I just did a couple of 5-man smite runs in Underworld and I got to thinking, maybe there is a way to reduce the "fluff" and get a REALLY optimized run. What good is a glob of ecto if somebody else gets it?
So here's the idea:
1 tank Aoe mage
1 Prot monk
After having tried the smite runs a few times, I know that as long as the Protection monk is careful they won't get attacked, so all they have to do is keep the tank alive. If the tank happened to do lots of AOE damage then who needs a nuker?
The idea is Protective Bond runs to reduce all damage to 5% of HP at the most. Life Bond on the tank to funnel damage to monk, Essense Bond to get 1 Energy for each damage, and Balthazar's Spririt on the monk to get 1 energy for each Life Bonded damage (probably reduced to 0 anyway) Once you get Protection up to 14 it only costs 2 energy to absorb the damage, so the system is self sustaining.
You put healing seed on the Tank which lasts 18 seconds, and will heal for 25 each time tank takes damage. If the tank can only take 5% damage each time, the lower their health the more effective all the heals are. For example, with 3 superior runes that's -225 health for a total of 255. 5% of that is only 13, and the seed would heal you 25 for each hit with a net gain of 12 extra health per hit!! For that 7 second period between seeds, there is the Signet of Devotion for 77+33=110 heal plus the Aura of Restoration on the mage should keep the health up nice and high. Plus the Blessed Signet will get you 12 energy back during off-times so you can keep your monk energy high.
Here are the skills:
Prot Monk:
Protection 10+4
Healing 11+1
Divine 10+1
Skills:
Life Bond
Protective Bond
Essense Bond
Balthazar's Spirit
Blessed Signet
Signet of Devotion
Healing Seed
Rebirth
AOE Mage
Not really sure, could be anything. Put all Sup runes in though to reduce health.
Energy Storage: 10+3
Earth:11+4
Fire/Air: 10+3
No vigor, maybe add Sup runes for something you aren't using. the less HP the better
Skills:
Aura of Restoration
Lots of nukes
Maybe Elemental Attunement
I think this can work. I tested with Stefan and some Hydras and he tanked 3 of them no problem in the desert including their meteors. Unfortunately I don't have a partner yet to test in UW and Korea has it right now anyway, but I really think this could be the answer to effecient farming in UW. If you are really desparate you could add a second nuker who just casts from a distance so you kill 2x faster and only lose 1/3 of your drops. What do you think?
MiteeThoR
2 man underworld smite runs? will this work?
miteethor
Aernok
Protective is 10% not 5 btw.
Garrett
Yes this works, drops arn't very good atm though.
stumpy
Protective Bond is 5% ... Protective Spirit is 10% ...
I would have to test this build to. How much will the AoE tanker take per hit though? Say they have 400 (sample) ... 20 damage / 2 for life attune = 10 damage? .... At that rate the sig of devotion is definately worth a shot. So every hit they would likely take 10 damage and you would take what 6? 4? Zero? Not sure how that calculation works but it look like zero. Does it still count as physical damage then? Do you gain your 2 energy from the spirit and essence?
Many questions I need to test when I get home... + for the ingenuity
I would have to test this build to. How much will the AoE tanker take per hit though? Say they have 400 (sample) ... 20 damage / 2 for life attune = 10 damage? .... At that rate the sig of devotion is definately worth a shot. So every hit they would likely take 10 damage and you would take what 6? 4? Zero? Not sure how that calculation works but it look like zero. Does it still count as physical damage then? Do you gain your 2 energy from the spirit and essence?
Many questions I need to test when I get home... + for the ingenuity
miteethor
Quote:
Originally Posted by stumpy
Protective Bond is 5% ... Protective Spirit is 10% ...
I would have to test this build to. How much will the AoE tanker take per hit though? Say they have 400 (sample) ... 20 damage / 2 for life attune = 10 damage? .... At that rate the sig of devotion is definately worth a shot. So every hit they would likely take 10 damage and you would take what 6? 4? Zero? Not sure how that calculation works but it look like zero. Does it still count as physical damage then? Do you gain your 2 energy from the spirit and essence?
Many questions I need to test when I get home... + for the ingenuity The beautiful part is the amount of damage and the tank's armor is irrelevant. They could be hitting for 1000 and it would still be reduced to 5% of total life. Even when the Life Bond reduces the damage to zero, it still applies 0 damage to the monk, which triggers Balthazar's Spirit even though the monk doesn't get hurt.
Another great thing - the less life the tank has the better. For instance, say you were wearing 5 superior runes reducing your health to 105, and then had a 60% death penalty - you would only have 42 health, and 5% of that is 2 damage on any attack!! Just imagine, even a weak Orison would heal the tank back to full health.
If you had an Elementalist/Monk as your tank and they brought one Orison with maybe 4-5 in healing prayers they could supplement heal if things got a little scary. Or if you had a Smiting/Healing monk as your tank they could probably endure anything and just spam Zealot's Fire/Symbol of Wrath/Balthazar's Aura until everything was dead. Granted a smiter may not kill as fast but as long as the damage stays physical you could sustain this indefinitely.
Even if they occasionally use a skill/spell that bypasses the Life Bond, it can still be dealth with pretty easily. If you used the Signet 5 times per minute that's 12x5 energy you get back, and you only need to cast Healing Seed 2.5 times per minute which is 40 energy out of 60 per minute you get back - that's 20 spells per minute you can deal with, plus the fact you should have 40+ energy at all times you can get into quite a defecit of spells before you run out of energy, and the mob should be dead long before that happens.
I would think this could easily handle a mob of 4-5 UW monsters, and if your tank has some healing I don't see much of a practical limit. If they just switch to Heal/Reversal of Fortune (or better yet Mark of Protection or Mist Form) between Seeds they could concievably handle a mob of any size.
