[shadow form] ---> [Spell breaker]x[dryder's defenses]x[death's charge]
shadowstep to target foe for 3-7 seconds you cant be the target of spells and you have 100% to block end effect lose 10% of your health
The reason I am suggesting this because every now and then i try something with shadow form in Random Arenas when it ends i lose all but 40hp 1 hit and im done -.-
nerfing shadow form without killing it
Lourens
zwei2stein
Eww.
In order to be viable without perma-ability, SF needs to stop dropping health when it ends. If you do that, it will work.
In order to be viable without perma-ability, SF needs to stop dropping health when it ends. If you do that, it will work.
MagmaRed
3-7 seconds of 75% blocking is killing the skill, which you said you didn't want to do. You can still take hits from skills that ignore blocking (Wild Blow/Strike/Throw, Sun and Moon, etc.) and you still suffer damage from spells. If it has a 3-7 second duration, the recharge would need to be 10-15 seconds, anything longer would make it useless.
Although I don't like the idea of perma, I don't see this as an effective change to the skill.... not at all.
Although I don't like the idea of perma, I don't see this as an effective change to the skill.... not at all.
Alex Dimitri
@OP
This is you solution for the skill ? Who would use Elite like that ??
I mean really, just give it a rest and leave this skill alone it`s been nerfed enough !
This is you solution for the skill ? Who would use Elite like that ??
I mean really, just give it a rest and leave this skill alone it`s been nerfed enough !
Damian979
I guess it is time for another "something something shadowform something" thread. These always pop up every few weeks like herpes. Get some cream and let it be.
jiggles
Just kill it.
dasmitchies
Since nobody can permaform in pvp I still can't understand why there is so much hate for it. And dont whine it's about the economy stupid, it is not like anet is going to change UW back to it's former self if SF gets nerfed. Someone close this thread.
DeFFik
Kill perma. Kill all farmer builds so noone could do it...
Kill, Maim, Burn, like Kharn the Betrayer(wh40k universum) says.
/having bad day today, needed that. Umh, not signed...
Kill, Maim, Burn, like Kharn the Betrayer(wh40k universum) says.
/having bad day today, needed that. Umh, not signed...
Skyy High
I think this is one of the better ideas for the skill I've seen so far. Just take out the 75% blocking and keep "all attacks against you miss" and we have a winner. Also, make it so that it can't be perma-ed. In its current form, Shadow form is either useless or broken, that's just the way it is. No one used it when it came out except the Afflicted, because it could only be kept up about 1/3 the time, and it basically guaranteed that the sin would die if he used it without telling the monk (which naturally would always happen in a PUG).
Shayne Hawke
"Nerf without killing" is what they've done since last summer or so when permaformers started raping the UW for ectos.
Just kill it already.
Just kill it already.
Kattar
So, you've suggested a nerf. But why? Why is there a need to mess with SF more?
More reasoning is needed.
More reasoning is needed.
Skyy High
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Katsumi
So, you've suggested a nerf. But why? Why is there a need to mess with SF more?
More reasoning is needed. |
Kattar
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Skyy High
Because the continued existence of 3 skill permanent invulnerability combo makes a mockery of every other balance ever done for the sake of PvE, most notably UB, the minion cap, and AI fleeing from AoE.
|
Konig Des Todes
How about just changing Sliver Armor to not work alongside Shadow Form, that would nerf the most effective Perma SF farming around.
Or, remove the end effect *loss of health*, turn the skill into a Skill or Form instead of an Enchantment, and have it set up that at 12 you have 5 second downtime - at 16 you have 3 seconds downtime, or less.
Four simple things that will not slaughter the skill, but makes Perma SF less viable.
The reason why the nerfing to the skill has not worked is because they are only changing the duration and recharge - aside from adding the damage nerf.
But, to me, as long as Perma SF exists, I think Ursan should return, Spell Break should be buffed, and every profession given their own "Godmode" - that way one profession will not rule them all.
Or, remove the end effect *loss of health*, turn the skill into a Skill or Form instead of an Enchantment, and have it set up that at 12 you have 5 second downtime - at 16 you have 3 seconds downtime, or less.
Four simple things that will not slaughter the skill, but makes Perma SF less viable.
