Slightly modified PS sin build

Cobalic

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2009

This isn't a super modified PS sin build, but I thought I'd share anyway.

[Critical strike][Palm strike][Trampling ox][Falling lotus strike][Twisting Fangs][Critical Defense][Dash][Resurrection Signet]

Yes, apparently this is a big deal to some people, I did test this in RA/TA.

Critical defense is one thing I didn't see in average wiki builds and that I like a lot. It makes it much harder for warrior to backline you, and sins are fairly squishy.

I'm not sure how useful critical strike is - for the most part, you can maintain crit defense without it. If you're getting blocked/stanced, theres no reason crit strike won't be blocked too, and you'll probably lose the crit defense.

Falling lotus' energy gain was very useful - imo. A lot of people use falling spider. What I like about PS is it's 4 second recharge - and with falling lotus you have the energy to repeat and repeat your combo until you drop a target.

Dash is another skill I think is variable. For targets that kite, it's enough for you to get close and land PS. Flail would be nice, so maybe take out crit strike for flail? I just think that what does the most damage is the whole combo, not attacking without using skills. You attack fast enough to drop a target quickly even without flail, but it may still be useful. I dunno.

Bowstring Badass

Bowstring Badass

Forge Runner

Join Date: Nov 2005

Character selection screen figuring what I want to play...

Purple Lingerie - :D

Take falling spider if you have critical strike. Palm Strike > crit strike when you need energy imo.

Another thing I think would be more useful would be an IAS.

Stealth Bomberman

Stealth Bomberman

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobalic View Post
Critical defense is one thing I didn't see in average wiki builds and that I like a lot. It makes it much harder for warrior to backline you, and sins are fairly squishy.

[critical defense] is lame. if ur using it in TA, ur wasting a slot. bring a monk to keep u up, plus if ur dieing to fast ur health is to low. avg health for sin should be 600-630hp.

if u want defense on a sin, try using [way of perfection] or [signet of malice]. these skills go a long way with PS sins since conditions are always on target.

dont waste energy keeping up [critical defense] when u could waste energy killing ppl.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cobalic View Post
Dash is another skill I think is variable. For targets that kite, it's enough for you to get close and land PS. in arena, every1 has to stop and cast once in a while (monks, rits) so kitting wont be a huge problem once u put cripple on em.

imo, ur relying to much on PS to get the job done. if it gets dshotted or diversioned, ur screwed. lose crit d and bring [leaping mantis sting] and dash for [wild strike] or [jungle strike] then complete ur chain. its better than being a blockbot.

Cobalic

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jan 2009

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth Bomberman View Post
[critical defense] is lame. if ur using it in TA, ur wasting a slot. bring a monk to keep u up, plus if ur dieing to fast ur health is to low. avg health for sin should be 600-630hp.

if u want defense on a sin, try using [way of perfection] or [signet of malice]. these skills go a long way with PS sins since conditions are always on target.

dont waste energy keeping up [critical defense] when u could waste energy killing ppl.
I have to disgree with that. In the current RA/TA meta, just about every team has melee. You won't be able to heal yourself out of a hole with way of perfection. And melee relies on landing hits to kill, beyond the obvious. A sin that can't land hits can't complete a combo, warriors that don't land hits don't have adrenaline.

I think pretty much any build in RA/TA should have some prot/defense. Monks are easily overwhelmed. That's the whole reasoning behind backlining, you take pressure off your monks by pressuring/killing the offense.

As an example, I saw a team in TA with two sins (using crit defense), a necro with stances, and a monk with stances. There was no easy target, and we lost in record time.

And as a side note, people that use pure offense builds in RA/TA and attack the monk only are extremely frustrating as a monk. They might kill the monk, but whoop de do - you're trying to heal the team from an offense that isn't shut down in any way. Then of course you die, the team dies, and everyone blames the monk.

And think about it. If you drop the monk, you have about 3 seconds to kill someone before the monk gets resd. If you drop someone on offense, your monk has a chance to gain energy, and now you have an easier DP'ed characted you can switch to and drop easily.
Quote:
Pretty much this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth Bomberman View Post
in arena, every1 has to stop and cast once in a while (monks, rits) so kitting wont be a huge problem once u put cripple on em. Not if they stop to cast guardian.