You just have to watch your aggro and make sure the Protection monk stays out of radar range. Cast Healing Seed and let the tank run up and engage, and you have 18 seconds before you have to get into healing range which should be plenty of time for the mob to lock onto the tank.
I really think this can work. My Hydra testing worked great using a fighter hencie, who was just swinging his sword over and over. Imagine some hard-hitting AOE by a caster tank loaded down with superior runes and I think 1 elementalist could handle anything.
MiteeThoR
I would have to test this build to. How much will the AoE tanker take per hit though? Say they have 400 (sample) ... 20 damage / 2 for life attune = 10 damage? .... At that rate the sig of devotion is definately worth a shot. So every hit they would likely take 10 damage and you would take what 6? 4? Zero? Not sure how that calculation works but it look like zero. Does it still count as physical damage then? Do you gain your 2 energy from the spirit and essence?
Many questions I need to test when I get home... + for the ingenuity The beautiful part is the amount of damage and the tank's armor is irrelevant. They could be hitting for 1000 and it would still be reduced to 5% of total life. Even when the Life Bond reduces the damage to zero, it still applies 0 damage to the monk, which triggers Balthazar's Spirit even though the monk doesn't get hurt.
Another great thing - the less life the tank has the better. For instance, say you were wearing 5 superior runes reducing your health to 105, and then had a 60% death penalty - you would only have 42 health, and 5% of that is 2 damage on any attack!! Just imagine, even a weak Orison would heal the tank back to full health.
If you had an Elementalist/Monk as your tank and they brought one Orison with maybe 4-5 in healing prayers they could supplement heal if things got a little scary. Or if you had a Smiting/Healing monk as your tank they could probably endure anything and just spam Zealot's Fire/Symbol of Wrath/Balthazar's Aura until everything was dead. Granted a smiter may not kill as fast but as long as the damage stays physical you could sustain this indefinitely.
Even if they occasionally use a skill/spell that bypasses the Life Bond, it can still be dealth with pretty easily. If you used the Signet 5 times per minute that's 12x5 energy you get back, and you only need to cast Healing Seed 2.5 times per minute which is 40 energy out of 60 per minute you get back - that's 20 spells per minute you can deal with, plus the fact you should have 40+ energy at all times you can get into quite a defecit of spells before you run out of energy, and the mob should be dead long before that happens.
I would think this could easily handle a mob of 4-5 UW monsters, and if your tank has some healing I don't see much of a practical limit. If they just switch to Heal/Reversal of Fortune (or better yet Mark of Protection or Mist Form) between Seeds they could concievably handle a mob of any size.
You just have to watch your aggro and make sure the Protection monk stays out of radar range. Cast Healing Seed and let the tank run up and engage, and you have 18 seconds before you have to get into healing range which should be plenty of time for the mob to lock onto the tank.
I really think this can work. My Hydra testing worked great using a fighter hencie, who was just swinging his sword over and over. Imagine some hard-hitting AOE by a caster tank loaded down with superior runes and I think 1 elementalist could handle anything.
MiteeThoR
theclam
I don't believe that Essence Bond works with Life Bond. Still, you could use something like Peace and Harmony instead.
Kha
Quote:
Originally Posted by miteethor
Another great thing - the less life the tank has the better. For instance, say you were wearing 5 superior runes reducing your health to 105, and then had a 60% death penalty - you would only have 42 health, and 5% of that is 2 damage on any attack!! Just imagine, even a weak Orison would heal the tank back to full health.
Actually, no. I use 4 superior runes when I'm soloing. With 45% DP (or somewhere between 45-30%), I only have 1 HP. DP affects original total, then runes are added into the equation. Just wanted to point that out.
Racthoh
I've done it with 3, and it was beyond easy. If you want to try 2, I would have a w/e and a protection monk set up similar to what you suggested. Have the tank with Bonetti's to restore MP while dishing out spells. The other tank's skills I would use Gladiator's Defense, Riposte, and Deadly Riposte so the warrior can do something while standing there taking the attacks of the smites.
stumpy
this could concieveably one of the most enjoyable apects in the game right now for me if it pans out tonight. While in idle until the release of the update for pve ... this would be alotta fun. I knew there was a way that it may work better than the standard pickup crowd ... but this is actually the first option I have ever seen put on the floor to test. So if the -60 actually affects the overall health ... what are we working with then 500 - 60% = 300 so no more than 2 superiors to be safe. that would leave a tank with -60% dp, and 2 sups ... at 50 health. much safer than 1 lol ... in case you aggro'd like 5 enemies who hit you once per second is 5dps your still safe to recast seed again.
miteethor
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kha
Actually, no. I use 4 superior runes when I'm soloing. With 45% DP (or somewhere between 45-30%), I only have 1 HP. DP affects original total, then runes are added into the equation. Just wanted to point that out.
That's interesting. It all makes sense of course now that I think about it because your'e death penalty should be applied first, then armor.
The question is, what happens if you have Protective Bond and 1 hp? Does it round down? Would that make you nigh-invincible? As long as you kept on Mending to counter-act the bleeding would you be immune to damage?
Obviously a scary proposition and wouldn't work against a lot of DOT stackers but in a physical PvE environment would it be feasable?
And even if not, having a health 105 with no Death penalty is pretty scary - max damage is 5 and Healing seed gives back 25 per hit? You could have 10 arrows of drain and still have max health all the time during combat...
MiteeThoR
The question is, what happens if you have Protective Bond and 1 hp? Does it round down? Would that make you nigh-invincible? As long as you kept on Mending to counter-act the bleeding would you be immune to damage?
Obviously a scary proposition and wouldn't work against a lot of DOT stackers but in a physical PvE environment would it be feasable?
And even if not, having a health 105 with no Death penalty is pretty scary - max damage is 5 and Healing seed gives back 25 per hit? You could have 10 arrows of drain and still have max health all the time during combat...
