The Languages Of Tyria: One left undiscovered! - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Amantis

Academy Page

Join Date: Mar 2007

The Mursaat Guardians

Me/

10 Dec 2008 at 00:23 - 1

Intro:
So I was browsing around the wiki looking at the images for the written language of Ascalon to see if any runes matched with the Elonian alphabet when I stumbled upon a lead language creators page. Mr Matthew Medina.
Here's the specific excerpt that caught my eye.

Quote:

As Guild Wars has evolved so have the languages - so far I haven't seen that anyone has translated the 100 or so Canthan symbols. One word of caution though - not EVERY language in the original Guild Wars universe actually translates into anything - I believe I was the only artist on the team that actually made readable languages, so some of the runes, glyphs and scripts you see in the game will be just for "show"

So in an effort to find out if the work of me and two of my guild mates and fellow loreites Gmr Leon and Konig Des Todes was all in vain I asked if he could provide a list of which languages were nonsensical. His reply was

Quote:

As far as I have seen, all of the languages that CAN be translated HAVE been translated. Ascalonian has it's own page here on the wiki, as does Canthan. The other languages you see will most likely be untranslatable. The specific example you cited is just such a prop - the scriptures of those banners and pillars are not developed languages, but simply aesthetic choices.
There is only one "language" that has escaped detection thus far, which I can understand being that it only appears on ONE particular prop in Eye of the North. And honestly, if anyone can find this prop, and decipher the text just based on that single piece of art, I might just have to send them something ultra-cool!

So with our current researched dashed it seems we have a whole new thing that has been brought to our attention. While this doesn't mean mean there is definitely only ONE left (Matthew is only human and he could be mistaken or misinformed) this IS a confirmation that there is a prop in EoTN just laying around waiting to be deciphered! In my opinion the first order of business should be likely places this prop could be. While exploring have YOU seen anything that would be a candidate? What places would you suggest. After we have a list of suggested places I think we should discuss organizing an expedition to scour Eye of the North. What say you?

KZaske

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2006

Boise Idaho

Druids Of Old (DOO)

R/Mo

10 Dec 2008 at 00:49 - 2

Sounds interesting. There are so many different ruins out in the explorables this is gonna be quite a task to find the right prop with runes one it.

razerbeak

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

R/

10 Dec 2008 at 01:07 - 3

Hmm, I have some ideas, but I can't check anything until I get home to my computer.

LordScro

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2008

Ethereal Guard

W/

10 Dec 2008 at 01:10 - 4

Hmm. Maybe its in the Shards of Orr.

I will be vanquishing the EoTN area soon, so if you want I could pm you in-game if I find anything unusual.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

10 Dec 2008 at 01:30 - 5

Razerbeak, you can just say where you think it is, no need for individual checking, nothing bad with teams going to look around.

I personally think it is in a dungeon that is quickly passed, such as Shards of Orr and Sepulchur of Dragrimmar.

Afterall, many people just go in, kill, and do what they need to do nowadays, especially in the more annoying areas like Shards of Orr.

Since there is only one prop, that means that it is not in an area with repeated designs, which rules out most of the dungeons, but still leave individual rooms of certain dungeons.

Amantis

Academy Page

Join Date: Mar 2007

The Mursaat Guardians

Me/

10 Dec 2008 at 01:41 - 6

Actually Azazel, I'm thinking maybe we might be misunderstanding. Only one prop doesn't have to mean only one place. Maybe he was just mentioning one prop to tell us its the only small piece where this language exists, it there could be multiple copies of this one prop.

Daisuko

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2007

California

[Vr]

E/Me

10 Dec 2008 at 01:42 - 7

Or it could just be the end quest NPC from tarnished haven (The spirit at the end which speaks gibberish)

Amantis

Academy Page

Join Date: Mar 2007

The Mursaat Guardians

Me/

10 Dec 2008 at 01:56 - 8

That's not a language its a cipher and we have deciphered it. That's also not on a prop.

razerbeak

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

R/

10 Dec 2008 at 02:15 - 9

Ok, so my idea was the statue/alter just in front of where you start on level 3 of CoF, its textured like the bloodstone and has the same small series of markings found throughout the Underworld. (when they are placed on top of each other it looks like an eye if that helps) Its not a full language by any means but perhahs a message regardless. Ill post screenshots as soon as I can. If that fails there might be something hidden in the bloodstone caves.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

10 Dec 2008 at 02:27 - 10

I know what you mean, and I looked at it a while back. Unless I missed something, it has no new symbols and is just a re-use of the pillar design in the Hall of Grenth in the Underworld, but just as four pillars clumped together.

