In your opinion, what's the best overall class in Guild Wars?

Elementalist

They can do basically everything.

Maybe I'm reading that wrong but that sounds pretty harsh. You want to keep your special sauce to yourself, fine. You could have just said so without the douchiness.

I'm casting my vote for necromancer in PvE. Necromancers are extremely versatile - they can run necromancer builds, ritualist builds, even elementalist, mesmer and monk builds if they really want. It's the best e-management in PvE, imo.

I don't PvP very often, but monk and mesmer come to mind.

I'm just going to be different and say Mesmers. Why? Because they own you.

+1 for elly.

My elly can heal or prot better than any monk can in PVE.

Go go Ether Renewal

Ether Renewal > Soul Reaping.

Its easy to prevent it from getting stripped by covering it with something else.

Elementalists.

They have a great mix of damage, control and support with decent range.

They are the most GW2-esque profession.

They are the Protagonists, after all. The ones blessed by all gods.

I second this and if I was going to play GW2 this would be it not that monkagon BML.

passive primary boost > elite skill wasted on the same thing

anyways, my post about derv in pve and paragon in pvp was sarcasm, as nothing could be further from the truth

anyways x 2, in such a subjective question with so few parameters laid out, it's open to interpretation and personal feelings.

Reminds me of when people ask me, what's better, wine from California or from France?

No not really. Necros cant match an elly spamming Shield Guardian / Spirit Bond / Prot Spirit / Infuse Health across the whole party as soon as each skill recharges. They do not have enough energy for it, nor will soul reaping ever give them enough energy back to allow it.

You dont need an elite healing skill when Ether Renewal gives you superior healing with non elite skills.

This is one crazy version of the build, but not the one I use:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYT7fAbAn6A

Mine is:

Shield Guardian / Spirit Bond / Infuse Health / Prot Spirit / Aegis / Ether Renewal / Aura of Restoration / Elemental Lord.

And I have hexes / conditions handled by the hero or hench.

I made a video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vF0uouZSls

Lets see necros or monk heal / prot that much

This, Necromancers in close second.

They can heal, support, deal damage. They exceed in those combined categories compared to other classes.

Combined is the key word,

Warriors, assassins, ritualists and dervishes deal much more damage.

Monks can heal or prot better than ele's but ele's exceed in that both of those if they're combined.

Mesmers and necromancers can are the damage dealing caster classes. Mesmers have access to the deadest hexes and powerful primary attribute and necromancers have a huge energy regain which is a force to be reckoned with. But they can't compare to heal and support of an ele.

Rangers are best built for PvP (its true ) and paragons have access to those three categories, but faulters much lower.

Ele's can play all three roles with little to no problems.

It is to bad you don't get the divine favour bonus as we do.Who is going to do the ressing and we only need 1 or 2 heal for a whole party.

most balanced would be warrior primary

^ This, but for the most powerful overall i'd probably say nec.

I'd have to go with Warrior although I've never played an Ele extensively.

Firstly a healer with a res is a bad healer. Divine Favor bonus still doesnt heal for as much as my Infuse does, no other class can spam infuse as much, and monks run out of energy far too fast to keep up with he amount of healing that can be required (Larger / infinite energy pool on a healer >>> DF bonus for sustained healing / support).

If you are ressing then you arent healing. If you need to res a lot, you're doing something very wrong in the first place. I dont really need to rely on much ressing, having heroes handle that when rarely required is fine (a death pact signet and a renew life or two is all I need, plus res sigs on the rest).

Resurrect spells on the human player is an obsolete requirement in GW PVE. I havnt ever taken a res skill since I first started using heroes and realised that I never needed it anymore.

Secondly try looking up what Shield Guardian does. It works as an AoE heal that hits everyone around the target while also mitigating damage (like an AoE RoF or Vengeful weapon). It has a 1s cooldown and IMO make the best AoE heal / support skill in the game for me on this build when it can be constantly spammed.

Also, only using 1-2 heals for a whole party sounds kind of lazy and lame to me, but an elly can manage with just infuse anyway, but I wouldnt ever do that as a diversion / chillblains or something similar would decimate it. As for party wide healing, there are a lot of other builds available too - Heal Party / Breath of the Great Dwarf, and even Extinguish can be added onto this bar. Even a Rit secondary on a couple of heroes with PWK / Life / Rejuvenation is fine as well.

I am able to get through anything in HM using just me with that build and Mhenlo, and prot spells and direct healing is a lot more important than just standing on the spot spamming heal party, which I actually assume is why you think that a res skill is needed on the healer, because when you use that build (healers boon woth no prots right?), I'm quite sure that your party will end up dying all around you.

Also, monks are no where near as good as an 'overall class'. They pretty much only have RoJ for an acceptable damage build, but stationary AoE spells pretty much fail at anything in PVE because the AI never stays in it.

I also have a PVE monk, rit, and paragon. After playing them all, I wonder why I even bothered making them because Elly's still make better healers. If you want to make a more direct healing build, then an E/Rt with restoration spells still pushes red bars up better than most monk builds can (Prism E/Rt > Monk).

Warriors cant swap to a healing role, and IMO the only decent warrior build in PVE now is Earthshaker. Also a derv with a Wounding Strike build backed by a curses necro with ulcerous lungs > Warrior anyday for me.

My personal specific order for the best 'overall classes' would be:

1) Elementalist (can damage / support / heal)

2) Necromancer (As above plus lots of hexes)

3) Ritualist (same again, damage / support / heals. Siphon Spirit = legendary energy management for a support build, and Chiyo in Factions has one of the best henchmen / hero skillbars in the game).

4) Paragon (damage / support, Paraway is very powerful in PVE)

5) Dervish (damage / support, have a lot of brilliant melee and support builds, I like orders dervish a lot, and Wounding Strike)

6) Mesmer (Damage / Shutdown. Major shutdown).

As for monks, only Mhenlo is required as he frees up a hero slot for something a lot more useful.

Meh, with warriors, I forgot about hundred blades / whirling + cyclone axe. But either Earthshaker or a derv is still a lot better for me.

That depends upon what you mean by "best". Best at what? The one you like to play the most is actually the best - it is, after all, just a game.

But, my overall response, for PvE, would be Ritualist - barring any future nerfs.

For PvP - don't know, don't care.

We do not run out of energy as if you read anything about DF is is our E-Mange

That is right which what you should be doing the ressing as i make a point not to put res on.

it is what you should be doing the ressing and leaving us doing what we were meant to do

I know what it does.

It is all we need to keep red bars up and players happy.

i think anyone can get through HM/

They are to and what about SoJ and Monks are the best protection class ever.

I have an Ele that I don't play to much anymore since all this hostilty towards Monks and them not being in GW2 has me hating the Eles class more for taking our jops away from us.

I have read nothing but negative posts on The Guru2 about Monks as we were once adored in this game which I hope this game lives long and prosper and that one dies of dishonorable death 2 proverbs from a Vulcan and a Klingon.





[/QUOTE]

In PVE

Rit for raw versitality (heal or spirits or damage)

Mesmer a close 2nd (Becuase you need to use your head to be effective and its not a button massing class)

This takes into account I do not use PVE skills that often most builds I omit them on purpose to give more challange

Deal damage in HM with their skills?

LOL.

Basically any player that has played both a Necro and Ele in Hard mode will tell you there is no contest.

Mark of Pain + SS + barbs... is like Searing Flames in NM. The only exception is when there is supremely heavy hex removal (use cover hexes).

And saying Eles have better energy management than necros is being blind to facts. ONE skill (ether renewal) does not make a profession. Ether renewal has been nerfed before, hence the term "ether renewaled". You can cover it, but then you have 2 enchants on your bar. What about "Rend Enchantments", "gaze of Contempt", "signet of humility"?

The necro brings more to the table without doing anything with elites. It has weaken armor, barbs, mark of pain, enfeebling blood (bigger aoe and longer duration than "You're all weaklings!"), etc. The entire Necro death magic has nonelites that are useful (Animate Bone fiend, Death Nova, anyone?). Blood magic has blood ritual, Order of pain, blood bond, blood of the aggressor (post buff), Dark fury, Strip enchant (removes 2), Oppressive gaze...

The money elementalist skills tend to be elite, except for Water Magic. (Mind Blast, Blinding Surge, Searing Flames, Unsteady Ground, Ward against melee, Blurred vision, Eruption, Rodgort's Invocation (with dual attunements/mind blast), Deep Freeze, Ether Renewal, etc.)

There is a difference. A Monk cannot spam 10e prots like Prot Spirit, Shield Guardian, and Spirit Bond on recharge. Ele's can do this without having to worry about energy whatsoever. A Monk must be selective.

...so why did you bring up rezzing in the first place?

You seriously need to get over your stubborn outdated Monks are better mindset. It's not 2005 anymore. We've tried explaining this to you before but you refuse to see reason. A Monk cannot spam 10e prots on recharge and ~300health heals every second indefinitely. This is a fact.

Fair enough, but Infuse is without a doubt significantly better.

We know. That is why HM isn't much of an indication of what is good and what isn't. However it is just a matter of looking at what is possible with an ER and you'll see a Monk simply cannot match up.

First half: sure they are, but other professions fill key roles better. Also SoJ, whether that refers to Shield or Signet of Judgment, is horrible damage. Surely you can see this.
Second half: it's not 2005 anymore.

So you refuse to admit ER's are better at Monking than Monks because you're bitter that they're losing their 'jops'? Things change, get over it, seriously.

Defense: Monks - best defensive utilities [i.e.: hex+condition removals/prots/redbarring/etc].
Offense: Warriors -damage + utility [i.e.: knockdowns/interrupts/deep wounds/high damage/etc.].

They took're jyobs!


Seriously though, there is no "best class". Necros have alot of versatility due to secondary abuse via soul reaping. But there is alot they cant do as well. Assassins are better at DPS than Wars and Dervs. And they are still the staple of most SCs. But, they tend to be squishy and lack support. They can both be trouble in PvP. If I had to choose, it would be between the Necro and Sin. But, I like them all.

Dervish. True we are getting a class overhaul because Dervish are simply ineffective compared to critscythes and WE warriors, and various alternatives. True that Dervish nor scythes will be in GW2. True that everyone hates us and I hate you.

Still, we're just badass. Haters gonna hate. 'Nuff said.

They can to ever hear of the SB as well the 55 Monk both spam 2 10e spells

It wasn't on their skill bars and Monks aren't for this



I will when all the Monk hate stops considering they won't be in GW2 and alll that I read on The guru 2 forums.Yes they can spam 10 e spells and they heal as well nothing an Ele can do.







They can to and I know one who can beat an Ele in any dungeon/misssion even if there is a wipe.



SoJ is not horrible damage




They aren't as that is not what they were designed for if so they are horribly imbalanced and try doing this in PvP Eles won't be able to keep up to a Monk.I would like to see Er go back the way it was and btw Monk have had more nerfs and had no buffs in last 2 years.The whole protection line as had more nerfs than any with no buffs.


I am not stuck in 2005 I am defending Monks right to exist.Why don't we just get rid of Warriors Sins seem to be able to fill the role nice they can wield sword shield on top of that they have more mana.Why don't they replace the Warrior as they have decent damage.Sins can use all their attribute where as Warrior only uses 2?How would you feel if you main class was replaced in pve as well say in GW2 considering the use guns why use Warriors.Sins don't need to build up all the adrenaline since they use energy based skills.You might want to think about all of that.

Offense - warrior
Defense - ele

IMO this makes any class the LEAST balanced class in the game. Requiring any class for basic survival is never an endearing quality. It's completely Artificial & forced synergy.

Best is by it's nature a subjective question. I only PVE so I don't really have a PVP opinion (except all the JQ/FA I did to max Luxon and they are kind of a poor man's PVP). My main character is an Ele, which is a fun way to lead a team of H/Hs to me. If best means what's easy I'd say necro or the ubiqitous SOS rit build. For PVE monks are nice but a hard way to lead the AI's unless you are ROJing. And for many pve uses the necro rit works as well or better than monks on an H/H squad.
So best.... I guess what's best is whatever you think is the most fun.

...are you serious? How is a 55 Monk or SB Monk going to take care of the team? Pulling out random builds like that indicates nothing.

Monks cannot spam 10e spells or heal as well as an ele (300+ health per second). This is a FACT. I repeat. THIS IS A FACT. You seem to have serious trouble accepting this.

See the above. A good ER will beat a good Monk in current PvE circumstances.

lol yes. The fact you can't see this shows how bad you are at GW.

Everyone knows ER is a PvE build. Bringing up PvP is pointless and irrelevent. Buffs/Nerfs are also irrelevant. Oh, and yes, ER's are horribly imbalanced, but welcome to 2010, where everything meta is. I never said anything bad about Monks (barring SoJ being complete rubbish, but that's not important); a good Monk is by all means really useful. The fact is that ER is like bringing a gun to a fist fight.

There is a difference between defending their right to exist (whatever that means) and blatantly ignoring the facts. Show me how a Monk in a standard PvE setting can produce 300+ heals every second and cover each and every party member with Prot Spirit/Spirit Bond while still being able to use other high energy spells with no regard to energy whatsoever. Until you do so all you've proved is that you are indeed stuck in 2005 and stubbornly refuse to accept that things have moved on.

1) Wars aren't completely outclassed by Sins. 100B is massively powerful.
2) Attribute usage is irrelevant.
3) Wars don't spend time building adrenaline unless you're doing it wrong.

A skill/build/profession's importance/power has nothing to do with balance. What matters is how it's executed. Monks take quite a lot of skill to play (at least in PvP), so it's a good thing they're so prevalent in the game.

I didn't say anything about a team did I


They can to and won't accept it.



Depends on the player



No it isn't and I have been playing longer than you have.



No it is not irreverent to bring up PvP as do you don't see ER running around in tourney's do you or in RA.



They can though but you won't accept it more so.No I am not stuck in 2005.



I would think they are by todays standards like you are saying Monks,attribute usage is not irrelevant.War do need to spend time building adrenal no I am not doing it wrong.

To the Limit? 100b is kind of a bad example if you ask me because you're only spiking every 30 seconds or so. It's a tank n spank build.

Teams are clearly the point of the discussion, given we were discussing keeping the team alive and resurrecting.

Show me a screenshot/video of your Monk producing 300+ health heals per second and still having energy to cast other big spells for an indefinite period and I'll believe you. However, given this is impossible, you are wrong. I seriously don't know why I bothered arguing with you again, you clearly have no remote idea what you're talking about.

Yes, but back to my previous analogy: ER is like bringing a gun to a fist fight. You're going to need a supernaturally powerful guy to win on the fist fight side. Unless you're comparing a really good monk to a really bad ER (which has no relevance whatsoever*) the ER should come out on top in general PvE circumstances.

*You bringing up useless irrlevant things is happening a lot in this discussion... actually, you haven't brought up anything that is particularly relevant at all.

Have you seen SoJ (whichever one you're referring to) used in current PvE hero setups? What about PvP builds? Speedclears? The answer to those is no (or stop taking build advice from idiots). Hopefully that means something to you...

Also, rofl at 'I've been playing longer than you'. That is possibly the worst argument you've made so far. Even if you take my forum registration date as my GW beginning date it's definitely long enough to not classify me as a beginner.

PS: I've been playing since ~June 2005.

PSS: Using 'I've been playing longer than you' just makes you look like an immature fool who has no valid arguments whatsoever.

No, but this is a PvE discussion. Anyone who runs an ER knows that it's for PvE. PvE is not a tiny niche with incredibly obscure requirements. Designing for it is completely legitimate. If we were discussing PvP, which we aren't, then ER would be useless and I would agree that Monks are better, but I repeat: this is a PvE discussion.

There is nothing to say to this but you are wrong. That is a fact. If this is not obvious to you, I advise you to stop posting and showing the world you have no remote idea what you are talking about.

No. The difference is that Warriors (referring to 100B here) achieve the same goal (killing) but in a different way. Sins will spam DB/MS or whatever to drop single targets quickly and produce good AoE damage through DB. 100B Wars can kill a whole mob in one go with Whirlwind Attack.

FGJ+EC=10 adr. Yes, you are doing it wrong. Building adrenaline engines is simple in PvE.

sins are most fun pve because you can do some much ridiculous stuff with them using SF

and for pvp, well i'm assuming that most people are terrible at it, so then ele is the best because you can be an effective team mate with very little skill. if you're very fukin good, then prot monk, mez, ranger, warrior are all excellent choices.

URBAD. Dervishes lack utility so badly... Warriors can knock down and interrupt, assassins can knock down, interrupt, deal high armor-ignoring damage, and more... What can the Dervish do that outclasses all of the above? The only thing they've got goin' for them is Wounding Strike, and that's about it. So if they have that elite Scythe Attack nerfed, they'd be in a whole world of butthurt and would become as useless as Paragons [except for Imbagons in PvE]! 'Nuff Said.

Learn to read the 1st post

http://pvx.wikia.com/wiki/Build:P/any_Utility_Paragon

The hell you on bro?

Elementalists can heal, prot, farm, tank, nuke, support with orders + wards + conditions, speedclear, run...

We have some competition from the necro, but overall we are the best.

That's a bad thing?

Mitigation and overall survivability my friend.DPS and healing are symbiotic.

It's all subjective but the OP needs to define best because I find it hard to see anyone taking the Warriors title of "Jack of all trades, master of none.".The class has also been a major and consistent factor in all forms of the game since it launched while other class influences on the meta seem to come and go based on the latest buff/nerf.

Outside that it's opinion, experience and situational categorisation imho.

I'm also thinking outside of a class automatically having an experienced player at the helm.

Semantics.

WAMMO FTW!!11!!

ROFLCOPTER

They're NOT prevalent though. The most farmed mobs in the game don't have any monks among them. Before nightfall came out, most of your time playing the game was spent waiting for a monk to show up. And the ONLY REASON monks seemed useful and required in the first place was because all the combat in the game was designed specifically around the assumption that every team had high levels of Healing or exactly 1 dedicated healer for every 3 spikers/nukers.

That's not how you design a class. You don't put 1 class into the game, and then design the Game around that 1 class. But that's what Anet did with Monks b/c it originally started out 100% as a PvP game that had PvE tacked onto. And Now that GW2 is coming out with that whole paradigm flipped on it's head and making huge news b/c of it, it's really really really .... really .... really .... reeeeeaaaaallllly hard to argue for those old crutches that have also been being slowly removed from GW1 (Spirits Summons & AotL buffs = better meatshields, Mesmer control buffs like Panic replacing reactive Mitigation entirely, Tactics got buffed liek whoah, & Dervishes up next for rebalancing)