MiteeThoR
miteethor
I just did my first test and it works!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Very important, do Protective Bond First, then Life Bond. The first time I did Life Bond first and it appears enchantment effects are applies from left to right (first cast is first calculated)
I can keep the tank alive indefinitely.
Very important, do Protective Bond First, then Life Bond. The first time I did Life Bond first and it appears enchantment effects are applies from left to right (first cast is first calculated)
I can keep the tank alive indefinitely.
What Now Homie
hey, i have a great nuker that can assist you, my in game name is Chemisty Set (yes i know its misspelled, sad that i noticed it when i was 3/4 into the game). I might get on here in 5 minutes if ya wanna try it out.
Kha
Quote:
Originally Posted by miteethor
The question is, what happens if you have Protective Bond and 1 hp? Does it round down?
Nope. It will be 1 dmg.
EmperorTippy
I tank with my lvl 8 monk with 10 HP in both UW and FoW and it works well. If you need a partener though my E/Mo will certanly be avalable. If you add in a couple of monks with spellbreaker this actually becomes a viable PvP build. My guild won HoH 4 straight times with the same basic idea and a little tweaking. Air spikers only doing 5 damage per spike was quite fun. Once we brought 5 people with spellbreaker though the tank really became invincible. He was a Mo/E so that all the other team would try to kill him while he sat there and nuked their priest and monks. He was also the resser so any deaths by the rest of us were quickly taking care of.
miteethor
Did some more testing in UW.
Two man team is definitely workable, but the damage dealing is very slow. I don't think it's worth the effort to do it as 2 even though it's possible. My guinea pig Ele was getting interrupted during all of his slow-cast AoE's and kept switching out his skills to faster ones, and he didn't quite have an optimal setup as far as Runes for our test.
I was able to easily keep him alive with 4-5 Ataxes on him at once. He would deliberately run and gather as many as he could and they couldn't touch him. We also survived a group of 3 Ataxes and 5-6 of those Squids on him at once. That was a close call but he didn't die and killed them all.
Later on we picked up an Air Ele and did some 3 man, one Ele in front doing Aftershock/etc. and the Air Ele in back with me droping lightning on everything. The Cleaning went much quicker - we got all the Ataxes and then went into the chamber and killed everything and completed the 5000 pt quest. We picked up the first quest after that and the guy you have to kill is a necro who rended all the enchants off. If the Ele had SpellBreaker or something to keep the enchants on we would have been ok.
Didn't get to test smites, we just happened to walk in the other direction during testing. I don't think smites would be any harder as long as we keep our aggro under control. I have to say I am very pleased with my initial testing.
P.S - the Ataxes were only doing between 6 and 9 damage to my ele who has 60 armor
Two man team is definitely workable, but the damage dealing is very slow. I don't think it's worth the effort to do it as 2 even though it's possible. My guinea pig Ele was getting interrupted during all of his slow-cast AoE's and kept switching out his skills to faster ones, and he didn't quite have an optimal setup as far as Runes for our test.
I was able to easily keep him alive with 4-5 Ataxes on him at once. He would deliberately run and gather as many as he could and they couldn't touch him. We also survived a group of 3 Ataxes and 5-6 of those Squids on him at once. That was a close call but he didn't die and killed them all.
Later on we picked up an Air Ele and did some 3 man, one Ele in front doing Aftershock/etc. and the Air Ele in back with me droping lightning on everything. The Cleaning went much quicker - we got all the Ataxes and then went into the chamber and killed everything and completed the 5000 pt quest. We picked up the first quest after that and the guy you have to kill is a necro who rended all the enchants off. If the Ele had SpellBreaker or something to keep the enchants on we would have been ok.
Didn't get to test smites, we just happened to walk in the other direction during testing. I don't think smites would be any harder as long as we keep our aggro under control. I have to say I am very pleased with my initial testing.
P.S - the Ataxes were only doing between 6 and 9 damage to my ele who has 60 armor
Red Locust
Yep, you could get through every single mission and EA in the game with just a tank and a prot monk. Other than enemies that use lingering/rend/natures renewal, of course.
stumpy
and DoT. I thought about testing this in thunderheadkeep but realized that the long battles wouldn't work to my favour with the DoT. Anywhere there is direct physical damage ... this will do well.
NFiNiTE
A great build for the monk, it really works.. my friend and I are really excited, so since there are so many specifics for the monk, I thought I would add a few pointers for the Elementalist.
First of all, I bought the Ascalon set of armor, just in case the mobs like to target the creature with lower armor, they would not accidentaly head towards the monk... hey, armor doesn't matter right
... as Elementalist type, E/Mo is my choice -- reasoning to follow.
Attributes:
11 + (1-3) _______ Magic
9+3 ________ Magic
8+4 Energy storage
8 Healing
Skills:
Flare/Stone Daggers/Ice Spear
4 PBAoE Attacks
Aura of Restoration
Mending
Ether Renewal {E}
So with this build you have the option for up to 3 superior runes. The blanks are for whatever you desire to choose. The desired types of skills are Point Blank Area of Effect (PBAoE) skills. These have the shortest cast time, spike damage, and comparatively better recharge time than AoE attacks. So the choice of two magics gives you the ability to stack effects -- water hex with lightning touch, whirlwind then aftershock -- it's all up to your preference. The 8 Healing Prayers is for Mending to counter the bleeding the ataxe may incur on your elementalist.
Finally, the skill that got me extremely excited was the elite skill Ether Renewal... your elementalist will have crazy amounts of enchanments on him/her -- the 3 bonds, aura of restoration, mending, and ether renewal -- this way, when you cast flare/stone daggers/ice javelin you will be getting back [(6 x 4) - 5] = 19 energy. So when your energy gets down to 15, cast ether renewal, and spam your flare/stone daggers/ice javelin and your energy should be replenished in a matter of seconds.
