! 2010 is a delay? oO)
Admael
I was in the same situation. I had Vista32, and 4 gigs of RAM, this was half a year ago.
I've upgraded since then to Vista64 and never looked back. I don't think I've noticed any differences, which could be good or bad, when it comes to performance/compatibility.
The only game I play that has full 64-bit support, is Crysis.
I've upgraded since then to Vista64 and never looked back. I don't think I've noticed any differences, which could be good or bad, when it comes to performance/compatibility.
The only game I play that has full 64-bit support, is Crysis.
Snograt
The main reason for me is the proper memory addressing. When more games/apps support 64bit, that will be a bonus. I just wants big memories
The Way Out
anything above four gigs is really lost in games. Unless you are running multiple game clients, which I do. However, most people don't run multiple accounts on the same system.
Snograt
GWx2 count? 
Anyhoo, I'm now seriously confused about the whole 64bit Vista thing. Are 64bit and 32bit Vista separate products, or does the one disc contain both versions?
I have the upgrade version of Vista Home Premium - will this contain a 64 bit version, or will I have to start from scratch and buy a whole new, extortionately overpriced Vista installation?
Anyhoo, I'm now seriously confused about the whole 64bit Vista thing. Are 64bit and 32bit Vista separate products, or does the one disc contain both versions?
I have the upgrade version of Vista Home Premium - will this contain a 64 bit version, or will I have to start from scratch and buy a whole new, extortionately overpriced Vista installation?
Admael
I have Windows Vista Ultimate, the copy I have has 2 discs, one 32-bit version and one 64-bit version.
I like physical RAM as much as the next guy, but I can't turn virtual paging off and play Crysis, it screams for more memory: and I have 4 gigs, DDR2-1066, PC8500.
I like physical RAM as much as the next guy, but I can't turn virtual paging off and play Crysis, it screams for more memory: and I have 4 gigs, DDR2-1066, PC8500.
The Way Out
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Originally Posted by Snograt
GWx2 count?
Anyhoo, I'm now seriously confused about the whole 64bit Vista thing. Are 64bit and 32bit Vista separate products, or does the one disc contain both versions? I have the upgrade version of Vista Home Premium - will this contain a 64 bit version, or will I have to start from scratch and buy a whole new, extortionately overpriced Vista installation? |
There are a few things I do not like about 64 bit...
One, unless the driver is digitally signed, the kernel will refuse it.
Most 32 bit drivers are not supported.
Lack of driver support.
Conclusion for me...
Most people have 64 bit hardware, however, have no need for an upgrade to a 64 bit operating system.
Last, Crysis doens't require more than 4GB of memory. You should never disable virtual memory, also. There is no need to. SATA drives are great for fast reading a writing bursts.
Snograt
Actually, I looked into it. You can upgrade a 32 bit install to a 64 bit, but only if you bought a retail box. I got an OEM upgrade, so I'm S.O.L. (See Windows Vista Alternate Media if you fancy 64bits of potential improvement). Oh, and yes - definitely a clean install. You need to boot from the Vista DVD as the 64 bit installation program won't run on a 32 bit system. Seems logical
The price for a Vista retail box is still ludicrous - £346.98, equivalent to US$700.
The price for a Vista retail box is still ludicrous - £346.98, equivalent to US$700.
Brianna
I was thinking of buying a new HDD and installing a 64 bit of Vista on it, but I've noticed a few things.
Firstly that it's new, and has lots of problems with games, undesirable for me.
Secondly I'm hearing about the new ''Windows'' coming out in 2010 or later?
That is very soon for a new operating system to be coming out, we had XP for at least 6 years? (Don't know exactly) but none the less, a long time.
Kind of turns me off of getting Vista, and I don't want an O.E.M Pack, I want to be able to reinstall it on a new rig if need be.
Choices..
Firstly that it's new, and has lots of problems with games, undesirable for me.
Secondly I'm hearing about the new ''Windows'' coming out in 2010 or later?
