I believe it's the only way to make this filthy disgrace of talentless garbage and grieving nuisances a viable option as "something to do" for the players who know better. At the moment it's a steaming cesspool of worthless shit, because good players such as myself stay far away from it, like i said, because i know better.
I know anyone with half a brain does the same, for beyond obvious reasons that i don't need to go on and name. Just saying, it's a quick and on-the-fly something to do in this game. As a game that's dying in the worst way, it'd be nice to have something to do since everything else has been thrown down the shitter.
If you disagree with this then i ask you the question. How can there be dishonor in something there is no honor in to begin with?
Remove dishonor from RA
Gift3d
CronkTheImpaler
I think honour is being used rather loosely here. RA has never been high end, and i dont see how it ever will be.
having said that, when you start referring to yourself as "how good you are" at RA then you may want to go outside and chase butterflies or something.
Cronk
having said that, when you start referring to yourself as "how good you are" at RA then you may want to go outside and chase butterflies or something.
Cronk
Chrisworld
Play the damn arena and ignore the people that oppose you? I don't mean put them in ignore, just IGNORE them and play the arena. You're bound to find a good team or two in there sometimes, but it's not perfect.
Besides, RA will never be up to your polished pedestal golden standards because it's just that - random.
Play it and quit moaning over here about it. No one wants to help you with your personal problem you have with parts of the game.
Besides, RA will never be up to your polished pedestal golden standards because it's just that - random.
Play it and quit moaning over here about it. No one wants to help you with your personal problem you have with parts of the game.
AndroBubbles
Good players such as yourself? That statement alone makes me doubt the validity of your opinion. On top of that, my own personal experience makes me think that it's a good think to punish bad behavior. I think it's pretty lame that a person should be able to leave just because my elite is Escape, just because they're under the misconception that it's a horrible elite in RA's context. I think it's a lame idea that a person should be able to leave on a whim and have no repercussions. That said, I think the dishonor system could be improved. Sometimes people will disconnect and 007 out, which can cause dishonor if you've already had a leave counted against you.
Luminarus
The issue with dishonor is that you can leave a couple of matches every hour or so and your alright. Also the 10 minutes break isnt that big a deal because it means you can go hit the head, or grab something to eat.
The bigger issue with it is leechers/griefers. If only one person reports you get dishonor yourself. They need to have a system in place where if you report someone and they dont do anything for 20 seconds and arent dc'd then they get dishonor points and you dont.
The bigger issue with it is leechers/griefers. If only one person reports you get dishonor yourself. They need to have a system in place where if you report someone and they dont do anything for 20 seconds and arent dc'd then they get dishonor points and you dont.
Benderama
dishonorable is meant to stop bots/leechers e.t.c. from repeatedley getting into games. it doesn't do anything for people who play PvP normally (and to do that you'd need a competent computer). why not just ask all your team to resign, or wait under 2 minutes for your team to be slaughtered?
neighto
I say we get rid of them "holier then thou" players from the game not just a certain area.. but hey thats my opinion
RA is fine the way it is.. you get good random teams, you get bad random teams.. you win, you lose...yes there's the occasional leecher/griefer but hey.. thats why its random.
my only suggestion to the change of dishonor would be to make it automatic if you load up and bail out cause you dont have a monk, or whatever "perfect" team set up there.
No questions you leave a match you get dishonor. no grace for being a jerkwad and leaving the other 3 people there to try to fight, or resign etc.
RA is fine the way it is.. you get good random teams, you get bad random teams.. you win, you lose...yes there's the occasional leecher/griefer but hey.. thats why its random.
my only suggestion to the change of dishonor would be to make it automatic if you load up and bail out cause you dont have a monk, or whatever "perfect" team set up there.
No questions you leave a match you get dishonor. no grace for being a jerkwad and leaving the other 3 people there to try to fight, or resign etc.
Moonstalker
I'm fine with it the way it is. It's broken, anyway, in one way or another. You can choose which ways those are. I get the usual trollers in RA. The people who bring run skills and just sprint around the maps until the time runs out, or whatever, and I don't want to waste my time so I leave, and get dishonored, but that, to me, is just a sign to cool down, and make a sandwich or something. But whatever. To each their arrogant-self own.
Reverend Dr
/report day 1
Got on vent. Synced into RA. Reported numerous people. Got 0 dishonor.
It was then that I knew this system was beautiful.
Got on vent. Synced into RA. Reported numerous people. Got 0 dishonor.
It was then that I knew this system was beautiful.