In theory, it looks like it will work. I'm not sure how we will fare against those energy suckers, but maybe we won't even do that and go straight for the smites.
Hopefully that gives a little definition to the elementalist part of the strategy.
First of all, I bought the Ascalon set of armor, just in case the mobs like to target the creature with lower armor, they would not accidentaly head towards the monk... hey, armor doesn't matter right
... as Elementalist type, E/Mo is my choice -- reasoning to follow. Attributes:
11 + (1-3) _______ Magic
9+3 ________ Magic
8+4 Energy storage
8 Healing
Skills:
Flare/Stone Daggers/Ice Spear
4 PBAoE Attacks
Aura of Restoration
Mending
Ether Renewal {E}
So with this build you have the option for up to 3 superior runes. The blanks are for whatever you desire to choose. The desired types of skills are Point Blank Area of Effect (PBAoE) skills. These have the shortest cast time, spike damage, and comparatively better recharge time than AoE attacks. So the choice of two magics gives you the ability to stack effects -- water hex with lightning touch, whirlwind then aftershock -- it's all up to your preference. The 8 Healing Prayers is for Mending to counter the bleeding the ataxe may incur on your elementalist.
Finally, the skill that got me extremely excited was the elite skill Ether Renewal... your elementalist will have crazy amounts of enchanments on him/her -- the 3 bonds, aura of restoration, mending, and ether renewal -- this way, when you cast flare/stone daggers/ice javelin you will be getting back [(6 x 4) - 5] = 19 energy. So when your energy gets down to 15, cast ether renewal, and spam your flare/stone daggers/ice javelin and your energy should be replenished in a matter of seconds.
In theory, it looks like it will work. I'm not sure how we will fare against those energy suckers, but maybe we won't even do that and go straight for the smites.
Hopefully that gives a little definition to the elementalist part of the strategy.
miteethor
I did some more testing today - My Mage parther is a E/Monk so he can do Essense Bond and Balthazar's Spirit on himself for energy gain, plus he has Ether Renewal - it takes 3 spams of Divine Boon to re-fill his bar to full. He was running with all Smiting skills. Kind of sucks because he was a monk secondary so we have to stay maxed at 12 smiting, but he did get the benefit of Ether renewal so its probably a wash.
We are EASILY handling Ataxes, Squids, and Smites with a 2 man team. The only problem spot is the Colfires since I don't get full energy back on their elemental attacks. We can handle them as a 2-man team but the Malestroms hurt my caster/tank and interrupt casting, so it takes a while but is definitely doable.
I can't wait to try this with a Monk with 16 smiting!! Smites take double-damage against holy, they drop in like 15 seconds.
We are EASILY handling Ataxes, Squids, and Smites with a 2 man team. The only problem spot is the Colfires since I don't get full energy back on their elemental attacks. We can handle them as a 2-man team but the Malestroms hurt my caster/tank and interrupt casting, so it takes a while but is definitely doable.
I can't wait to try this with a Monk with 16 smiting!! Smites take double-damage against holy, they drop in like 15 seconds.
miteethor
Some comments based on some further testing...
- Bleeding from Ataxes is not an issue. The Healing seed is going at +15 health gain per hit, and bleeding is only 6 dot per second. As long as the caster tank is engaged you can safely ignore bleeding - that way you don't have to wasted a spot on mending
- My caster ran Balthazar's Spirit and Essense Bond on himself. If in a mob of 4-5 Ataxes that's 10 Energy per second that is fed to the caster. He also had Ether Renewal and Divine Boon (Divine Boon was at minimum since he's a secondary) and he was literally spamming Divine twice per second almost all the time, triggering Zealot's Fire damage in addition to the other stuff.
- Fire only does about 1/3 damage to Ataxes, and 1/2 damage to ColdFires
-Holy damage is Full strength
- A blast of 100 Lignthing with 25% penetration does about 90 dmg to an Ataxe
- We tried running Retribution / Holy Wrath and found that no matter what order we applied the enchantments these always took affect after the protective bond. We also know that the order you pu on Life Bond/Protective Bond is very important - one works and the other kills you in 2 hits.
- As an E/Mo most mobs were dropping in around 60-90 seconds. This is with only one damage dealer, I assume adding a ranged Ele would cut that time in half.
- Bleeding from Ataxes is not an issue. The Healing seed is going at +15 health gain per hit, and bleeding is only 6 dot per second. As long as the caster tank is engaged you can safely ignore bleeding - that way you don't have to wasted a spot on mending
- My caster ran Balthazar's Spirit and Essense Bond on himself. If in a mob of 4-5 Ataxes that's 10 Energy per second that is fed to the caster. He also had Ether Renewal and Divine Boon (Divine Boon was at minimum since he's a secondary) and he was literally spamming Divine twice per second almost all the time, triggering Zealot's Fire damage in addition to the other stuff.
- Fire only does about 1/3 damage to Ataxes, and 1/2 damage to ColdFires
-Holy damage is Full strength
- A blast of 100 Lignthing with 25% penetration does about 90 dmg to an Ataxe
- We tried running Retribution / Holy Wrath and found that no matter what order we applied the enchantments these always took affect after the protective bond. We also know that the order you pu on Life Bond/Protective Bond is very important - one works and the other kills you in 2 hits.
- As an E/Mo most mobs were dropping in around 60-90 seconds. This is with only one damage dealer, I assume adding a ranged Ele would cut that time in half.
Interregnum
I've been doing 2 person smite runs with my partner in game.
Mo/W and E/Me.
The monk tanks while the ele nukes. We use roughly the same build (dependent on protective bond) but use some different skills. The major factor here is that although fire doesn't do much, burning will. Keeping incendiary chains, searing heat and immolate on the aatxes will kill them quickly.
As the ele, I've been both air and fire. I can tell you that fire kills things much quicker than air. Undeniably, air is much more useful with blinding flash and enervating charge.
