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Originally Posted by AmbientMelody
Not quite. People simply need some time to adapt to the new meta.
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Update - Friday, May 21, 2010
Del
Martin Alvito
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Originally Posted by AmbientMelody
Not quite. People simply need some time to adapt to the new meta.
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bhavv
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Originally Posted by AmbientMelody
Not quite. People simply need some time to adapt to the new meta.
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This mesmer buff has gone well too far over an 'adaptable meta', unless you adapt to it by playing mesmers yourself.
Mesmers never needed to be made this overpowering in PVP. Anet's balance team have proven themselves to be a bunch of clueless monkeys once again.
Apok
Anyone remember when Anet did that one update that simply nerfed the majority of the problem skills and the meta instantly got better?
Anyone know why that is?
Perhaps because by simply putting on a bandaid over a wound, you can let it heal on its own, instead of having to make a new wound just to redirect the pain.
Simple physiology here, Anet: The parts where you buffed Mesmers in the one area that wanted them (PvE), and nerfed the imba crap in PvE (SV, SW, FC affecting <2 sec spells of different profs) were great for the game. The part where you transfered your buffs to PvP.... well, let's just say that Monks don't have a virgin's chance in hell.
Anyone know why that is?
Perhaps because by simply putting on a bandaid over a wound, you can let it heal on its own, instead of having to make a new wound just to redirect the pain.
Simple physiology here, Anet: The parts where you buffed Mesmers in the one area that wanted them (PvE), and nerfed the imba crap in PvE (SV, SW, FC affecting <2 sec spells of different profs) were great for the game. The part where you transfered your buffs to PvP.... well, let's just say that Monks don't have a virgin's chance in hell.
R_Frost
after reading some of the recent posts here, i pulled this reply from the mesmer update preview thread
any thoughts?
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| Pardon me, but some of us in the TK happen to be very proficient with the Mesmer, and in my opinion, none of our prior balances were dart board style... I've received almost completely positive feedback from players I've spoken with in game in regards to prior skill updates headed up by the TK vs without. So... no. Again, you will be pleasantly surprised by the changes; they are well executed, thoughtful, and broad reaching without being completely overpowered. |
Tearz1993
the new mesmer is stupid. not because of the results you get from the bar necessarily, but because all it requires is mindless usage of some fast-casting, fast-recharge mesmer skills to do it.
Axel Zinfandel
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Originally Posted by R_Frost
any thoughts?
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Owik Gall
I think I see a Mes Sig-interupter build soon. Especially for PvE (heroes).
Well, anet is depending on the krewe for skill efficiency. Being that they are players, there might be a chance that they'll take advantage of their role and get anet to make their 'dream' skills (you know, stuff that are kinda op.) Anet took that chance when they put the krewe to motion. Still, Anet is trusting them to suggest and test skills for balance purposes and if they break that trust by testing the skills for one sided over poweredness than we have an issue on our hands. Not to mention the severity of the relationships between Anet and the test krewe. Of course, this might not be so, and the krewe are just doing the best they can think of to make the skills balanced and playable by todays player standards.
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Originally Posted by Axel Zinfandel
It frankly looks like Anet changed a handful of stuff under the test krewe's eyes right before the update. Suprised that it's some of that same crap that is OP?
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Gabriel of Ravn
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Originally Posted by Owik Gall
I think I see a Mes Sig-interupter build soon. Especially for PvE (heroes).
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Owik Gall
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Originally Posted by Gabriel of Ravn
Lol I've already seen people trying out a build like those revolved keystone signet of course. I however do not have a mesmer but will probably create on very shortly due to this update.
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bhavv
Heroes have godly interrupt reflexes because they tend to only use an interupt if its going to hit.
But the problem is that they interrupt anything. I never find myself usig using Mesmer heroes, just the henchmen which usually have decent skillbars (Power Block in Proph, VoR in NF, and whatever Erys Vasburg had was somehow just incredible for an AI mesmer).