The reason why the nerfing to the skill has not worked is because they are only changing the duration and recharge - aside from adding the damage nerf.
But, to me, as long as Perma SF exists, I think Ursan should return, Spell Break should be buffed, and every profession given their own "Godmode" - that way one profession will not rule them all.
Loki Seiguro
/notsigned
I don't know what you are going on about but nerfing shadow form and puting in those three skills is a waste. 3 > 1 is it not? So instead of using one skill slot you are now using 3
.
As for perma SFers ruining pve for you then join a guild that doesn't perma Sf and runs balance or something.
So stop complaining about SF and what not like those other people.
I don't know what you are going on about but nerfing shadow form and puting in those three skills is a waste. 3 > 1 is it not? So instead of using one skill slot you are now using 3
.As for perma SFers ruining pve for you then join a guild that doesn't perma Sf and runs balance or something.
So stop complaining about SF and what not like those other people.
Xsiriss
Damn shadowform haters. So what, people can obtain decent amounts of money without having to confront the elitist pricks of all the old 'team' builds. Which also too revolved around exploit (eg. B/P). Y'all need moar cowbell.
FoxBat
Lindsey already mentioned that SF continues to be a problem, measured primarily by the enabling of UWSC, and is something to be looked at once the big april update is finished. If perma wasn't going to be killed outright, she would need time/ideas to try and adjust the skill further.
What the OP posted was more like a "total rework" of the elite as we had in the past, trying to make this a viable and interesting PvP skill. It would about obliterate it from the farming world, that's generally the point; if some people played around with it in AB then all the better.
Sticking with the current "SF is for PvE' track, A PvE-only version that wasn't perma-able, but let you keep your health, sounds fair to me. It would still be useable for certain sliver farms where you kill the target fast, such as green farming; it might be viable in other instances where you use shadowsteps to escape (there was an old build for soloing tombs like this); and it would still be fairly strong at tanking the initial onslaught of whatever.
To make the skill more versatile and less narrowly farm-y, I'd make it into a self-disabling form like the dervish skills. It could then even have 30s uptime and 45s recharge. You might even set the pvp version up like this, the only difference being that the pvp one drops your health. (It's just far too abuseable otherwise.)
What the OP posted was more like a "total rework" of the elite as we had in the past, trying to make this a viable and interesting PvP skill. It would about obliterate it from the farming world, that's generally the point; if some people played around with it in AB then all the better.
Sticking with the current "SF is for PvE' track, A PvE-only version that wasn't perma-able, but let you keep your health, sounds fair to me. It would still be useable for certain sliver farms where you kill the target fast, such as green farming; it might be viable in other instances where you use shadowsteps to escape (there was an old build for soloing tombs like this); and it would still be fairly strong at tanking the initial onslaught of whatever.
To make the skill more versatile and less narrowly farm-y, I'd make it into a self-disabling form like the dervish skills. It could then even have 30s uptime and 45s recharge. You might even set the pvp version up like this, the only difference being that the pvp one drops your health. (It's just far too abuseable otherwise.)
Bong Bro Zac
/not signed
imo opinion awful idea but still not as bad as having perma SF... i think they should increase the length slightly and the recharge a ton... it was commonly used for green farming long before "permas". even though i hate to say it i think perma SF is here to stay there are just too many fans of those mountains of easy 123 cash. 1000 times more unbalenced than ursan was
imo opinion awful idea but still not as bad as having perma SF... i think they should increase the length slightly and the recharge a ton... it was commonly used for green farming long before "permas". even though i hate to say it i think perma SF is here to stay there are just too many fans of those mountains of easy 123 cash. 1000 times more unbalenced than ursan was
Sage Tylos
I agree that what Shadow Form needs is some sort of alteration to its functionality. Personally, I feel that combining [[Spell Breaker] and a buffed version of [[Mist Form] into a single skill was a terrible idea and should never have happened in the first place - that's just too powerful. There's a reason they make ele's chose between [[Mist Form] and [[Obsidian Flesh] (both are elites and tied to different attributes): Both at once would be godly, and that's what Shadow Form is. As long as it's a single skill that makes you immune to almost all mechanics, it will always be either overpowered or worthless. You can't balance that sort of functionality by simply adjusting enchant duration vs. skill recharge time.