The only problem with this, as with other builds using only mages, is that the grasping darknesses give us a little more trouble than we normally have. Originally we also did ele tank and prot monk healer, using distortion to prevent interrupts during cast. This was bad because we depended on the ele to deal damage and the squids sucked all energy. It ended as a slow staff firing to the death.
On the other hand, we've done 2 person smite runs (albeit much much slower) with W/Mo and Mo/E. The aatxes took long to kill (but bleeding them back eventually did it) but the squids weren't a problem at all. And the smites are fine as long as you switch targets when you see them cast shield of judgement. The monk should also attack them with wand/staff to clear away reversal so the warrior can land major hits.
Overall, I think 2 person smite runs are a great idea...more people should give it a try rather than sitting in temple waiting for a full party. Of course this way, you'd have to be prepared and coordinated. I think this is also true for fissure, although I believe you'd need more than 2 because of the monks. I've been in a fissure party of 4 that had made it to the forge (and completed all the quests to activate the crafting). The other 4 people dropped out around the tower quest with the first eternal.
Mo/W and E/Me.
The monk tanks while the ele nukes. We use roughly the same build (dependent on protective bond) but use some different skills. The major factor here is that although fire doesn't do much, burning will. Keeping incendiary chains, searing heat and immolate on the aatxes will kill them quickly.
As the ele, I've been both air and fire. I can tell you that fire kills things much quicker than air. Undeniably, air is much more useful with blinding flash and enervating charge.
The only problem with this, as with other builds using only mages, is that the grasping darknesses give us a little more trouble than we normally have. Originally we also did ele tank and prot monk healer, using distortion to prevent interrupts during cast. This was bad because we depended on the ele to deal damage and the squids sucked all energy. It ended as a slow staff firing to the death.
On the other hand, we've done 2 person smite runs (albeit much much slower) with W/Mo and Mo/E. The aatxes took long to kill (but bleeding them back eventually did it) but the squids weren't a problem at all. And the smites are fine as long as you switch targets when you see them cast shield of judgement. The monk should also attack them with wand/staff to clear away reversal so the warrior can land major hits.
Overall, I think 2 person smite runs are a great idea...more people should give it a try rather than sitting in temple waiting for a full party. Of course this way, you'd have to be prepared and coordinated. I think this is also true for fissure, although I believe you'd need more than 2 because of the monks. I've been in a fissure party of 4 that had made it to the forge (and completed all the quests to activate the crafting). The other 4 people dropped out around the tower quest with the first eternal.
miteethor
Quote:
Originally Posted by Interregnum
I've been doing 2 person smite runs with my partner in game.
Mo/W and E/Me.
The monk tanks while the ele nukes. We use roughly the same build (dependent on protective bond) but use some different skills. The major factor here is that although fire doesn't do much, burning will. Keeping incendiary chains, searing heat and immolate on the aatxes will kill them quickly. If your monk is tanking, how are you keeping up health? Healing Seed can only be cast on another player, not yourself? If you went Protective Bond, Balthazar's Spirit, Essense Bond on yourself that takes care of the energy costs and you have 1 arrow left. Are you just doing Dwaynas Kiss on yourself or maybe Healing touch at appropriate times? Are you still using a Signet to get energy back or is 1 arrow enough? I'm guessing you use the Adrenaline to do Gashes/Galraths/Final Thrust?
Mo/W and E/Me.
The monk tanks while the ele nukes. We use roughly the same build (dependent on protective bond) but use some different skills. The major factor here is that although fire doesn't do much, burning will. Keeping incendiary chains, searing heat and immolate on the aatxes will kill them quickly. If your monk is tanking, how are you keeping up health? Healing Seed can only be cast on another player, not yourself? If you went Protective Bond, Balthazar's Spirit, Essense Bond on yourself that takes care of the energy costs and you have 1 arrow left. Are you just doing Dwaynas Kiss on yourself or maybe Healing touch at appropriate times? Are you still using a Signet to get energy back or is 1 arrow enough? I'm guessing you use the Adrenaline to do Gashes/Galraths/Final Thrust?
Interregnum
The monk is using divine boon and shield of regeneration for regain.
She has about 200 max hp and the heals from divine boon as well as the regen keep up with the damage.
I believe her full setup was:
10+4 protection (+1 protection tattoo)
8+3 divine
10 tactics
rest+3 smiting
0+2 healing (major rune just to get hp down)
Protective Bond
Balthazar's Spirit
Essence Bond
Divine Boon
Blessed Signet
Guardian
Shield of Regeneration
Bonetti's Defense
She's also using the collector's fire wand (outside Nolani academy for 3 charr carvings) which gives 5 energy (unconditional) and +10% increased attack speed.
The idea is to also attack while healing yourself with shield of regen and guardian (from divine favor). Once you gain enough adrenaline and you're low on energy, hit bonetti's defense to get filled up. Bonetti's is also a perfect counter to the squid's energy draining. The aatxes and squids sometimes interrupt shield of regen, so when they do just spam divine boon for heals and hit bonetti's to recover energy.
We're going to drop tactics to 9 since it doesn't seem to lower Bonetti's duration, and pump the extra points into smiting for faster adrenaline regain. On the same topic, we're thinking of dropping divine to 10 also and pumping the extras into smiting. Right now, one burst of any spell heals her for a little under half max hp.
The most problems we've been having is with coldfires...but generally just sidestepping their maelstroms is enough. Bonetti's doesn't work here so you have to get out of the way and regain energy with blessed signet. It takes a while but you can take down coldfires this way also.
And yes, signet is for regaining energy in between fights. Bonetti's is for regaining energy during fights. Everything else is geared towards survival.
The E/Me is much easier to figure out...just straight heavy fire AoE nuker with Echo.
