Illusionary Weaponry Fighting Build
MasterSasori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Painbringer
...Enchantment rippers are the killers of my build
The reason why IW fails.
I much rather have a shutdown Mesmer.
Diversion > IW
I much rather have a shutdown Mesmer.
Diversion > IW
Blkout
I've never been able to get a decent build out of an IW Mesmer due to the reliance of IW to inflict damage and the low armor of a Mesmer in melee applications, however I have a VERY good IW Warrior build that works well in every area of PvE and some areas of PvP also. IW is not the total failure that some would like to believe, but I've found that you cannot rely on it as your only damage dealing skill, in case it gets stripped.
Kale Ironfist
Warriors do more damage without IW than with it, so I don't see the point of ever bringing it in the first place.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale Ironfist
Warriors do more damage without IW than with it, so I don't see the point of ever bringing it in the first place.
Not in certain situations. I can point them out to you, but if you've played the game long enough, certainly you should know standard warrior melee counters.
Kale Ironfist
Blind? Go /Rt and Sight Beyond Sight. Hexes? Your team brings hex removal, and if that's not enough, Purge Signet.
Standard anti-physical counters are also easily countered, and every team brings it anyway, so I don't see why people keep spouting that line. Heck, sometimes I've just played stubborn and fought with the counters still on me, and still won.
Physicals are just that good at dealing damage that it's worth cleaning them.
Standard anti-physical counters are also easily countered, and every team brings it anyway, so I don't see why people keep spouting that line. Heck, sometimes I've just played stubborn and fought with the counters still on me, and still won.
Physicals are just that good at dealing damage that it's worth cleaning them.
MasterSasori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
Not in certain situations. I can point them out to you, but if you've played the game long enough, certainly you should know standard warrior melee counters.
Of course there are standard melee counters on the warrior, but the pressure they can apply makes them worth it. IW gives very little compared to what a normal W/E Shock Axe can do.
Besides enchant strip will own IW.
Besides enchant strip will own IW.
Hugh Manatee
^cover enchants FTW!
MasterSasori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
^cover enchants FTW!
[rend enchantment]
I think not.
Wouldn't even bother trying to cover enchant whoever is using IW anyway.
I think not.
Wouldn't even bother trying to cover enchant whoever is using IW anyway.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterSasori
Of course there are standard melee counters on the warrior, but the pressure they can apply makes them worth it. IW gives very little compared to what a normal W/E Shock Axe can do.
Besides enchant strip will own IW. If you say so...to each his own.
Besides enchant strip will own IW. If you say so...to each his own.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterSasori
[rend enchantment]
I think not.
Wouldn't even bother trying to cover enchant whoever is using IW anyway. There's a counter for every skill in the game, just because you post one skill after someone posts a skill suggestion or build doesn't mean that every person playing the game is going to be carrying that single skill. The game is designed to be able to counter any skill. My IW Warrior build just offers more flexibility than a standard melee warrior, which is all you can hope for.
I think not.
Wouldn't even bother trying to cover enchant whoever is using IW anyway. There's a counter for every skill in the game, just because you post one skill after someone posts a skill suggestion or build doesn't mean that every person playing the game is going to be carrying that single skill. The game is designed to be able to counter any skill. My IW Warrior build just offers more flexibility than a standard melee warrior, which is all you can hope for.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kale Ironfist
Blind? Go /Rt and Sight Beyond Sight. Hexes? Your team brings hex removal, and if that's not enough, Purge Signet.
Standard anti-physical counters are also easily countered, and every team brings it anyway, so I don't see why people keep spouting that line. Heck, sometimes I've just played stubborn and fought with the counters still on me, and still won.
Physicals are just that good at dealing damage that it's worth cleaning them. Sure you can play stubborn and continue to fight with counters on you, or you could have IW available to you and kill quicker with melee counters on you. Ultimately, you may kill your enemy, my way just works quicker.
Standard anti-physical counters are also easily countered, and every team brings it anyway, so I don't see why people keep spouting that line. Heck, sometimes I've just played stubborn and fought with the counters still on me, and still won.