That is very soon for a new operating system to be coming out, we had XP for at least 6 years? (Don't know exactly) but none the less, a long time.
Kind of turns me off of getting Vista, and I don't want an O.E.M Pack, I want to be able to reinstall it on a new rig if need be.
Choices..
Snograt
One final thing, then I PROMISE I'll leave you alone
My rig has 2 non-RAIDed 500GB HDDs. Would there be any advantage in dual-booting the 2 versions of Vista? (And if so, is it even possible!)
Thank you, oh wise ones.
My rig has 2 non-RAIDed 500GB HDDs. Would there be any advantage in dual-booting the 2 versions of Vista? (And if so, is it even possible!)
Thank you, oh wise ones.
The Way Out
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Originally Posted by Snograt
One final thing, then I PROMISE I'll leave you alone
My rig has 2 non-RAIDed 500GB HDDs. Would there be any advantage in dual-booting the 2 versions of Vista? (And if so, is it even possible!) Thank you, oh wise ones. |
Admael
700 USD are you serious. I got mine for 450 USD.
Dual booting on different hard drives is a bit trickier, but I don't see any real advantage. The OS itself takes up a whopping 15 gigs, I wouldn't do it.
Just setup the version you'd like to try on one of the drives, and if you don't like how it goes, backup the data to your other drive, wipe it, then install the version you want. When it comes to Windows, there's no better precaution than a clean format.
Dual booting on different hard drives is a bit trickier, but I don't see any real advantage. The OS itself takes up a whopping 15 gigs, I wouldn't do it.
Just setup the version you'd like to try on one of the drives, and if you don't like how it goes, backup the data to your other drive, wipe it, then install the version you want. When it comes to Windows, there's no better precaution than a clean format.
llsektorll
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Snograt
Actually, I looked into it. You can upgrade a 32 bit install to a 64 bit, but only if you bought a retail box. I got an OEM upgrade, so I'm S.O.L. (See Windows Vista Alternate Media if you fancy 64bits of potential improvement). Oh, and yes - definitely a clean install. You need to boot from the Vista DVD as the 64 bit installation program won't run on a 32 bit system. Seems logical
The price for a Vista retail box is still ludicrous - £346.98, equivalent to US$700. |
Admael
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Brianna
I was thinking of buying a new HDD and installing a 64 bit of Vista on it, but I've noticed a few things.
Firstly that it's new, and has lots of problems with games, undesirable for me. Secondly I'm hearing about the new ''Windows'' coming out in 2010 or later? That is very soon for a new operating system to be coming out, we had XP for at least 6 years? (Don't know exactly) but none the less, a long time. Kind of turns me off of getting Vista, and I don't want an O.E.M Pack, I want to be able to reinstall it on a new rig if need be. Choices.. |
Brianna
Oh? Well hmm.. I was wondering why a 32bit OEM costs like 180$, sounded cheap compared to some other packs.. like the full box set, didn't know the difference.
Admael
OEM are usually sold in bulk to people who build systems, that's why they're so cheap. Theres no extra packaging like you would find in a "retail" version, just what you need to get your OS running.
Surena
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Originally Posted by Admael
OEM are usually sold in bulk to people who build systems, that's why they're so cheap. Theres no extra packaging like you would find in a "retail" version, just what you need to get your OS running.
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LoL,
people believe that Windows 7 is some extremely new uber-windows that blows everyone's mind while infact it's based on Vista and will not have less hardware requirements. The only advantage that really could mean a bit (and will be overglorified soon, just wait) is the modular system that allows you to "disconnect" anything that your system doesn't need, so your kernel in usage will be pretty slim.
Other than that I can recommend Vista 64 SP1 for gaming unless you truly need EAX via DirectSound. EAX via OpenAL works under Vista.
Don't debate Crysis, it's just above today's GPU power. Wait for the GT200 in June. That'll most likely be the first GPU that can handle it.
Brianna
People just use Crysis to see how good their comp is, It's not even a game anymore, It's just a testing program designed around a game.