That said, I also agree with MagmaRed:
The skill needs an alteration to its functionality, but the OP's idea wouldn't really work.
That said, I also agree with MagmaRed:
Quote:
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
I don't see this as an effective change to the skill.... not at all.
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Loki Seiguro
OK, having a down time is somehting but if I remember correctly you could bring eternal aura(is the SS dervish skill that does an instant recharge) and perma SF is back up 
Hailey Anne
/not signed.
Shadow Form is fine as is.
Shadow Form is fine as is.
T. Drake
Who would use Shadow Form as an offensive skill with the massive health loss?
Reduce the activation time, remove the health loss and let it end prematurely if another (offensive) skill is activated. This would turn this skill into a defensive one, like it was supposed to be (right?).
But to be honest, I don’t care.
Reduce the activation time, remove the health loss and let it end prematurely if another (offensive) skill is activated. This would turn this skill into a defensive one, like it was supposed to be (right?).
But to be honest, I don’t care.
Yawgmoth
SF is an AWESOME skill even WITHOUT the ability to perma it, and without perma it still has a ton of uses
The only good way to fix it is removing the ability to maintain it permanently, for example by:
-Changing it to a FORM instead of Spell/Enchantment (no Arcane Echo)
-Making it DISABLE itself for a given amount of time, for example 45 seconds. No faster recharge skills should change that.
-Lenghten it's duration to make up for the loss of +20% Longer Enchantments.
-Optional: Make it so you lose only HALF of health when SF ends instead of dropping to ~40.
-Optional: Remove the -33%dmg, but I'd rather keep it.
The skill would be still viable in A LOT of farming and running applications, it just wouldn't be an Uber God Mode which is beyond imba.
Nonperma SF is also Much more FUN to play - I use it all the time for years, in a lot of different places so I know that.
The only good way to fix it is removing the ability to maintain it permanently, for example by:
-Changing it to a FORM instead of Spell/Enchantment (no Arcane Echo)
-Making it DISABLE itself for a given amount of time, for example 45 seconds. No faster recharge skills should change that.
-Lenghten it's duration to make up for the loss of +20% Longer Enchantments.
-Optional: Make it so you lose only HALF of health when SF ends instead of dropping to ~40.
-Optional: Remove the -33%dmg, but I'd rather keep it.
The skill would be still viable in A LOT of farming and running applications, it just wouldn't be an Uber God Mode which is beyond imba.
Nonperma SF is also Much more FUN to play - I use it all the time for years, in a lot of different places so I know that.
Damian979
2006 original functionality but make it a skill instead of a spell = no more perma = no more obnoxious whining about sf.
Then we can see even more people leave gw because face it, what is there left to do but farm cash to pay for grinding titles or play in a dead and rotting pvp environment?
Then we can see even more people leave gw because face it, what is there left to do but farm cash to pay for grinding titles or play in a dead and rotting pvp environment?
Gift3d
Shadow form. Up the duration a few seconds, take away the 33% less damage, and add one thing that will solve most of the SF abuse:
While Shadow Form is up, you cannot cast enchantments.
Just like shadow walk. Annnnnnnnd, done.
While Shadow Form is up, you cannot cast enchantments.
Just like shadow walk. Annnnnnnnd, done.
destroythecity
This is a simple matter of the way the game was designed to played. Professions were made to be mixed and played together, in balanced team builds (or with henchmen/heroes) It is for this reason that they made professions so that they could not over-tank, or over-heal/buff themselves. That they would have to help other team mates by buffing them, or taking/dealing damage while being buffed. When PvE was balanced in the first years of GuildWars, things were fine. Fissure of Woe and Underworld were still elite areas, which I do no think they should be considered that anymore. And ectoplasm prices would hover between 8-10K.
We saw this change when ArenaNet added new gameplay choices to the game. We saw ectoplasm prices drop an extreme amount when the new 'Ursan Meta' came into play and balanced teams were impossible to find. That was near destroyed and things remained stable for a short period of time. But then Shadow Form when combined with several other skills becomes a super skill and one profession is pulled into the meta. Ectoplasm prices have again dropped a severe amount and once elite skins have been diminished into nothing.
