.. another "monk awareness" thread.

Nice post Studio Ghibli, I planned on doing this exact thing a long time ago but never got round to it!

Just a few things I would have added:

- As with any caster, monks are constrained by spell recharge times, if the group is taking a lot of damage then people can end up dead no matter how good the monk is. Decent monks always have an eye on the party window, they never let characters die on purpose so don't flame them like they did!

- Try and stay close to your monk, if you go out of his/her range and take damage you can't be healed obviously. Yes monks should keep up as well as they can but on the by and large they aren't normally the ones running about in front (or shouldn't be anyway! )

- Non-warrior professions should not be aggroing! Normally the targeted monsters will attack the first character to attack them or come into their aggro circle, only warriors (and to a lesser extent rangers) have the armor and health to do this effectively, hence the nickname 'tank'. Help your monk by helping yourself, stay at the back if you're a caster, the amount of tanking eles I have seen is ridiculous (and almost everyone of them has blamed the monk for not doing a good enough job).

My piece of advice, which has been mentioned earlier, if you are a healing monk and getting verbal abuse from other players then just warn them you will not heal them if they continue. If they do then carry out your threat, they will change their tune once they die (probably a lot more quickly too). A general PUG needs you much more than you need them, get out and find another group if you have to. NOTHING should stop you enjoying this game, especially people who have never even tried being a monk flaming you But also play like you would want other people to play, don't be a jerk because you think you're untouchable. Thats why monk henchies are popular

/signed

I was in the wilds mission with my monk and one character decided that they wanted to go a differnet way to earn more exp, they died after we were WAAAY past them, and they then started yelling at me beacuse i wouldn't go back and rez them.

Actually, warriors with holy rods isn't so dumb, under the right circumstances. My warrior spent most of Hell's Precipice with a fire wand until there were Hands/Fists to beat up on (we had Winter available, and there's no point in standing next to a Titan and being set on fire when you can deal damage from a distance).

But yes, the proverb about walking a mile certainly applies here. I have a baby monk (hasn't reached Kryta yet) and playing one certainly gives you a certain degree of respect for those who do it well (I suspect I'm in the 75%, but hopefully I won't be by the time he finishes the game).

If that ever happens I will definitely thank them

My warrior uses an earth wand at times, he drops wards and the +5 energy comes in useful

Zehnchu, I nearly fell out of my chair laughing! Agreed, been there and had it said!

merty, even 55s are not invincible. Have one die and see what happens. Full rez or nothing.

Me (low on egy); Cait Nic Cailleach is using Signet of Devotion on (player)
Him: WTF is that! That didn't do sh*t.
Him: Heal me, n00b!
Me: Devotion heals you for 77 while my energy regens.
Me: Cait Nic Cailleach uses Heal Other on (player)
Me: Cait Nic Cailleach uses Signet of Devotion on (player)
Him: N00b! If you didn't waste your energy, you wouldn't be low.
Me: If you didn't aggro after I asked for regen from the last battle, you wouldn't be dying.

I was a smiting monk for a while, especially in Kryta. Cait is now nearly pure heal with Spiteful Spirit to 'soften' up a nasty foe or boss for the tanks and a couple other curses for her defense. My blood necro can heal nearly as well as a monk(better than some and has been party healer on several quests and missions), however, if given the chance with Well of Blood. But everyone expects cookie-cutter builds: healer monk, MM necros, stance tanks, etc. Pfft.

now thats just classic

hey don't forget the bad monks.. there are so many of them in tombs uw these days it seems. one bad monk in a 2 monk party can make both monks look bad, especially if the group is highly unintelligent aggro-wise.

i had this one monk who had no idea when to cast SB. i told him to cast it before the warrior ran in to aggro, but he never would. then he'd stand around and spam orison which i'm sure all monks know how well that keeps an ele or ranger alive who's hp will drop 2/3 from one grasping attack.
then the war would go on about how he didn't want any enchants on him whenever sb was put on him. and this monk would always just be standing next to the war at the front lines of aggro.