Oh, erys has PI / CoF / Backfire / Empathy, Shatter Hex, but not so great E Management for that bar. I'd change his ether feast to Power Drain if I could, the rest is great though.
But the problem is that they interrupt anything. I never find myself usig using Mesmer heroes, just the henchmen which usually have decent skillbars (Power Block in Proph, VoR in NF, and whatever Erys Vasburg had was somehow just incredible for an AI mesmer).
Oh, erys has PI / CoF / Backfire / Empathy, Shatter Hex, but not so great E Management for that bar. I'd change his ether feast to Power Drain if I could, the rest is great though.
Fluffy Kittens
Mesmers in pve are now good and actually playable... but in pvp they're way too strong with all the energy denial kinda ruined the game QQ
Gabriel of Ravn
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Originally Posted by Owik Gall
If you don't have a mes, just gear up a mes hero and see how it handles your build ideas. I some how don't see the godly interrupts they make since mine don't use them all the time. Even when they are recharged and the opportunity is right there. That leaves me not to believe the whole NPC godly interrupt reflexes thing. Just from my experience, though.
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Tearz1993
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Originally Posted by QueenofDeath
Love my ranger....stomps new Mesmers silly.
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Eragon Zarroc
mind wrack is OP! on another note, they made HM even easier by reverting casting times to normal on skills under 2sec cast time 
lolololol
lolololol
Nerel
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Originally Posted by QueenofDeath
Is DEL whinning again? He's always QQing about something. Anytime someone beats him to a pulp he calls it imbalanced or it needs to be nerfed. hahahahaha
Mesmers are where they should have been years ago. Now the shoe is finally on the other foot and Mesmers can be a power as long as Rangers aren't around.  ) Love my ranger....stomps new Mesmers silly. |
dagrdagaz
Besides Mind Wrack, Panic is prolly OP to imo, if u have 2 or 3 players (H/H) cast it permanently.
Thats the problem i am guessing. One player using the one skill seems ok.
But did the TK properly look into combinations being OP...................
Or they just wait till players come up with OP combo's, and then nerf that.....perhaps.
Thats the problem i am guessing. One player using the one skill seems ok.
But did the TK properly look into combinations being OP...................
Or they just wait till players come up with OP combo's, and then nerf that.....perhaps.
-Makai-
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Originally Posted by QueenofDeath
Is DEL whinning again? He's always QQing about something. Anytime someone beats him to a pulp he calls it imbalanced or it needs to be nerfed. hahahahaha
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Jeydra
Terrible update, and I don't say that often. If the update were oriented towards PvE, well essentially nothing changed for Mesmers. The class is still bad. For players I can see no reason to use Mesmers more except possibly in some SCs. Hero Mesmer builds have a few more options, but then hero Mesmers were pretty weak options in the first place so who cares? The only real change is to henchmen Mesmers when you're H/H'ing. A big deal (not). In the meantime the difficulty of PvE in general dropped dramatically thanks to the HM cast time nerf, affecting every other class, and the (massive) imbalances in PvE are still no closer to being addressed. Paragons and Elementalists still have one viable build, Monks are still weak, physicals in general (Warriors, Dervishes, Assassins) still deal twice the DPS of everyone else, blah blah blah.
If this were primarily a PvE update, then as has often been the case with PvE updates I don't object to any individual change - the HM cast time change excepted - but ANet just doesn't get what the state of PvE is right now. And it seems the Test Krewe hasn't much idea either.
On the other hand, if this is a PvP update ... then the power creep is insane. Back in the day when Cry of Frustration stopped the infamous FoC spike, it was 15 energy. Then it got buffed to 10 energy, and now it's not only 10 energy it deals increased damage. Energy Surge used to have a longer cooldown, higher energy cost and less damage, yet it was still a good skill at that time. What the heck!? Instead of buffing the things that counter Monks, why not just nerf the already-overpowered Monk skills ... back in the day Orison healed for 60 health for 5 energy, yet now Patient Spirit heals twice that much for the same energy cost while being essentially uninterruptable, and WoH heals three times that much for the same energy cost.