And Me and Gmr Leon pretty much cleaned out the Bloodstone Caves a while back and found nothing new in terms of runes, Except for the bloodstone itself, everything there that is not natural is either Mursaat *the inscription on the doors* or from Nightfall *the plinths and the broken Monoliths*.

Although I feel like going back to re-observe those objects, for no real purpose though. They're just cool.

razerbeak

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

R/

10 Dec 2008 at 02:39 - 11

Any chance of something being in the ooze pit? I tend to fly through that one and it would be pretty easy to miss something.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

10 Dec 2008 at 03:20 - 12

As far as I remember, that entire level is a copy from HoS lvl 1, Volxen lvl 2, and a few others. So if there is something in Ooze Pits, it's probably in those other areas.

BTW, just remembered, Heart of the Shiverpeaks has an entire half that most people skip, easily gotten to via Bogroot Growths, might be something there.

LordScro

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2008

Ethereal Guard

W/

10 Dec 2008 at 13:45 - 13

Ok, so he said that Ascalonian and Canthan are decipherable and have been deciphered. Only one language has skipped detection. So to make this easy to figure out, which languages have you found that are decipherable and what languages are undecipherable. That will rule out a large portion of the possible languages and help narrow down the location of said 'prop'.

razerbeak

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

R/

10 Dec 2008 at 21:18 - 14

Don't rule out a dungeon just because its made up of pieces from other dungeons, If wehat we're looking for is a prop it could be in any one of them.

LordScro

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2008

Ethereal Guard

W/

10 Dec 2008 at 23:39 - 15

Quote:

Originally Posted by razerbeak

Don't rule out a dungeon just because its made up of pieces from other dungeons, If wehat we're looking for is a prop it could be in any one of them.

If its made up of other dungeons, then the prop would also be in the dungeon in which the piece came from.

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

10 Dec 2008 at 23:52 - 16

It may not even be in a dungeon. I've been through them all tons of times and i always look around at the scenery. Usually when i find something with text on it i take a good look at it. If it is in a dungeon it must be very well hidden, however it could be inside one of the explorable areas. Perhaps even an outpost. He never says what it is - it could be a box, pot, banner or even a rock. Something that we could of passed hundreds of times.

My money is on it being in the Tarnished Coast area.

Scythe O F Glory

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2008

New Jersey

League of Elite [LoE]

D/

11 Dec 2008 at 02:32 - 17

I'm no expert on lore or anything, but has anyone examined closely the tree in Ventari's Sanctuary? Just seems like a good spot for an inscription if you ask me.

EDIT: This may also seem like a stretch, but on the wiki picture of the Asuran Beacon (bundle in GOLEM mission) there seems to be some text.

razerbeak

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

R/

11 Dec 2008 at 02:33 - 18

Ya, I'm starting to think it belongs to the Asuras, ill do some snooping this weekend.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Dec 2008 at 03:23 - 19

As I told Amantis in the guild, I believe that this untranslated language is the Charr symbols on the Charr decorder.

Iirc, no one has bothered with translating it, very little has been done with it at all actually. We are currently getting all three from a guildie on Amantis' non-Sanctum account. After that, I will put all three through the decoder, record the decoding for all three ways to decode for each plan (i.e., 9 times), and start doing work with that.

If that is the translatable language, I can have what is translatable soon - and anything I get confused about I will post up.

EDIT: Never mind, the aformentioned way to translate won't work, the dials on the decoder go to the same spots (although the middle dial goes to two spots). So if it were to be the Charr symbols to be translatable, we could only translate two.

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

11 Dec 2008 at 09:25 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scythe O F Glory

EDIT: This may also seem like a stretch, but on the wiki picture of the Asuran Beacon (bundle in GOLEM mission) there seems to be some text.

Continuing this:

This is the Asuran Beacons text.

And this is the banner found in the same mission. The face at the bottom is a inactive golem.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Dec 2008 at 11:31 - 21

And with that, it is on two props. Therefore not the last translatable language. And is simply gibberish.

Sadly.

