This is how you fix your game. (LONG comprehensive update)

"Any good monk can outlast an assassins chain and be away from him and have plenty of time to kite before next chain."

maybe if it was 1v1 but I heard this was a team game with other skills??? There's going to be more than just the 1 sin who magically strolled up to you no matter how much you kited collapsing on you, knocking you down, etc.

No.

I'm throwing up a couple of additional PvP only updates in a minute.

Realms of gods and other content-wise updates/modifications you mentioned - yes plz! That is brilliant.

Can't really comment on skill balances since i'm not bothering myself much with them anymore.

Good job on the post.

Thanks.

Version 1.1 is now up, changes:
*Added new PvE skills in the PvE only skill update section. These are old skills removed because of PvP balance issues...
*Added VoD changes.
*LoS for Shadowsteps.
*Made AoM cost 10 energy, since its now an Elite Assassin's Remedy, I think that's fair.
*Changed Ether Nightmare a bit. Now is 4 instead of 2 points of energy lost, recharge increased.

Version 1.2 coming Soon(TM) will feature:
*Added Ranger/Ritualist/Warrior PvE changes.
*A couple of changes to PvE mesmers.
*A couple more PvP skill changes (very minor though!)

Tune down BHA a little for PvE!

And I also suggest making Nat Stride the same duration as Escape in the PvP Ranger bit, also changing Mending Touch to scale with Protection Prayers.

Oh right I also updated Ether Nightmare so it wasn't PEWPEWPEW because I'm dumb and misread the recharge time XD! I also changed the recharge times of the Shadowsteps to reflect their different recharge times in-game.

cool ideas imo

You nerfed probably the main reason why paragons are even considered for teams (SY + TNTF).

Seriously, outside of guild parties, I've never partied with a Paragon.

Let them have those skills as they are. Personally I don't care since my para is a storage char now. But you boosted just about every other pve skill but nerfed those two.

What?

15 energy, 3 second cast, and you can only use the copied skill once? What's the point?

PUGs are dumb. Paras are imba even without SY + TNTF. This is pretty much a GIVEN. Unremovable party wide buffs are good all around. SY +TNTF removes the need for monks though. Like....completely. You can just SY+TNTF+SoR everything with 8 paras.

The point is that it was made back in 2005 before the game went live. Obviously now there'd be something better to it, but I haven't decided what that is yet. I was thinking of adding "You may use the skill once at the attribute the ally used it at last" clause.

Excluding Kuunavang, as that is a "Young Ancient Dragon," all of the Ancient Dragons known are in the continent of Tyria, The closest dragons to Elona, which are not in Elona, are the Orr Dragon, Deep Sea Dragon, and The Desert Dragon*in the Crystal Desert, which might even be the Water Dragon in the Charr Homelands*. So it doesn't really fit.

Anyways, the non-skill suggestions you make are a nearly full-proof good addition, that I see, and will cause no QQ from people. The skills, many are over-powered, and even with making the Monsters harder, it is not good. If your skill ideas were put in the game, we would at least know what NOT to do, which many people do not seem to get. If skills don't work out by being too imba, then they will get changed back. That simple.

If you're not going to be constructive, don't post, above 2 people. I've told you many times why Shadowsteps are overpowered, as have a couple of other people who are in top end PvP, and you're an Assassin, so if you can't realize that then thats not my problem. :/

yes, shadowsteps are overpowered, but making them completely useless along with all of the other viable assassin builds, doesn't do anything for the class.

Assassins would still be viable at splitting man. There's more to a game of GvG than just killing the other person, and I think this is a thought lost on some people now.

viable example pl0x.

The fact that you nerfed [shattering assault] shows how little you know about the assassins abilities other than killing.

while these skill change suggestions r more intelligent than most on these forums...

its still lacking in many ways

(I like how you assume my age)

It took 3 hours to type. At 12 at night.

Show me a college that has classes at 2 in the morning, and I'll show you the world.

AoD sin seemed to of did a pretty good job of splitting and always has, everything else is just way better right now.

Shattering Assault was because of 4v4.

Assassins are meant to kill things, however Shadowsteps are abused to all hell. It removes kiting if used offensively, defensively it can be the best kiting power in the game (Return), remove Aftercast (Shadow Walk), etc.

It's abused by secondaries more than the primaries, which in itself is pretty not good.

60 seconds in itself isn't that much of a nerf, to be honest, except in the lower level areas. It's enough to perform your goal, and escape. You'll have to wait a bit before you can get the crippling boost it gives you offensively, but that's not much of a problem really, if you're going after NPCs. If you're going after players, make sure to use it wisely. You'll have to be more careful with how you use it, and when. Sins would still take it (hell, I know a ton of people would) simply because even at 60 seconds the massive benefits it gives a player outweighs the negatives. I bet you if Tyla played with that balance, and was a sin, he/she would still take a Shadowstep. It's a given.

However, a lot of secondaries would steer away from them. As a WoH monk that 50-60 second Shadowstep is no longer looking that hot in 4v4/8v8. As a AoM derv that 60 second shadowstep isn't that hot anymore, it'd be best to take something else...

Because secondaries don't particularly need Shadowsteps to do their job, they can just help them sometimes do it a lot easier.

If anything, possibly add a new function to Critical Strikes that lowers the recharge time of Shadowsteps by 2s per rank (which brings most of these down to ~40.) but even that isn't needed.

Next to Paragons, Shadowsteps are probably the most broken mechanic in the player's hands right now.

I, for one, do not believe in letting overpowered things stick around just because it's what makes a class "stick". That isn't even the case here. An Assassin is more than just Shadowsteps.

/agree with costing skill points, but instead of paying cash for them, I'd suggest paying with points earned through winning battles in Destiny's Challenge.

Also, for all skills, you seem to not mention their attribute lines. Some are self explanatory, but I think you should list them later anyways.

Marble Trap sounds fun. I think Twisted Spikes is a little too overpowered.

It sounds weird, but I think the enemy should shadow step to the caster. The way it's set up now could ruin a dagger chain.

Difference in skills in bold. Make both skills the same - either both cause enchantment loss, or neither do.

Add a minimum cost of one. I was going to say to remove the elite status, but something else would have to be done in order to prevent it being stacked with other Dervish elites that give energy.

Makes me lol. I can't even think of a use for that except reducing energy woes between battle, and then you still have to stand still.

The reason this was ejected was because Air was not meant to be seen as having AoE effects the same way that Fire does. I was going to cry "IMBA!!11!1," but then I saw that it only interrupts one foe. Possible need to place Exhaustion on this skill.

Don't play Mesmer, so I don't see the true intention of this skill. The fact that you can cast again before it ends makes me question how it would work. Would you lose the energy after the 30 seconds anyways, or could you postpone that by recasting?

"any character in range" would mean adjacent foes, right? Or, in the case of Rangers and Paras, would that means anyone they could strike? Seems a little quirky.

Seems like a joke of a skill unless the enemy has a skill disabled. I would like to see it disable that skill on the enemy for 20 seconds, or until the caster uses the skill.

I'd like to place stress on the bold part.

I'm worried about it being maintained indefinitely.

Cost/casting time seem horrifically long. I wouldn't mind so much if I'd get assurance that any gain in health, uninclusive of health regen, causes this to reapply.

Dur-d-dur, I thought this was going to replace ["Make Haste!"] until I remembered it was elite. It's still something to consider.

---

Overall, I think that having more skills like that, as long as they aren't all elites is a nice addition.

Edit: I missed the rest of them apparently.

Just glancing through, I see lots of repeat effects. Some of those skills probably don't need added, and there are already some skills out there that can perform some of those tasks, if only to a lesser extent.

Love it. More power to Ritbombers!

Absolutely inferior to [Spirit's Strength]. You would still need to spec in the proper attribute line to get the base weapon damage or to use any of that line's skills. As a result, you're still doing the same point split as SS, but you put out just a few more crits/damage/whatever instead of having a flat-out increased damage boost.

The functionality sounds familiar to something. Not sure if I'd rather let Paragons have this or not. Needs to affect all allies within earshot.

