i agree with most people, the requirements for the luxon/kurzick titles are just a bit much. millions of faction points to max?
Millions. yeah. millions. wait did i mention its millionssss?
it is unreasonable to have to spend mindless hours of HFFF to get these points.
Increasing Faction gained by methods other than HFFF
Carboplatin
Arduin
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Originally Posted by Ayelet Feldspar
I can't believe you would even offer that link here -- or that the moderators would allow it to stay... How idiotic.
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Hugh Manatee
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Originally Posted by Drop of Fear
lawl i did it
 14k luxon points / hour = 28k in the title / hour.it's already as fast as fff if you know what to do and where if go fast and without wasting time, it's 260-270 hours for saviour of the kurzicks and little longer for luxon, around 300 |
Esan
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
wherebouts is this magical faction generating place?
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Shakkara
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Originally Posted by cgruber
They should nerf the HFF faction farming and add points for killing stuff like eotn.
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Fates
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Originally Posted by Drop of Fear
lawl i did it
14k luxon points / hour = 28k in the title / hour.it's already as fast as fff if you know what to do and where if go fast and without wasting time, it's 260-270 hours for saviour of the kurzicks and little longer for luxon, around 300 |
10,000,000 divided by 28k per hour is almost 360 hours, not 260 hours.
Esan
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Originally Posted by Fates Monk
Your math is a little off.
10,000,000 divided by 28k per hour is almost 360 hours, not 260 hours. |
Another Felldspar
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Originally Posted by Esan
First of all, 28k of collected faction per hour is not sustainable (unless you use a bot, in which case, please die now). Second, at that rate it would be 56k per hour because you get two points per faction donated to your alliance. Lastly, (and this is addressed to the general public) don't believe a word anyone says about HFFF unless you try it yourself; people lie about farming rates all the time. I have yet to meet the mythical honest farmer.
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Fates
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Originally Posted by Ayelet Feldspar
Actually, he had claimed 14k of faction per hour and translated that to 28k toward the allegience title by donating faction -- so the doubling was already done. I still doubt that 14k of faction per hour is sustainable, at least for more than an hour or two. But, even if it is, think about 360 hours of setting flags for heroes. Hell, I don't like doing that hero training thing in NF even once -- I can't imagine flagging heroes for 360 hours.
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Racthoh
Give us the blessings in The Deep and Urgoz's Warren, please.
Shayne Hawke
I wouldn't mind having some other ways of getting faction than HFFF.
Chthon
As someone suggested when the PVE-only skills first came out:
There's no need to make the title easier to grind or reduce the point threshholds. That's only going to tick off the grind monkeys who got their title maxed the hard way.
Instead, reduce the scale range on the PvE-skills. Let them scale from rank1 to max effect at rank3 or rank4. That way people who just want to have fun with a 5sec SY can do so with a minimal grind and title grinders can "enjoy" HFFF 10 million points if they want to. Everyone wins.
There's no need to make the title easier to grind or reduce the point threshholds. That's only going to tick off the grind monkeys who got their title maxed the hard way.
Instead, reduce the scale range on the PvE-skills. Let them scale from rank1 to max effect at rank3 or rank4. That way people who just want to have fun with a 5sec SY can do so with a minimal grind and title grinders can "enjoy" HFFF 10 million points if they want to. Everyone wins.
Phoenix Tears
imo people have to stop to take the whinery of the minority more important, than the useful suggestions of the majority, which would improve the overall gameplay and fun factor of the game and would make GW again to the funny game, it was, before the implemention of Factions, where it was regardless, with how many characters you simultanously play. >.>
Who the **** cares about, how much people have already done a shit the the hardway, when there exist possible ways to make the game more fun again for million other players, which will never work on those titles ect. because of their totally ridiculous and retarded concepts with too bad options to receive points for them, other then endless mindsucking grindfests of FFF/HFFF >.<
The Goal of Anet should be imo, to make the game finally again multi character friendly ASAP, not to make harccore gamers and posers 24/7 happy with such ridiculous gameplay concepts, hwich force players to concentrate only on playing 1 single character 24/7/365, just to have enough time for them to do all the things of GW ingame in a humanous amount of time effort and not within a half grindage of century >.<
Those 2 titles are not the only retarded concepts of Anet, which totally discourage players to play with more than only 1 character, since Factions, the game has become ever more and more full of shit, that discourages step by step more, to fully concentrate only on 1 main chara.
