Super-secret builds, vanity or trade secret?

The Josip

The Josip

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2009

Me/

Every once in a while I meet someone who claims his build is secret and doesn't want to reveal it. At the same time, he has no problem asking for other people's builds (how hypocritical is that?).


What I'd like to know is, does anyone here use the same tactic of keeping their builds secret?

What is the actual benefit of this? Is it trade secret or mere vanity? Note: this isn't about farming builds. It's about playing builds (missions / vanquish etc).




---

For instance, today I meet a guy. I tell him what's my build after he tells me he doesn't know what AP mesmer is since he hasn't played with a mesmer in 3 years (lol). Then he tells me I'm not good enough for Discord team and that he wants only SoS (ok, fair enough, his choice). Now, this was after I wanted to help him vanquish an area in EotN. So I was curious what his super-build must be (since I can easily vanq eotn real fast with just heroes n henchies), but alas, he said he made 2 builds in this game and doesnt want to reveal them. Not even just elite skill. I mean, come on what the hell, I posted many great builds on GWO and Guru (albeit mostly with my old nick in the good old days), and couldn't care less how many people would use them. But he made *2* builds which must be special of course. You see, he is working on his GWAMM title. No one else will be able to achieve that title without his super-builds, or it will take insanely longer. PS: he kills in 2,5 seconds and if you guys cant kill in 2,5 seconds you're not worth his time. He will ask you to the guild hall to kill him within 2,5 sec :>


How do you get friends?

Introverted Dimensions

Introverted Dimensions

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jan 2006

R/

No, that's just dumb.

And chances are he just copied his build off PvXwiki and maybe made some slight changes to it by replacing a skill or two.


If they go out of their way to tell people that their build is secret or if they have one, then they're just seeking attention. Whenever people refuse to show me their builds and tell me it's a secret, I just tell them that it's okay and then I proceed to boot them out of the party for being a dumbass.

The Josip

The Josip

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2009

Me/

IMO chances are his build sucks and if someone criticized it his world would collapse and he wouldn't be super cool anymore in his head. Also, by using word "secret" he expects a lot of awe I guess.


But check this out, if I went as Rt SoS with him on a vanquish, how would he use that build without me seeing it?

Kerwyn Nasilan

Kerwyn Nasilan

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2007

WHERE DO YOU THINK

W/

When someone refuses to share their build I kick them.
There build probably sucks and they probably have some kind of god complex.

Snograt

Snograt

rattus rattus

Join Date: Jan 2006

London, UK GMT??0 ??1hr DST

[GURU]GW [wiki]GW2

R/

When someone refuses to tell me their build, I assume that it's terrible and that they're embarrassed by it.

xMinimalism

xMinimalism

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Sep 2009

USEast

Guildless

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Teenage Lobodomy View Post
And chances are he just copied his build off PvXwiki and maybe made some slight changes to it by replacing a skill or two.
Exactly.

Quote: Originally Posted by Snograt View Post When someone refuses to tell me their build, I assume that it's terrible and that they're embarrassed by it. That, too. Lol.

Quote: This is classic don't-know-shit 8-year-old complex. He said you weren't good enough for a discord team; that's not even worth a laugh. Forget about it and realize that GW is teeming with these self-absorbed brats.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Josip View Post
How do you get friends? If "You" refers to the blatant idiot whose build is "super-secret", they don't. They are sad, lonely people.

syphonus

syphonus

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2007

The Dirtiest Parts Of My Mind

Phlying Skwirls[PS]

N/

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Josip View Post
For instance, today I meet a guy. I tell him what's my build after he tells me he doesn't know what AP mesmer is since he hasn't played with a mesmer in 3 years (lol). Then he tells me I'm not good enough for Discord team and that he wants only SoS (ok, fair enough, his choice).
How do you get friends? Look me up ingame.

Elon's Rose

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2010

Forever Knights [FK]

P/Me

Vanity/God-complex. Keeping things secret entitles you to a sense of self-importance.

That is to say, I don't really care about bad builds anymore. I don't think everyone should be forced to use crud off PvXwiki, because a lot of those just aren't that fun (I'm looking at you, Discordway). As long as it isn't echomending, I'm fine with it - my heroes can pick up the slack anyway

Narcin

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2007

Mo/

The builds you will find on PvX wiki are pretty much better than anything most people will decide to use...those builds have been tested time and again and WORK. He isn't running anything special, or that hasn't been though of before.