Duration not listed. I suggest that it affect all allies within earshot.

Isn't this just like one of the Paragon ones but without the early cancel?

Edit #2: I'd like to run an idea by everyone about shadowsteps that I just dawned on.

Move all shadowstep skills back to their original duration. Also, make them all cause exhaustion.

He's doing to assassins exactly what most PVPers want done to them, I'm afraid...

It's not AoE, per se. Yes it's an Area of Effect, but it's more or less a damage over time.

Confusion worked based on the stuff, so if they do a physical attack, anyone in range of a sword. A flare? Anyone in range of the flare.

It targets ally, my friend.

Actually, it says attacks, not attack skills. So, afaik what it would do is basically use Channeling Magic as your weapon attribute, so if you had 16 channeling and was using a sword you'd have "16 swordsmanship." I think.

It didn't have a duration! It's an instant effect.

EDIT:
@ Shayne: Thanks for being one of the few actually contributing good posts. I enjoyed reading it.

Thanks for reading only half of it, being very unspecific, and ultimately contributing nothing to the topic.

Making them more balanced?

How dare they.....

EDIT:
If you can give me a good (read: 2-3 paragraph) post on why Shadowsteps are not overpowered and should not be nerfed all around, that is written intelligently and with obvious knowledge of the game and is not misinformed, I will un-fake (since...yknow...this isn't going into the game any time soon) nerf them.

You need to even out the amount of "new PvE-only" skills that you add for Destiny's Gorge. There are too many Ranger skills, only one monk? huh? I suggest only 2-3 per profession. Over-all those new skills could use tweeking, but look ok. I still suggest you stay out of the skill area of what to change though, some are good, many bad, all would effect GW in both good and bad ways.

Judging from Shayne Hawk's post, I see you've dug up the old skills that weren't implimented.

I only took skills that were removed from betas, so there's not much I can do. Ranger's saw a lot of change from Beta Prophecies to Release, Monks didn't.

Suppose someone had 12 Swordsmanship and 16 Channeling.

My impression of the skill is that someone swinging with a sword without the skill would be able to do damage as if they had 12 Swordsmanship and use attack skills as if they had 12 Swordsmanship. Someone swinging a sword with the skill would be able to do damage as if they had 16 Swordsmanship and use attack skills as if they had 12 Swordsmanship.

In all of the SS builds I've used, I've had to go into Spawning, a Mastery, Resto, and Communing or Channeling. I'm saying that SS is still better than this skill because it would be like having 12 Swordsmanship + ~40 instead of just 16 Swordsmanship.

Also, I had to edit my post alot, if you noticed, because I missed various parts of skills. I'm not surprised you caught a slip-up on my idea of Mimic.

I don't even know if mechanics work that way that it could function as an instant effect. Is there any skill that works like that, to instantly double/halve a duration of something without a reactivation?

[Extend Conditions]

Also, again, I think the way its worded is attacks use Channeling for everything. So sword attacks would use Channeling too. Kind of like SoI except for attacks.

Updated to v1.2.

Contains the following changes:
*New area idea: Gorge of Eternity. Features a PvP like setup in PvE.
*Adjusted Triple Shot barely.
*Ursan Rage now only disables for 1 second instead of 2.
*Removed Shadow Form nerf in PvE only section.
*Weakened a few of the Mesmer buffs in the PvE only section
*Added some Ranger & Ritualist buffs, with more on the way later.
*Added more PvP updates, but removed the Splinter Weapon change cause ArenaNet did my update on that XD

The PvP updates redid Shadowsteps to only have a +10s recharge time, but they fail if you don't have Crit Strikes to prevent secondary class abuse. Changed Shadow Form to be a bit more useless. Modified Scythes to be less abused. Reverted BSurge nerf to add defense. Fixed humsig/PBlock/Diversion. Weakened WoH to make Blessed Light look a bit better. Weakened the overpowered Foul Feast & Escape.

v1.3 will feature:
*New formatting.
*More ranger & ritualist buffs in PvE & minor changes to the other classes in PvE.
*Example teams for the Gorge of Eternity
*A way bigger PvP balance that will focus on changing hexes into more active play skills, rather than fire & forget skills. It will also include power creep weakening all across the board, a weakening on offense, mechanic changes, other abusive skills (hello Obsidian Flesh) and such. The 1.3 version skill balance for PvP would basically be the first skill balance I would do were I to become skill balancer xD. (Oh god, I can sense the assassins and dervishes knocking on my door with guns already.)