And I'm not up to date on all the acronyms. What's IAS? It's familiar, but I can't remember.

Super Igor

Banned

Join Date: Mar 2008

why should you kno? Oo

A/W

Normal ps bar but worse with no ias and crit defense LOL thumbs down

Painbringer

Painbringer

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

Minnesota

Black Widows of Death

W/Mo

[palm strike] [trampling ox] [golden lotus strike] [wild strike] [blades of steel] [assassin's remedy] [Critical Defenses] [shadow refuge]

I find the above somewhat effective it has something for everyone. But I am not totally sold on it.

Super Igor

Banned

Join Date: Mar 2008

why should you kno? Oo

A/W

[palm strike][flail][trampling ox][falling spider][horns of the ox][falling lotus strike][twisting fangs][dash]

[flurry] and [resurrection signet] instead of [flail] and [dash] for RA.

vtheglad

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Feb 2009

Sin

A/

one thing about the set up with trmp ox + falling spider + twisting fang, if you notice, it's the low dmg capacity. (combo only gives about 300 dmg max, that's usually half hp)
Sure you have -8 condition but purge, will do that right in and you have to wait for 15 sec to start that combo again. (600 hp, monk or warrior usually have the time to heal it right back up).

Rez sig is useless imo, in TA if a sin needs to rez then the team is in pretty bad shape.
If you're In RA that's understandable, but ...next game will starts in 40 sec, why bother rezting when you just grab the next team with a monk that can rez?

However, there is no perfect built. If you're grab crit def, then surely you'll live by stands toe-to-toe with other melee built (which is good), only 10energy, for 10 sec (yes I have 15 crit strike), if you're enchantment running low, just grab some minions, spirit or some monks, w/o stances and start wailing on him to get the crit def back up. (I usually only have to redo crit stance once a match).

Sin, with high dag and high crit skill, the normal dmg is around 37each, dmg (depends on ur dagger, sundering or not), it'll do more dmg faster than any skills if ur wailing on non-melee stance target. Free energy, and supressing their hp.

However, The built describes below have the greatest weakness, Mesmer, they slow you, put on diversion, empathy, energy stealing, and hex -8, this will do you in, ain't matter what. (if you're know ur encountering one, make sure you kill it first b4 it kills you).
or spike nuker, ain't a skills below can counter it, you'll get blinding flash, + 400 dmg thru nuke.

Solution?, dark escape. (400 dmg nuke, will only result in 200dmg), sounds good?
or classic sin tactic, Palm strike, .....poison, ....bleeds...then run!, have them crippling to you with -7 healths. Come back when they're busy healing themselves

What do sin do when they have melee def such as crit def?...lol run, dark escape, triggers it, palm strike and wait till it out, then come back with ur own crit def...xD
(only one of Many solutions). Remove stances, or just deadly art!!!
SIGnet, of toxic, 90 dmg, no energy cost.
(set back...6 skills, that'd leave you with extra 2 slots for self-surviving), no good, if you're want to have a balance game.

Suggestion:
Palm strike specialist,
PS, Trm OX, FL SPID, TWST FNG, DTH CH (great healing skills + need the spd to kill ...caster), CRIT DEF, DRK ESCP, YOUR ChoICE.

know your job, wut you need to do, don't try to do everything, 8 skills is not alot to do "everything".
GO for DD, monk rusher, caster shut-down, melee freak, or condition spammer.
Choose one and do well at it.

X Cytherea X

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

A/Mo

[palm strike][trampling ox][falling lotus strike][twisting fangs][blades of steel][remove hex][mending touch][resurrection signet]

this is the best palm strike build for RA.

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

The lure of BoS had me enthralled for a while, too. Dual KD is totally worth the damage sacrifice, though.

Sorry Shinde

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

It just looks like you replaced Flail with Crit Defenses and Death Blossom with Critical Strike.

I'm not impressed.

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

Your thinking fails.