Does anyone remember when a perfect Elemental Sword was 100K +x amount of ectoplasm? I do, but that was all turned to ash. ArenaNet needs to configure some way to destroy this new Superman meta build and balance it out. I'm not going to spend time developing theories that will be rejected, but I am saying this needs to be done. I want a balanced PvE to return to GuildWars, a game were earning money took commitment and teamwork with other members. With such a powerful build this can not be done.
We saw this change when ArenaNet added new gameplay choices to the game. We saw ectoplasm prices drop an extreme amount when the new 'Ursan Meta' came into play and balanced teams were impossible to find. That was near destroyed and things remained stable for a short period of time. But then Shadow Form when combined with several other skills becomes a super skill and one profession is pulled into the meta. Ectoplasm prices have again dropped a severe amount and once elite skins have been diminished into nothing.
Does anyone remember when a perfect Elemental Sword was 100K +x amount of ectoplasm? I do, but that was all turned to ash. ArenaNet needs to configure some way to destroy this new Superman meta build and balance it out. I'm not going to spend time developing theories that will be rejected, but I am saying this needs to be done. I want a balanced PvE to return to GuildWars, a game were earning money took commitment and teamwork with other members. With such a powerful build this can not be done.
MithranArkanere
Well, I always though that Forms are a Dervish specialty.
but if they change it to a Form, I won't mind as long as they change the appearance of the character when that happens, to something like a Nightmare version of the character. (I know how you dye Anet, and I know that you can dye a whole model black that way!)
Assassins were going to have Traps, ritualists got spirits, assassins also got the maintained enchantments, paragons got a lot of shouts...
The skill intended behavior sounds quite like Forms. A HUGE advantage for some time, and then becomes useless for quite some more time.
So now I think that the Form way could be the way:
Elite Form. For 5...18...21 seconds, all hostile Spells that target you fail, all attacks against you miss, and you deal Dark Damage. This Skill is disabled for 120 seconds.
The huge recharge against the low duration would certainly ensure the skill is wisely used when the time is right, and the dark damage ignoring special armor bonuses (vs elements, vs phsycal) but not full armor bonuses(i.e. Dolyak signet) will compensate to make it a skill to 'go for a kill', and instead a skill to spamm as much as possible with the aid of echo and copy ally spells.
But I'm certainly against change in skill type to Form if the skill doesn't change appearance. It is enough having the Norn blessings being Forms when they do not turn you into an animal (Yeah, Norn may turn into Nornbear, but that doesn't mean a human can't turn into a bear).
but if they change it to a Form, I won't mind as long as they change the appearance of the character when that happens, to something like a Nightmare version of the character. (I know how you dye Anet, and I know that you can dye a whole model black that way!)
Assassins were going to have Traps, ritualists got spirits, assassins also got the maintained enchantments, paragons got a lot of shouts...
The skill intended behavior sounds quite like Forms. A HUGE advantage for some time, and then becomes useless for quite some more time.
So now I think that the Form way could be the way:
Elite Form. For 5...18...21 seconds, all hostile Spells that target you fail, all attacks against you miss, and you deal Dark Damage. This Skill is disabled for 120 seconds.
The huge recharge against the low duration would certainly ensure the skill is wisely used when the time is right, and the dark damage ignoring special armor bonuses (vs elements, vs phsycal) but not full armor bonuses(i.e. Dolyak signet) will compensate to make it a skill to 'go for a kill', and instead a skill to spamm as much as possible with the aid of echo and copy ally spells.
But I'm certainly against change in skill type to Form if the skill doesn't change appearance. It is enough having the Norn blessings being Forms when they do not turn you into an animal (Yeah, Norn may turn into Nornbear, but that doesn't mean a human can't turn into a bear).
Kanyatta
Quote:
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Originally Posted by MagmaRed
Although I don't like the idea of perma, I don't see this as an effective change to the skill.... not at all.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gift3d
While Shadow Form is up, you cannot cast enchantments.
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Vel
Current:
Full: For 5...18 seconds, all hostile spells that target you fail and all attacks against you miss, but you deal 33% less damage. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 5...41 Health.
Maybe in Future:
Full: For 8...18 seconds, all hostile skills that target you fail and all attacks against you miss, but you cannot deal any damage. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 50% Health.
Concise: Viable Tank. End of UWSC and Keg Dropping. Learn to play GW in other ways.
Full: For 5...18 seconds, all hostile spells that target you fail and all attacks against you miss, but you deal 33% less damage. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 5...41 Health.
Maybe in Future:
Full: For 8...18 seconds, all hostile skills that target you fail and all attacks against you miss, but you cannot deal any damage. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 50% Health.
Concise: Viable Tank. End of UWSC and Keg Dropping. Learn to play GW in other ways.
zling
for all you [shadow form] lovers, a little food for your thought:
why should a single skill, be it elite or not, make all other skills meant for the same purpose obselete?
in this case we're talking about [shadow form] and farming, why would you: 55, 130, 330, VwK Warrior, Glads Def Warrior, R/E spider farmer, etc when you have [shadow form]?
why on earth should Assassins be godly with this stupid skill and make all other professions obselete as far as farming, and even regular PvE if you insist, goes?
why on earth do we need actual GOD MODE? as if PvE and farming are not easy enough already...
why did ANet nerf Ursan, only to buff [shadow form] to its ridiculous form now? Ursan at least required an entire party... :\
so well, [shadow form] is NOT fine, and it has nothing to do with the economy and all other crap you guys are trying to defend against. it's simply got to do with freakin' ridiculous GOD MODE!!!
why should a single skill, be it elite or not, make all other skills meant for the same purpose obselete?
in this case we're talking about [shadow form] and farming, why would you: 55, 130, 330, VwK Warrior, Glads Def Warrior, R/E spider farmer, etc when you have [shadow form]?
why on earth should Assassins be godly with this stupid skill and make all other professions obselete as far as farming, and even regular PvE if you insist, goes?
why on earth do we need actual GOD MODE? as if PvE and farming are not easy enough already...
why did ANet nerf Ursan, only to buff [shadow form] to its ridiculous form now? Ursan at least required an entire party... :\
so well, [shadow form] is NOT fine, and it has nothing to do with the economy and all other crap you guys are trying to defend against. it's simply got to do with freakin' ridiculous GOD MODE!!!
MithranArkanere
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Vel
Current:
Full: For 5...18 seconds, all hostile spells that target you fail and all attacks against you miss, but you deal 33% less damage. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 5...41 Health. Maybe in Future: Full: For 8...18 seconds, all hostile skills that target you fail and all attacks against you miss, but you cannot deal any damage. When Shadow Form ends, lose all but 50% Health. Concise: Viable Tank. End of UWSC and Keg Dropping. Learn to play GW in other ways. |
Imagine shadow form as a way to get behind enemy lines holding the damage untill your job is done, and then receiving it in one hit.
Hey. That could be one way. It could stop making the attacks and spells fail, but 'save' the damage for later, with a minimum of 1 Health kept.
No one attacks you, you don't lose health. Enemies spike you, when the skill ends, you may be one hit away from death.
Assassins are not tanks, they are killers. They work to move to a target and deliver a death blow at all costs. Some times regardless of the consequences.
_Nihilist_
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sage Tylos
I agree that what Shadow Form needs is some sort of alteration to its functionality. Personally, I feel that combining [[Spell Breaker] and a buffed version of [[Mist Form] into a single skill was a terrible idea and should never have happened in the first place - that's just too powerful. There's a reason they make ele's chose between [[Mist Form] and [[Obsidian Flesh] (both are elites and tied to different attributes): Both at once would be godly, and that's what Shadow Form is. As long as it's a single skill that makes you immune to almost all mechanics, it will always be either overpowered or worthless. You can't balance that sort of functionality by simply adjusting enchant duration vs. skill recharge time.
|
I agree with the post above mine. Good idea. Nice explanation for the loss of HP @ the end of the skill. Makes sense, unlike the hordes of bitching from the "Don't Change my SF" camp across the way...
Kanyatta
Quote:
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Originally Posted by MithranArkanere
Imagine shadow form as a way to get behind enemy lines holding the damage untill your job is done, and then receiving it in one hit.