Shadowhaze

Shadowhaze

Nothing, tra la la?

Join Date: Oct 2007

I knew someone who did that. lol.

I don't have a problem with it unless it may conflict with someone else's build (ex - two rits in the party). But it's not like it will be secret...you'll see it outside when they use their skills.

drunk n angry

drunk n angry

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2009

in a quiet little town that i love.

Ancient Dragoons [AGED]

W/

yes most likely this character has a god superiority complex and thinks he is the shit and just seeking more attn.

but on the off chance that he created a build that was so OMFG OVERPOWERED and noone thought of it before in that exact combination i sure as hell wouldnt tell anyone about it.. then again if i did that i wouldnt team with anyone either cuz then they would inevitably see it.

and there you have it the difference between a real secret build and a loser with a complex. if you have a badass build you dont need people, if you NEED to run with other people and you THINK your build is secret he's just a loser LOL.

Twin Blade Warriror

Twin Blade Warriror

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jan 2006

I was in a guild by myself with 2 of my other accounts..but im banned now

W/

if someone doesnt share his or her build...
they're probably like 10 years old...
ignore list they go imo..

Eragon Zarroc

Eragon Zarroc

Atra estern?? ono thelduin

Join Date: Jan 2008

Madness Incarnate

[Duo]

W/P

it is only usefulto keep builds super secret if it provides you with a monopoly on a particular farm. but this is rare and far in between when u can figure out how to farm something much better than everyone else using a build no one has thought of before.

Gennadios

Gennadios

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2009

N/A

Not sharing builds is a pretty noob move atm. The game is all about synergy, and the refusal to ping pretty much tells me that it's a person that likely won't put the effort into coordinating skills with the rest of the team.

Aside from that, I make it a point not to ping my skills to randomp ppl that ask in PvP(outside of my immediate team/guildies.)

Also, farming builds are pretty much best kept secret.

Chthon

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: Apr 2007

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snograt View Post
When someone refuses to tell me their build, I assume that it's terrible and that they're embarrassed by it. This.

When you see it in-game it means that you've encountered someone who doesn't understand intrateam synergy. No doubt their build is bad as a standalone build too.

When you see it in the forums it means that they know they don't have a build that does what they claim they can do, but they don't want to admit their mistake. There's a particular poster in the ranger forums infamous for this.

Shayne Hawke

Shayne Hawke

Departed from Tyria

Join Date: May 2007

Clan Dethryche [dth]

R/

lol, "super-secret" builds. Never understood that idea.

HigherMinion

HigherMinion

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

East Anglia, UK

Order of [Thay]

N/

I like to "spam-ping" all of their skills when we enter the mission. It's rather entertaining for the rest of the team when they see he's running Ursan, or something even sillier.

Pony Slaystation

Pony Slaystation

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2008

Cardboard Box

Guilds are irrelevant. This... is...... BUILD WARS!!!

Rt/

There are only so many skills that can be used at a time, and with the amount of people that play Guild Wars, I'm sure that at least five other people have used the exact same build as him. Chances are, it's just something he thinks is cool, but is really just a normal build.

So many different builds have been thought up already, the only way it can really be a secret build is if he is using a secret skill that nobody else knows about.

isildorbiafra

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2007

The Netherlands

W/

I can show you my build....but then i'd have to kill you.

David Wooding

David Wooding

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2006

W/

I only don't ping my build when I know that they're going to sit there whining about what skills I use for the next half an hour.
Most of my builds are actually made by me without influence, but end up being something on PvX wiki any way.

Grape Bird

Grape Bird

Academy Page

Join Date: Jan 2010

E/

Quote:
I can show you my build....but then i'd have to kill you.
totally /signed.

Xenomortis

Xenomortis

Tea Powered

Join Date: May 2008

UK

N/

Quote:
Originally Posted by HigherMinion View Post
I like to "spam-ping" all of their skills when we enter the mission. It's rather entertaining for the rest of the team when they see he's running Ursan, or something even sillier.
But Hundred Blades + Whirlwind attack is good.


If someone refuses to ping their build I generally kick them. If I'm organising a PuG for something then it's something that might require builds that exceed that of henchmen.

When I'm asked to ping I always ping.