GW has become to a game, where the player has the feeling, that playing with other characters beneath the main chara is just only a WASTE OF TIME and that sux and it is absolutely not understandable, nor tolerateable in any way ,why Anet seems to be so blinded, that they never changed something on their shit gameplay concepts to make them better and to lead the game again to a point, where it made lots of fun to play with a big bunch of different characters !!!!
The only hope we have now is only, that hopefully LAZY-NET will make some drastically changes, after the release of GW2, because then there will not stand anymore the silly excuse in the immaginary room, that they can't do somethign, because devs are all working on GW2 -.-
Who the **** cares about, how much people have already done a shit the the hardway, when there exist possible ways to make the game more fun again for million other players, which will never work on those titles ect. because of their totally ridiculous and retarded concepts with too bad options to receive points for them, other then endless mindsucking grindfests of FFF/HFFF >.<
The Goal of Anet should be imo, to make the game finally again multi character friendly ASAP, not to make harccore gamers and posers 24/7 happy with such ridiculous gameplay concepts, hwich force players to concentrate only on playing 1 single character 24/7/365, just to have enough time for them to do all the things of GW ingame in a humanous amount of time effort and not within a half grindage of century >.<
Those 2 titles are not the only retarded concepts of Anet, which totally discourage players to play with more than only 1 character, since Factions, the game has become ever more and more full of shit, that discourages step by step more, to fully concentrate only on 1 main chara.
GW has become to a game, where the player has the feeling, that playing with other characters beneath the main chara is just only a WASTE OF TIME and that sux and it is absolutely not understandable, nor tolerateable in any way ,why Anet seems to be so blinded, that they never changed something on their shit gameplay concepts to make them better and to lead the game again to a point, where it made lots of fun to play with a big bunch of different characters !!!!
The only hope we have now is only, that hopefully LAZY-NET will make some drastically changes, after the release of GW2, because then there will not stand anymore the silly excuse in the immaginary room, that they can't do somethign, because devs are all working on GW2 -.-
kazjun
The problem is that it's a pvp title. Tied to pve skills. To scale it to pve would have the title too low and may get ABer's feeling that they aren't really getting any worthwhile reward since they've already maxed it. Like SS/LB. How many of you have gone back and done runs after you've maxed those titles? I certainly haven't. If that affects too many ABer's, they could lose players which is always bad for any form of pvp.
Course you could say that you should just play it for fun, and I agree. Anyone who pvp's does it for fun (and well, fame) since until recently, all balth was really good for was unlocks. And you don't even have a title for balth faction earned. But it has been like this from the start. ABer's from the start knew they got the extra benefit of faction they could use for numerous things, and changing it now could be pretty bad for AB.
Personally, I reckon that unless they uncouple the pve skills from a pvp title (which I don't reckon they'll ever do), there's not really much that can be done for this.
Course you could say that you should just play it for fun, and I agree. Anyone who pvp's does it for fun (and well, fame) since until recently, all balth was really good for was unlocks. And you don't even have a title for balth faction earned. But it has been like this from the start. ABer's from the start knew they got the extra benefit of faction they could use for numerous things, and changing it now could be pretty bad for AB.
Personally, I reckon that unless they uncouple the pve skills from a pvp title (which I don't reckon they'll ever do), there's not really much that can be done for this.
Another Felldspar
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Originally Posted by kazjun
The problem is that it's a pvp title. Tied to pve skills.
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I see your point about lowering the number of AB players that are participating for the sake of gaining faction, but I doubt that the people who enjoy AB would quit because they managed to top out a title track. Conversely the people who are doing repeatable quests (aka: HFFF) will definitely stop when they finish the title. The difference is that like all forms of PvP AB forces you to think and react in ways that PvE never will. People who want that will continue to play, even after the title is maxed. And Balthazar Faction continues to be awarded even after the allegience title is topped off, still providing a tangible reward to people that AB.
As a matter of fact I would venture a guess that most people who actually have the title, and who Ab'd to begin with, have won the Saviour track via HFFF but have continued to AB. Unlike the SS/LB farmers. The difference is fun. One is fun (at least to a large number of people), one is not. But, even if I am incredibly wrong and there are people that only AB for the sake of Allegience and would leave and never come back if they could just get the title maxed, then shouldn't there also be an end in sight for them? It should be possible to top the track using AB if that's how people choose to top it. It should be possible to top the track using Challenge Missions if that's how people choose to top it. That's the whole point of this thread. Not denying the possibility of repeatable quests but adding other possibities as well.
C'mon -- A-net sells fun. It's their business. This is not in any way an unreasonable request. Make it viable to win the title and still have fun.
MithranArkanere
Yeah. Getting a carrot is fun. Having a carrot you cannot reach tied in front of you is not.
