There's been a ton of discussion on skills that deserve nerfs, but not a lot on what need improvement. I'd like to talk about those skills.
To keep this thread under control I propose that each person select one skill that needs improvement, state why it's underpowered currently, and then what they would do to improve it.
Also each post should include at least some commentary on the previous ones so that we have something to discuss.
I'll start off with an elementalist skill, since they are currently the class that's hurting the most.
Lightning Orb
Problem:
This is perhaps the quintessential elementalist skill. Good in theory, but crippled by a ridiculous 15E cost.
Consider that a 10E fireball does 119 damage vs a 60 AL target. A 15E orb does 140 damage. Orb is actually substantially worse in terms of damage per energy, MUCH worse when you consider that fireball is AoE (and consequently much harder to dodge and can hit multiple foes). Isn't air supposed to be the single target line? Why is its flagship skill so lackluster?
Improvement:
Energy cost reduced to 10E, damage upped to 20...110 (at level 15). Now orb is more efficient than fireball vs single targets as it should be. Also the damage increase gives air elementalist dps a (small) kick in the pants, something that they desperately need.
Which skills do you think deserve buffs?
Symbol
LifeInfusion
I'd be happy if they made it so that it isn't a projectile. But that won't happen. The 15 energy isn't so bad, really.
Comparing it to fireball on a 60AL target is not a good idea. Armor penetration is only good on higher armor targets.
Comparing it to fireball on a 60AL target is not a good idea. Armor penetration is only good on higher armor targets.
Symbol
Quote:
| Comparing it to fireball on a 60AL target is not a good idea. Armor penetration is only good on higher armor targets. |
So orb will do 140/83 damage. Fireball will do 119/60 damage. No matter how you slice it orb is worse efficiency wise, and this is ignoring fireball's AoE.
The skill is overcosted.
Mithie
Mending. Seriously.
[FnG] Lazz
Personally I think Conjure Phantasm deserves a buff. In pre-searing, it is very powerful (arguably slightly overpowered) but later on in the game, it doesn't become much use unless you combine it with another health degen spell.
I think it should be increased by damage amount, rather than damage time. Sure by the time you are say half way through the game (depending in attribute points) your probably doing 50 - 60 damage, but it takes a lifetime to get to it. I think it would be better for the Mesmer class if it was more like length: 10 seconds, damage: 8 health degen per second.
I think it should be increased by damage amount, rather than damage time. Sure by the time you are say half way through the game (depending in attribute points) your probably doing 50 - 60 damage, but it takes a lifetime to get to it. I think it would be better for the Mesmer class if it was more like length: 10 seconds, damage: 8 health degen per second.
Mithie
Quote:
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Originally Posted by [FnG] Lazz
Personally I think Conjure Phantasm deserves a buff. In pre-searing, it is very powerful (arguably slightly overpowered) but later on in the game, it doesn't become much use unless you combine it with another health degen spell.
I think it should be increased by damage amount, rather than damage time. Sure by the time you are say half way through the game (depending in attribute points) your probably doing 50 - 60 damage, but it takes a lifetime to get to it. I think it would be better for the Mesmer class if it was more like length: 10 seconds, damage: 8 health degen per second. |
So... No.
tafy69
Well hexes are pretty pathetic in the current meta game tbh.
Cant hex monks easily with boon/CoP
Hexes fall off warriors like water off a ducks back
that leaves you to hex a probable 2-3 people from 8
Back to topic, I think Remove Hex should be 1 second cast!
Cant hex monks easily with boon/CoP
Hexes fall off warriors like water off a ducks back
that leaves you to hex a probable 2-3 people from 8
Back to topic, I think Remove Hex should be 1 second cast!
Mithie
Quote:
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Originally Posted by tafy69
Well hexes are pretty pathetic in the current meta game tbh.
Cant hex monks easily with boon/CoP Hexes fall off warriors like water off a ducks back |
LightningHell
I still don't want to see that teammate over there spamming Conjure on that Mursaat. It sucks, when it goes to late-game.
But then, if Conjure were to be that good, then we would also have to buff Life Transfer.
I suggest we buff Thunderclap. I can't really see a use for it.
But then, if Conjure were to be that good, then we would also have to buff Life Transfer.
I suggest we buff Thunderclap. I can't really see a use for it.
Mithie
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Originally Posted by LightningHell
I still don't want to see that teammate over there spamming Conjure on that Mursaat. It sucks, when it goes to late-game.