12+4 fire (+1 fire headgear)
12+1 energy
Fire Attunement
Immolate
Searing Heat
Incendiary Bonds
Fire Storm
Echo
Meteor Shower
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Basically I cast in this order:
Fire Attunement
Echo
Meteor Shower
Incendiary Bonds
Fire Storm
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Meteor Shower
Searing Heat
Incendiary Bonds
Then follow with immolate on whichever aatxe is still alive.
The squids and smites die really fast, I rarely get to the second Meteor Shower or Searing Heat when fighting them. The monk can attack the smites but need to switch target when one of them uses shield of judgement.
I'm also thinking of adding a superior energy storage just for 6 more energy...I honestly don't think it'll make a difference so I haven't yet.
Whew what a long post, I think I covered everything. Please give me some feedback, I'd like to know what I'm doing that could be improved.
She has about 200 max hp and the heals from divine boon as well as the regen keep up with the damage.
I believe her full setup was:
10+4 protection (+1 protection tattoo)
8+3 divine
10 tactics
rest+3 smiting
0+2 healing (major rune just to get hp down)
Protective Bond
Balthazar's Spirit
Essence Bond
Divine Boon
Blessed Signet
Guardian
Shield of Regeneration
Bonetti's Defense
She's also using the collector's fire wand (outside Nolani academy for 3 charr carvings) which gives 5 energy (unconditional) and +10% increased attack speed.
The idea is to also attack while healing yourself with shield of regen and guardian (from divine favor). Once you gain enough adrenaline and you're low on energy, hit bonetti's defense to get filled up. Bonetti's is also a perfect counter to the squid's energy draining. The aatxes and squids sometimes interrupt shield of regen, so when they do just spam divine boon for heals and hit bonetti's to recover energy.
We're going to drop tactics to 9 since it doesn't seem to lower Bonetti's duration, and pump the extra points into smiting for faster adrenaline regain. On the same topic, we're thinking of dropping divine to 10 also and pumping the extras into smiting. Right now, one burst of any spell heals her for a little under half max hp.
The most problems we've been having is with coldfires...but generally just sidestepping their maelstroms is enough. Bonetti's doesn't work here so you have to get out of the way and regain energy with blessed signet. It takes a while but you can take down coldfires this way also.
And yes, signet is for regaining energy in between fights. Bonetti's is for regaining energy during fights. Everything else is geared towards survival.
The E/Me is much easier to figure out...just straight heavy fire AoE nuker with Echo.
12+4 fire (+1 fire headgear)
12+1 energy
Fire Attunement
Immolate
Searing Heat
Incendiary Bonds
Fire Storm
Echo
Meteor Shower
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Basically I cast in this order:
Fire Attunement
Echo
Meteor Shower
Incendiary Bonds
Fire Storm
Glyph of Lesser Energy
Meteor Shower
Searing Heat
Incendiary Bonds
Then follow with immolate on whichever aatxe is still alive.
The squids and smites die really fast, I rarely get to the second Meteor Shower or Searing Heat when fighting them. The monk can attack the smites but need to switch target when one of them uses shield of judgement.
I'm also thinking of adding a superior energy storage just for 6 more energy...I honestly don't think it'll make a difference so I haven't yet.
Whew what a long post, I think I covered everything. Please give me some feedback, I'd like to know what I'm doing that could be improved.
Bueno Star
man, i gotta say, those are some of the most creative and thought-laden builds ive heard of yet.
good stuff
good stuff
ICURADik
It's been posted a few times in other threads. But you need level 17 Protective Bond to make it perfect. You only lose 1 energy... Just get the wand/focus that has 20% chance of increasing skill and recast protective bond a couple times until it's level 17. IMO 2 monk would do it best since, you have to be monk based to get level 17 protection. Both monks use life bond on each other and constantly run Balthazars Spirit, and and Essence Bond. Whenever your hit you gain two energy and lose one, and your ally gains one energy. Infinite energy, nearly 0 damage. Also, using 5 superiors lowers your life some more, and don't use a vigor rune.
Interregnum
I'll definitely have to give that a try, have a staff wrapping of 17% lying around that could make up for my laziness to go find the collector's protective icon.
The reason we took out points from protection is because when the squids drain all your energy, it breaks protective bond which means the monk dies almost immediately.
Also, the reason we didn't just use 5 superior runes is because the bleeding from the aatxes hurts a lot when your max hp is low.
Anyways thanks for the tip, will try the 17 protection thing. Could refund and pump it to 16 to cast that, then refund it and put it back to where we took it from.
The reason we took out points from protection is because when the squids drain all your energy, it breaks protective bond which means the monk dies almost immediately.
Also, the reason we didn't just use 5 superior runes is because the bleeding from the aatxes hurts a lot when your max hp is low.
Anyways thanks for the tip, will try the 17 protection thing. Could refund and pump it to 16 to cast that, then refund it and put it back to where we took it from.
??Evan??
Me and a friend do 2 man smite runs all the time, he is a smiting tank warrior and Im a Mo/W I use life bond and sheild of regen. and just heal him while he kills 
Ikinsey
Im a regular necro and I farm UW and FoW by myself, I just bring someone with rebirth for the occasional time I die.
miteethor
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ikinsey
Im a regular necro and I farm UW and FoW by myself, I just bring someone with rebirth for the occasional time I die.
How do you survive as a necro? What skills keep you from dying in 1 hit? I assume if you are by yourself (except for the rebirth) that means you have to be the tank? How do you deal with the interruptions, since lots of the Necro spells have long casting times?
Maiyn
LOL
Hahah, I was just talking about this the other day. That is so great ! Right on, heh.. hardcore
I figured it had to be possible. Just need the right build.