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

11 Dec 2008 at 11:36 - 22

Actually if you look you'll notice they are not the same text. Also only one is a prop (the Golem Banner) and the other is a bundle.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Dec 2008 at 11:48 - 23

Not the same text, but the same origin/language. As it seems, this is a singular language we are looking for. Of course, how I'm looking at Matthew's wording (one prop, one language - not one prop, one text) is that it is on one item.

And, what's exactly the difference between a prop and a bundle in your terms? Because what was thinking he meant was one object (whether on only one, or on many duplicates of the same thing - unknown, but the question was brought to Matthew and we are waiting on a response).

Well at 6 in the morning here, I am finally tired. So time to make some z's I guess.

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

11 Dec 2008 at 12:00 - 24

When he said prop i was under the impression he was talking about things found in the backgrounds of Explorable Areas.

When he says its on one prop as mentioned he could of simply forgotten that a similar text appears on that bundle. As it is that Banner is only in that mission and i have never seen that text before. It was also hidden behind the Golem in G.O.L.E.M (I only noticed it by chance).

I'm not saying its the text but that we shouldnt throw it away yet - not until we have found more props.

Shasgaliel

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Apr 2008

[bomb]

11 Dec 2008 at 15:06 - 25

what about those signs which are all over EoTN. Like "avalanche" "wurm breeding area" etc. If they have different markings depending on what they mean we can have a language...

EDIT: Maybe tablet in Jaga Morraine?

"In memory of the Norn who ventured into the bottomless pit to discover if it leads to the other side of the world:

Askel Cliffdiver

Gunolf the Mountain

Hardi Jotuncrusher

May they find glory and honor in the Mists should they never return."

Might be tombs of Norn outside Gunnars hold.

Might be the monster description tablets in sifhala but they all look the same to me...

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

11 Dec 2008 at 20:31 - 26

Norn markers were considered, but they are all the same. So it depends on Matthew's responce to Amantis' last question:

By one prop, does it mean only one in one place, or on item with duplicates.

If it's the first, then anything that has a copy, cannot be it.

The tombs we have checked, they are blank. Same with the monster descriptions in Sifhalla.

Scythe O F Glory

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2008

New Jersey

League of Elite [LoE]

D/

11 Dec 2008 at 22:30 - 27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

what about those signs which are all over EoTN. Like "avalanche" "wurm breeding area" etc. If they have different markings depending on what they mean we can have a language...

EDIT: Maybe tablet in Jaga Morraine?

"In memory of the Norn who ventured into the bottomless pit to discover if it leads to the other side of the world:

Askel Cliffdiver

Gunolf the Mountain

Hardi Jotuncrusher

May they find glory and honor in the Mists should they never return."

Might be tombs of Norn outside Gunnars hold.

Might be the monster description tablets in sifhala but they all look the same to me...

But those are already deciphered if you can read them...

And also I'm going to have to agree with Azazel in that it looks like gibberish on the Beacon. It doesnt look like individual letters, more like a long string of scribbles. Unless its some form of cursive?

Gmr Leon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

12 Dec 2008 at 00:50 - 28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scythe O F Glory

It doesnt look like individual letters, more like a long string of scribbles. Unless its some form of cursive?

Or Arabic, or Sanskrit, or..Any of the Middle Eastern languages have a style that appears that way, to an extent at least.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

12 Dec 2008 at 00:58 - 29

Scythe, I wasn't saying it looks like gibberish, but that it is gibberish - i.e., cannot be translated.

Just like the (apparently) untranslatable Elonian lettering, it looks like a form of middle-eastern language.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

12 Dec 2008 at 16:33 - 30

Update Notice:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew Medina

Definitely the second one. Although if I recall correctly, the prop placement is such that it just requires a "short" walk. --Matthew Medina 15:44, 12 December 2008 (UTC)

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/User_...Nonsense_Runes

So I suppose that kicks out lvl 2 and on for dungeons, and it is a duplicatable object.

Sir Cusfreak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2007

In your backline

No Tags [NONE]

13 Dec 2008 at 01:40 - 31

I think this is what we're looking for. Its a short walk, to be sure. Also, its repeated. It looks like a language and text to me.
The problem I'm seeing is that there arent really any repeated symbols. I looked at some of the old runic alphabets and I see some definite similarities, but nothing I'm seeing a way to use.

Let me know what ya'll think.

<if this IS it, then I'm glad I could be a part of it. Once translated/decrypted, I'd love to know what it says.>

Happy Hunting.