But then, if Conjure were to be that good, then we would also have to buff Life Transfer. I suggest we buff Thunderclap. I can't really see a use for it. |
tafy69
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Originally Posted by Mithie
Nah. Even with the lieutenant's helm, Conjure will stick on long enough to be a threat, and boon monks can CoP themselves, but will have trouble de=hexing teammates.
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7 seconds on warrior with hod helm
thats 70 damage for 10 energy where it should have been 150.
instead of removing the hex a monk casts 5 energy spell that heals 100+
Were getting off topic here...
Mithie
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Originally Posted by tafy69
15 second conjure at 16 spec?
7 seconds on warrior with hod helm thats 70 damage for 10 energy where it should have been 150. |
Quote:
| instead of removing the hex a monk casts 5 energy spell that heals 100+ |
Quote:
| Were getting off topic here... |
Sab
Buff Hundred Blades. For an elite skill, I'd expect it to be much better than it's non-elite axe counterpart, Cyclone Axe, which it's not. I'm suggesting one or more of the following improvements:
- Increase HB's area of effect
- Decrease the recharge time
- Add additional damage to each hit
- Hits three times instead of twice
- Increase HB's area of effect
- Decrease the recharge time
- Add additional damage to each hit
- Hits three times instead of twice
tafy69
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Originally Posted by Mithie
Mantra of Persistence.
CoP only works for the monk, not for the rest of his team. No we're not. We're debating whether or not a skill needs a buff - in the this case CP. |
15 seconds + 80% from the mantra
Now you phantasm lasts 26 Seconds
13 seconds for the hod warrrior = 130 damage
130 dot damage over 13 seconds for 25 energy, yeah thats really nice...
And yes it is off topic as HoD helms isnt what were talking about. As you can see phantasm lasting its full length times to normal targets does some nice degen.
Okae
Finally a post about buffs instead of nerfs. 
Off the top of my head I'd like to see the following skills get a buff:
Warrior:
Skull Crack - As it is now, 9 adrenaline and very situational. Build up adrenaline and wait for the right moment. Maybe change it to have a 10 energy cost with a medium-long recharge.
Ranger:
Concussion shot - lower mana cost increase recharge. 15-1/2-20
Necro:
Chillblains - nice spell but at a cost of 25 and the need to carry another spell to get the poison off of yourself it needs help!
Mesmer:
Crippling Anguish <e>- I'd like to see it have a lower mana cost currently 15. Heck, Faintheartedness causes degen of 1-3 and slows down attacks to 50%. at only 10 energy.
Ele:
I know alot of people were upset with monsters running away from aoe spells but I particulary didn't care for stupid monsters that just stood in a fire storm the whole time. I think a good way to give the Ele's some dmg back is to increase the aoe on some spells. ie. from "adjacent" "to nearby" or to "in the area."
Off the top of my head I'd like to see the following skills get a buff:
Warrior:
Skull Crack - As it is now, 9 adrenaline and very situational. Build up adrenaline and wait for the right moment. Maybe change it to have a 10 energy cost with a medium-long recharge.
Ranger:
Concussion shot - lower mana cost increase recharge. 15-1/2-20
Necro:
Chillblains - nice spell but at a cost of 25 and the need to carry another spell to get the poison off of yourself it needs help!
Mesmer:
Crippling Anguish <e>- I'd like to see it have a lower mana cost currently 15. Heck, Faintheartedness causes degen of 1-3 and slows down attacks to 50%. at only 10 energy.
Ele:
I know alot of people were upset with monsters running away from aoe spells but I particulary didn't care for stupid monsters that just stood in a fire storm the whole time. I think a good way to give the Ele's some dmg back is to increase the aoe on some spells. ie. from "adjacent" "to nearby" or to "in the area."
Tuoba Hturt Eht
Recharge time for all these skills are way too long.