X Cytherea X

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

A/Mo

you gain 100+ more damage with blades. you dont need to kd what's dead.

ele pl

ele pl

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2007

E/

Quote:
Originally Posted by X Cytherea X View Post
[palm strike][trampling ox][falling lotus strike][twisting fangs][blades of steel][remove hex][mending touch][resurrection signet]

this is the best palm strike build for RA.
Actually, it's exactly 100. KD is still more powerful. It's a team game. Being able to remove conditions/hexes from your allys>KD. It's a team game.

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by ele pl View Post
Being able to remove conditions/hexes from your allys>KD. It's a team game. Where did I mention taking HotO over those 2 Monk skills? Learn to reason, please.

X Cytherea X

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

A/Mo

Quote:
Actually, it's exactly 100. KD is still more powerful. It's a team game.
so kd occasionally stops a skill from activating, sometimes it is an important one. but the threat is not over if the target is still alive. in RA, you cannot depend on your team to bring the damage, much less hit the guy you're kd-ing. id rather kill and be done with it.

Quote:
Being able to remove conditions/hexes from your allys>KD. It's a team game. it's mostly for oneself but yes it can used on allies too. it's a very reliable bar

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

If you knock someone down, then you have quite a few advantages.

- It interrupts a skill.
- It disables the usage of the majority of skills.
- It sets up a knockdown chain to keep people from using skills, and sets up someone else to throw a D-Shot off, get in a better position for a kill and various other scenarios which include more defensive uses if need be.

Saying that it will only "interrupt a skill occasionally" is dumb and closed minded to all of the kill oppertunities and tactics that can be exploited by such tactics.

You also have a more flexible bar with HoTo. Not necessarily more powerful in "123456lolurded", but in utility.

I think I'd take the ability to aid others in their killing while holding better defense.

X Cytherea X

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

A/Mo

Quote:
kd is awesome. End of story. it prevents kiting, prevents healing, can be used defensively to stop someone from raping your own monk. there's a reason why war hammer kd attacks are so freaking expensive. no trampling on a ps sin is fail.
trampling is on the bar dumbass learn2read lol

Quote:
I think I'd take the ability to aid others in their killing while holding better defense. that's not a role i like to play

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by X Cytherea X View Post
so kd occasionally stops a skill from activating, sometimes it is an important one. I will stop arguing with you here. We play totally different games.

Lusciious

Lusciious

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2009

I'm from Singapore but i live in Shanghai ATM

Order of [Thay]

N/

Quote:
Originally Posted by X Cytherea X
View Post
[palm strike][trampling ox][falling lotus strike][twisting fangs][blades of steel][remove hex][mending touch][resurrection signet]

this is the best palm strike build for RA.
so a chain like PS -> Trampling -> Lotus -> Twisting Fangs before using the same chain but now with blades of steel ? if there is a healer, the other chain wouldn't be as good since your DW is removed.

off topic: i'd rather get [backbreaker][flurry][falling spider][twisting fangs][falling lotus strike][blades of steel]. a normal BB bar is probably the strongest spike bar you can get. probably cus nobody likes building up adren. it only takes 10 seconds to build up the adren needed to use BB. lets say if you're going against a monk, you wouldnt be able to kill anyone unless you assist someone's spike or the monk fail at monking. but with BB, you can even kill a 100al when your spike finishes ( go test it at the isle of nameless ) and monks usually cast Patient spirit when you do twisting fangs and with an IAS, you'd be able to use Falling lotus + Blades of steel faster than Patient spirit's end effect can take place. i've killed many 60al profession in monk teams. try it for yourself if you don't believe.

back to topic: and PS can be easily interupted. so .. and without an IAS, your chain wouldn't be as effective as monks can easily negate your spike.