Sigh, terrible update.
If this were primarily a PvE update, then as has often been the case with PvE updates I don't object to any individual change - the HM cast time change excepted - but ANet just doesn't get what the state of PvE is right now. And it seems the Test Krewe hasn't much idea either.
On the other hand, if this is a PvP update ... then the power creep is insane. Back in the day when Cry of Frustration stopped the infamous FoC spike, it was 15 energy. Then it got buffed to 10 energy, and now it's not only 10 energy it deals increased damage. Energy Surge used to have a longer cooldown, higher energy cost and less damage, yet it was still a good skill at that time. What the heck!? Instead of buffing the things that counter Monks, why not just nerf the already-overpowered Monk skills ... back in the day Orison healed for 60 health for 5 energy, yet now Patient Spirit heals twice that much for the same energy cost while being essentially uninterruptable, and WoH heals three times that much for the same energy cost.
Sigh, terrible update.
Bobby2
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Originally Posted by Sante_Kelm
Eh? Lots of players are expressing disgust with the PvP changes.
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jray14
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Originally Posted by Owik Gall
If you don't have a mes, just gear up a mes hero and see how it handles your build ideas. I some how don't see the godly interrupts they make since mine don't use them all the time. Even when they are recharged and the opportunity is right there. That leaves me not to believe the whole NPC godly interrupt reflexes thing. Just from my experience, though.
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When they're in the mood to use them, though, yeah, they sure do fire them off effectively!
EPO Bot
They can nerf mezmers for pvp for all i care, but keep em in pve because before the update i saw few mezmers actually using mezemer skills.
Coast
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Originally Posted by Jeydra
Energy Surge used to have a longer cooldown, higher energy cost and less damage, yet it was still a good skill at that time.
Sigh, terrible update. |
The Josip
Give me a mesmer hero build that is at least nearly as good as N or Rt or EMo or RRt hero.
ps: Great update. Mesmers being great is how things should be. Look at us and despair!
ps: Great update. Mesmers being great is how things should be. Look at us and despair!
Dzjudz
Well I'm using a Me/Mo hero vanquishing Ferndale with Psychic Instability, Power Return, Mirror of Disenchantment, Power Drain and prot skills. Coupled with the mesmer hench (also with Psychic Instability), the 4 sec aoe knockdowns are a-ma-zing.
Tild
Ok for the PvE update.
But could anyone tell me why the hell did we need a buff for mesmers in PvP ?
Oh and improve bots with their interrupts... what's the point ?
But could anyone tell me why the hell did we need a buff for mesmers in PvP ?
Oh and improve bots with their interrupts... what's the point ?
-Makai-
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Originally Posted by Bobby2
Is this the place for that? If so, here's one more... xD
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On topic, has anyone tried to go through Magus Stones since the update? I need to complete The Elusive Golemancer in HM, but I'm terrified of those Wind Riders.
The Josip
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Originally Posted by Dzjudz
Well I'm using a Me/Mo hero vanquishing Ferndale with Psychic Instability, Power Return, Mirror of Disenchantment, Power Drain and prot skills. Coupled with the mesmer hench (also with Psychic Instability), the 4 sec aoe knockdowns are a-ma-zing.
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Dzjudz
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Originally Posted by The Josip
You mean your hero uses Phsychic Instability? My Norgu hardly ever used it in the entire zone.
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The Josip
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Originally Posted by Dzjudz
Yes, I'm a little disappointed with the supposed "omgwtf mesmer heroes have amazing interrupt abilities!" hype. Sometimes, even when there are 2 interrupts recharged and energy is plentiful, a Dredge Gardener can cast Life Bond without being interrupted, even when the hero is locked to it.
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So now when mesmer is so supposedly overpowered, can someone give me a proper mesmer hero build. I'd love to use it, really. But I can't find one that *in practice* is more useful than Necro, Rt, EMo, R/Rt and other heroes are.