Too Long
Wary Stance - 60 seconds
Shield Stance - 60 seconds
Disciplined Stance - 60 seconds
Warrior's Cunning - 60 seconds
Quite Long
Defensive Stance - 45 seconds
A bit long
Deflect Arrows - 30 seconds
Balanced Stance - 30 seconds
"Shields Up!" - 30 seconds
"I Will Survive!" - 30 seconds
I propose the changes:
Wary Stance - 30 seconds | 5 energy
Shield Stance - 30 seconds
Disciplined Stance - 30 seconds
Warrior's Cunning - 30 seconds | 5 energy
Defensive Stance - 25 seconds
Deflect Arrows - 20 seconds
Balanced Stance - 20 seconds
"Shields Up!" - 20 seconds | 5 energy
"I Will Survive!" - 20 seconds
Too Long
Wary Stance - 60 seconds
Shield Stance - 60 seconds
Disciplined Stance - 60 seconds
Warrior's Cunning - 60 seconds
Quite Long
Defensive Stance - 45 seconds
A bit long
Deflect Arrows - 30 seconds
Balanced Stance - 30 seconds
"Shields Up!" - 30 seconds
"I Will Survive!" - 30 seconds
I propose the changes:
Wary Stance - 30 seconds | 5 energy
Shield Stance - 30 seconds
Disciplined Stance - 30 seconds
Warrior's Cunning - 30 seconds | 5 energy
Defensive Stance - 25 seconds
Deflect Arrows - 20 seconds
Balanced Stance - 20 seconds
"Shields Up!" - 20 seconds | 5 energy
"I Will Survive!" - 20 seconds
Symbol
Conjure phantasm doesn't really need a buff if they nerf the HoD helm. If it is improved, the only change I could see working is to reduce the energy cost.
Hundred blades really only needs a small improvement. I think a reduction in recharge is appropriate.
Also, try and keep it to one skill per post please, that way it's easy for people to follow.
Hundred blades really only needs a small improvement. I think a reduction in recharge is appropriate.
Also, try and keep it to one skill per post please, that way it's easy for people to follow.
devilru
Swirling Aura and Magnetic Aura:
Decrease recharge to 45 seconds atleast and make Swirling Aura on par with its counter part Magnetic Aura.
Glyph of Lesser Energy: should have a 15 second recharge.
Protective Bond : Perhaps just rework the whole skill, maybe an enchantment that lasts for 8 seconds instead of one that has to be maintained.
Balthazars Aura: Either reduce energy cost to 15 or keep the original recharge time. The only time you ever see a smiting monk is for farming, let's try and make smiting monks a valuable asset in a normal team.
Thrill of Victory: I liked the older version of this better. (Gaining HP on hit instead of extra damage)
Mend Condition: Targeting yourself would be nice, it wouldn't overshadow mendailment due to ailment's ability to give you a great HP gain from stacked conditions.
Decrease recharge to 45 seconds atleast and make Swirling Aura on par with its counter part Magnetic Aura.
Glyph of Lesser Energy: should have a 15 second recharge.
Protective Bond : Perhaps just rework the whole skill, maybe an enchantment that lasts for 8 seconds instead of one that has to be maintained.
Balthazars Aura: Either reduce energy cost to 15 or keep the original recharge time. The only time you ever see a smiting monk is for farming, let's try and make smiting monks a valuable asset in a normal team.
Thrill of Victory: I liked the older version of this better. (Gaining HP on hit instead of extra damage)
Mend Condition: Targeting yourself would be nice, it wouldn't overshadow mendailment due to ailment's ability to give you a great HP gain from stacked conditions.
Tuoba Hturt Eht
Quote:
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Originally Posted by devilru
Thrill of Victory: I liked the older version of this better. (Gaining HP on hit instead of extra damage)
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I suggest that the recharge time be lowered to 7 seconds instead of 10 seconds.
Lower recharge time of Desperation Blow from 7 seconds to 5 seconds as well.
Nevin
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Symbol
Lightning Orb Problem: This is perhaps the quintessential elementalist skill. Good in theory, but crippled by a ridiculous 15E cost. |
Skills that need buffs:
-Blood of the Master (Heal Area does the same job, but with out sacrificing) Should still cost 10 energy, same recharge, same 17% sacrifice; But it should give 160 hp at 16 Death Magic.
-Deathly Swarm (Casting time is 3 seconds) I suggest making it 2 seconds with a 6 second recharge time.
Symbol
Quote:
| If you have the Air Attune/Ele Attune build, Energy is no problem. The 15 energy actually helps because you get 80% of that energy back when you cast it. Personally I don't use Lightning orb unless the person is coming head on is within 3 meters. If you use it against someone you're chasing, well duh its gunna miss. |
Quote:
| Lightning Orb does more damage then a fireball as well, and if it were downed to 10 it'd be much more spammable then it already is making Air Spikers too strong. |
Quote:
| Deathly Swarm (Casting time is 3 seconds) I suggest making it 2 seconds with a 6 second recharge time. |
[FnG] Lazz
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Mithie
What? You gotta be joking right? Conjure Phantasm (especially when backed up by Mantra of Persistence) is the BEST degen in the game, especially in the current metagame, when boon monks are ALL OVER THE PLACE (who has trouble with hex removal).