Lord Dagon
Why remove penalties? that jsut doesnt make sense. Thats just asking for people to go in and leech points...
Divine Ashes
Yeah let's make an already crappy arena even crappier by allowing those terrible players/leechers/leavers to get away with it all. Sound logic there.
Making the penalties worse would be a lot better than removing them altogether.
Making the penalties worse would be a lot better than removing them altogether.
Shayne Hawke
If it weren't two in the morning already, I would do a search to find an idea similar to this that has been proposed before, because I'm so sure that it has. Can't be arsed to do it right now, maybe I will after I've slept. Anyways,
Closed.
Edit: Actually, all I could find were suggestions for changing the dishonor system or removing it altogether. There was nothing about specifically removing it from RA. Re-opening this thread for now.
I thought that the original intent of the dishonor system was to prevent people from immediately ditching a terrible team in RA so that they could eventually roll something that works. I'm aware that the system is fairly flawed, but I don't see removing it from the arena that it was primarily meant to police as a good move.
Closed.
Edit: Actually, all I could find were suggestions for changing the dishonor system or removing it altogether. There was nothing about specifically removing it from RA. Re-opening this thread for now.
I thought that the original intent of the dishonor system was to prevent people from immediately ditching a terrible team in RA so that they could eventually roll something that works. I'm aware that the system is fairly flawed, but I don't see removing it from the arena that it was primarily meant to police as a good move.
colosusjokers
Considering posts I have seen from gifted so far I think the system works to some degree at least in keeping griefers out. I can honestly see him doing nothing but giving whoever has the misfortune of being grouped with him a bunch of crap. Even if it's a decent team.
There should be a penalty added however for people that just go around reporting people as leaching even though they aren't. Other than that it makes no difference to me.
There should be a penalty added however for people that just go around reporting people as leaching even though they aren't. Other than that it makes no difference to me.
Gift3d
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Chrisworld
Play the damn arena and ignore the people that oppose you? I don't mean put them in ignore, just IGNORE them and play the arena. You're bound to find a good team or two in there sometimes, but it's not perfect.
Besides, RA will never be up to your polished pedestal golden standards because it's just that - random. Play it and quit moaning over here about it. No one wants to help you with your personal problem you have with parts of the game. |
-Getting worthless teammates without secondaries vs mo/me/w/a teams
-Grievers on your team who run around the map for 7 minutes after your team of secondarylesss scrubs get facerolled, forcing you to stay in the match while they run in circles.
-Healing eachother to death for 8 minutes without a single kill
Also, no one's moaning, and this is an improvement i see fit in guild wars. Not personal. You need to brush up on your English comprehension skills, either that or you read the wrong post. Mine's up there, the first one.
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Benderama
dishonorable is meant to stop bots/leechers e.t.c. from repeatedley getting into games. it doesn't do anything for people who play PvP normally (and to do that you'd need a competent computer). why not just ask all your team to resign, or wait under 2 minutes for your team to be slaughtered?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Tobi Madera
Why remove penalties? that jsut doesnt make sense. Thats just asking for people to go in and leech points...
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Skye Marin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gift3d
Wasting time for reasons such as:
-Getting worthless teammates without secondaries vs mo/me/w/a teams -Grievers on your team who run around the map for 7 minutes after your team of secondarylesss scrubs get facerolled, forcing you to stay in the match while they run in circles. -Healing eachother to death for 8 minutes without a single kill People in RA do not resign. Ever. |
If wasting time is your concern, you should be happy that some random asshole can't waste your time by quitting your team when they join just because they feel like it.
Horus Moonlight
RA back before the dishonor system was MUCH worse than what it is now. It might be a flawed in certain ways but it is still better than the alternative.
Chocobo1
Yeah, I'd love dishonor removed but honestly It's just trading one shitty system for another. Either people are forced to stay on bad teams, or your monk leaves when you zone in because he didn't sync with his friend. Or your team mate doesn't like the fact you have a paragon on your team so he leaves. It's all retarded, just leave it as it is tbh.
Jeydra
I'd much rather play with bad players than with so-called good players who leave every match before it begins.
Missing HB
Point is then , people who're trying to sync will just leave at begin , people having no monk , 4 melee , etc will do same and the arena will become even more crap than it is atm , so id rather keep dishonor like it is
/notsigned
/notsigned
Morphy
Yeah, I miss the old days where if you had a bad team you would just gtfo.
