As everyone knows, Arenanet has introduced a variety of PvE skills into the game, as well as changing some of them for PvE purposes.
Now, everyone and his mother understood pretty quickly that some, or many, of these skills were quite over-the-top. Thus they began forming teams abusing these skills, generally by the simplest and most brain-dead method possibly - for example, groups using six Ursan Blessing warriors. Some nerfs incredibly followed, but, well, I'm writing this thread to show you what they missed.
There are several ways to create team builds for PvE with an offensive and defensive power that simply borders on the laughable, and this is what happens if you combine some of these imbalanced skills in an intelligent fashion.
I've called this "Steroidway" which is a bloody stupid name and I'm open to suggestions. This is built for eight human players, and it's an exercise in trying to construct a really ridiculously overpowered Guild Wars PvE configuration. It's not "all new builds" - some are widely used, others are specials. Together, they create a team that can only be described as absurd. It's a shameless exploit.
[build prof=P/W name="Standard Imbagon" leadership=11+1 spear=11+1+1 command=8+1][save yourselves][there's nothing to fear][for great justice][focused anger][air of superiority][go for the eyes][vicious attack][aggressive refrain][/build]
This is your standard imbagon bar. Air of Superiority is added as an option for recharging Focused Anger, For Great Justice and There's Nothing To Fear. This character maintains Save Yourselves, it's his main job.
[build prof=D/Me name="Volfen Scythe" scythe=12+1+1 mysticism=12+1][volfen blessing][pious assault][crippling sweep][rending sweep][optional][optional][optional][arcane mimicry][/build]
This is the Volfen Blessing character on the team. The exact build isn't very important. This build can be done with any front line worthy character class and perhaps with some not-so-worthy.
The point of this character is to maintain the Blessing for as much uptime as possible. When it is over it can be recharged by a successful execution of Assassin's Promise via Arcane Mimicry on the Mark of Pain nuker. In order to use this you need to be able to go with a Mesmer secondary or primary. You need to be good with your shot at the Promise! It's only a five second window for the kill.
Of course, you can decide not to run with a scythe, but the build will be stronger by the AoE element of that weapon. While in the Blessing your main job is to maintain Volfen Bloodlust for a 33% IAS to all nearby allies. Note that you can run this on a Mesmer primary if you so wish, because the Blessing sets your armor level.
[build prof=W/Rt name="Whirlwind Blade" swordsmanship=12+1+1 strength=12+1 restoration=3][hundred blades][whirlwind attack][frenzy][enraging charge][for great justice][save yourselves][air of superiority][flesh of my flesh][/build]
This is the backup Save Yourselves copy and a major source of damage for the team. Air is used to recharge For Great Justice and possibly 100B for more DPS, and besides Air is a severely underrated PvE skill with numerous benefits for any character. By following the Mark caller's directions this character can make everything explode.
You can use any secondary on this character, such as Ritualist for hard resurrection, or Dervish for various utility skills (an example would be Test of Faith for AoE enchantment removal.) One example is shown. You can also obviously use any melee primary with good results.
Amusingly, this build will out-damage any other physical on your team with all attributes set to zero.
[build prof=N/A name="Mark of Pain Caller" curses=12+1+1 soulr=10+1 deadly=8][mark of pain][barbs][rigor mortis][reckless haste][assassin's promise][ebon vanguard assassin support][technobabble][by ural's hammer][/build]
This is the group caller, the trusty Mark nuker. He calls every target and the group follows. Ural's is maintained to create a stable 25% damage increase from the hexes.
Some leeway is possible for this build, obviously. Most notably an enchantment removal tool might be nice on this character if enchantments pose a problem - I recommend switching one hex (possibly Barbs, since the damage output of the team is astronomical anyway) for Rend Enchantments.
[build prof=E/N name="Ether Order" energy=12+1+1 blood=11 curses=5 air=4][glyph of swiftness][ether renewal][order of pain][dark fury][great dwarf weapon][ebon battle standard of honor][foul feast][plague sending][/build]
This is a robust Ether Renewal Orders build that will have no problem to maintain orders full time and buff party members with Great Dwarf Weapon for knockdown spam purposes, as well as maintaining the Ebon ward, clearing conditions and transferring them.