Scythe O F Glory

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2008

New Jersey

League of Elite [LoE]

D/

13 Dec 2008 at 02:10 - 32

That one looks decipherable. But where exactly is this? Ill need better screenshots to clearly make out the letters.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

13 Dec 2008 at 02:36 - 33

That was actually the first thing brought up in our guild. We took it as most likely gibberish due to the mass amount of them, but it is worth looking into for sure.

Sir Cusfreak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2007

In your backline

No Tags [NONE]

13 Dec 2008 at 02:38 - 34

there are a few matches here, but not enough to tell me much.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phoenician_alphabet

same here
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/hungarian_runes.htm

and here
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/runic.htm#gothic

anyway, I'm going back to playing the game now. I'll try some more of this later.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

13 Dec 2008 at 03:11 - 35

Those definably look like the origins of these runes.

Possibly same with the Tyrian language - in design that is.

I'll go ahead and start translating if possible.

Edit: yeah, this doesn't translate anything, at least with the given runes.

Going with exact and similar runes you get: (letters separated by |, possibilities separated by /)

-|'/k|-/(-|i/j/is/ice/isca)/(-|-|i/j/is/ice/isca)
(R|a|-)/-/(R|-)|-|-|i/j/is/ice/isca
a|(-|k/kw|-)/-|(i/j/is/ice/isca|i/j/is/ice/isca|-|-)/(i/j/is/ice/isca|i/j/is/ice/isca|-)/-
-|k/kw|R|-|(i/j/is/ice/isca|-)/-
i/j/is/ice/isca|(k|-|i/j/is/ice/isca)/-
-|-|(i/j/is/ice/isca/-s)|/(i/j/is/ice/isca|-|s)/(i/j/is/ice/isca|-)/-

Only alternative I can see to making this translatable, is to compare it to the Tyrian alphabet (as they seem similar) or to find more runes. But it looks like this is, in fact, not it.

Sir Cusfreak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2007

In your backline

No Tags [NONE]

13 Dec 2008 at 05:12 - 36

I have a similar chart here on my notebook, only more of mine are scratched out.

we pretty much know this cant be translated as a cypher or cryptogram, per se; not enough letters repeat to make intellegable words. However, I still have a hard time dismissing it, considering it fits the criteria so perfectly. (on a repeated prop, short walk, overlooked language, the runic discussion on the talk page, etc.)
I know a lot of these base languages used just as many - or more - symbols as whole words, as they did letters or actual alphabet; but theres not enough of a guide or reference for being able to translate it if thats the case here.
I do know that almost every symbol on it appears here, (or very very close) but using it would again be basing thought of it as alphabet, which we know doesnt work. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codex_Runicus

However -
one of my favorite quotes:
"just because you don't know what the answer is, doesn't mean there isn't one." - some wiseass or another. I forget who.

long story short, I dont think I'm ready to give up on this being the object of our search just yet.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

13 Dec 2008 at 05:22 - 37

Do note that the word short is in quotation marks. Sometimes this represent sarcasm, so it could be in fact a long walk instead of a short walk.

While I couldn't translate it, I saw something interesting which is off-topic to this, so I won't bring it up until I make a new thread.

You can keep on this object and credit will go to you if it is, but my guild and myself are hoping that this is in fact not the language, as it would be too short of a search and would leave the lore community back to being inactive.

Free Runner

Forge Runner

Join Date: Oct 2005

GW2G

Knights Of The Sacred Light [KSL]

13 Dec 2008 at 11:40 - 38

Its hard to tell if they have overexagerated on it. I can see similarites to other runic languages such as Norse.

Any chance you could post a full image of all the text? the part at the bottom is cut off.

Konig Des Todes

Ooo, pretty flower

Join Date: Jan 2008

Citadel of the Decayed

The Archivists' Sanctum [Lore]

N/

13 Dec 2008 at 14:12 - 39

Check the attachment for the full sign, lighted up.

Sir Cusfreak

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2007

In your backline

No Tags [NONE]

13 Dec 2008 at 18:50 - 40

@ Azazal:

of course he was being sarcastic.

I'd also like to point out that Mr. Medina also put the word "translatable" in quotation marks.

at first when I saw the "short" walk comment, I figured for sure it meant this would be Dwarven or Asuran...but after looking at where these signposts are, I think the sarcasm may come from the fact that there's really no walk at all, not that it's a real hike.

Just an opinion, meaningless as all the rest.

Have fun.