or the other monk i got really pissed off at for yelling "wtf, heal me! monk!" on level 2 of tombs uw. in the area surrounded by 2 terrorwebs on each side, and 3 in front. the monk is at full hp, then 1/4 then dead in less than a second. fireball spikes. so i click on his name in the party window to find out where he is. lo and behold, his corpse lies in front of all the other party members at base of the chained soul. being the only other monk on the team, i was like, "wtf is the monk doing up there in the front?" thinking maybe he lagged up there or something.

his reply is "i was attacking and doing damage"
he's up there wanding 3 terrorwebs.... and he's a monk, he should have been intellilgent enough to keep himself alive if he was going to do that. not expect the other monk to heal his idiocy.
"um no, you're a monk, you're supposed to be back here healing, not attacking."
also i told him that "i don't heal stupidity"

after that i think he just didn't bother healing much because the party supported me and not him. all in all a bad monk, he nearly killed our tank several times by repeatedly throwing healing breeze and other enchants on him around packs of dreamriders.

and he kept repeatedly dying.. just didn't know when to stay back..
good thing i have no problems as the only monk in 6 man groups.. because this monk was gimped


so while many players aren't aware of what a monk goes through on the job, it's even less apparent (often to monks themselves) when the other monk(s) aren't pulling their own weight or just outright suck

Old topic indeed, but such a reminder seems necessary. Your first post reminds me why I rarely play in random groups anymore. PvE henchmen are always happy with my healing, and they're good enough to go through all missions & capture runs, as well as most quests. To be honest, they're much better and smarter than the average pick-up player. For tougher places or PvP, I'll join a Guild (or friend) group.

Concerning noob management, playing as a monk is a great way to control the most stupid players. Makkert mentioned unyielding aura which is the ultimate noob emergency button. Once you've gone through all basic explanations (don't aggro, focus fire, wait for patrol, pull...), plain threat is your best ally: "wait for patrols or you get no heal until the end of this mission", "next time casters aggro everything they'll spend the rest of this mission with their face on the ground", "keep using caps in party channel, and I'll bail out", "if you keep running out of healing range, we'll see if you can self-heal and stay alive".

You wouldn't believe how smarter a palanoob can become once his group has successfully killed the toughest opponents while he was waiting to be resurrected.

Concerning bad monks, there are very few PvE areas where two good healers are needed. Most of the time one human monk (and a hench in groups of 8) will be more than enough (at least in decent groups). So if you're struggling to keep everybody alive (energy problem is the classic symptom), either you're playing in a tough area (UW/SF come to mind), or your group sucks badly (bail out a.s.a.p and look for a better one), or the other monk is doing nothing, or your own monking needs to get better (that's something most monks never consider).

Thx Studio for finnally made ppl aware of all the torments (and joys) of being a monk. It could not have been said better!

Ok, first off... monks don't have 74 energy unless they are using -energy regen items... which is just retarded as hell. Second, your a warrior, you WILL listen to the monks, or, well, IMHO, I'll just let you die. I really don't play these games with warriors. Argue with me, fine, enjoy dying. Argue with me more, enjoy eating dirt. Don't bite the hand that feeds. Warriors are mostly pathetic excuses for players... oh look, AMITY in pvp, OWNED. PvE, you are just giant meatbags, nothing more. Do your job and STFU about it. You are there to get the shit beaten out of you, that's all. You don't even need to talk when we get right down to it. And BTW, I have a warrior, and he is a QUIET good boy who does as he is told, and has patience. So, you can take that comment on ENERGY MANAGEMENT and shove it where the sun doesn't shine, because you don't want to see my ways of energy management... it's called, SCREW YOU WAMMO JACKASS, no healing for you.

In general I would sign this thread... but honestly I've never had someone be nasty to me..

Although I useto ONLY play Smite Monk before the AoE nerf.. I rarely played healer... Smite was soooo powerfull...

I think most monks have no clue what they are doing.. I especially love the ones who bring Rebirth and Restore Life... and then mix prot and heal and smite (gotta love the Heal/Smite/Prot Monks)... and think they are good... I spend all my time actually healing the team and they are doing god knows what..

When I run with my guild and I play warrior or Necro we always get the henchies it isn't worth trying to pick up a monk...