[build prof=E/Mo name="Ether Healer" energy=12+1+1 heal=3 prot=12][glyph of swiftness][ether renewal][protective spirit][spirit bond][shield guardian][reverse hex][infuse health][extinguish][/build]
[build prof=E/Mo name="Ether Protector" energy=11+1+1 heal=12 prot=6][glyph of swiftness][ether renewal][mindbender][reversal of fortune][reverse hex][heal party][heal area][infuse health][/build]
Here are the two main energizer bunny hybrid healers. The bars are both pretty tunable. They spam a lot.
[build prof=N/Rt name="Undeath MM" death=12+1+3 soul=12+1][Masochism][Order of Undeath][Animate Bone Fiend][Animate Bone Horror][Ebon Battle Standard of Courage][Blood of the Master][signet of lost souls][Flesh of my flesh][/build]
This is the Order of Undeath Minion Master. The Undeath MM brings the Courage standard to help with the armor problem of the poor Fiends. Signet of Lost Souls or some other form of energy management is badly needed; this is a very, very energy-intense build.
Now, when we've thrown together all these builds, which admittedly can still use some work and aren't precisely fine-tuned, what do we end up with?
We end up with minions which will in an optimal situation strike for whatever measly damage they originally do, and a +32 armor ignoring damage under 33% IAS (+15 from Ebon Battle Standard of Honor, +17 from Order of Undeath.)
We end up with physical frontliners and a paragon who will strike under a 33% IAS for +52 damage (+15 EBSOH, +17 Order of Pain, +20 Great Dwarf Weapon) and knock down their foes 40% of the time.
We end up with a necromancer which will take this damage output and add a +52 adjacent AoE damage from Mark of Pain and +20 damage from Barbs.
We end up with bone fiends with 78 armor.
We have healers that have an endless energy supply and are capable of keeping the party under strong conceivable protective enchantments while spamming Heal Party or Infuse Health on recharge.
Enjoy, if you really want to use it.
Steroidway, or "how to turn PvE into a joke".
Moloch Vein
Cherng Butter
I can see the merits of the Volven character (though is it really limited to R/D? What about W/D or A/D?), but the Ursan seems a little superfluous. Ursan Roar is only maintainable 33% of the time, so let's say that adds +5 damage, and given that Bone Fiends attack every 2 seconds (and Vampirics slower) and there's going to be a Ebon Assassin there, what does that add, +30-40 DPS? Is it worth it? Maybe an Hundred Blades instead?
Hows the energy on the MM?
All in all looks fun, though sadly I've never seen an E/Mo healer in action :/
Hows the energy on the MM?
All in all looks fun, though sadly I've never seen an E/Mo healer in action :/
Elad-Daizen
Looks really nice, pity I dont know enough people that play at the same crazy hours as me to try it with.
Moloch Vein
MM build will probably need to be adjusted, it's got really harsh energy issues as it is.
Chthon
I've got to agree with Cherng, a HB+WW Warrior would be more useful than the Ursan. Better synergy with the curses, plus a second source of SY!
Overall though, I really. really like this build. Aside from the Ursan (which I wouldn't run) and the Wolfen (which is really clever and I wish I'd thought of), this is pretty much what I've been thinking I'd run if I could ever get 7 people together at the same time who would take build instructions from me.
(Oh, and I think the MM needs maso.)
Overall though, I really. really like this build. Aside from the Ursan (which I wouldn't run) and the Wolfen (which is really clever and I wish I'd thought of), this is pretty much what I've been thinking I'd run if I could ever get 7 people together at the same time who would take build instructions from me.
(Oh, and I think the MM needs maso.)
Moloch Vein
I agree, a 100B warrior would be nice. I just... well, I wanted to use Ursan. For kicks 
Actually I know that the bars can use a deal of love as of right now. I just wanted to outline the elements - the dual ER heal/prot, the new Ether Order, the Scythe Volfen, etc, and show how insane the combination could get.
How about switching Foul Feast to the Ether Order and maybe add him Plague Sending?
Actually I know that the bars can use a deal of love as of right now. I just wanted to outline the elements - the dual ER heal/prot, the new Ether Order, the Scythe Volfen, etc, and show how insane the combination could get.
How about switching Foul Feast to the Ether Order and maybe add him Plague Sending?
Trinity Fire Angel
Zodiac Meteor
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trinity Fire Angel
E/Mo healer can pretty much spam Infuse + Heal Area + Infuse + Heal Area non stop for mega huge heals.
nope, Infusion Spam.
A smell nerf...
A smell nerf...
