What is each class good for?

That's why I wrote something about Scythe Assassins a few posts above yours. If you dislike Moebius + Blossom, the Assassin will still do a lot more damage then the Dervish ever could with a Scythe + critical strikes. I've played both, and yes I have used Scythe Sin.

I found Dervish to be much better at dishing out consistant damage.

I've played both, and yes I have used Scythe Sin.

I found Dervish to be much better at dishing out consistant damage. How can that be?
The Assassin has more critical strikes (which are _awesome_ with a scythe, even in hard mode and after armor), the better IAS and more mana.
It's simple math. The Dervish can never win.
I also play both (Dervish even was my main for a while) and from my experience, the Assassin is seeing bigger yellow numbers more often.

But this isn't all about Assassin vs Dervish. I'm still concerned with the Rangers. They are my second favorite class and I haven't really figured out what to do with them effectivly in hard mode except for BHA.

And what about the Warriors? I don't play them often so I went with knockdown because that's where Warriors do have an advantage (the Insignia).

SS for Necromancers is a fine elite skill and it kills stuff fast. It can even kill stuff faster then any direct damage (like Moebius + Blossom or scythe attacks). I like it a lot, especially since [[Mark of Pain] and [[Barbs] are in the same line.
However, damage isn't that hard to get. BiP on the other hand helps all casters to be more effective, which is imho superior.
And to those claiming "nobody ever should need +7 energy management or he sucks anyway": I'm talking about boosting a team to the maximum performance here. If you know you will get BiP then every party member can plan his build accordingly and intentionally put in highly effective spells with a high energy cost. There is nothing wrong with intentionally spamming good skills when you know you will have nearly unlimited mana.
And 7 players all spamming their best skills is a lot more effective then one guy using [[Arcane Echo] + [[Spiteful Spirit]. On top of that, the [[Blood is Power]-bar has a lot of free slots for further party support - it's not like BiP is the only thing that Necro would do.

Dervs are better than Sins at scything *cough* [wild blow][save yourselves!] *cough* [malicious strike]

Though I would rather have a Dervish. Avatar of Dwayna + FoW = win.

Your thoughts on necromancers aren't very up-to-date. Everything in the first post either doesn't make sense or is outdated.

But meh, I won't even go on. Everyone has his/her own idea about "good" and some are struck up on one skill/build as being perfect and would never play anything else.

Everything in the first post either doesn't make sense or is outdated.

But meh, I won't even go on. Everyone has his/her own idea about "good" and some are struck up on one skill/build as being perfect and would never play anything else. Then please give me an update Point out were I am wrong and give a better use for that class. After all, that's why I made this topic.
But no "hey you suck and you don't know stuff and everything is outdated". Arguments please.

Then please give me an update Point out were I am wrong and give a better use for that class. After all, that's why I made this topic.
But no "hey you suck and you don't know stuff and everything is outdated". Arguments please. The problem is that you make it sound like these are the ONLY ways that the professions are any good. The roles you described may be alright if you're set up right but so is any other role the warrior, necro or any prof may chose, considering their build and play-style does make sense.

If I'd have to enumerate all possibilities and then explain them, I'd probably have to write a book about it... So don't get crazy there.

The problem is that you make it sound like these are the ONLY ways that the professions are any good. The roles you described may be alright if you're set up right but so is any other role the warrior, necro or any prof may chose, considering their build and play-style does make sense.

If I'd have to enumerate all possibilities and then explain them, I'd probably have to write a book about it... So don't get crazy there. Guess I wasn't clear enough on what I had in mind:

Of cause there are lots and lots of really good possibilities to play a character. Each class has tons of different builds which can all be good.

But what I am looking for is the single best role a class can fill. Of cause there are other good possibilities - but which is the best one? What is the single strengh of each class that no other class can do?

For example the the Dervish vs Assassin discussion:
Dervishes are not the best damage dealers with a scythe. So the best role for Dervish can not be scythe damage dealer. So ... what is it?
Necromancers can play minion masters, SS, BiP and so on. Which of these builds is the most useful in HM elite missions that no other class can do? I'd go with BiP+Orders here, Curses Necromancer being a close second.

But what I am looking for is the single best role a class can fill. Of cause there are other good possibilities - but which is the best one? What is the single strengh of each class that no other class can do? You're still looking at this wrong then. There is no perfect/best role, it all depends on the area, but even more, it depends on what team setup you have. For example, if you have almost none of physical attackers (or they're all elemental/hole damage), then orders will not provide any advantages to your team. And if your team doesn't have energy problems and you're not gonna encounter any energy denial, then BiP is pretty much wasted.

In other words, if you want to find a "best" role, you gotta look at a team as a whole, then look at the area and mobs you'll be facing... and then of course make sure you're playing with fairly competent players (or make sure heroes can run the builds they are given).

P.S. Yes, sins gain more critical hits with scythe that dervishes... but if you're not running any avatar or other mysticism elites, you can lower mysticism and not lose much. There are plenty of things you can combine with a scythe.

You're still looking at this wrong then. There is no perfect/best role, it all depends on the area, but even more, it depends on what team setup you have. For example, if you have almost none of physical attackers (or they're all elemental/hole damage), then orders will not provide any advantages to your team. And if your team doesn't have energy problems and you're not gonna encounter any energy denial, then BiP is pretty much wasted.

In other words, if you want to find a "best" role, you gotta look at a team as a whole, then look at the area and mobs you'll be facing... and then of course make sure you're playing with fairly competent players (or make sure heroes can run the builds they are given).

P.S. Yes, sins gain more critical hits with scythe that dervishes... but if you're not running any avatar or other mysticism elites, you can lower mysticism and not lose much. There are plenty of things you can combine with a scythe. Isn't that how the game seems to be in the first place anyway? The classes and setup of skills as well as versatility of secondary professions seems to have always allowed the player to be able to change up as the situation demands prior to going into an area. Though the primary professions seems to have more of an edge with the runes factor, however depending on the primary attribute of the class another class may also utilize certain aspects of another more efficiently. That seems me anyway what this game is surrounded around, the ability to create and come up with new fun or overpowered combinations and keeps people thinking and creative imo anway. If a specific class's primary attribute which is in a way their forte allows them to greatly excel with skills of another class then so be it. Each class has its versatile abilities that would allow it to assume different roles, even though some classes are more common for the average person to be used in the generic accepted manner. Asking what really each class should be able to do best seems to be a bit out there as even if a warrior is well suited for kd or such, if the enemies have anti-melee or such would hinder it in some areas depending on the situation. Really the purpose of the classes seems to be just what the community is used to or accepts over time, as such with the "assassins seem to have better dps with crit buffs using a scythe than a derv would be able to get" ideal that is out there.

Though on the discussion with the sin vs derv, I'm actually curious about what others thoughts on this are. As lyssa, yes I know it may not be used depending on the situation which would gimp the dmg output otherwise, would be mysticism based and a primary attribute to dervs so they would gain a moderate 40-50 dmg and energy for a considerable time and a sin would not gain that but rather have its inherent crit and buffs to get the higher end scythe dmg. I guess what I'm curious about is would the output in damage for the sin be much greater even so crit scythe wise compared to the derv with lyssa and other similar dmg empowering buffs. (dun shoot me here, just posting my thoughts and curiosity)

sry if thats a bit long

I agree 100%, I mean Dervish's are so underrated about everything. Yet a D/A is a really deadly combo. a/d is even moar deadlier. you see, when you put the professions in alphabetical order they do moar critical domage hits which, much to the charr's disgust, is very large with an scythes.