Lopezus
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| With a 7 second recharge, PI is totally OP imo. |
aspi
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Originally Posted by The Josip
You mean your hero uses Phsychic Instability? My Norgu hardly ever used it in the entire zone.
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Voodoo Rage
Norgu doesn't seem to want to use PI, he spams Empathy like crazy and seems to be able to manage his energy decent enough via Waste Not Want Not and from draining enchantments but otherwise the elite is being wasted.
Martin Alvito
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Originally Posted by Lopezus
Well, it isn't at least not with using it on heros, switch for 3 discord necro heros and well, you will see the difference. PI is giving mesmer some fun in pve, hardly op in comparison to what other proffesions deliver.
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That said, if you herd critters up, pop out a Bed of Coals, and knocklock them on it...they die real fast. Critters die quick when they can't heal. And all it takes is two PIs for perma-knocklock.
All it takes is a player to round them up, a couple of key binds and the brains to interrupt something with comparatively slow skill activation times (midline caster, some melee).
Tild
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Originally Posted by The Josip
So now when mesmer is so supposedly overpowered, can someone give me a proper mesmer hero build. I'd love to use it, really. But I can't find one that *in practice* is more useful than Necro, Rt, EMo, R/Rt and other heroes are.
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The mesmer is getting better in PvE, and I guess it's a good thing.
The problem appears to be in PvP. Just have a look to HA or RA... U'll see tons of mesmers - having no idea of what they're doing, but who cares, now they're just brainless dammage dealer.
And there's no hero there. Only lot of bots. Even more now they're getting better with those better rupt skills : shorter reload, higher dammage ... Who wanted this ? Why did those good working - and commonly used skills had to get better ? This makes no sense at all.
LoKi Foxfire
I don't get why they made a lot of these changes for both PvP and PvE? Mesmers were doing fairly fine in PvP....
Apok
I'm having better results with Gwen having PI and giving her a rit heal bar. Especially in the Courier runs; as soon as the Mantle pop up, she'll knock them all down. It's quite hilarious, really.
But yes, Mind Wrack is pretty much the number one skill to tone down, perhaps even revert.
But yes, Mind Wrack is pretty much the number one skill to tone down, perhaps even revert.
FlyMoto
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Originally Posted by Jeydra
On the other hand, if this is a PvP update ... then the power creep is insane. Back in the day when Cry of Frustration stopped the infamous FoC spike, it was 15 energy. Then it got buffed to 10 energy, and now it's not only 10 energy it deals increased damage. Energy Surge used to have a longer cooldown, higher energy cost and less damage, yet it was still a good skill at that time. What the heck!? Instead of buffing the things that counter Monks, why not just nerf the already-overpowered Monk skills ... back in the day Orison healed for 60 health for 5 energy, yet now Patient Spirit heals twice that much for the same energy cost while being essentially uninterruptable, and WoH heals three times that much for the same energy cost.
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The power creep is ridiculous (even moreso in PvE even though you don't mention that). ANet keeps buffing classes in PvE only making the game increasingly mindless. Include massive amounts of consumables which make you ridiculous to try to kill, PvE-only skills which are purposefully more powerful than any non-PvE-only skill, and PvE versions of some skills which make them ridiculous to NOT use and you simply make the game boring. The only way to make the game challenging any more is to either play really stupid and/or refuse to use cons/pveskills/other skills which are much more powerful than anything from back in prophecies days.
lemming
Lightning Strike - 5e 1s 5s, 47 damage with 25% armor penetration
Overload - 5e 1/4s 4s, 38+47 damage with 47 aoe splash
Just saying.
Overload - 5e 1/4s 4s, 38+47 damage with 47 aoe splash
Just saying.
Cuilan
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Originally Posted by FlyMoto
QFE
The power creep is ridiculous (even moreso in PvE even though you don't mention that). |