You've still nerfed the Imbagon and Ursan but left even more powerful alternatives. Half the PvE skills are on partly the same level (Eg. wards and CoP) but if you're going to deal with Imbagon and Ursan, please don't make other choices even more imbalanced.

I guess. The thing is though Tyla, ArenaNet has got themselves in a rut here. Honestly, I'm doing this (writing it) as if I was the skill balancer, and thinking as ArenaNet, the business, would. Ursan has brought a new level of imbalance to PvE, one that (whether we like it or not) many people enjoy. And in my mind, as a business oriented perspective, you can't take that imbalance away, and replace it with nothing. It is very much what I consider an Indiana Jones-like environment. If they take the golden chalice (Ursan) away, and don't replace it with anything, you're going to get your pyramid crumbling and trying to kill you. (though I nefed SY simply because 100 armor is retarded. Nothing dies eveeeer with both those skills on you.)

It's just not economically/business feasible to remove Ursan with no alternative. Ideally, there would now be a selection to use PvP skills in PvE too, but it's just not something I would do as a company. Is it better for the game? Yes. (though like I said, give the option to use the more balance PvP skills imo) Is it feasible to keep the majority happy, and keep the company running?

Not really.

This, my friend, is the sad truth. And something I hope ArenaNet has learned from and won't make the same mistake on in their new clean slate (Guild Wars 2).

My goal was to replace Ursan, while giving a variety of choices that do keep to the original game design of building a skill bar.

(Though I do admit I put less thought into the PvE skill balance section than the other sections simply because it's not really what PvE needs, but its neigh impossible to balance PvE by the mechanics themselves now, so it's really all you're left with unless if Anet were to somehow decide to completely revamp every single area and every single monster and every single little detail from 4 different chapters. Not happenin.)

This isn't a dream update, (well, it is in a way) where I wrote it as THIS IS HOW YOU MAKE GUILD WARS PERFECT, Tyla, as I wrote this to be realistic. And let's be realistic, for every URSAN SUCKS thread we have on these forums, if Ursan was made crap with no alternative that "FEELS EPIC", these forums would be in an uproar, I guarantee it.

It's basically an update I would do to fix the big problems, but you can't just fix the big problems and leave something behind entirely.

If I wasn't looking or writing this from a good business perspective, yes I would just remove PvE skills entirely, not add anymore, remove the skill separation, etc.

You know I would, right? :P

But that's just not feasible, here.

EDIT:
Like I even did a PvE/PvP skill update, yet I don't really like this idea of a skill separation at all. Each new skill update furthers the gap between PvE & PvP. I very much wrote this playing on ArenaNet's current Guild Wars 1 ideals, including title grind (added a new title and stuff that rewards you doing title stuff (Vanquisher & Cartographer), making PvE feel epic (EPICCCCC DPSSSS), and such.

My idea of a perfect update is completely different, and would probably piss off everyone who hasn't been around since the dawn of time...I mean...Guild Wars.

These forums would be an uproar in the case of carebears, while the majority continues to play. Nobody can tell the future, but I doubt they will even care to be honest, but thanks for the explanation anyway.

it's hard to say.

Honestly, I mean, a lot of people use Ursan. ArenaNet can easily (read: already has, according to Regina) pull the numbers on the amount of people who use Ursan. I'm sure you've even used it. I've had it on my bar, but I didn't even know it existed until I saw a post on GWG about it some time shortly after the release of EOTN.

But Anet can't easily pull the numbers of the amount of people who like Ursan and would care if it was nerfed. It's a general business sense to assume that if people are using something, they like it, because if they didn't like it, they'd either not use it, or they'd quit because it's not fun for them. It's just generally safer to assume everyone who uses it likes it, than everyone who uses it doesn't, or even its 50/50. It's impossible to really gauge that, but it's just a safer bet to assume they do, y'know?