Hahah, I was just talking about this the other day. That is so great ! Right on, heh.. hardcore
I figured it had to be possible. Just need the right build.
miteethor
Underworld was open for about 30 minutes this morning and we snuck in. Just two of us in for about an hour or so. Here what we got:
4 globs of Ecto = 28K
1 Ruby = 8K
2 Storm Bows (not Max Damage)
3 Fiery Dragon Swords (not Max)
4 Max Def Sheilds
1 Purple Max Axe
Bunch of other stuff
I'd say quite the productive trip, sure beats farming Kryta!!
We also completed the 5000 point quest easily including the Dryders, took on several mobs of 8-10 Ataxes+Grasping Darkness, cleaned out the entire Smite/Coldfire area, and wandered around for a while and killed a bunch of other stuff.
Problem Areas: Coldfires, we took on a mob of 6 once, the hardest part is that they charge around and sometimes find me. Plus with that many they kept Malestroms on the tank almost constantly making it hard for him to cast. Normal mobs of 3 are no problem.
We started doing the staue quests and killed some more dryders, and then accidently activated one in the ice area where a ton of Dryders started wandering around. We were doing fine but suddenly the mission failed and we were kicked out, not sure why.
Overall quite a productive trip, and all this with only 2 people. I think we each got 2 skill points while we were there, and one time when the tank died he went from 15 to 4% death penalty after only 1 mob!!
Does anybody know where I can find a collector with a Protection +1 item? I would really like to try the Protection lvl 17 thing, because I could start spamming Balthazar's on the tank and kill things twice as fast!! Having that extra energy is key for that....
4 globs of Ecto = 28K
1 Ruby = 8K
2 Storm Bows (not Max Damage)
3 Fiery Dragon Swords (not Max)
4 Max Def Sheilds
1 Purple Max Axe
Bunch of other stuff
I'd say quite the productive trip, sure beats farming Kryta!!
We also completed the 5000 point quest easily including the Dryders, took on several mobs of 8-10 Ataxes+Grasping Darkness, cleaned out the entire Smite/Coldfire area, and wandered around for a while and killed a bunch of other stuff.
Problem Areas: Coldfires, we took on a mob of 6 once, the hardest part is that they charge around and sometimes find me. Plus with that many they kept Malestroms on the tank almost constantly making it hard for him to cast. Normal mobs of 3 are no problem.
We started doing the staue quests and killed some more dryders, and then accidently activated one in the ice area where a ton of Dryders started wandering around. We were doing fine but suddenly the mission failed and we were kicked out, not sure why.
Overall quite a productive trip, and all this with only 2 people. I think we each got 2 skill points while we were there, and one time when the tank died he went from 15 to 4% death penalty after only 1 mob!!
Does anybody know where I can find a collector with a Protection +1 item? I would really like to try the Protection lvl 17 thing, because I could start spamming Balthazar's on the tank and kill things twice as fast!! Having that extra energy is key for that....
capitalist
I am wondering if it would work with this build:
W/Mo
Smiting: 11
Swords:12+4
Tactics:9 (I can add superior here)
Skills:
Sever Artery
Galrath's Slash
Zealots Fire
Divine Boon
Balthazar's Aura
Balthazar's Spirit
Bonneti's Defense
Gladiators Defense
Thought process is Zealot's fire, cast spirit, then DoT damage with the Aura, gain energy with spirit, spam boon on self during gladiators defense, bonetti's if energy gets too low. Maybe riposte instead of sever and galraths.
Partnered with N/Mo running the Protection + blood ritual
If not, how can I switch up the W/Mo build to work. I can add some random major/superior to decrease health more if needed.
W/Mo
Smiting: 11
Swords:12+4
Tactics:9 (I can add superior here)
Skills:
Sever Artery
Galrath's Slash
Zealots Fire
Divine Boon
Balthazar's Aura
Balthazar's Spirit
Bonneti's Defense
Gladiators Defense
Thought process is Zealot's fire, cast spirit, then DoT damage with the Aura, gain energy with spirit, spam boon on self during gladiators defense, bonetti's if energy gets too low. Maybe riposte instead of sever and galraths.
Partnered with N/Mo running the Protection + blood ritual
If not, how can I switch up the W/Mo build to work. I can add some random major/superior to decrease health more if needed.
stumpy
Quote:
Originally Posted by miteethor
We started doing the staue quests and killed some more dryders, and then accidently activated one in the ice area where a ton of Dryders started wandering around. We were doing fine but suddenly the mission failed and we were kicked out, not sure why.
odd ... the dryders are strictly around statues ... only freak deaths I ever encounter are the new soul deaths ... did someone get the quest from the statue wraith? this activates the tortured souls (*enemy ones) including one group that hordes directly around the new souls ... If 1 dies ... you lose. blammo back to square 1.
EDIT *********
M ... Did you use the Ele tank? or Monk tank? or warior tank?
EDIT *********
M ... Did you use the Ele tank? or Monk tank? or warior tank?
Interregnum
We did the statue quest for the enemy tortured souls before escorting the new souls to the village. Made it so much easier. After clearing out all the aggro, we then escorted the new souls over.
Acan Vishnu
Quote:
Originally Posted by miteethor
We started doing the staue quests and killed some more dryders, and then accidently activated one in the ice area where a ton of Dryders started wandering around. We were doing fine but suddenly the mission failed and we were kicked out, not sure why.
That is the Ice King quest, half of the dryders spawned go after the Reaper and the other half go after the Ice King. You need to keep them both alive or you fail the quest and get kicked out of the area.
sleazeh
Me and 2 guildies have been trying a 3 person team in the UW, with a monk/wa as our smiting-tank-herder, and 2 AoE nukers. It seems to work reasonably well for the early stages, not too sure about some of the "later" quests. The real problem with these small 2-3 person runs is the all-or-nothing aspect; if our tank/smiter goes down, it often means end of mission. Both the nukers are set up for damage and not defense or running....so if a group of foes gets through, we have to be real careful about attacking from just outside of aggro range, and being able to make a hasty exit from the area in the event of an surprise mishap.