Hey. That could be one way. It could stop making the attacks and spells fail, but 'save' the damage for later, with a minimum of 1 Health kept. No one attacks you, you don't lose health. Enemies spike you, when the skill ends, you may be one hit away from death. Assassins are not tanks, they are killers. They work to move to a target and deliver a death blow at all costs. Some times regardless of the consequences. |
Shadow Form (Elite Form): Teleport to target foe's location. For 8...18 seconds you cannot cast enchantments, but receive no damage/conditions/hexes. When this form ends, you return to your original location and any damage/conditions/hexes that were previously negated are applied.
Puebert
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hailey Anne
/not signed.
Shadow Form is fine as is. |
Kill it.
For 1..1...2 (15 spec) seconds this skill does nothing. When it ends, you lose all but 1..1..2 (15 spec) health. This skill is disabled for 60 seconds.
Kanyatta
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Puebert
Its the biggest problem in PvE.
Kill it. For 1..1...2 (15 spec) seconds this skill does nothing. When it ends, you lose all health, and your account is perma-banned. |
12 chars.
Yawgmoth
Don't completely change functionality, don't make it a teleport skill or remove damage completely. The biggest problem is it's maintainability. Sins shouldn't be godlike tanks but this skills purpose should be a quick stealth attack and retreat or just moving through a few groups of enemies to a safe place, untouchable for a moment like a shadow.
Because abusing a stupidly overpowered skill is being good at the game?
Quote:
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Originally Posted by faraaz
Making money in game is a crime now? Sorry but not all of us like to make mounds of ecto by powertrading then pretend to actually be good at this game.
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Hugh Manatee
Quote:
| why on earth should Assassins be godly with this stupid skill and make all other professions obselete as far as farming, and even regular PvE if you insist, goes? |
IMO, nerf all farming, all of it, properly balance PvE mobs so that they have diverse and well thought out skills that challenge the player, every mob should have enchant stripping, decent healing, skills that go through blocking and ignore armor, the second, the instant, the moment something is discovered to have a flaw that makes it soloable, plug the hole in their defense. Every PvE mob should be like a compact GvG/HA team. Improve their AI to so if they see traps they send guy in protected to trip them while the others hang back, that if they get body blocked they'll try and run around the obstruction, give them all res sigs ect.
Nerf all the "lawlz I am invincible" skills(prot spirit, spirit bond, obsidian flesh, ect), make it so grouping up with players or a full diverse party of heroes is the actual only viable way to beat a zone.
Then make the quest rewards and drops worth that time and effort, No more of this YAY I beat a FOW quest I got 5-10k xp.... in a game where the level cap is 140k... Give them a decent gold or item reward, buff the drops from chests(if I get another R13 common skin offhand with imperfect mods from a chest in hard mode I'ma put my fist through a wall...) buff the drops from monsters, make it worthwhile to take the time and effort to play the game "correctly" then it won't be worth it to use stuff like SF, then we're on our way.
Literally [Shadow Form] is the least in a long line of farming junk and gimmick builds that's been going on from day 1. They had the right idea when they put the phantoms with signets in the UW, dunno why they moved them.
vandevere
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
you got it backwards, why should monks, warriors, rits, eles, dervs, necroes, mesmers, and rangers have all the viable farming PvE Invincibuilds, yet assassins get crap for farming.
IMO, nerf all farming, all of it, properly balance PvE mobs so that they have diverse and well thought out skills that challenge the player, every mob should have enchant stripping, decent healing, skills that go through blocking and ignore armor, the second, the instant, the moment something is discovered to have a flaw that makes it soloable, plug the hole in their defense. Every PvE mob should be like a compact GvG/HA team. Improve their AI to so if they see traps they send guy in protected to trip them while the others hang back, that if they get body blocked they'll try and run around the obstruction, give them all res sigs ect. Nerf all the "lawlz I am invincible" skills(prot spirit, spirit bond, obsidian flesh, ect), make it so grouping up with players or a full diverse party of heroes is the actual only viable way to beat a zone. Then make the quest rewards and drops worth that time and effort, No more of this YAY I beat a FOW quest I got 5-10k xp.... in a game where the level cap is 140k... Give them a decent gold or item reward, buff the drops from chests(if I get another R13 common skin offhand with imperfect mods from a chest in hard mode I'ma put my fist through a wall...) buff the drops from monsters, make it worthwhile to take the time and effort to play the game "correctly" then it won't be worth it to use stuff like SF, then we're on our way. Literally [Shadow Form] is the least in a long line of farming junk and gimmick builds that's been going on from day 1. They had the right idea when they put the phantoms with signets in the UW, dunno why they moved them. |
That, ftw...