So... No. |
Cymmina
Energy Drain & Energy Tap: with a 30 second recharge (bumped from 20 when they got nerfed), these skills are completely worthless for energy management. When the amount of energy they drain was cut in half (and the amount of energy you receive is doubled to compensate), they're worthless for energy denial.
No one in their right mind would consider these skills over Offering of Blood, Mantra of Recall, or Power Drain for energy management. Not only do these skills all have a casting time of 1 second or lower (E Drain = 1s, E Tap = 3s), they give you back more energy.
No one in their right mind would consider these skills over Offering of Blood, Mantra of Recall, or Power Drain for energy management. Not only do these skills all have a casting time of 1 second or lower (E Drain = 1s, E Tap = 3s), they give you back more energy.
Alcazanar
A skill that really needs to be changed is
Plague Touch (my fav :P)
3/4 cast time? [no recharge]
il rather think of 1/4 cast time and 1 sec recharge
this allows me to be more effective and
primary necros unable to spam conditions
and of course i know that anet or anyone in charge wont fix it (they dont give a sh1t)
Plague Touch (my fav :P)
3/4 cast time? [no recharge]
il rather think of 1/4 cast time and 1 sec recharge
this allows me to be more effective and
primary necros unable to spam conditions
and of course i know that anet or anyone in charge wont fix it (they dont give a sh1t)
Tuoba Hturt Eht
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Alcazanar
A skill that really needs to be changed is
Plague Touch (my fav :P) 3/4 cast time? [no recharge] il rather think of 1/4 cast time and 1 sec recharge |
However, I would like a 1/4 cast time and 0 sec recharge.
TwinRaven
Spinal Shivers: At 1 in Curses you loose 10 energy whenever target foe is interrupted, but at 13 Curses this is only reduced by 4, to 6...Necromancers need one huge power well for this to be effective....cast on a mesmer cranking out the fast-cast lovins that they do and you end up powerless....the only practical use I can think of is if you are standing in a well of power or if you are a Wa/Ne using an IDS and relying on adrenalin skills...All in all, I'd just like to see higher end curse necros take a bit less of a penalty.
SpeedyKQ
As has been mentioned, elementalist AoE damage-over-time spells are absurdly overpriced now. Especially ones like Searing Heat and Eruption, which give a condition only to foes who are still in the area at the end of the duration, i. e. nobody.
awesome sauce
inspired condition needs a buff. almost no-one uses it. I would raise the energy benefit to at least 15 (at 12 inspiration) or lower the cost to 5.
Pyromaniac
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Originally Posted by Tuoba Hturt Eht
Recharge time for all these skills are way too long.
Too Long Wary Stance - 60 seconds Shield Stance - 60 seconds Disciplined Stance - 60 seconds Warrior's Cunning - 60 seconds |
Dragannia
Quote:
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Originally Posted by LightningHell
I still don't want to see that teammate over there spamming Conjure on that Mursaat. It sucks, when it goes to late-game.
But then, if Conjure were to be that good, then we would also have to buff Life Transfer. I suggest we buff Thunderclap. I can't really see a use for it. |
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Cymmina
Energy Drain & Energy Tap: with a 30 second recharge (bumped from 20 when they got nerfed), these skills are completely worthless for energy management. When the amount of energy they drain was cut in half (and the amount of energy you receive is doubled to compensate), they're worthless for energy denial.
No one in their right mind would consider these skills over Offering of Blood, Mantra of Recall, or Power Drain for energy management. Not only do these skills all have a casting time of 1 second or lower (E Drain = 1s, E Tap = 3s), they give you back more energy. |
Ensign
The reason you don't see Conjure Phantasm or any degen strategy has nothing to do with hex removal and everything to do with Heal Party. One powered Heal Party completely destroys any degen strategy and there's nothing you can do about it.
Glyph of Lesser Energy used to have a 15 second recharge, it was pretty nutty then. 20s recharge is about where it should be I think.
Chilblains really wants to be disease, not poison.
Blood of the Master needs something, AoE I think.