If I had my way, here would be my dream update:
*Titles removed.
*PvE skills removed.
*Skill separation removed.
*Huge ass skill update.
*Complete PvE mechanics reworking across all 4 campaigns.
*New content added.

The above is far less likely to happen though, since again, this is ANets current ideals for GW1...EOTN is a testament to that. I just built upon them, while trying to appease the majority, as any business would. PvE still feels epic, has a challenging aspect (due to a reworked HM (farrrrr less work than reworking PvE itself)), new content, and more variety & skill building.

PvP has a somewhat decent skill balance, and new features, with a few mechanical changes to keep it going and a bit more fresh and rewarding.

Basically I wrote how to fix and improve the game in its current state, rather than fix and improve the game as it used to be. Completely playing by Anets rules now, than how they used to be.

I actually don't like probably 75% of what I wrote. The only parts I even like is the reworked HM, new content areas, new PvP features, and the PvP skill balance.

Everything else is just crap to keep the new carebears happy, and I don't like it anymore than you do.

Buff Blackout

[[email protected]]

here you go


that's rank 0.

So you want Anet to pretty much give every skill a complete overhaul, fix the AI, give PvP a complete overhaul, add a large number of areas to the game, add more titles, and fix all of the bugs.

While they are at it, why don't they just improve the graphics and let us jump. Then they could call it GW2 and make us buy it again.

-Every skill a complete overhaul: actually it's mostly just number changing. Unless if for some reason ArenaNet decided to use the most ridiculous coding ever, changing skills themselves isn't that hard. Making another copy of a skill isn't that hard. Functionality changes, sure, but number changing? Not really.
-Fix the AI: They've been doing that lately anyways. All they'd really have to do here is make the AI do less stupid things, like say killing themselves all the time even when they have hex removal on an ally.
-PvP a complete overhaul: It's just a couple features. Making a merchant and awarding items is also a very simple process. Making new original items is, yes, harder, and probably the least feasible thing out of the whole thing for Token of the Gods / the PvP reward system.
-Large number of areas to the game: eh. Just do the EotN solution and reuse textures if you have to, reuse creature models. Just make it challenging.
-Add more titles: There was 1.
-Fix all the bugs: yes, but they are all documented and none of them are really that complicated. Obviously some aren't just flip a switch and PRESTO CHANGO but a lot of the reported bugs are very simple bugs. Stuff like a fail message on a skill, a typo here & there, etc...these are very simple fixes, and I don't doubt that, because ArenaNet uses an intuitive engine and coding design. These are things even a first or second year student in a coding class could fix after they took a look at the code, the problem is ArenaNet not able to dedicate people to these tasks. Not enough resources. They currently only have enough to do a few bugs each update, which is understable given their current endeavors. Once they get Lisa (er, I think that was her first name) and the other unnamed guy to be completely focused on GW1, I honestly think you'll see a lot of the reported bugs fixed in a couple updates.

These things aren't as impossible as you make them seem, and Guild Wars 2 is already going to be a different design and focus than Guild Wars 1...I can already tell you that from UAX in PvP areas at the start, the world PvP in PvE areas, the quest structure, emergent complexity on skills, companion system, et al.

a little bit of awesome, a bunch of obvious, a ton of meh, some wtf, some LoL, and some pathetically bad.

Why I wasted so much time to read this all?
/selfowned

A lot of chests dropping multiples of 'rares' everywhere, and a repeatable? area to quickly farm then in multiples, thats sick.

Adding a huge lot of PvE versions of existing skills for completely no reason is pointless and adds unneeded complexity and confusion.

There are more terribaaad skill changes than actually good ones. Seriously, don't comment on pvp. PBlock and Diversion nerf to complete uselessness =wtf?

oh well, it was so long that if I wanted to comment on everything I wanted, I would have to write a book...

oh I know now where's the problem! It's this:

This is one idea, a huge update, it's just split into many parts....like an update. :d

From what I gathered from my skimming through skill updates (the rest I really couldn't care less about) it seems "Buff everything for PvE, Nerf Mesmers and Monks to make them unusable in PvP."