Hatchet Child
As effective as Infusion spam is you could change all 4 bonds on your bar to make a lot more effective. Stop hogging the bonds!!! :P
DarkNecrid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor
Zodiac Meteor
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatchet Child
Bye bye Ether Cryer and Ether Healer.
Hmmm, 2 infusion spammers + 8 protective bonds = imbagon is gone. [[It's just a [email protected]] wound anyone?
DarkNecrid
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zodiac Meteor
Bye bye Ether Cryer and Ether Healer.
Hmmm, 2 infusion spammers + 8 protective bonds = imbagon is gone. [[It's just a [email protected]] wound anyone? Why would they nerf anything in PvE that doesn't a) force everyone into the same class (Ursan) or b) Owns farming (SF)?
They won't, that's why they have the skill split system, so they don't ever have to nerf anything in PvE cept 1 or 2 things. They buffed Ether Renewal knowing full well what it can do (Ether Smiters!!!, I'd like to see 6 Ether Smiters and 1 ether healer and 1 ether protter just roll through a PvE area actually), it was nerfed into the way it was for a reason, namely it gives you infinite energy+health. Disabling all non-ele skills for 10 seconds would still let you bond everyone, then you just have to spam an ele spell to keep your energy up. The only way to really nerf it is to put it back the way it was, and they won't do that.
My only problem with this build is definitely the Ursan, I think even the Raven Blessing would be more useful in that slot, lol.
Amnel Ithtirsol
saw this:
"how to turn PvE into a joke"
and almost didnt read further
Nice concept. Should be fun.
"how to turn PvE into a joke"
and almost didnt read further
Nice concept. Should be fun.
drunknzelda
(10%) "Is there anything I can't do?", recharges all skills except for Ursan Blessing, Volfen Blessing, Raven Blessing, and those that require a Morale boost (e.g. Resurrection Signet).
Gg on that ^^
Gg on that ^^
Moloch Vein
Oh crap. Air didn't use to have that limitation.
Well, since there seems to be a bit of interest in this, I'm going to tidy it up a little and fix up the Ether bars (which need more diversity), fix up the MM bar and replace the Ursan with a 100B/WW. The Volfen will need to be modified, perhaps to a D/Me with Arcane Mimicry on Assassin's Promise. I will change OP accordingly.
Well, since there seems to be a bit of interest in this, I'm going to tidy it up a little and fix up the Ether bars (which need more diversity), fix up the MM bar and replace the Ursan with a 100B/WW. The Volfen will need to be modified, perhaps to a D/Me with Arcane Mimicry on Assassin's Promise. I will change OP accordingly.
Hatchet Child
An idea for your Ele's would be something like this. Not golden but just threw them together after seeing your post.
[Healer;OgNCwczEJxHBGxX0aJtg0XtA]
[Prot;OgNDwcrPO1DtYdjkQPoFS/aB]
The healer one might be a bit sucky and could use improvements.....heck i think they both could.
EDIT: I do notice none of these have Hex Removal which is probably needed in the team setup. Drop [Aura of restoration] if need be.
[Healer;OgNCwczEJxHBGxX0aJtg0XtA]
[Prot;OgNDwcrPO1DtYdjkQPoFS/aB]
The healer one might be a bit sucky and could use improvements.....heck i think they both could.
EDIT: I do notice none of these have Hex Removal which is probably needed in the team setup. Drop [Aura of restoration] if need be.
Moloch Vein
Dual Heal Areas seem a little much though, no?
Seriously even Healing Breeze might be good.
Seriously even Healing Breeze might be good.
MirkoTeran
Looks fun, but I don't see how this makes PvE easier then it already is.
Hatchet Child
It's what Varda used to run. I may be wrong i don't recall the other skill otherwise.
Elephantaliste
And what do you plan to do with a 8-man team, since most of game can be h/h ?
Xenomortis
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elephantaliste
And what do you plan to do with a 8-man team, since most of game can be h/h ?
Just because it can be done with H/H, doesn't mean you have to do it that way.
As far as I can tell, this setup would reduce HM PvE to something on par with pre.
And it's always fun to play with 7 other competent players.
As far as I can tell, this setup would reduce HM PvE to something on par with pre.
And it's always fun to play with 7 other competent players.
upier
How extensively was this tested?
Because it seems to be more draft-like atm.
Because it seems to be more draft-like atm.
Moloch Vein
It is a draft.
However, the various components making up the configuration have all been tested more or less extensively.
Basic question I fielded was, "how insane can I make a team with 8 human players carrying full PvE unlock?" This is my attempt at an answer.