Physicals are just that good at dealing damage that it's worth cleaning them. Sure you can play stubborn and continue to fight with counters on you, or you could have IW available to you and kill quicker with melee counters on you. Ultimately, you may kill your enemy, my way just works quicker.
Kale Ironfist
...
Or you could have your mid and backline clean your Warriors with the skills they already pack and not waste your elite? That's even faster.
Or you could have your mid and backline clean your Warriors with the skills they already pack and not waste your elite? That's even faster.
isamu kurosawa
All the IW discussion aside why did you decide to make a second mesmer just to run illusion as opposed to using the one you already have?
Attributes, 2nd professions, armour, weapons can be changed so its a good idea to do so, saving your char slots for different professions.
And to add, some of the best elites for mesmer are from other professions. A few include
[assassins promise]
[glyph of energy]
[glyph of renewal]
one of the best general purpose mes elites in pve is still
[mantra of recovery]
Attributes, 2nd professions, armour, weapons can be changed so its a good idea to do so, saving your char slots for different professions.
And to add, some of the best elites for mesmer are from other professions. A few include
[assassins promise]
[glyph of energy]
[glyph of renewal]
one of the best general purpose mes elites in pve is still
[mantra of recovery]
Tyla
^I'm quite happy with E-Surge on my bar as a source of damage myself.
@Blkout -- I enchant removal your IW. I win.
If your build depends on an enchantment and not something that you can vary before the area and have that damage in your hands at that point, it's a bad build.
Not to mention you've got a huge dent in your survivability as a frontlining squishy, which can't get one of the best skills in the game to his / her disposal for: More pressure, make then sit on the ground and pummel them in, and that includes your entire party to take this advantage.
@Blkout -- I enchant removal your IW. I win.
If your build depends on an enchantment and not something that you can vary before the area and have that damage in your hands at that point, it's a bad build.
Not to mention you've got a huge dent in your survivability as a frontlining squishy, which can't get one of the best skills in the game to his / her disposal for: More pressure, make then sit on the ground and pummel them in, and that includes your entire party to take this advantage.
MasterSasori
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
Sure you can play stubborn and continue to fight with counters on you, or you could have IW available to you and kill quicker with melee counters on you. Ultimately, you may kill your enemy, my way just works quicker.
Spike v. 60 AL mesmer = Spike wins
I heard [diversion] was good
. Maybe you should stick with that.
I heard [diversion] was good
. Maybe you should stick with that.
gocall911
Wow... me and my friend run a similar argument all the time.. but both of us are too stubborn to admit that our builds are not PERFECT. you can counter any thing in this game, but certain weakneses slip by easily on a skill bar with 8 skills. No one can tell me they havent been in RA and come up with a team with no monks or against a team with no monks and they got rangers with blinds... IW gets through it, or you get that random necro that might possibly have rend enchantments and a war has to eat em... i see ppl posting trying to defend the war and saying that a certain skill can counter this and that, but what are the odds you dont have that skill when your running a different build. Like ppl have been saying this entire time the IW SPEEDS UP THE KILL, they have 7 more skills to to hex, condition and what not. your IW gets interupted/ stripped, oh look your a regular mesmer now!
isamu kurosawa
Quote:
Originally Posted by gocall911
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Tyla
^I'm quite happy with E-Surge on my bar as a source of damage myself.
E-surge can be nice scince the damage increase but i just can't resist firing off multiple [[cry of pain]'s instead
gocall911
Quote:
Originally Posted by isamu kurosawa
Without an elite.
Like i said, cant be perfect =p
yum
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
There's a counter for every skill in the game, just because you post one skill after someone posts a skill suggestion or build doesn't mean that every person playing the game is going to be carrying that single skill. The game is designed to be able to counter any skill. My IW Warrior build just offers more flexibility than a standard melee warrior, which is all you can hope for.