Mesmers...I nerfed 3 skills. 3. One makes stuff blow up uncontrollably to the point where matches between anyone decently skilled vs anyone even slightly less skilled end in less than 5m (2m or less thanks to resign) (hello there Humsig), another has always been overpowered for the longest time (hello there Diversion), and one makes running Water Eles less than favorable (hello there PBlock). No one really runs PBlock much anyways, but when it is run it rapes Water eles like no tomorrow which makes them less played. A mesmer is much more than just Diversion, and if you think those 3 skill changes make mesmers completely unusuable in PvP, then you really are kind of crazy, as a Mesmer brings so much more to a party than a simple Diversion.

As for Monks, WoH is simply too good. It is blatantly overpowered, and is a completely one dimensional skill that was buffed because there was no way for defense to keep up otherwise because hellot nerf to LoD. SoH is needed because it stacks with Conjures. WoH is needed a slight nerf to make other healing options more viable. I buffed defense a tad by reverting some key changes so that the obscene healing wouldn't be needed. Again, if you think Monks would be unusuable in PvP because of a single WoH nerf, you are also crazy, because quite frankly the Hybrid Bar, ZB bar, RC bars, etc, aren't going anywhere, this just allows BL to be used, in conjunction with WoH. WoH still beats BL in raw healing power, but BL allows for greater bar variety and powr, so there is now a trade off, whereas there is no reason to run BL right now...WoH is simply better in every way, so much so that it's easier to just out heal conditions and hexes, than remove them with WoH.

EDIT: Also again, the PvP upate currently only faces the major issues, not a ton of the issues. That'll come in v1.3.

The PvE buffs is to replace Ursan, because hoenstly if ANet nerfs Ursan, this is basically what they will be forced to do (and what they've slowly gotten closer and closer to doing with each passing update.)

Just that is enough.
The Anguish is Kormir's realm.

I don't care much about the skills. I always use what I have, and since my main is an elementalist, I have a lot of good stuff to choose.

Man, am I glad I'm not a game designer! Thankless job, no way to please everyone. I mean, take Monks, for instance: how many ways can you heal something? LoD or WoH? I can heal 1 person a lot, or a lot of people a little (well, sometimes a lot, but...) So, let me see, I have this kind of heal, and that kind of heal - sh*t! I've got like 30 heals to choose from! And then, when I Prot someone, I heal them a little, too - so, Protection and Healing... oi vey! Too many options, and only a handful will get used anyway.

Good effort, DarkNecrid! Welcome to the nightmare that is game balancing!

some of your ideas for skills are good but most of this is kind of useless this close to gw2

I read the whole thing and Im sorry to say there arent really any good ideas for changes in this entire post. you seem to be under the impression that you deserve a ton of free new content for some reason and that everything in the game should drop 6 gold weapons. we are not getta a ton of new content for free. its just not going to happen. sure, it would be nice for them to put in the remaining go areas, but anet probably wont do it for free...

There are really only 2 things here I don't agree with. One is the 5 new elite areas. DoA is basically Kormir's area, and the game already has enough (like, 5 I think. And yes, UW and FoW are elite areas, even if not by name, get over it).

The other thing I don't agree with:

In your suggestion, Sig of Hum is unusable it's so bad, put a 30 second recharge on it, don't change anything else.

Also, with suggested changes, Pblock becomes a crappy elite version of Plock and Sig of Distraction. If you're going to kill Pblock that badly, at least bring the energy cost down to 5 to at least keep it viable.

Diversion really isn't THAT overpowered as it's made out to be. It has a 3 second cast, its an incredibly easy interrupt if it's shutting you down that badly. Maybe lower the duration to 5 and recharge lengthening to 9...40, that way you don't completely kill it with fire, and it may still be usable.


Why is that? Because "the rest" improves PvP? Just because you don't play it doesn't mean it's bad and doesn't need fixing. Stop being an arrogant little infant.