All methods to get Faction should provide almost the same amount of points per hour, so you can choose based on what you like, not based on what is faster.
All methods to get Faction should provide almost the same amount of points per hour, so you can choose based on what you like, not based on what is faster.
nightwatchman
As I see it, AB should reward skill whereas the PVE quests rewards dedication.
Problem at minute is that even if you win in AB, you're not going to be getting faction faster than you can get via PVE.
ANet should balance it so that if you win at AB (or other competitive missions) you're gaining more per hour than HFFF; and only if you lose will you be gaining less.
Problem at minute is that even if you win in AB, you're not going to be getting faction faster than you can get via PVE.
ANet should balance it so that if you win at AB (or other competitive missions) you're gaining more per hour than HFFF; and only if you lose will you be gaining less.
Esan
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Originally Posted by Ayelet Feldspar
I still doubt that 14k of faction per hour is sustainable, at least for more than an hour or two.
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14k/h Luxon is simply impossible. The highest known rates (as determined by the [any] alliance that permaowns Cavalon) is about 12k/h in the Jade Arena from the Jade Quarry, and that particular run is not HFFF-able. I doubt vanquishing in the Jade Sea can beat this figure, though I would be delighted to be proven wrong using screenshots.
fenix
Sadly, I imagine the 'other methods' will be simply that you can now get blessings in Luxon/Kurzick zones. Yes, it's an easy way of doing it on Anet's behalf, but I imagine with all the GW2 developing...and lack of ANYTHING related to GW, they threw in something quick and easy.
Either way, you have to grind for weeks to get the titles, regardless of how you do it.
Either way, you have to grind for weeks to get the titles, regardless of how you do it.
Ajantis
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Originally Posted by Esan
14k/h Luxon is simply impossible.
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http://guildwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imag...ery_bosses.gif
hooray for HM boss bonuses? :]
Not in a luxon alliance but it's 25 kills (I think?) to get the full boss bonus and you got 5 bosses that are really close together.. Should be a hefty faction sum (yes yes I know, no screenshot prove, too lazy to try it out
)
Enko
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Originally Posted by Ajantis
Actually..
http://guildwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imag...ery_bosses.gif hooray for HM boss bonuses? :] Not in a luxon alliance but it's 25 kills (I think?) to get the full boss bonus and you got 5 bosses that are really close together.. Should be a hefty faction sum (yes yes I know, no screenshot prove, too lazy to try it out ) |
Esan
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Originally Posted by Enko
the mt qinkai quest (which is HFFFable) takes about 1:30-2:00
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MithranArkanere
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ajantis
Actually..
http://guildwars.wikia.com/wiki/Imag...ery_bosses.gif hooray for HM boss bonuses? :] Not in a luxon alliance but it's 25 kills (I think?) to get the full boss bonus and you got 5 bosses that are really close together.. Should be a hefty faction sum (yes yes I know, no screenshot prove, too lazy to try it out ) |
In Factions, with a max per character... let's say that we have 10 characters, one of each profession, which makes: 1,000,000 per character, you will NEVER get more than 250 per enemy in hard mode.
There's something wrong here, isn't it?
Drop of Fear
gyala hatchery hard mode: order is --> 3x4 outcasts, 5 outcasts and the 3 carps, 3 urukai then jump in the whyk group.
kill him fast, jaqui join the party just in time to be destroyed, lure mohby safely and kill him alone without wasting time with the multiple patrols. reeflaw arrives, kill him then head to soulwhisper...
killing the 3 remaining bosses is just a waste of time, not profitable enough, points wise...
with an essence of celerity each run, done properly it's 1750-1800 points / 6-7 minutes (around 50 foes + 1300 points from bosses -every boss gives 260pts not 250 u know it right?
-). once in a while reefclaw dies and u don't get points for killing him, henche the 14k / hour. if he never dies u can reach up to 16k / hour.
oh and ofc u open around 15 HM chest / hour and drop a couple elite tomes from bosses / hour.
done luxon saviour like that ^ and anyone who played with me knows that i don't like wasting time...
kill him fast, jaqui join the party just in time to be destroyed, lure mohby safely and kill him alone without wasting time with the multiple patrols. reeflaw arrives, kill him then head to soulwhisper...
killing the 3 remaining bosses is just a waste of time, not profitable enough, points wise...
with an essence of celerity each run, done properly it's 1750-1800 points / 6-7 minutes (around 50 foes + 1300 points from bosses -every boss gives 260pts not 250 u know it right?
oh and ofc u open around 15 HM chest / hour and drop a couple elite tomes from bosses / hour.
done luxon saviour like that ^ and anyone who played with me knows that i don't like wasting time...