/signed
/signed
urania
RA players report me for resigning in dual or tripple heal teams, in teams with wammos and eles without secondary. oh and synchs abuse it to the most too.
remove the goddamn thing already. or better: remove RA altogether. it only stands for [R]etards' [A]rena anyway now.
on a side note, void and rok's game Conquest has finally been officially released...much better to play that than waste one's time in RA. honestly.
http://www.conquest-game.com
=P
if only gw devs had shown such dedication...sigh.
remove the goddamn thing already. or better: remove RA altogether. it only stands for [R]etards' [A]rena anyway now.
on a side note, void and rok's game Conquest has finally been officially released...much better to play that than waste one's time in RA. honestly.
http://www.conquest-game.com
=P
if only gw devs had shown such dedication...sigh.
Sirius Bsns
Quote:
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Originally Posted by urania
RA players report me for resigning in dual or tripple heal teams, in teams with wammos and eles without secondary. oh and synchs abuse it to the most too.
remove the goddamn thing already. or better: remove RA altogether. it only stands for [R]etards' [A]rena anyway now. on a side note, void and rok's game Conquest has finally been officially released...much better to play that than waste one's time in RA. honestly. http://www.conquest-game.com =P if only gw devs had shown such dedication...sigh. |
On topic though, I hope to Gawd they get rid of the Dishonor System because the cons far outweigh the pros by far! Random Arenas has decreased in size a lot, and I'm pretty sure that the Dishonor System accounts for most of it. If Anet doesn't take care of this issue quick, they're going to be losing more and more players as a direct result. It wouldn't take a whole lot of effort to fix these issues. They just need to find a way to minimize /report abuse to the point where the player has something to lose if he/she overuses/abuses it, but at the same time not overdo it and cause a worse predicament than when this abusable system was first introduced.
Bandwagon
I think I see where the OP is coming from. Getting bad groups, yet having to stick with them stinks, however that is pretty much the premise of RA.
If anything the report/dishonor feature can use an improvement, I hate whiny babies reporting me/ friends out of spite (as a pose to, well you know, being a D-bag/ leecher) and then making us wind up with dishonor.
/signed
A real form of casual PvP should be implemented instead of this tripe.
If anything the report/dishonor feature can use an improvement, I hate whiny babies reporting me/ friends out of spite (as a pose to, well you know, being a D-bag/ leecher) and then making us wind up with dishonor.
/signed
A real form of casual PvP should be implemented instead of this tripe.
Steps_Descending
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Bandwagon
A real form of casual PvP should be implemented instead of this tripe.
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Sirius Bsns
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Kaloff THE overlord
i think if you dont like RA then you should go play GvG or HA, the rewards there are far better than RA and is less frustrating
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Hugh Manatee
If you're not prepared to live with the consequences of hitting the enter battle button in RA then don't bother to hit the button. This is what "dishonor" and the report system were meant to address.
If you wanted an arena where you can pick and choose teammates you should have played TA or codex.
Hawk up there is right, last big streak i went on we had no monk, just 4 guys who could support themselves, use well timed res sigs and not be stupid. we rolled at least 3, 4 or more teams that did have monks. A lot of the time I've gone 2v1 after my allies go down and res sigs were burned. That's just how RA is.
If you wanted an arena where you can pick and choose teammates you should have played TA or codex.
Hawk up there is right, last big streak i went on we had no monk, just 4 guys who could support themselves, use well timed res sigs and not be stupid. we rolled at least 3, 4 or more teams that did have monks. A lot of the time I've gone 2v1 after my allies go down and res sigs were burned. That's just how RA is.
HawkofStorms
They will not remove dishonor in order to promote the very behavior dishonor was implemented to stop.
Jeydra
You think "throttling back on the Dishonorable Combatant System" will breathe more life into RA? How naive. I would quit at once if half the matches end in 10 seconds with one side resigning out / all leaving / playing 3v2s in a 4v4 arena. The problem you state - that teams with Monks win far more than teams without - should be addressed by nerfing Monks, not by changing the arena to suit overpowered Monks.
Xenomortis
Kill the Gladiator title. Lock it now or remove it from the game.
I have no wish to be teamed up with people who will just resign or leave if they don't like the look of the team they're in. Currently the dishonorable status is the only thing preventing them from doing just that.
I have no wish to be teamed up with people who will just resign or leave if they don't like the look of the team they're in. Currently the dishonorable status is the only thing preventing them from doing just that.
Skye Marin
I feel the real issue with RA are the players who play there. It's the easiest to pick up because you only have to set up a character and go, and all of people expect to win long streaks consistently because they feel they are the best players ever.
Luck has a lot to do with winning a strong streak in RA, but luck favors the prepared. If your build requires a monk to function, and you're wasting time waiting to be paired with a monk, then maybe it's time to re-think your build or roll a monk yourself.
Luck has a lot to do with winning a strong streak in RA, but luck favors the prepared. If your build requires a monk to function, and you're wasting time waiting to be paired with a monk, then maybe it's time to re-think your build or roll a monk yourself.
Skyy High
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Gift3d
I believe it's the only way to make this filthy disgrace of talentless garbage and grieving nuisances a viable option as "something to do" for the players who know better. At the moment it's a steaming cesspool of worthless shit, because good players such as myself stay far away from it, like i said, because i know better.
I know anyone with half a brain does the same, for beyond obvious reasons that i don't need to go on and name. Just saying, it's a quick and on-the-fly something to do in this game. As a game that's dying in the worst way, it'd be nice to have something to do since everything else has been thrown down the shitter. |
Pathetic. RA is a viable option as "something to do", it just happens that your definition of "something to do" is restricted to "something that earns me title points".
I'm so not sorry that the anti-griefing measures are preventing you from doing what you want to do in RA. In fact, I take it as evidence for the success of Dishonor. RA was absolutely unplayable for anyone who was just in there for kicks and giggles before dishonor and /report, now at least I'll get through a few games without incident. It probably has as much to do with the fact that all the "good" (read: "too 1337 for thou") players have been driven back to the organized formats where they belong.
Shayne Hawke
In case you all haven't noticed, the discussion point of this thread is the Dishonorable Combat System and its existence in RA, not any potential balance flaws to the arena. Please do not throw this thread off into another tangent again.
You have to either
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Reverend Dr
The /report was a band-aid fix to design problems with the arena itself, but we can't discuss the design flaws of RA?
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- Make the connection
- Make a new thread with proper suggestion or discussion point
Reverend Dr
The report system was put into place because of leechers/leavers, that type of player didn't exist before the Glad title. Its a very valid tangent.
The /report was a band-aid fix to design problems with the arena itself, but we can't discuss the design flaws of RA?
The /report was a band-aid fix to design problems with the arena itself, but we can't discuss the design flaws of RA?
X CDH X
Hmm tbh in a hopeless situation it probably is best to resign - if for example you have 3 healers or no healers vs a well balanced group but ppl dont always want to resign. Resigning is good as can have a chance to get a better team...
The dishonarable system is kinda fair I think - can get away with one leave then you get punished with the ban.
In RA I nearly always fight to the end of the battle and leave after we win as I think maybe the remaining people on the team will get a monk
It would be kinda dumb to remove it as ppl will be leaving teams to fight 3 v 4 too much.
I'd guess the number one way to get high streaks and avoid the annoying ppl / teams would be to sync with guildies / friends - lame but works
The dishonarable system is kinda fair I think - can get away with one leave then you get punished with the ban.
In RA I nearly always fight to the end of the battle and leave after we win as I think maybe the remaining people on the team will get a monk
It would be kinda dumb to remove it as ppl will be leaving teams to fight 3 v 4 too much.
I'd guess the number one way to get high streaks and avoid the annoying ppl / teams would be to sync with guildies / friends - lame but works
Roen
Maybe off topic but (forgive my naivete here I never play PvP at all) wouldn't it make sense to leave Dishonor in place but also allow a X-minute team prep time before the fight starts so you get randomly paired and you've got X minutes to adjust builds as best you're able before the fight starts?
I'm thinking, even if you pop in with three Monks you've got enough time even if it's just 60 seconds to ping each others' builds and pop into templates to switch one to protector one to smiter and one to healer. Make it 30 seconds to see if you can get the team organized that quickly. Adds to the challenge.
Then if people still bail on their teams repeatedly, they more truly deserve dishonor.
Just my un-PvP-playing two cents.
I'm thinking, even if you pop in with three Monks you've got enough time even if it's just 60 seconds to ping each others' builds and pop into templates to switch one to protector one to smiter and one to healer. Make it 30 seconds to see if you can get the team organized that quickly. Adds to the challenge.
Then if people still bail on their teams repeatedly, they more truly deserve dishonor.
Just my un-PvP-playing two cents.
Skye Marin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Roen
Maybe off topic but (forgive my naivete here I never play PvP at all) wouldn't it make sense to leave Dishonor in place but also allow a X-minute team prep time before the fight starts so you get randomly paired and you've got X minutes to adjust builds as best you're able before the fight starts?