However, the various components making up the configuration have all been tested more or less extensively.
Basic question I fielded was, "how insane can I make a team with 8 human players carrying full PvE unlock?" This is my attempt at an answer.
Xenomortis
The only thing I'm thinking, is that a lot of mobs may not last long enough for certain aspects of the setup to seem worthwhile.
Moloch Vein
I want Jeydra in here to offer suggestions on the Ether bars.
upier
Because the thing I am wondering is:
1. An Imba, a second dude also spamming SY!, 2 Ether guys and the necro has a selfheal? In a 8 man team?
2. Why no AoR on the ER guys?
3. OoP does +13 damage at 11 and 12 blood. Which means you can dump the 20 points into ES.
4. Why RoF? If the guy is under SY/TNtF - he should be receiving minimal damage. And when he does take damege - you just overheal it. You have unlimited energy for it.
5. Horrors?
6. Only 1 hex removal?
1. An Imba, a second dude also spamming SY!, 2 Ether guys and the necro has a selfheal? In a 8 man team?
2. Why no AoR on the ER guys?
3. OoP does +13 damage at 11 and 12 blood. Which means you can dump the 20 points into ES.
4. Why RoF? If the guy is under SY/TNtF - he should be receiving minimal damage. And when he does take damege - you just overheal it. You have unlimited energy for it.
5. Horrors?
6. Only 1 hex removal?
Xenomortis
I can understand the use of Bone Horrors, as fiends cost a lot and that can hurt even a necromancer, especially since Masochism no longer triggers on OoU. Although horrors are less likely to benefit from the Ebon Wards.
I don't think Heal Area is really necessary on the Undeath necro either.
Do the ether guys really need AoR? And RoF is useful when you encounter some armour ignoring damage, which does happen.
Barbs may become redundant on that MoP caller, as a two second cast time will mean the target will probably be dead before you can finish casting, especially with the current damage output. Bringing Mindbender over Technobabble may help alleviate that if you don't need Dazed.
I don't think Heal Area is really necessary on the Undeath necro either.
Do the ether guys really need AoR? And RoF is useful when you encounter some armour ignoring damage, which does happen.
Barbs may become redundant on that MoP caller, as a two second cast time will mean the target will probably be dead before you can finish casting, especially with the current damage output. Bringing Mindbender over Technobabble may help alleviate that if you don't need Dazed.
Moloch Vein
No AoR because it's not strictly needed, there are tons of enchantments and their bars are very packed.
OoP is true and attributes should be switched. I don't normally run this bar myself.
Animate Bone Horror is the best melee minion because it has a 5 seconds recharge and only costs 10e. The energy load on the MM becomes astronomic if he runs Order of Undeath and his lowest cost minion is 15e, with fiends costing 25e. I know you like to talk about how necromancers have "unlimited energy" but they don't. It is true that you can bring Animate Bone Minions but the Horrors actually have decent armor while in the Courage ward; the Minions won't.
Like I said I need second opinions on the Ether bars and yes a second hex removal skill might be necessary. Reversal of Fortune is simply a nice spammable low-cost skill to quickly pump up energy if something goes a bit wrong, and just for the record, all damage in the game isn't armor-dependant.
Dammit Xeno you type too fast... 
upier
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenomortis
I'd just save the 10 energy and the skillslot instead.
1 minion is enough.
Quote:
However, I'm not sure how you intend to quickly raise and army of 10 Bone Fiends whilst spamming OoU, BotM and use the wards.
Note that at 13 SR, you can gain at most, 39 energy every 15 seconds. Add that onto the natural regeneration in 15 seconds (20) and you get 59 energy. Raising two bone fiends will cost you 50 energy.
Quote:
So I'd ask myself - if horrors are doable, do I really need fiends?
If the answer to that question is no - then I'd do something about the build to support the fiends army. Adding additional e-management is the first thing that pops to one's mind. With horrors and Heal Area gone - that opens two slots for e-management.
What horrors basically represent is comparatively being unable to spam SFlames and thus spamming Flare instead.
Now - if a build that just offers fiends isn't sufficient - you might want to ask yourself if dumping the mm completely might not even be preferable. (Which would kinda be my suggestion.)
Quote:
You can only run 10 minions - and the recharge isn't holding you back. There is just no point in running two sorts of minions.
I'd go with an additional physical. You get the benefits of the orders and you know that the guy will followed the called target.
Quote: