We need ultimate hard mode - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

stanleyhkw

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jun 2005

06 Mar 2011 at 05:14 - 1

Hard mode isn't hard any more with 7 heroes update.
It is as easy as monkey mode now.

Anet please bring us more challenge, we need mod with 50+ level
or just simply add environment effect to all area, such as

constantly health degen
every step u lost hp
every time u death u randomly get disable 1 skill in your skill bar permanent in that zone. etc

and introduce more title for vang, guardian title etc.

Verene

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jan 2009

[SOTA]

D/

06 Mar 2011 at 05:17 - 2

...you know you don't have to go out with seven heroes, right?

If you think it's too easy with that, then don't use it.

Gabriel of Ravn

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2010

Virginia

None, retired to GW2.

W/A

06 Mar 2011 at 05:19 - 3

Or just go with nothing but hench if you want a semi challenge of course excluding the areas you can't use them.

Kunder

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2010

06 Mar 2011 at 05:20 - 4

We clearly need enemies with +100% attack speed, +500% movement speed, and with an aggro radius of the entire map as well.

DRGN

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2005

In Memorium [iBot]

Mo/A

06 Mar 2011 at 05:36 - 5

The real problems with HM is that it doesn't really fix monster's shit skill bars or their pretty lackluster AI. It just tries to compensate for it with bigger numbers. This would do the same thing.

also 50% chance this is a troll thread

NeHoMaR

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Feb 2006

06 Mar 2011 at 05:43 - 6

I suggested Nightmare Mode 4 years ago:

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10224643

I even did a new icon for the mode

FengShuiDove

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2007

Trinity of the Ascended [ToA]

A/

06 Mar 2011 at 05:45 - 7

No, we need to go back to being bad at the game.

The game has gotten easier, but if we just threw 7 heroes at the playerbase 3 years ago, it wouldn't be as easy as it is now. Turns out, the community has gotten better and mostly the people around here are skilled enough to curbstomp the whole game.

Old game is old, experienced players are experienced.

cosyfiep

are we there yet?

Join Date: Dec 2005

in a land far far away

guild? I am supposed to have a guild?

Rt/

06 Mar 2011 at 06:13 - 8

take all the skills out of your bar, remove all heroes and henchmen from your P...now go and play hm.

seriously if its too easy with 8 people/heroes then dont use 8....my husband likes to play solo, areas that should have 8--and then he has no healing either. so try that.

TheGizzy

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Oct 2010

A giant mitten

TeAe

E/R

06 Mar 2011 at 06:22 - 9

Quote:

Originally Posted by cosyfiep

seriously if its too easy with 8 people/heroes then dont use 8....my husband likes to play solo, areas that should have 8--and then he has no healing either. so try that.

Your hubby and mine are cut from the same cloth, apparently. He runs some sort of incendiary triple shot build he designed and just charges solo into areas I'd be biting my cuticles over even with a full party of 8 skilled human players.

I think he thinks he's some sort of

with a bow. LOL

Eternal Equinox

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

Manhattan, New York

lolumad

E/A

06 Mar 2011 at 07:02 - 10

Ultimate hard mode? solo the game.

Lasai

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2009

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 07:04 - 11

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanleyhkw

Hard mode isn't hard any more with 7 heroes update.
It is as easy as monkey mode now.

Anet please bring us more challenge, we need mod with 50+ level
or just simply add environment effect to all area, such as

constantly health degen
every step u lost hp
every time u death u randomly get disable 1 skill in your skill bar permanent in that zone. etc

and introduce more title for vang, guardian title etc.

Remove all your armor. Equip some vampiric weapon. Take two skills, no elite/pve. Take one monk whose sole skill is heal area. Set to HM. Everytime you die, drop 10k in the zone. Between hidious defeats, pop into SJM to inform everyone how hard core you are. Take a crayon and write whatever titles you want directly on to your monitor.

Seriously, set the bar for yourself. If you think 7 heroes is "monkey mode" why are you using them?

Shayne Hawke

Departed from Tyria

Join Date: May 2007

Clan Dethryche [dth]

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 07:24 - 12

Hard Mode already has introduced a plethora of balance issues with regards to how well suited some classes are for it versus others. We don't need more gimmicky raising-the-bar-on-difficulty modes. It doesn't even sound like it would be remotely like anything that could interest players.

UnChosen

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2006

06 Mar 2011 at 07:24 - 13

I'm willing to bet that if the word "heroes" is replaced with "shadow form" or "Pve Skills" or "Save yourselves!" we would get a different reaction...just saying. There is a massive double standard between heroes "overpowered" and pugs "overpowered".

I rather Anet focus of stuff like Elementalist HM damage, Rangers, Paragon, and grouping incentives.

SongOf

Academy Page

Join Date: Dec 2007

06 Mar 2011 at 07:32 - 14

game too easy with 8 heroes?

play with 4 heroes => increase your drop rate + harder = problem solved + benefits

Lasai

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Apr 2009

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 07:45 - 15

I find it ironic that along with the comments that the game is too easy that there seems to also be a large group of people that want several classes buffed up.

I don't have an opinion on buffing up classes. My main is a ranger, always a bow ranger/me, and has achieved the most. I finished Proph, all of it, with hench only. Possibly that is why I have always felt challenged with the game..I play ranger more than any other class..3 of them.

/shrug. Just an observation. perhaps the game isn't as universally facerolling easy as some would like to claim it is.

Rites

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2010

Deep in the belly of Texas

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 07:48 - 16

as with everyone else here i agree that you need to set your own standards as far as whats hard or not.
there is a challenge out there for peeps to just use core skills
or as everyone else stated drop your heroes

i have an idea.... use a completely unique build setup that wasn't copy/pasted from pvxwiki (no sabway/racway/discord etc...) and see how you fare then

i read somewhere on guru that someone challenged peeps to play solo (no hench/heroes) with no armor and only with sword/shield

seriously the henchmen and heroes were just to replace humans if you couldn't get into parties. theres no rule saying you must use them

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasai

/shrug. Just an observation. perhaps the game isn't as universally facerolling easy as some would like to claim it is.

in all honesty the game actually is so easy with spiritway/sabway/discordway and a few other meta setups. but the ones crying that the game is so easy are usually the ones that dont like playing rangers, paras, eles or any of the more "needing" classes. if it aint meta, they wont play it, which is actually a sad loss for them cuz i enjoy my ranger over all else

Saru The Boss

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Nov 2010

Texas

We Gat Dis [HRUU]

A/

06 Mar 2011 at 07:58 - 17

And give us Speed Clearers even moooooooore drops from Monsters/Chests.

/signed <3

HellScreamS

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2009

wouldn't you like to know?

^yea KFC just subscribed to me for 1 year^

P/

06 Mar 2011 at 08:27 - 18

Seriously this logic is flawed beyond belief. PvE was easy before, and now it's become shit and not challenging at all. Moreover, I see people suggesting going with no heroes or anything. So yea, although you can do this, I find it retarded that by doing this and playing the game in a way it should be played you get the same amount of benefits as some scrub going afk and leaving his heroes to do the job. Casual PvE was easy enough as it was before, without all those retarded heroes, and for the elite areas, well, they are elite areas so they're designed to be more challenging and group people up to do them together.

But really, in a game that already had few player interactions and pug groups for missions and dungeons and everything, this update RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOed the game over even more. I sometimes can't help but think Anet is trying to fail on purpose.

turbo234

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Sep 2006

WI

Mo/

06 Mar 2011 at 08:32 - 19

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiDove

No, we need to go back to being bad at the game.

The game has gotten easier, but if we just threw 7 heroes at the playerbase 3 years ago, it wouldn't be as easy as it is now. Turns out, the community has gotten better and mostly the people around here are skilled enough to curbstomp the whole game.

Old game is old, experienced players are experienced.

I actually completely agree with this. It's easy to realize it too. Ran through the first mission in factions a couple days ago like whatever its a beginner mission, but when it first came out I remember having to get teams bc I couldn't do it alone

Kaida the Heartless

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

N/

06 Mar 2011 at 09:19 - 20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kunder

We clearly need enemies with +100% attack speed, +500% movement speed, and with an aggro radius of the entire map as well.

Tank entire map with Shadow Form. --> Spike with Manlyway and crash the server.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lasai

...Take a crayon and write whatever titles you want directly on to your monitor.

I laughed pretty hard at that. +1 for you.

GW2 is around the corner, we don't need any more modes. If you are really impatient, Dragon Age 2 comes out in a few days; grab that.

Tripolityx

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2006

+2 GMT

WTB Q9 20/20 Bo Staves

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 09:32 - 21

Go solo VQ every area first and then ask for the mode. Kkthx

Bristlebane

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2008

Mo/

06 Mar 2011 at 10:07 - 22

Welcome to Lunatic Mode,
All attack skills used by foes seems to penetrate all defenses. All attacks are double strikes and hit nearby foes. Each strike also removes one stance or enchantment from each foe.

Now beat that

Spiritz

Forge Runner

Join Date: Apr 2007

DMFC

06 Mar 2011 at 10:31 - 23

It seems that many players now have forgotten exactly how far gw has come and how much better they have become at playing.
When we first start we are total newbs and everything seems hard , we also had diff skills in the sense of no new eotn skills , title skills , and many skill buff/nerfs and ai foe improvement.
Ive played for around 4 yrs and wasnt till a few months ago i actually did gayla for first time with a guildie - he did the long route and after a yr of sin doing factions she got her protector title.Now last week i helped wife thru factions and we went thru gayla head on and tbh i was shocked how easy it was ( and was only 2nd time i ever tried it ).
Why was it easy - because in the last year ive improved , better builds and even better hero builds - The mission hadnt changed nor had it got easier.
We all learn and adapt our gameplay at times without even thinking and like has been suggested - if its too easy in hm ( tho you havnt mentioned that elite areas are too easy lol ) then try less heros , use random hero builds with no synergy , no gimmick , no elites , no healers , no heros , no armor.... jeez i could go on but you can easily see where its leading.
Not everyone is an uber1337 player who finds the game easy in hm - as in life ppl find diff things easy or hard.

Ayuhmii Shanbwa

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Holland

[GaMe]

Rt/

06 Mar 2011 at 10:52 - 24

there's just a few things you shouldnt use if you find the game too easy:
1. elite skill
2. pve skills
3. pvx (worst of all, make your own builds from scratch, like i do now)
4. heroes/7 heroes

only these 4 would make the game much harder in HM already, unless you remember pvx builds which you can use and edit, but then still isnt yours

pvx was first made for those who like to share and the ones who liked to get inspired, but now people just go pvx and copy/paste templates, thats NOT playing the game, thats copying what others do.... find your own way in life... AND in GW (and perhaps other games too)

use SF in your 7 hero team, that way it wont be as useful, as you play with your heroes

i can think off more ideas to make it harder, like "use half max armor" (and without runes/insignia's) "no weapon upgrades" and "no healers" and such

for me, i just enjoy the game with my own made builds now, got inspired by existing builds which i heard of, and some i didnt even see, and i try to make the game fun by using all my heroes (all as in whole team of heroes) and in the future i'll use more heroes like derv and such (if they ever improve hero's melee AI)

unlike those hardcore whiners, i enjoy the game, and while waiting for cantha: WoC, i'm doing stuff i like to do, or try to achieve what i want to achieve, and not looking at anyone's builds

for example, i never used AP (and never will)

speaking of which, make AP work only for assassin skills, thats what it is for imo, thats half the problems of elitism being solved i think

Taurean

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jan 2009

South of Norway - The land of Vikings

I have no guild - Yet

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 10:53 - 25

It may be easy if you use overpowered builds and skills. Try to use something else and make it work. I for one think that, if you bring slightly wrong skills\builds, you will get raped.

Kunder

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2010

06 Mar 2011 at 14:05 - 26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaida the Heartless

Tank entire map with Shadow Form. --> Spike with Manlyway and crash the server.

It was a bit of a joke, actually. 100% IAS in guild wars terms = infinite attacks per second. Anything that took more than 1 damage per hit would die instantly, but something like a VwK build would also win instantly.

Quote:

GW2 is around the corner, we don't need any more modes. If you are really impatient, Dragon Age 2 comes out in a few days; grab that.

Which is now a crappy fighting game because Bioware can't make good RPGs anymore

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bristlebane

Welcome to Lunatic Mode,
All attack skills used by foes seems to penetrate all defenses. All attacks are double strikes and hit nearby foes. Each strike also removes one stance or enchantment from each foe.

Now beat that

Hey, hey. Lets not forget that you can't kill any enemy until you lower its personal rest meter to 0. Also, need some kind of shout or weapon spell removal somehow.

Missing HB

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Mar 2010

Anna

A/

06 Mar 2011 at 14:46 - 27

Go do DoA HM with heroes with no bonus items then tell me if HM is easy or not .

wilebill

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Dec 2005

Mt Vernon, Ohio

Band of the Hawk

W/Mo

06 Mar 2011 at 15:23 - 28

No sense ANet wasting time on new modes. If you remember how long it took them to do the current hard mode ... no, they do not have the time or personnel to do it.

Elite Old Vets can adjust their own difficulty level in the existing HM. Who says you need heroes? Give 'em a rest. And then take only the henchmen you need! Whole new game! (heh heh)

Rites

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2010

Deep in the belly of Texas

R/

06 Mar 2011 at 15:45 - 29

Quote:

Originally Posted by wilebill

Elite Old Vets can adjust their own difficulty level in the existing HM. Who says you need heroes? Give 'em a rest. And then take only the henchmen you need! Whole new game! (heh heh)

not really, some of us that only had proph when the whole HM and hero thing came out are used to the silly henchies and still know how to work around their buggy AI

I am Judge

Academy Page

Join Date: Sep 2010

We Wear Sombrero's

P/

06 Mar 2011 at 16:18 - 30

funny thing is that in order for anyone to want something more of a challenge they have to gimp themselves out. And get flamed for bringing it up LOLOLOL.

Pony Slaystation

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Nov 2008

Cardboard Box

Guilds are irrelevant. This... is...... BUILD WARS!!!

Rt/

06 Mar 2011 at 17:09 - 31

Adding anything harder than hard mode would just encourage players to keep coming up with and using gimmicky builds, and people who don't want to make an entirely new character wouldn't be able to play in PUGs just because they aren't an assassin or ritualist or mesmer or whatever is being used for the new meta build for it.

Milennin

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Sep 2006

Europe

W/

06 Mar 2011 at 17:31 - 32

Hell-Mode

Environmental Effects:
-10 Health Degeneration
-10HP loss every step you take
-50HP loss every time you activate a skill
-50% chance to miss when attacking/be interrupted when casting spells
-Enchantments/Spirits/Shouts/Buffs last 50% shorter
-Every 10 seconds one random piece of equipment is unequipped
-Every 10 seconds one random skill on your skillbar is disabled

All enemies have full map aggro (including pop-ups)
All enemies move 200% faster
All enemies have access to Enraged, and are able to activate it at max HP.
All enemies have access to Call to the Torment, and are able to activate it max HP.
All enemies have +50 damage reduction
All enemies have 10HP Health Regeneration
All enemies gain 50HP per step they take (possibly take them over their max HP)

Verene

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jan 2009

[SOTA]

D/

06 Mar 2011 at 18:45 - 33

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiDove

No, we need to go back to being bad at the game.

The game has gotten easier, but if we just threw 7 heroes at the playerbase 3 years ago, it wouldn't be as easy as it is now. Turns out, the community has gotten better and mostly the people around here are skilled enough to curbstomp the whole game.

Old game is old, experienced players are experienced.

That's a good point that a lot of people don't really think about, I think.

A lot people who have been playing for years have gained experience, learned the nuances of how things work, and hence are simply good enough that nothing is going to be too hard. Not everyone can do that. There's nothing wrong with either thing there.

And then you have those who won't run anything but meta builds and then whine that it's too easy...

FoxBat

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Apr 2006

Amazon Basin [AB]

Mo/Me

06 Mar 2011 at 19:02 - 34

I have a very simple to implement variant on this idea.

Monsters: Identical hard mode stats, use PvE versions of skills.

Players: PvE skills locked. PvP-prohibited consumables cannot be used.
Players/Heroes: Use PvP versions of split skills.

There's some challenge that doesn't actually need any rebalancing.

I am Judge

Academy Page

Join Date: Sep 2010

We Wear Sombrero's

P/

06 Mar 2011 at 19:09 - 35

what seems to still be funny. Is that people are complaining that the 7 hero's don't work properly and they need UI updates.... /facepalm

Quote:

Originally Posted by Verene

That's a good point that a lot of people don't really think about, I think.

A lot people who have been playing for years have gained experience, learned the nuances of how things work, and hence are simply good enough that nothing is going to be too hard. Not everyone can do that. There's nothing wrong with either thing there.

And then you have those who won't run anything but meta builds and then whine that it's too easy...

and to add to this, we have those that are going to pay 15k to get a run from Eotn to Longeyes Ledge and then complain about 'Ebon Vanguard Storyline being too hard.'

LifeInfusion

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

in the midline

E/Mo

06 Mar 2011 at 20:24 - 36

Funny thing is if they made this update, but
*did it like WiK where the armor levels aren't insane
* turn off cons + PVE skills
* made balanced teams that do not have 5+ necros with chilblains/strip enchantment
* gave mobs hex removal that doesn't suck

then Eles would be stronger in "Ultimate hard mode" than "hard mode".

chuckles79

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2009

FILA

P/

08 Mar 2011 at 19:38 - 37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Saru The Boss

And give us Speed Clearers even moooooooore drops from Monsters/Chests.

/signed <3

This quote is what's wrong with HM elite areas now.

I think they should introduce new elite areas, where Shadow Form and PvE skills are disabled.

That milkshake will bring the boys to the yard.

chuckles79

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2009

FILA

P/

08 Mar 2011 at 19:40 - 38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Milennin

Hell-Mode

Environmental Effects:
-10 Health Degeneration
-10HP loss every step you take
-50HP loss every time you activate a skill
-50% chance to miss when attacking/be interrupted when casting spells
-Enchantments/Spirits/Shouts/Buffs last 50% shorter
-Every 10 seconds one random piece of equipment is unequipped
-Every 10 seconds one random skill on your skillbar is disabled

All enemies have full map aggro (including pop-ups)
All enemies move 200% faster
All enemies have access to Enraged, and are able to activate it at max HP.
All enemies have access to Call to the Torment, and are able to activate it max HP.
All enemies have +50 damage reduction
All enemies have 10HP Health Regeneration
All enemies gain 50HP per step they take (possibly take them over their max HP)

You forgot all enemies have access to Fingers of Chaos as well.

chuckles79

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2009

FILA

P/

08 Mar 2011 at 19:45 - 39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spiritz

It seems that many players now have forgotten exactly how far gw has come and how much better they have become at playing.
When we first start we are total newbs and everything seems hard , we also had diff skills in the sense of no new eotn skills , title skills , and many skill buff/nerfs and ai foe improvement.

For everyone who played before PvE skills and HM, I have two words that will render this conversation moot: Thunderhead Keep.

Seriously I remember when people still had trouble with Prophecies and the first time I did Ice Caves of Sorrow. Coming out of the cave someone typed in bold caps "BONUS!" and all 7 teammates ran towards the mursaat mob.
For added effect someone even typed "Holy sh---"

Lucky for them I had rebirth, but the point is that you don't see noobness like that anymore.

Oh you see stupid crap everyday. The game is so dumbed down that even a caveman could do it.

Bristlebane

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2008

Mo/

09 Mar 2011 at 14:12 - 40

Instead of a new hardmode .. how about a new "Defend Ascalon" challenge mission .. for up to 3 parties with 4 players in each. Waves of Charr will attack the Ascalonian forces, starting with weaker foes and increasing the level for each wave.

You can chose to stay at the gates for more easy kills (and less rewards) as the ascalonians replenish their forces, or you can push your team deeper behind charr lines and kill much more tough foes. Expect traps, enchantment removals to remove Shadow Forms etc to avoid it becoming a solo farm mission.

Want a preview how it would look like? Go to pre-sear near Rurik and look over the wall at vanguards and charrs fighting. Wouldn't you be able to jump down and take part of it?