Hi - This is a good dervish build, stop asking if yours is.
Super Igor
So is it going to kill shit or stand there spamming [draw conditions]? wtf leave you heroes to remove conditions give this moar dommages and moar [save yourselves].
iVendetta
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Originally Posted by Lusciious
@vendetta, dervs aren't casters so i don't see why you need 6-8 energy regen.
You mentioned energy management. ;3
iVendetta
[[Asuran Scan] is not always useful considering you're not trying for single-target spikes in PvE.
Darkside
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Originally Posted by MegaVolti
I could just as easily say:
Auto attack minimal damage: 9
Auto attack minimal damage with [[Asuran scan]: 13
Victorious sweep: 38 (= 9 + 29)
Obviously [[Victorious Sweep] is stronger then the Scan Yes I know this calculation is wrong, but so is yours. Actually mine is a little closer to the truth then yours
Of cause, if you always assume a critical strike then the +% from [[asuran scan] will beat anything, but that's simply not the case in the game.
Also my numbers are not "wrong" they are optimistic there is a difference.
If you're not convinced that's fine.
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Quote: No you did not back up your argument in any way because your assumptions are wrong.
A calculation based on wrong assumptions does not prove anything.
Your assumption that you only face AR 60 targets and get a critical with every single attack is obviously wrong. *sigh* The reason I used 60 AR target was because all those test numbers were taken from a thread I posted a couple months ago showing the highest possible damage a dervish could do. Since the object of those tests was to see the maximum possible damage it made sense to use the 60 AR targets.
Anyway, I wasn't assuming every single attack was going to be a critical. How many times do I need to type that? I'm just showing the damage potential that is there when using Asura Scan in combination with Aura of Holy Might. I'm not gonna go spend an hour testing for new damage numbers against a higher AR target just for you.
Asuran Scan is not always useful considering you're not trying for single-target spikes in PvE.
You will always be hitting at least one target, hitting more then one target is just a bonus of using a scythe and if you can kill even one of those targets faster then I'm for that. I find that in HM removing priority targets is key, annoying healers, or ele's that do crazy AoE thats where Asuran scan really shines. MegaVolti
Lol. You are funny
First, [[Conjure Flame] or any other conjure don't really do well with [[aura of holy might]. Second, as you have proven yourself by posting these numbers, your "test setup" is completely unrealistic and will about never happen in any even remotely real situation. And still you assume criticals with every hit which isn't even remotely realistic. Hint: You can only bring 3 PvE skills, one of which has to be [[eternal aura] since we are talking about avatar builds here. So yes, it's all fiction. MegaVolti
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Originally Posted by Darkside
The point of my test was to show the highest possible damage and obviously unless you are a complete moron you can figure out on your own that you will not be getting a critical on every single attack, but that overall average attack damage will still be increased whether you get a critical attack or not. As for your "hint" I was talking about a wounding strike build not an avatar build so again that wonderful "hint" of yours is full of stupid. The highest possible damage in one hit is completely and utterly irrelevant in our discussion. You say: Auto attack + Asuran scan is better I say: Victorious Sweep is better You are just wrong. On average damage, meaning DPS, Victorious Sweep will do a lot more donus damage then Asuran Scan. Yes, if you critical against an AL60 target then Asuran Scan wins. But we are talking about builds for "real" situations here and in HM you will neither find AL60 targets not will you get a critical strike very often (chances vs high lvel targets are considerably lower). Your calculation is completely pointless. Anwyn
When I Scythe in HM on my derv, I score crits all the time... 15 in Scythe ftw...
gunster
Here's my solution:
Switch to war, run DS/SY! + BH Sorry, just thought i'd lighten up the mood here :P Lucian
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Originally Posted by MegaVolti
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I thought normal monster AL was the same, you just don't do the same damage because of the increased difference in levels.
Here's my solution: Switch to war, run DS/SY! + BH + Steelfang Slash. My solution... have both a Warrior and a Dervish. Swap to one when you feel bored with the other. This thread has me thinking that my recently neglected Derv needs some love. *runs off to try Melandru builds* Jeydra
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Originally Posted by MegaVolti
You say: Auto attack + Asuran scan is better I say: Victorious Sweep is better You are just wrong. On average damage, meaning DPS, Victorious Sweep will do a lot more donus damage then Asuran Scan. Yes, if you critical against an AL60 target then Asuran Scan wins. But we are talking about builds for "real" situations here and in HM you will neither find AL60 targets not will you get a critical strike very often (chances vs high lvel targets are considerably lower). Your calculation is completely pointless. |
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I see. Thanks. That makes sense, I just never gave it much thought, I guess. The most HM I've done has been farming and vanquishing with Sabway/Discord necros, so I just never paid much attention to the effects of damage reduction. I figured lower damage was mostly from level difference.
Originally Posted by MegaVolti
"Optimistic" is just plain wrong. Imaginary would be the right word. There is nothing even remotely realistic about your numbers.
For a real comparison you have to take average damage and not max damage. Average damage of a scythe 25. With high mastery the critical chance is only about 20%, which increases the average damage to about 30. That's nowhere near the 86 you claim. In fact the 86 is wrong, even if you could critical with every hit. Critical means max damage (which is 41) and 50% bonus damage, so you end up with about 60 for a critical and not 86. Therefore his calculation proves you wrong. Lucian
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Originally Posted by MegaVolti
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As for the OP AoM build, I gave it a tryout. My Derv hasn't got Asura Scan yet, so I wasn't running that. But that's beside the point, I can see the concerns over energy because I felt like the build was a lot to handle with AoM, and the two 10e enchantments. I took a N/Mo with Patient Spirit and Dark Fury. I'd cast AoM just before aggro, target myself and click the hero's bar for Patient Spirit/Dark Fury/Patient Spirit to get some energy back for the fight, but then casting AoHM and Eternal Aura once into battle and it's a big energy drop again. It works well (really nice for the Norn area mandragors), but felt like it required too much micro management.
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Quote: No you did not back up your argument in any way because your assumptions are wrong.
A calculation based on wrong assumptions does not prove anything.
Your assumption that you only face AR 60 targets and get a critical with every single attack is obviously wrong. *sigh* The reason I used 60 AR target was because all those test numbers were taken from a thread I posted a couple months ago showing the highest possible damage a dervish could do. Since the object of those tests was to see the maximum possible damage it made sense to use the 60 AR targets.
Anyway, I wasn't assuming every single attack was going to be a critical. How many times do I need to type that? I'm just showing the damage potential that is there when using Asura Scan in combination with Aura of Holy Might. I'm not gonna go spend an hour testing for new damage numbers against a higher AR target just for you.
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So I do not have to provide anything here. You provided a calculation based on wrong assumptions. If you want to be taken seriously you have to correct your calculation to match realistic (meaning: common in HM) conditions.
Not completely unrealistic. One of my necro heroes brings along cracked armor thus lowering the targets AR. I often see huge numbers even in HM. Of course that is completely dependent on what heroes you bring and what skills are on their bars. Just saying the damage table is not irrelevant even in HM. Quote:
Yes what if indeed...there are what if's for every situation and skill in the game. I could argue that Dwayna is the best avatar because IF you get hexed with blurred vision or reckless haste you can't hit the side of a barn. Just because Avatar of Dwayna is a counter for those two hex's doesn't make it the best elite skill choice ALL the time. BUT it's probably a good choice in hex heavy areas. Same can be said about AoM unless you are going to encounter mass conditions that will overwhelm the monks in your party there isn't a need to be immune to them.
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