Either nerf everything, or nothing at all...
Kanyatta
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
you got it backwards, why should monks, warriors, rits, eles, dervs, necroes, mesmers, and rangers have all the viable farming PvE Invincibuilds, yet assassins get crap for farming.
|
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
IMO, nerf all farming, all of it, properly balance PvE mobs so that they have diverse and well thought out skills that challenge the player, every mob should have enchant stripping, decent healing, skills that go through blocking and ignore armor, the second, the instant, the moment something is discovered to have a flaw that makes it soloable, plug the hole in their defense. Every PvE mob should be like a compact GvG/HA team. Improve their AI to so if they see traps they send guy in protected to trip them while the others hang back, that if they get body blocked they'll try and run around the obstruction, give them all res sigs ect.
|
Either way, it's a bad idea
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
Nerf all the "lawlz I am invincible" skills(prot spirit, spirit bond, obsidian flesh, ect), make it so grouping up with players or a full diverse party of heroes is the actual only viable way to beat a zone.
|
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
Then make the quest rewards and drops worth that time and effort, No more of this YAY I beat a FOW quest I got 5-10k xp.... in a game where the level cap is 140k... Give them a decent gold or item reward, buff the drops from chests(if I get another R13 common skin offhand with imperfect mods from a chest in hard mode I'ma put my fist through a wall...) buff the drops from monsters, make it worthwhile to take the time and effort to play the game "correctly" then it won't be worth it to use stuff like SF, then we're on our way.
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
Literally [Shadow Form] is the least in a long line of farming junk and gimmick builds that's been going on from day 1. They had the right idea when they put the phantoms with signets in the UW, dunno why they moved them.
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Yeah... no.
FengShuiDove
Ummmm... the classic, first version of UWSC included Obsidian Flesh Earth tanks and like, what, 1-2 Perma-Sins? To speed it up, the Obby crawl Eles have been replaced with Perma-Shadow versions of whatever. If UWSC is the problem then nerfing Shadow Form will slightly slow it down and groups will replace Assassins with Eles... AGAIN.
Everything that Assassins can do, something else can do similarly and either slower or with slightly more difficulty. Wow. Gonna kill a profession's farming options to slow UWSC from 20-25 minutes? Yeah, good idea. Then the community will bitch and moan endlessly about 600s, Obsidian Flesh, Mist Form, whatever. Oh wait, no they won't, because everyone already has a Monk or Ele so there won't be complaints about just making the new build.
If there is any fix necessary, revert to ORIGINAL functionality. Maintainable with A/Me perma only, able to farm reasonably but without the single-target killing power of Sliver Armor can't do bosses or some of the farms with any heals involved. Plus, 99.99999% of the community is retarded and doesn't know it can (or could ever be) maintained with A/Me, so they'll probably just give up because they can't formulate independent thought. Hell, even keep the damage reduction if it's that much of a freaking issue.
Everything that Assassins can do, something else can do similarly and either slower or with slightly more difficulty. Wow. Gonna kill a profession's farming options to slow UWSC from 20-25 minutes? Yeah, good idea. Then the community will bitch and moan endlessly about 600s, Obsidian Flesh, Mist Form, whatever. Oh wait, no they won't, because everyone already has a Monk or Ele so there won't be complaints about just making the new build.
If there is any fix necessary, revert to ORIGINAL functionality. Maintainable with A/Me perma only, able to farm reasonably but without the single-target killing power of Sliver Armor can't do bosses or some of the farms with any heals involved. Plus, 99.99999% of the community is retarded and doesn't know it can (or could ever be) maintained with A/Me, so they'll probably just give up because they can't formulate independent thought. Hell, even keep the damage reduction if it's that much of a freaking issue.