The stances are pretty rough because they don't want an easy infinite cycle of block stances. If you had two of the current warrior stances on 30s recharges you could just cycle them indefinitely and never be vulnerable. That's abusive, they want stance cycles to have some downtime. I agree that most of 'em need buffs, but you should look at ranger stances for inspiration, all of those are pretty reasonable and used (except maybe Dryders).
Peace,
-CxE
Glyph of Lesser Energy used to have a 15 second recharge, it was pretty nutty then. 20s recharge is about where it should be I think.
Chilblains really wants to be disease, not poison.
Blood of the Master needs something, AoE I think.
The stances are pretty rough because they don't want an easy infinite cycle of block stances. If you had two of the current warrior stances on 30s recharges you could just cycle them indefinitely and never be vulnerable. That's abusive, they want stance cycles to have some downtime. I agree that most of 'em need buffs, but you should look at ranger stances for inspiration, all of those are pretty reasonable and used (except maybe Dryders).
Peace,
-CxE
KelvinC
1. Water spells, need to slow the enemy arm(attack) speed
2. Damage over time Area of Effect. ie firestorm, chaos storm, maelstorm, searing heat etc...
2. Damage over time Area of Effect. ie firestorm, chaos storm, maelstorm, searing heat etc...
Symbol
Another elementalist skill up next, this one a little more obscure
Grasping Earth
5E Cost, 3/4 sec cast, 30 sec recharge
Problem: This is one of those overlooked skills that's almost good. Right now it's like a more flexible ward vs foes that costs less but with an annoying drawback (+24AL vs physical). However ward vs foes has a 20 sec recharge and grasping earth is 30 seconds, making it considerably less useful.
Improvement: Change recharge to 25 or 20 seconds. This would bring it in line with ward vs foes, with each skill having distinct but well balanced tradeoffs.
Grasping Earth
5E Cost, 3/4 sec cast, 30 sec recharge
Problem: This is one of those overlooked skills that's almost good. Right now it's like a more flexible ward vs foes that costs less but with an annoying drawback (+24AL vs physical). However ward vs foes has a 20 sec recharge and grasping earth is 30 seconds, making it considerably less useful.
Improvement: Change recharge to 25 or 20 seconds. This would bring it in line with ward vs foes, with each skill having distinct but well balanced tradeoffs.
tosyazul
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ensign
Chilblains really wants to be disease, not poison.
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twicky_kid
Quote:
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Originally Posted by Ensign
Chilblains really wants to be disease, not poison.
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Though expunge is going to be hairy when chapter 2 hits (that's for another post though).
Tuoba Hturt Eht
Oh ya, Purge Signet's recharge time needs to be faster.
At the moment its 30 seconds recharge time.
Make it 20, or 15, or even 10.
Make it drain more energy per hexes and conditions removed, maybe 20 energy per hex and condition removed, but reduce to recharge time down to 15 seconds.
At the moment its 30 seconds recharge time.
Make it 20, or 15, or even 10.
Make it drain more energy per hexes and conditions removed, maybe 20 energy per hex and condition removed, but reduce to recharge time down to 15 seconds.
Cymmina
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Originally Posted by Dragannia
Energy Drain and Energy Tap are both 5 energy.
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Symbol
Energy drain and energy tap should return 3x the amount of energy they drain and energy tap needs its cast time reduce to 2s.
Age
I will agree with hex removal especially those of the mesmer kind.There is in one for necro hexs but you have to buy it.The 2 that you get from quests smite hex and remove hex are good but do have casting time.This is unless you use Dywanas kiss.This can't be used on the target unless you use vigourse spirit and increase the healing of it and it can be stripped.
Tuoba Hturt Eht
Anet Buffed Mah Skills! Hurraaah!
Purge Signet's recharge time is now 20 seconds.
Thrill of Victory's recharge time now is 8 seconds.
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Originally Posted by Tuoba Hturt Eht
Oh ya, Purge Signet's recharge time needs to be faster.
At the moment its 30 seconds recharge time. Make it 20, or 15, or even 10. Make it drain more energy per hexes and conditions removed, maybe 20 energy per hex and condition removed, but reduce to recharge time down to 15 seconds. |
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Originally Posted by Tuoba Hturt Eht
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I suggest that the recharge time be lowered to 7 seconds instead of 10 seconds. Lower recharge time of Desperation Blow from 7 seconds to 5 seconds as well. |