Quote:
Originally Posted by huitzilopoctli View Post
I'd like to know the setup for that because vanquishes in EotN kick my @$$ when I do them h/h ... and of course it's impossible to get teams together to do that because it seems all the experienced players already have them done. Depends largely on your primary. EotN isn't too bad for VQs though, can't think of anything exceptionally difficult. Drakkar Lake and Sacnoth Valley is as bad as it gets I think.
If you're a physical, the solution is simple; lots of damage + physical buffs + Save Yourselves.
If you're a caster, Discord teams will usually do. If you don't like that, then Rits can run SoS Spirit Spam, Necros can run AP-MoP with physicals or Fevered Dreams, Eles can try out stuff like AP-MS or AP+whatever or Ether Renewal, Mesmers can run EVAS-Spam or FD... it goes on. Strong hero builds are important.

jonnieboi05

jonnieboi05

Forge Runner

Join Date: Mar 2006

Mableton, Georgia

Guild Ancestors Reunited [?????????]

This is why I do not PuG. Ever.


Although, I've had people randomly PM me asking for my build 'cause of my r6 KoaBD title (like it matters?) and I tell them "no can do". My build, only 3 people know it in all of GW. I made the build ~the time EotN came out and I have no intention of ever giving it out.



Do note in the screenshot listed above I have absolutely no enchantments or anything on me. I pump out insane amounts of dmg when I am in my normal custom 8-man team build (I deal roughly 650 dmg every 4-5 seconds constantly with Srength of Honor + Judges Insight on me and that's not even including in Splinter Weapon's dmg).


But, in the end, I will say that most of the time people don't ping their bar because they're bad or PvX'ed it. Meh... Heroes > real people imo.

maxxfury

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Apr 2006

[DVDF] Gp

Me/A

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05 View Post

I pump out insane amounts of dmg

. Since when has 106 dps been insane?

A sin could likely double that sorry to say

The only times ive known anyone to keep a build secret(pve), thats NOT crap, is when a new broken imba farming setup is rolled up, and then its only so its not abused by genpop and nerfed quickly (so they can make their money easy first :P) everything else has pretty much been covered now in this thread.

jonnieboi05

jonnieboi05

Forge Runner

Join Date: Mar 2006

Mableton, Georgia

Guild Ancestors Reunited [?????????]

Quote:
Originally Posted by maxxfury View Post
Since when has 106 dps been insane?

A sin could likely double that sorry to say

The only times ive known anyone to keep a build secret(pve), thats NOT crap, is when a new broken imba farming setup is rolled up, and then its only so its not abused by genpop and nerfed quickly (so they can make their money easy first :P) everything else has pretty much been covered now in this thread.
Maybe you should consider reading my entire post and not selectively read (that includes also looking at the entire screenshot). Having said that, I would like to see an Assassin pump out 150+ dmg every second consistantly non-stop with virtually zero cool down. Good luck.

Zodiac Meteor

Zodiac Meteor

Imma Firin Mah Rojway!

Join Date: Aug 2008

At the Mac Store laughing at people that walk out with anything.

E/Mo

I loved to play ER infuser before ER infuse was popular.

When I told people, I'm an elementalist healer that spams infuse health, it would be the last time I see them.

I can kind of understand that, but unless it is an extreme oddity like infuse spammer, 55 monk or something along those lines then it must be a bad build.
You can't really have "Super Secret"
1,000 skills in the game is a lot. But some skills only works great on other skills like a combo, get the best combo and you have the best possible build, simple.

By the way JonnyBoi05, I've seen a similar build. Chucking spears for insane damage, funny how Paragons are out done by a lot of primary's.

Lusciious

Lusciious

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2009

I'm from Singapore but i live in Shanghai ATM

Order of [Thay]

N/

My super secret build is ..





















































































































































Frenzy + Heal Sig + Mending .

Ghost Dog

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Mar 2008

W/

Reminds me of all of the retarded assasins that came through prophecies shortly after factions release...

They sounded exactly the same with the "My build is private" and "I can kill in 2 seconds flat brah" (kill what?). Followed by "you know if you sit you recharge health faster" and "Hey can you show me that sword outside and drop it on the ground for a ss".

Pay them no mind, give them no time.