When I go with PUGs I've never been told I was a crappy monk...

I rarely attack since I pack an HoD sword... never been questioned about it before.. my want does little dmg I rather get the enchantment boost from my sword..

Try a Yakslapper, +10 energy over the HoD sword and the same bonus to enchantments.

Wielding a melee weapon on a non-smiting/i-monk is just..well..odd.

The Yak is a 2 handed weapon is it not? This doesn't compare to my Bhron's Staff & Stoneheart or the HoD & Soneheart..

Rahja, witha max +/- egy offhand and a + egy^50 weap, I boost my reserves to 64 with +3 regen (could gain five more if I went full tats). Even throwing SS at a boss, using Sig of Devotion as in-between heals, I seldom run dry even with the degen *unless* another group is aggro'd before any of the casters (including me) have had time to catch their breath (or degen skills are thrown at me/it's a degen zone such as Dragon's Lair where I switch to a regular max ankh for full regen but lower energy).

In the first instance, more care needs to be taken by the party warriors (or whomever aggro'd). In the other, simple energy management skills come into play just like any other caster profession.......something that not many seem to realize or be able/willing to do, it seems.

Built a monk to see what the fuss is about. Now addicted to monking. It's a whole different feel to the game when you spend most of the time watching red bars shrink and grow. It's gets so involved that there are times I find spells not working only to realize that I'm trying to heal myself with a 'heal other ally' type spell... character identities gets lost, it's solely heal bars that need attention. Been spending a lot of time in the underworld lately. Here's a quick thought or two...

Warriors... if you're the one doing the aggro and getting Spell Breaker cast on you... do NOT immediately run back to the group when they see you. Stay put and suck it up. I get a real kick out of hearing the rapid fire chirps of failed spells and they won't hurt you. Besides, there's at least two monks watching your health bar. Be brave, we have your back.

The 'heal me' 'rez me' thing... most true. I can see if your health is low or absent. Trust me.

For the love of Dwayna, if there's more than one warrior and SB is cast on warrior "A", the second warrior should not run past the first and get the attention of the casters. It wastes SB and possibly yourself.

Well, 'nuff for now.

Don't forget about the 'blind invites' when you are in a town, especially if it's a mission. When I went through the game with my monk, I avoided any group that did a blind invite.

Monks will usually pick a group when they are good and ready.

Oh, and a note towards the popularity of monks. Sunday early afternoon, there was a grand total of TWO monks in Hell's Precipice. The Superbowl pre-game stuff was hours away too.

I agree with everything except the "Player X is dead" thing. Usually when I click that I'm just goofin. I know everyone knows I'm dead. (Except a few times where they did forget...)....Anyway.... When I play monk I dont mind that, its the "rez plz" or "heal me" that I really hate. Whenever someone says that I tell them to not ask for healing and I'll rez after battle.

I might try the "kill now plz" when/if I play monk again. But usually the only time I play monk now, is for farming and occasionaly to help guildies on missions. Healing is so boring.

Unyielding Aura.

Beautiful.

I enjoy the "Player X is dead" thing. It's cute. But when a player is going out of his way to inform you that he's dead, and you -know- he's being an ass about it, then..

Peh.

As for "healing is so boring," it's.. interesting. It's like a game in and of itself. Kind of like an old 386 game back in the day. KEEP THE BARS FILLED!

I played a warrior with no clue for the first 3 months.

I made a monk and put it all the way through the game.

All my other characters, necro, ele, ranger, are better because they truly understand what a monk can and cannot do.

And my warrior is absolutely better than ever.

Want to understand monks? Be a monk.

indeed...i love it!

need more be said, no

What is this thread suppose to achieve we all know that it isn't easy playing the role of a Monk as well as any castor role but Rangers and Warrior think it is easy and besides they aren't the real damge dealer being the castors are mostly the Elementalist.They can put out more damage than a Warrior or Ranger can and spread it out the Warrior is more for defence although try telling that to axe Warriors.there is one thing that bothers me the most and that is seeing Monks in high level areas at a low level say a level 12 at Thirsty.This is the very reason there are bad Monks in the game now and don't know how to play their role when getting ran through the game.