Lycan Nibbler
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Originally Posted by Kalendraf
...as should be nearly all titles. In GW, there is no good reason for having nearly all of the titles be character specific. A few specific ones like cartographer and protector should be, but most of the others could be and should be account based (sweet tooth, party animal, drunkard, wisdom, treasure hunter, etc). This includes the EotN rep titles and the SS/LB ones from Nightfall. It already requires significant grind to max those titles on just 1 char, so there is no sense punishing players by making them have to repeat it for all their characters.
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Whats the point of having titles if you want them given to you anyway? Yes, the Kurz/Lux are hard and take work (Lux more than Kurz due to the Kurz HFF) but if you dont want to work for them, then you dont really want the title.
Lycan Nibbler
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Originally Posted by Racthoh
Give us the blessings in The Deep and Urgoz's Warren, please.
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Esan
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Originally Posted by Drop of Fear
with an essence of celerity each run
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cebalrai
Faction farming in AB isn't efficient at all due to long wait times - at least on the KUrz side.
Drop of Fear
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Originally Posted by Esan
At your claimed rate of 3.6k points per run, you'd have to have used 2778 essences of celerity. Most people don't have a spare 3000 skill points for consumables, so I find your claim a bit on the dubious side.
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u can
A- buy essences from other ppl(u pay them back with the drops during the runs)
B- do the runs with humans splitting the essences costs.
C- do the runs without essences as long as u're fine with trashing 10-15 minutes every hour of gameplay
Thierry2
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Originally Posted by Racthoh
Give us the blessings in The Deep and Urgoz's Warren, please.
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Another Felldspar
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Originally Posted by Miss Drops Az
Whats the point of having titles if you want them given to you anyway? Yes, the Kurz/Lux are hard and take work (Lux more than Kurz due to the Kurz HFF) but if you dont want to work for them, then you dont really want the title.
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MithranArkanere
Exactly.
Imagine a game where you get experience only in a single area.
Or items only in another (not certain items, all items)
There's nothing wrong with having to get stuff, but if it's too slow (like 1 year to get to the max level) or too repetitive (like having to stick to one single area to get the faster possible outcome) then great part of the fun is ruined.
If they fix the amount earned in any of the methods to be the same, and not be so slow, it would be much better.
One good way could be to add books to Factions.
Imagine a game where you get experience only in a single area.
Or items only in another (not certain items, all items)
There's nothing wrong with having to get stuff, but if it's too slow (like 1 year to get to the max level) or too repetitive (like having to stick to one single area to get the faster possible outcome) then great part of the fun is ruined.
If they fix the amount earned in any of the methods to be the same, and not be so slow, it would be much better.
One good way could be to add books to Factions.
Esan
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Originally Posted by Drop of Fear
[Yo]u can
A- buy essences from other ppl([yo]u pay them back with the drops during the runs) |
Quote:
| B- do the runs with humans splitting the essences costs. |
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| C- do the runs without essences as long as [yo]u're fine with trashing 10-15 minutes every hour of gameplay |
Anyeay, if you did it this way, good for you. Even though it is a pure grind title, it is an impressive achievement regardless of how you did it. I think Recall farming the Jade Arena quest or HFFFing the Scout the Coast quest might be better overall in terms of ease and time and money spent.
Kalendraf
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Originally Posted by Miss Drops Az
Whats the point of having titles if you want them given to you anyway? Yes, the Kurz/Lux are hard and take work (Lux more than Kurz due to the Kurz HFF) but if you dont want to work for them, then you dont really want the title.
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I find the effort required to max out those titles is already way too high, and grind-heavy. Compare it to the Luxon/Faction titles, and they are simply ludicrous. A game that is supposed to embrace casual gamers has epicly failed in regards to the Factions Allegiance titles.
Drop of Fear
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Originally Posted by Esan
At nearly 500g per, that's an expensive thing to be buying. You probably won't break even with drops, especially since repeatedly zoning and quick killing will have shot your drop rate to hell
Not HFFF, then. I don't think this run is popular enough to be able to get groups for it consistently in the Leviathan Pits. Not 14k/h, then. Anyeay, if you did it this way, good for you. Even though it is a pure grind title, it is an impressive achievement regardless of how you did it. I think Recall farming the Jade Arena quest or HFFFing the Scout the Coast quest might be better overall in terms of ease and time and money spent. |
i have to agree with the jade arena quest being more profitable and -if your group is well coordinated- faster then gyala. i was fed up of the endless 60 seconds grind so that wasnt an option for me.
this gyala run is still not a money trash. i've earned my luxon saviour with this run... usualy doing with 2 friends and our heroes, using my essences most of the times, earned more then enough to keep buying essences...
first time i think about it, but i can guarantee that anti-farming code or anything like that doesnt belong here.
does this run gets boring? sure as hell it's boring, i don't suggest anyone to do more then 25-30k / day like this. it took me approx 5 months 2 hours a day.
BladeDVD
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Originally Posted by Ayelet Feldspar
This is the mindset that I most want to argue against. I don't want to work for titles. This is a game -- it's supposed to be fun. I want to play for titles. I want to acquire titles by doing all of the things that come naturally while playing all aspects of the game. I want to vanquish, I want to play challenge missions, I want to AB, I want to play the storyline, I want to have fun -- and in the course of having that fun I want to earn a title. By playing. Not by working. I do plenty of work already.
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Not every title in the game was designed with your particular play style in mind, but you can get quite a few as it is.
What's wrong with that?
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I'd like the reputation titles in EoTN to be account wide, but can live with it as is I guess.
Treasure Hunter/Wisdom, yeah, that would really benefit. As it is I only ID golds on one of my ten characters and now my friend who bought his Wisdom title is giving me his golds to ID too and I'm only around 1400 on that.
The Kurz/Lux title needs a serious reworking of it's title levels. The first level should be like 25,000 or 50,000. 100,000 is nuts. I don't care too much how they scale beyond level 3 or so, but for people who don't like to do PVP, having to rack up 100,000 points in this title to get access to PVE skills is one of the few design decisions in the game that really upsets me.
Another Felldspar
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Originally Posted by BladeDVD
Not every title in the game was designed with your particular play style in mind, but you can get quite a few as it is. What's wrong with that? |
It isn't about play style unless you're calling repetitiously flagging heroes for months on end a play style. The Allegience Title track is in need of a change. It is not feasible to top it for a normal, casual player while it is in its current state. I've personally advocated that change to come about by increasing the number of points given for pursuits such as AB, Challenge Missions, Vanquishing, etc. and, since the former Community Representative had agreed to take up that battle, it seemed likely to me that if the track changes it will be changed in this way.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by BladeDVD
The Kurz/Lux title needs a serious reworking of it's title levels. The first level should be like 25,000 or 50,000. 100,000 is nuts. I don't care too much how they scale beyond level 3 or so, but for people who don't like to do PVP, having to rack up 100,000 points in this title to get access to PVE skills is one of the few design decisions in the game that really upsets me. |
CagedinSanity
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Originally Posted by Dr Strangelove
Personally, I just hit r6 Kurzick from nothing but AB and Fort Aspenwood. The r6 thing is nice, but isn't really why I was doing it. Believe it or not, I'm playing a video game to relax and have fun.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by BladeDVD
The Kurz/Lux title needs a serious reworking of it's title levels. The first level should be like 25,000 or 50,000. 100,000 is nuts. I don't care too much how they scale beyond level 3 or so, but for people who don't like to do PVP, having to rack up 100,000 points in this title to get access to PVE skills is one of the few design decisions in the game that really upsets me.
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So quit bitching.
Fear Me!
/notsigned. Comparing the work of gaining kurzick faction to HFFF is already a moot point; people always want what they want via the best means possible. When Factions came out, HFFF didn't exist, only FFF, with a doorman;this was prenerf amber, when it sold for over 2k a piece. Only two chapters require you to grind in order to advance the plot, that is Factions and Nightfall. At no other point in the game, are you required to grind. Even if you wish to grind faction to advance the plot, you can do that via repeatable quests, and AB. If you've chosen a town owning alliance however, then you've made your choice, no need to change the game to favor your choice of grinding. And if you just want to max your title, and not be a part of a town owning alliance, then you're in the same boat.
Shadowmoon
Kill Urgoz/Kanaxai in NM, 5k faction to all in party
Kill Urgoz/Kanaxai in HM, 10k faction to all in party
There you go, easy fix, and adds some decent players to get this higher than Hff in faction.
Edit:
Also allow people to donate faction to guilds they are guested to again, it is a pain to have to leave guild, join a new one just to donate, then leave and return to your old guild.
Kill Urgoz/Kanaxai in HM, 10k faction to all in party
There you go, easy fix, and adds some decent players to get this higher than Hff in faction.
Edit:
Also allow people to donate faction to guilds they are guested to again, it is a pain to have to leave guild, join a new one just to donate, then leave and return to your old guild.