I'm thinking, even if you pop in with three Monks you've got enough time even if it's just 60 seconds to ping each others' builds and pop into templates to switch one to protector one to smiter and one to healer. Make it 30 seconds to see if you can get the team organized that quickly. Adds to the challenge. Then if people still bail on their teams repeatedly, they more truly deserve dishonor. Just my un-PvP-playing two cents. |
The title is fine, the rewards are fine. I issue is short-tempered players expecting to win all the time, and blaming something other than themselves when they inevitably lose.
Instead of removing Dishonor, a great solution would be permanently adding Costume Brawl, with rotating builds every month or so.
Sirius Bsns
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Shayne Hawke
In case you all haven't noticed, the discussion point of this thread is the Dishonorable Combat System and its existence in RA, not any potential balance flaws to the arena. Please do not throw this thread off into another tangent again.
You have to either
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If both teams in every match-up had either one monk per team, or no monk at all, each team would have an equal chance at winning the match every single time by default [this variable would depend on each individual player's build, and how well they play it]. Would players have any reason whatsoever to leave prematurely if this were true?
The answer: they wouldn't! By default, teams would have an equal chance, thus providing the reason to stay and play for at least that match.
So, to say that we cannot talk about the reasons "why" RA and the D.C. System is just preposterous.
Jeydra
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sirius Bsns
If both teams in every match-up had either one monk per team, or no monk at all, each team would have an equal chance at winning the match every single time by default [this variable would depend on each individual player's build, and how well they play it]. Would players have any reason whatsoever to leave prematurely if this were true?
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... yeah. Thank ANet for dishonour.
Hugh Manatee
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Sirius Bsns
Your first part of the first sentence is absolutely correct, and the second part of it is the cause. The Dishonorable Combatant System alone isn't what makes playing in RA aweful, it's the fact that this monk-imbalance exists....
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We need a mechanism to punish stupid players who lack the mental capacity to implement these tactics, who rely on pvx cookies to win for them, who would otherwise abuse other players by leeching or quitting. It's not perfect but it's there.(and, dr reverend, these issues were always around, I recall people leeching faction or raging from even before factions was released, though iirc it was more due to syncing). The biggest flaw with them now is they aren't very binding, you can abuse them once every hour or so, and if you try to enforce with report you're the one with your ass on the line.
What RA could might use is some sort of tiebreaker, or scoring system that might allow a truly "random team"(4 healers, 4 melee ect) to actually win, they could put some other goals in there with minimal modifications to existing maps, and annihilation matches should be far, far shorter(with some sort of goal or objective to allow defense teams to do damage, like with the flag stands, but ramped way up). Maybe they could implement some sort of "holding area" for teams before they actually start fighting, like they have in HA with the zaishen fight and vault, let people see whats up before a real fight, let them rage there without penalties. I dunno but giving people less of a reason to rage seems like a good idea.
And bring back TA, add tourneys for it and CA...
Sirius Bsns
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Hugh Manatee
It's not monk imbalance or or the dishonorable, it's a player stupidity issue. As said, last streak i was on, was like 15 or 17 wins, we skull****'d several teams with a monk, and i think a couple team with 2 or with a rit and a monk(those took awhile but they couldn't out pressure us). If you don't have a healer in your party you have a whole extra slot of offense with which to overwhelm defense, and if each player is self sufficient(they can deal with blinds, burn sigs, identify and shut down hexes) it shouldn't be that hard to run out a monks energy, or decoy damage to get past prots.
We need a mechanism to punish stupid players who lack the mental capacity to implement these tactics, who rely on pvx cookies to win for them, who would otherwise abuse other players by leeching or quitting. It's not perfect but it's there.(and, dr reverend, these issues were always around, I recall people leeching faction or raging from even before factions was released, though iirc it was more due to syncing). The biggest flaw with them now is they aren't very binding, you can abuse them once every hour or so, and if you try to enforce with report you're the one with your ass on the line. What RA could might use is some sort of tiebreaker, or scoring system that might allow a truly "random team"(4 healers, 4 melee ect) to actually win, they could put some other goals in there with minimal modifications to existing maps, and annihilation matches should be far, far shorter(with some sort of goal or objective to allow defense teams to do damage, like with the flag stands, but ramped way up). Maybe they could implement some sort of "holding area" for teams before they actually start fighting, like they have in HA with the zaishen fight and vault, let people see whats up before a real fight, let them rage there without penalties. I dunno but giving people less of a reason to rage seems like a good idea. And bring back TA, add tourneys for it and CA... |
Also, giving people less of a reason to rage doesn't seem like a good idea, it IS a good idea! Punishing players more as opposed to just mitigating the cause for said punishable player reaction will lead to the death of RA.