EDIT: @ above, master of damage doesn't move or do anything, not impressed.

jonnieboi05

jonnieboi05

Forge Runner

Join Date: Mar 2006

Mableton, Georgia

Guild Ancestors Reunited [?????????]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Malician View Post
Given that we've all seen numerous persons claiming they have a secret build that can do amazing things (and that no-one has ever produced such a thing), I hope you don't feel hurt if we assume it's BS. Once more. I would like to see an Assassin dish 160+ dmg per second with virtually zero cool-down (for those who can't read- I would like to see an Assassin do 160+ DPS without having to wait for their entire bar to recharge). I've provided my screenshot with zero help from any heroes and/or players with zero support enchantments. I've honestly got nothing to try and prove to anyone on here, I know what my build does and what an Assassin can and cannot do.


But that is besides the points and rather off-topic. So, to the OP, it's up to you whether or not you make the ultimate decision of letting a PuG stay with or without pinging their current skill bar.

Jeydra

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05 View Post
Do note in the screenshot listed above I have absolutely no enchantments or anything on me. I pump out insane amounts of dmg when I am in my normal custom 8-man team build (I deal roughly 650 dmg every 4-5 seconds constantly with Srength of Honor + Judges Insight on me and that's not even including in Splinter Weapon's dmg). This looks like a good time to link this post, this post and, if you want one, I can upload a screenshot where a Warrior hits >106 DPS (actually, almost 50% more than 106 DPS) without enchantments or anything on him. Note screenshots are taken over much longer than 10s.

My last brush with "super secret" builds was when I tried to improve my heroes' builds. I PM'ed Varda, who referred me to someone else (not naming names). We talked about H/H in general, and he went from bashing Discordway to saying he has a super secret build for Mesmers that's so powerful, he can clear Vloxen's HM with 3 humans only and no consumables (!). He links me an image to prove it, and tells me the run could've been smoother had his team's Warrior known how to tank (read this as "gather aggro").

Now Vloxen's HM is hard, but so hard that you need humans to do it. I tell him that's nothing impressive and that I can do Vloxen's quite easily H/H, wherupon he challenges me to do it and get him a screenshot. He was quite specific with the requirements: run the AP bar I pinged him, and have a screenshot in which I was dealing damage so I can't wait for consumables to run out. I told him it would take a day to get the screenshots and promised to get it.

Needless to say I can back up my statements, and I got the screens easily (the dungeon's easier than I remember it to be, to be honest). It'd been a long time since I felt so alive while playing - I got all my micro and flagging done, and though I suffered deaths I didn't wipe either. I even did level 3 faster than him, despite the H/H setup vs. his three humans. Still I felt quite insulted by his arrogance, so in true "super secret" fashion, I positioned my screenshot in such a way that the only things visible were my bar and the henchmen I used. Even which heroes I used weren't visible (I flagged them away).

The next day I showed him the screenshot. In all fairness he quickly took back what he'd said the previous day, and realized why we'd so quickly fallen out with each other the day before was because I, as he put it, "play smart". He showed me his teambuild, although I didn't look at it because I was still angry. Judging from our conversations I know he's a good player as well, so perhaps sometime I'll talk to him more (I can hold a grudge for quite a long time ... not a good trait of mine though).

Long story short, this is what I think about super secret builds.

1. You can usually achieve more with multiple brains than with one. No matter how good you think your build is, more opinions (especially from good players) are not going to hurt.
2. If you insist on keeping your builds secret, fine, but you cannot expect other players to be as forthcoming with their own knowledge when you're so protective of your own. If you get entangled in a situation like the one I described above, you'll have to eat the fruits of your own decision.

HigherMinion

HigherMinion

Forge Runner

Join Date: May 2008

East Anglia, UK

Order of [Thay]

N/

Quote:
Originally Posted by JonnieBoi05 View Post
This is why I do not PuG. Ever.


Although, I've had people randomly PM me asking for my build 'cause of my r6 KoaBD title (like it matters?) and I tell them "no can do". My build, only 3 people know it in all of GW. I made the build ~the time EotN came out and I have no intention of ever giving it out.



Do note in the screenshot listed above I have absolutely no enchantments or anything on me. I pump out insane amounts of dmg when I am in my normal custom 8-man team build (I deal roughly 650 dmg every 4-5 seconds constantly with Srength of Honor + Judges Insight on me and that's not even including in Splinter Weapon's dmg).


But, in the end, I will say that most of the time people don't ping their bar because they're bad or PvX'ed it. Meh... Heroes > real people imo. But... This is exactly what we're arguing AGAINST. Rather... Arrogant of you to post this. Especially when you probably have some gimmicky skill spamming going on to achieve this- but of course, we shall never know.

I can only assume it's just a normal spear build.