@ele pl, yeah i agree its a team game. no offence but its with people like you with that cause RA to be so easy. you bring hybrid builds thinking that you can assist + kill which isn't true when your damage can't do much at all.
sins usually don't pressure. they spike. thats what they're made for. so you're saying a w/mo with healing breeze to help heal party members ?

ele pl

ele pl

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2007

E/

@up

Well, i understand your point. For long time, i was against all Cytherea's builds, because i though it was just version of wammo with assassin primary. I changed my mind, when i played that build once. A sin with this bar can kill, even without IAS, mending touch and holy veil is to counter the best counter to the sins, like blind and melee hexes. Also, hybrid builds are fun imo

Stealth Bomberman

Stealth Bomberman

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Oct 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lusciious View Post
sins usually don't pressure. they spike. thats what they're made for. no other prof can incorporate multiple conditions and hexes in one bar like sins. they're a pressure class to me with the potential to spike.

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth Bomberman View Post
no other prof can incorporate multiple conditions and hexes in one bar like sins. they're a pressure class to me with the potential to spike. Man PS really fked up some people brains...

Bobby2

Bobby2

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2007

Delayed in order to meet ANet's high standards

[MaSS]

W/E

Oh, but I was. If your remark didn't stem from warped views caused by extensive PS usage, I'd like to know what counts as 'pressure' for your argument...

X Cytherea X

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

A/Mo

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lusciious View Post
so a chain like PS -> Trampling -> Lotus -> Twisting Fangs before using the same chain but now with blades of steel ? if there is a healer, the other chain wouldn't be as good since your DW is removed.
no, it's ps-to-fls-tf-ps-bos. 61+160++ damage on a target with dw is epic pain.

Quote: off topic: i'd rather get [backbreaker][flurry][falling spider][twisting fangs][falling lotus strike][blades of steel]. a normal BB bar is probably the strongest spike bar you can get. probably cus nobody likes building up adren. it only takes 10 seconds to build up the adren needed to use BB. lets say if you're going against a monk, you wouldnt be able to kill anyone unless you assist someone's spike or the monk fail at monking. but with BB, you can even kill a 100al when your spike finishes ( go test it at the isle of nameless ) and monks usually cast Patient spirit when you do twisting fangs and with an IAS, you'd be able to use Falling lotus + Blades of steel faster than Patient spirit's end effect can take place. i've killed many 60al profession in monk teams. try it for yourself if you don't believe. yeah but if a blindbot or any average nec so much as looks at you, you can expect to spend most of the match doing pretty much nothing. and dont tell me "kill him first/run away/wait for it to wear off/let your monk remove it", nothing beats removing it yourself right when you need to. i can even do this mid-combo, it must surprise the shit out of the poor antimelee im slaying.

now if you were talking about TA, i would gladly leave the cleanup to the designated guy on the team and possibly bring a bar like that one.

Quote:
back to topic: and PS can be easily interupted. so .. and without an IAS, your chain wouldn't be as effective as monks can easily negate your spike. no they fail quite a lot.

Quote:
@ele pl, yeah i agree its a team game. no offence but its with people like you with that cause RA to be so easy. you bring hybrid builds thinking that you can assist + kill which isn't true when your damage can't do much at all.
sins usually don't pressure. they spike. thats what they're made for. so you're saying a w/mo with healing breeze to help heal party members ? not healing breeze. but if he brought my same 2 monk skills, he would be decent. healing breeze is a weak defensive skill. but get this... [remove hex] and [mending touch] on a sin in RA are powerful offensive skills, more so than an ias, and they will bring you more success.

X Cytherea X

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Feb 2006

A/Mo

Quote:
Against a blindbot or an average nec you would spend most of your time pretty much doing nothing EVEN with remove hex and mending touch. Faintheartedness or IP covered with parasitic is the least you will get. And thats still pretty lucky, imagine a mesmer there as well.
Ebon Dust Aura/bsurge low recharge simply owns mending touch so.. If you want to make yourself clean go Mo/A with PnH at least in the current meta.
Quote:
Also, if a Necromancer is hexing you, Veil will be a lot better, and if a blindbot is coming onto you, you'll probably be blind more than you can remove. That, and when you cast, you also get this thing called "aftercast" which lets them have even more time to move away from you, and that makes a problem when you don't have an IMS of some sort. i wont try to remove every single blind or hex. sometimes i even let them stay on and spam palm strike until i successfully time the removal simultaneously with the cond/hex application and use moments of (relative or complete) cleanliness to get kills. i also try to trample their recast of any antimelee stuff.