Do we really need anymore of these? Seriously, is this any surprise? You find idiots on the internet all the time...

Here is a rundown of what I encountered while going through PvE before faction was introduced/made reasonable, although I suspect similar comments/problems will be made well into chapter 2.

Warrior - For some reason the group doesn't understand that while you are pulling, if the angry little red dots gets into their happy little white circles, bad things will happen, so its best to stay back.

Ranger - "OMG U R A RANGER? TEY SUX"

Mesmer - See above. Sub in mesmer for ranger, add in homophobic comments if your character is a male mesmer. Mix vigorously.

Elementalist - Go read Ensign's article in the Gladiator's Arena section.

Necromancer "DO U HAVE BIP AND WOP?" "NO?" "OMG U NOOB"

Monk - "HEAL ME! HEAL ME! OMG! HEAL ME! RES ME! RES ME! OMG ! RES ME!"

And now for my favorite post of the day-
You do realise that if the tank in PvE dies, most often the group dies too? So its best not to insult the tank either, or else he might just go Leeroy.
And I hate to break this to you but, Amity sucks in PvP, badly. Warriors through and through are the best offense you can bring along in PvP, so, um yeah....

I'll bet one of those monks was myself. I created a monk after seeing just how rare/poor quality monks were in end-game areas. I'll still go back to Hells just to run groups through simply because I'd have appreciated it if someone did the same for me.

and, for more information about warriors being the better damage dealers, look at the post of 'why nuking sucks'...give me a few minutes and I will edit the link in. Hell, lets just bring every class in here, and say why everyone else is a noob, while not examining our own tactics and strategies. YES! THATS THE TICKET!

edit link: http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...y+nuking+sucks

Me in green
Monk in white

need I say more

One big thing to learn is Ctrl+Click is you friend. The more info I have about the situation the better I can manage it.

Call out your debilitating hexes and conditions so I can prioritize removal and keep you functional! Ctrl+Click that blind as an offensive warrior and Ctrl+Click that migraine or backfire as a caster and I will get it off you as fast as I can.

If you aren't a warrior in PvE, KITE KITE KITE KITE KITE KITE KITE KITE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD KITE! Good Kiting can mitigate more damage that a monk could ever dream of healing or protecting against.

I do listen to monks their energy and stuff. But anyway I prefer keeping myself alive then trusting a monk to keep me alive for the reason that monks many times are bad.

I absolutely hate monks who don't heal if you don't listen to them, if it is a good comment, like a warrior agroing the whole map, ok! good, that's fine with me. But not 'i won't heal you because we need to go that way for my elite!'

In PvE, the only monks I group with are my guildmates or if I need to do a mission with my mesmer which I need someone else for.
Otherwise henchies are my best friends.

Guess that's one of the other reasons why IWAY is so popular, it doesn't require monks at all.

You can't smell if the warrior in front of you has SB on him, you know that right?

The most annoying situation I encounter in the new uw area is when you are the only one getting hit over time for example pulling - i.e. they have plenty of time to heal you, no excuses. The mo is right there and simply does not heal or the only thing they do is cast breeze - to be shattered straight away and make you worse off.

If I am constantly not getting healed - like its blatantly obvious the healer is terrible, I will always be polite but I will confront them and say 'you dont heal, why are you not healing?' or something like 'All you do is run away, you dont heal' I dont care If they quit - I'd rather restart and get a good healer. Im morally opposed to carrying a crappy player through the game to get them easy greens, ecto's etc. Thats unfair on me and my other party members. I just cant do that, people say e.g. 'omg dont piss off the healer' well thats sort of discrimination to me - they are a healer so get special rights despite the fact they are a terrible party member?

Whilst spamming is annoying yes - there is nothing wrong with saying 'im dead' if you have a reason. Personally If I'm the healer, last one standing - I run, come back when the enemies have left, all my comrades are in the same spot. Im going to rez the MM first so he can make more of an army. Or Im going to rez the fast casting mesmer who also has rebirth - this just makes sense to me. Lets turn this around. You are a dead MM and call 'im dead' - it isnt always impolite. Sometimes its a gentle reminder.

But on the whole I do agree with you, people are quick to blame the healer before they look at themselves and their faults.

I found a wonderful solution for all those really bad non-monks out there. Bring Unyielding aura, if they bitch, let them fall. Then you own them If they bitch again, drop the enchantment. They'll get the hint quickly, and it works every time.

Warrior "A" is the designated attention getter. Warrior "B" should have the smarts to hold back and let him draw the first wave of spells. It's not a hard concept.

One thing about being a monk in high level hard hitting mob area like UW and Tombs UW is that for a monk, there is little margin for error.
As a monk you are at the back of the pipeline. You basically have to deal w/ the accumulation of all the previous errors and/or mistakes everyone else may have made. And it falls upon you as a monk to fix it all, without running out of energy.

I never realized when I first started playing GW as a fire ele, how simple my life was. Hit "c" for the closest mob and fire off a nuke, or a glyph and then a nuke. If I made a mistake and targeted the wrong mob, or the mob moved, no big deal, the party would just have to wait a bit longer for my unleashing of overwhelmingly powerful damage.

Even now, when I play as an echo SS necro in tombs uw, it's not going to kill anyone if i tab to the wrong mob and throw one of my Spitefuls on a chained soul instead of a grasping by accident. Or if i hit my skills in the wrong order and have to wait an extra recharge cycle, just move back and try again.

As a mesmer or ranger, you don't always manage to interrupt those siege wurms, giant stomps or healing breezes in time, but it's unlikely that some poor ele is going to die because of your mistake.

I've never played as a warrior, but I've had some warriors die when they hit the wrong stance or miscalculate aggro. Who dies directly because of their mistake? only themselves.

These days, monking in UW or Tombs, one mistake on your part can easily cost the life of any number of your party members. Click on the wrong person to cast your heal? The player you were trying to be save will probably be dead by the time you finish casting on the wrong player. Too slow to click on the monk getting repeatedly fireballed by terrorwebs? He'll be dead before you can finish casting your heal on him.

Or choose to cast your skills in the wrong order when one ranger is under attack by 2 graspings, while the entire party is being hit by a Wurm Siege, and that ranger will be dead by the time you finish casting Heal Party. In this case, WoH or PS on the ranger before casting the 2 sec heal party.

Got a Bladed Aatxe on the loose headed for your casters? If you predict the wrong caster to cast a prot spirit on in anticipation of an attack, the caster that is hit could be dead before you get out that Word of Healing on him.

Put Healing Seed and prot spirit on the warrior you thought would hold the line of mobs, but who instead begins to lead the retreat? You just wasted 25 energy and will be hard pressed to keep the dying softies alive.

Add the little room for error that monks have in a party with the fact that they often will be cleaning up the accumulation of all the little errors committed by the party (nukes were too slow, blind was cast on the wrong mob, SS was interrupted because the necro forgot to use the mantra, warrior ran too low on energy to use a damage avoidance stance) and you understand how some monks might get a little "annoyed" when they seem to be on the receiving end of countless derogatory epithets and imperious commands of rez me/heal me's.

Yeah, definitely, calling out blind, dazed, important hexes, and the like is actually useful information for a monk and I ask teammates to call those out for me when I pug on a monk (though they rarely do).

Endure Pain is the best skill for a warrior to use when he is looking to commit suicide. Most warriors are retards and pre-endure before every fight, so that right in the middle when energy starts to get tight they eat a fat 300 HP hit that'll finish them off more often than not. It's a good skill that can give you a big buffer in the right situation, but it's main use in a PUG is to trick your teammates into thinking you have more health than you really do.

The best way to deal with idiots who insist on extending to the other side of the map, or who insist on running off into the next mob before you can regen from -20, is to just mention how so and so must be bored with life and wishes to commit suicide. Sometimes you get a whole team like that in which case you need to just quit on the spot, but if you can convince everyone else on the team that guy is a retard who wants to die they'll tend to stick around.

Peace,
-CxE

/Sign

Let your Monks (in most places/situations) set the pace people!


I guess I have just come off a frustrating weekend with PUGs (moving a new monk up the game) and it really makes me never want to repeat the process.

I mean, doing THK for the 6th time this weekend with PUGs that have no idea wtf they are doing, even after you explain it in multiple languages (not even telling people any specifics, but just, hey wait for the monks to have energy...stay back ELE, quit Tanking).......sorry a /Vent is in order.



And Again, just as the Thought of the Day:

Elementalists.........your spells are ranged. Please don't run up next to the horde of mobs to cast your UBER Firestorm.....stand by your monk please.

Love thy monk..

I played the game as monk, I know what's involved in monking, I'm the first one to appologise for doing a lousy job of healing the team.. and generally.. prefer to not play monk. It sux being blamed for a single mistake (not hitting word fast enough and having someone die because of it).

The amount of people not carrying rez amazes me, the amount of people who foget to res a monk during battle is even more mind blowing. Happened during an ids run to the point of me, who was playing bonder, taking a res sig so I could res our healer on the spot while the other 3 were.. fighting and not realising that they were about to die. Are monks the only ones who look at the team bar?

Enough of monks though, I enjoy playing mesmer most, that means... I DONT call targets and I DONT have the same target as the team has, you guys are entertaining one target, I'm tryin to keep the rest of them entertained so you can kill target one faster. My biggest screw-up is trying to stop the healer in the backline of monsters, and doing that before the warrior has full aggro, makes for me being dead most of the time I do that, which is deserved and is normally followed by an appology or acknowledgement of my own stupidity.

Now, the one thing I can't stand about monks is the ones that demand everything happens according to their divine will. Last time I checked, it was not your place to tell the team to attack a single target, or in what order to attack what. You don't wanna heal me for not liking your all-powerful dominance of the team is bad and therefore doing what I think is right and attacking something else? Fine by me, we have two monks in the end missions for a reason.

And the best one is being dead as mesmer, biding my time until that mob is down, the team starting to head off, someone random pointing out that the mes. is down, and the monks reaction is "oh yeah, so he is"...

Ok as much as I agree with the points made I have to say this is a somewhat common post and i have a feeling the majority of people on this forum already understand it. To actually feel like a change is being made do as has already been mentioned and learn to deal with idiots another way.

I've been a slaphead now for 8months, its been my only charachter class and I'm very confident with it in pve and pvp. I have tosay the biggest skilli've learnt so far is 'signet of patience' Due to the fact we cannot overtly control the flow of battle as easily as other classes we must rely on others to do our dirty work while we keep them healthy. This means party forming skills must be developed if you wish to keep a thread of sanity.

My fave call if looking for a pug is....

'monk lfp that understands the use of the word noob is punnishable by death'

This has bore many fruits since i adopted it

Remember learning to use a class isn't just how to use your skills, you need to adjust your way of thinking. If you let them wind you up then you will be.. have clarity in purpose and you will not have the issue in the first place.

While I think those numbers are a vast overestimate (particularly the 'good as useless' bit), surely people should be smart enough to realise that if a monk is too dumb to look at the parties health bars then surely pinging their own health a bazillion times isn't likely to help matters. Also I will often get told I'm useless:

- 'heal me u $%(# monk' - I healed you 5x dude and you still died.
- 'r u a healer or r u a noob' - Prot actually.
- 'u dont evn have breeze (#$%en noob' - Well there's more than one way to set up a monk skill bar and if you can't stay alive with Protective Spirit, Shielding Hands, and Shield of Regen on you then it's hardly my problem is it.

Anyway, just be a little cautious before you automatically assume your monk is useless.

Funny THK mission yesterday..

Idiot W> i no this miss lots
Idiot W> do what i tel u
...
Idiot W> put minding on king

Now I knew what he meant but I hadn't brought mending, neither had the other monk (why would we?). So just chose to ignore him for the moment .

...
Idiot W> minding on king!
Me > Don't worry I'm minding the king
Idiot W> do it, i no mission!
...
Me > I think it means mending...
Idiot W> mending on king!

lol

Anyway we got surprisingly far (close to the end) but certainly not due to these guys efforts .