In TA, almost every team and their mothers bring Rend.
mistokibbles
For PvE though, I think IW would work decent. Me/D with a ton of cover enchants + damage reduction skills like Armor of Sanctity would help. That insignia to add armor while enchanted will help too. IW doesn't have a terribly long recharge time either so it's not too bad if it gets stripped. I still prefer Sabway to IW anyway though.
MasterSasori
Quote:
Originally Posted by isamu kurosawa
Without an elite.
Not just without an elite, but consider it an empty slot.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by yum
In TA, almost every team and their mothers bring Rend.
And if you read my earlier posts in this thread, I said "works well in every area of PvE and some areas of PvP."
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by MasterSasori
Spike v. 60 AL mesmer = Spike wins
I heard [diversion] was good . Maybe you should stick with that.
My W/Me IW build works just fine. That's the beauty of the build. Thanks for playing though.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyla
^I'm quite happy with E-Surge on my bar as a source of damage myself.
@Blkout -- I enchant removal your IW. I win. If your build depends on an enchantment and not something that you can vary before the area and have that damage in your hands at that point, it's a bad build. Not to mention you've got a huge dent in your survivability as a frontlining squishy, which can't get one of the best skills in the game to his / her disposal for: More pressure, make then sit on the ground and pummel them in, and that includes your entire party to take this advantage. Nope, remove IW and I can still do quite a bit of damage to you. I'm not talking about a Me/W IW build, I'm talking about a W/Me IW build. I have no love for a Me/W IW build as I've stated in previous posts, I think it's got too many flaws. My W/Me IW build relies on axe mastery to do most of it's damage, IW is just a back-up for certain scenarios and it works very well.
ShadowsRequiem
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
My W/Me IW build works just fine. That's the beauty of the build. Thanks for playing though.
You're kidding right? IW on a warrior? all that is doing is screwing you out of a lot of dmg.
LOTS Tyla
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:|
Nope, remove IW and I can still do quite a bit of damage to you. I'm not talking about a Me/W IW build, I'm talking about a W/Me IW build. I have no love for a Me/W IW build as I've stated in previous posts, I think it's got too many flaws.
In other words you're wasting attributes in Illusion on your Warrior, when you could be doing more damage with *weapon* mastery and Strength alone? Not to mention reliable Deep Wound, spikes and Bull's Strike. And how do you build adrenaline? How do you even...keep your energy up? Edit: And as a side note, your damage doesn't rely on an enchantment when you're using a real build. Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShadowsRequiem
You're kidding right? IW on a warrior? all that is doing is screwing you out of a lot of dmg.
LOTS Not kidding, and negative. Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyla
So basically what you ment was "RA"?
W/Me for IW? You obviously are bad at Warrior and Mesmer. Good day. In other words you're wasting attributes in Illusion on your Warrior, when you could be doing more damage with *weapon* mastery and Strength alone? Not to mention reliable Deep Wound, spikes and Bull's Strike. And how do you build adrenaline? Obviously bad at everything and bow down to your excellency. Good thing I have you to count after these 3 years of playing. A word of advice though, sometimes you can think outside the box and come up with some great builds, but in the world of cookie cutters and Ursan's maybe you don't realize that. My primary warrior build uses a Hammer and no IW, but that doesn't mean I don't have a great Axe IW build.
Squishy ftw
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
Nope, remove IW and I can still do quite a bit of damage to you. I'm not talking about a Me/W IW build, I'm talking about a W/Me IW build. I have no love for a Me/W IW build as I've stated in previous posts, I think it's got too many flaws. My W/Me IW build relies on axe mastery to do most of it's damage, IW is just a back-up for certain scenarios and it works very well.
Show us this awesome build please.
I'm very interested. Tyla
I don't run Ursan, or cookie-cutters. (Maybe Sabway, but sometimes I feel lazy. Laziness doesn't contribute to any argument, so don't start making more attacks.) And I use things that work very well. (BHA + Epidemic, since I mostly go Ranger.)