And in that case, I might look into the 64bit OEM pack for a new HDD, probably a Raptor, but who knows.
I think I'm going to wait a while, I'm in no rush to set any of that stuff up.
And in that case, I might look into the 64bit OEM pack for a new HDD, probably a Raptor, but who knows.
I think I'm going to wait a while, I'm in no rush to set any of that stuff up.
The Way Out
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Brianna
People just use Crysis to see how good their comp is, It's not even a game anymore, It's just a testing program designed around a game.
And in that case, I might look into the 64bit OEM pack for a new HDD, probably a Raptor, but who knows. I think I'm going to wait a while, I'm in no rush to set any of that stuff up. |
Also, 10k rpm is the way to go... anything else is painful...
Surena
HDDs suffer from very bad access times not transfer speed and while Raptors might seem nice, they lose (epicly) against SSDs which hopefully see more and more land. I would get a Raptor only for its access speed, not for anything else.
Saying that anything else below 10k RPM is painful is pretty epic fail.
Saying that anything else below 10k RPM is painful is pretty epic fail.
Admael
Striped raid terabytes > Raptors
For awhile I had striped raid Raptors, but one of them broke, now I'm just running Raptor and mirror raid terabytes.
SSD is in a totally different class than a Raptor, plus imagine the small fortune you'd have to pay to get a SSD with the capacity of a 150GB Raptor.
Anything below the 15k RPM Cheetahs are epic fail! rawr
For awhile I had striped raid Raptors, but one of them broke, now I'm just running Raptor and mirror raid terabytes.
SSD is in a totally different class than a Raptor, plus imagine the small fortune you'd have to pay to get a SSD with the capacity of a 150GB Raptor.
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Originally Posted by Surena
Saying that anything else below 10k RPM is painful is pretty epic fail. |
Brianna
Well, we high-jacked this one.
At the moment I have a 7,200RPM Sata drive, but figured that a Raptor would be better for Vista's needs, guess it doesn't need it, but maybe help some.
Either way O.E.M it is then I guess.
At the moment I have a 7,200RPM Sata drive, but figured that a Raptor would be better for Vista's needs, guess it doesn't need it, but maybe help some.
Either way O.E.M it is then I guess.
Pasha the Mighty
not so much vista's needs as your needs... it will speed up your comp because your program files will be accessed faster. imho, your pc would profit more from a new cpu, or memory with a faster mhz count.
BTW, this is totally off topic, and I have absolutely no experience with 64bit os's
BTW, this is totally off topic, and I have absolutely no experience with 64bit os's
Admael
I think it's cheaper to stripe raid (2) 500GB Seagate 32MB cache drives than to have one or Raptors at 150GB (or even worse 74GB, 300GB Raptors are too expensive for me, and I own a QX9650)
EDIT: There is no 300GB Raptors, I was mistaken for 300GB Cheetahs.
EDIT: There is no 300GB Raptors, I was mistaken for 300GB Cheetahs.
Snograt
I always think of them as 300GB Raptors, cos you always buy a pair to stripe ^^
Go the whole hog - get four for a stripy mirror 0+1
Feel free to hijack this thread - it's always interesting to see diverse opinions on tech toys
By the way - DAMN IT! I got my Vista Ult from Amazon (purely because they do next day delivery)> I deliberately steered clear of the OEMs cos I thought "better not, I'm not a system builder".
Idiot :/
Go the whole hog - get four for a stripy mirror 0+1
Feel free to hijack this thread - it's always interesting to see diverse opinions on tech toys
By the way - DAMN IT! I got my Vista Ult from Amazon (purely because they do next day delivery)> I deliberately steered clear of the OEMs cos I thought "better not, I'm not a system builder".
Idiot :/
Admael
The only OEM I buy is hard drives and CPUs. Everything else is retail.
4 Raptors... I prefer terabytes, I have lots of stuff to store. The newer TBs from Seagate are pretty impressive.
4 Raptors... I prefer terabytes, I have lots of stuff to store. The newer TBs from Seagate are pretty impressive.