Just a question though, how is a Warrior depending on an enchantment better than a Warrior who deals a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO load more damage, reliable deep wounds and utility and has a secondary profession open for use? And yeah, come up with a valid argument as of why your build is so good, don't just say "Think outside the box, you might learn something." And yeah, you should go in this box instead of making some weak build, thinking it's awesome and making invalid arguments as to why. You're entitled to thinking it's good, but when it comes down to a discussion your arguments are moot.
Stormlord Alex
IW is bad and this thread is silly.
Warriors do big damage. [illusionary [email protected]] is not big damage. It's pathetic. All Blkout is really proving is that 3 years of playing don't make you good. Time to bring in the catpics? Tyla
I love you sometimes Alex.
 You should spam me with Ensign's quote sometime, along with some cat pictures.
isamu kurosawa
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stormlord Alex
Time to bring in the catpics?
After the W/Me comment i guess we have no choice.
Wyat Hawke
Quote:
Originally Posted by Squishy ftw
Show us this awesome build please.
I'm very interested. Yes please, we'll bow down for you then. Yeah, bring in the cats...
Stormlord Alex
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyla
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Wyat Hawke
Yeah, bring in the cats...
The people have spoken.
Go on, I wann see this awesome build too!
Tyla
Bottom line, if any competent player on the other side used their brains and brought something sexy called "Enchantment Removal", gg to all your DPS.
And Warriors deal big damage, up to 62 on a squishy with a vamp weapon with no attack skills. What weapon mastery are you running, below 14? (By the way, hexes such as Faintheartedness cripple the DPS of IW too. <3) (Also, if you read Blkout's posts he mentioned he used it on a Warrior aswell, DOUBLE BAED AMIRITE??)
MagmaRed
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blkout
Nope, remove IW and I can still do quite a bit of damage to you. I'm not talking about a Me/W IW build, I'm talking about a W/Me IW build. I have no love for a Me/W IW build as I've stated in previous posts, I think it's got too many flaws. My W/Me IW build relies on axe mastery to do most of it's damage, IW is just a back-up for certain scenarios and it works very well.
An elite that requires significant attribute points to be effective as a back-up?
Stormlord Alex
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
Bottom line, if the player knows what he's doing, he won't be using IW in the first place
Fix'd for accuracy.
Blkout
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyla
I don't run Ursan, or cookie-cutters. (Maybe Sabway, but sometimes I feel lazy. Laziness doesn't contribute to any argument, so don't start making more attacks.) And I use things that work very well. (BHA + Epidemic, since I mostly go Ranger.)
Just a question though, how is a Warrior depending on an enchantment better than a Warrior who deals a RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO load more damage, reliable deep wounds and utility and has a secondary profession open for use? And yeah, come up with a valid argument as of why your build is so good, don't just say "Think outside the box, you might learn something." And yeah, you should go in this box instead of making some weak build, thinking it's awesome and making invalid arguments as to why. You're entitled to thinking it's good, but when it comes down to a discussion your arguments are moot. It appears you didn't read any of my prior posts on the subject of IW. In a nutshell, I think it sucks trying to make it work as a Me/W. I did however say that it's viable on a W/Me using an axe... not a sword, and not a hammer. Never ONCE did ever say the W/Me build relied on IW, I explained that it was a utility skill to use in certain scenarios and works well within those scenarios. The build is based on axe damage attacks with adrenaline skills instead of energy skills. Of course you can't build adrenaline while under the effects of IW and this build doesn't attempt to or need to. This build is not an all out 16 spec axe damage build but certainly does plenty of damage without IW. Again, IW is used in this build as a utility for specific situations. This is the major difference between a W/Me and a Me/W IW build, the warrior doesn't have the armor disadvantage of the Mesmer and the warrior can rely on an actual melee weapon instead of the only damage coming from IW. So even if IW were to get stripped during a scenario use, you can always fall back to reliable axe attacks. With your attitude, I'm really not motivated to explain anything to you since it's pretty obvious you think you know everything already. You can't teach anyone that thinks they know it all already. Unfortunately you're not alone and there are many others like you on this forum which really brings the quality down since people like yourself thrive on trying to make yourselves feel superior, when you're really no better than anyone else here. |