It's quite "by the seat of your pants" stuff, which can be fun and exciting, but also disappointing if something goes wrong early.
It's quite "by the seat of your pants" stuff, which can be fun and exciting, but also disappointing if something goes wrong early.
Ka RaTae
FYI...my current tank build that Mitee and I are using is.
E/Mo
1-Divine Boon
2-Balthazras Aura
3-Symbol of Wrath
4-Crystal Wave
5-Zealots Fire
6-Ether Renewal
7-Balthazars Spirit
8-Essence Bond
I was thinking that if we got another member it would work well to have a M/W be the tank.
I would then switch to.
1-Osrison of Healing
2-Balthazars Aura
3-Zealots Fire
4-Ether Renewal
5-Life Bond
6-Essence Bond
7-Balthazras Spirit
8-Strength of Honor
The new M/W Tank would run.
1-Cyclone Axe
2-Zealots Fire
3-Balthazars Aura
4-Essence Bond
5-Symbol of Wrath
6-Strength of Honor
7-Judges Insight
8-Bonettis Defense
With 3 people, Mitee's character....(I Want Your Pants) could do his normal protections first. Then i would put on Life bond and Essence Bond. This is strictly so I can gain some energy with out haveing to depend on the sole use of Ether Renewal.
The Tank would have to co-ordinate with me when his Balthazars Aura runs out so I could cast mine on him. I would outherwise spend my time doing Osiron of Healing on tank to trigger my Zealots Fire Attacks. The tanks really only needs to Spam Cyclone Axe as much as possible...only stopping to renew zealots or kick off balthzars aura or symbol of wrath.
This seems like we would have alot more killing power. I would somehow like to work in Judges Insight into the support characters as well. This would insure that all damage from cyclone axe is Holy with 20% armor penetration. If mitee can get his energy down to 1 from protective spirit maybe he could carry Judges Insight.
Something else we may need to work in is Spell Breaker or if I am the tank..Obsidian Flesh for those pesky Enchantment Strippers.
E/Mo
1-Divine Boon
2-Balthazras Aura
3-Symbol of Wrath
4-Crystal Wave
5-Zealots Fire
6-Ether Renewal
7-Balthazars Spirit
8-Essence Bond
I was thinking that if we got another member it would work well to have a M/W be the tank.
I would then switch to.
1-Osrison of Healing
2-Balthazars Aura
3-Zealots Fire
4-Ether Renewal
5-Life Bond
6-Essence Bond
7-Balthazras Spirit
8-Strength of Honor
The new M/W Tank would run.
1-Cyclone Axe
2-Zealots Fire
3-Balthazars Aura
4-Essence Bond
5-Symbol of Wrath
6-Strength of Honor
7-Judges Insight
8-Bonettis Defense
With 3 people, Mitee's character....(I Want Your Pants) could do his normal protections first. Then i would put on Life bond and Essence Bond. This is strictly so I can gain some energy with out haveing to depend on the sole use of Ether Renewal.
The Tank would have to co-ordinate with me when his Balthazars Aura runs out so I could cast mine on him. I would outherwise spend my time doing Osiron of Healing on tank to trigger my Zealots Fire Attacks. The tanks really only needs to Spam Cyclone Axe as much as possible...only stopping to renew zealots or kick off balthzars aura or symbol of wrath.
This seems like we would have alot more killing power. I would somehow like to work in Judges Insight into the support characters as well. This would insure that all damage from cyclone axe is Holy with 20% armor penetration. If mitee can get his energy down to 1 from protective spirit maybe he could carry Judges Insight.
Something else we may need to work in is Spell Breaker or if I am the tank..Obsidian Flesh for those pesky Enchantment Strippers.
capitalist
I was just think about this, so I thought I would post. Remember to have the tank use enchantment mods on his/her weapons, +2 seconds for Aura(assuming 18-20% mod) would provide 44 extra dmg.
Ikinsey
Quote:
Originally Posted by miteethor
How do you survive as a necro? What skills keep you from dying in 1 hit? I assume if you are by yourself (except for the rebirth) that means you have to be the tank? How do you deal with the interruptions, since lots of the Necro spells have long casting times?
I use spells with a one second cast time, they only work if you time it right however because the interuptions do get annoying, especially when youre tanking about 5 - 15 mobs.
Interregnum
With the 17 protection thing, I've revised the build posted earlier.
6+3 divine favor
11+4 healing prayers
9+3 protection
9 tactics
Balthazar's Spirit
Protective Bond
Essence Bond
Mending
Vigorous Spirit
Blessed Signet
Bonetti's Defense
Healing Breeze
We pump protection up to 16 and use the +1 staff/focus to get the 1 energy loss protective bond (haven't verified this yet).
Then refund that protection and put it into healing.
With 13 healing, mending gives 4 pips of regen.
With 15 healing, vigorous spirit gives 13 life back each attack.
Peculiar to this new build is that we're not using any elites...who needs them.
We've also replaced the protection tattoo with a healing tattoo, upgraded the major healing to a superior healing, and bought another superior smiting for an additional -100 max hp bringing us to 105 max.
We also picked up a peculiar focus from post-searing old ascalon quests that gives -50 health so we equiped that. These are the items in our hands:
Final max health: 55.
The 4 pips from mending will continue to heal for a good deal even during bleeding from the aatxes. Without bleeding, the 4 pips will keep the monk completely healed from any damage. While bleeding, cast vigorous spirit to gain 13 health per attack, healing for over 20% of your max hp each hit.
You would still need Bonetti's to counter the massive energy drain from the squids though.
Since we're invested into healing now, can take out shield of regen which had a long recast and add in healing breeze. We also took out guardian for vigorous spirit because there wasn't much of a need to block attacks anymore.
In my eyes, this build would work better than the old one. The mending itself would keep the monk alive against smites so they don't have to attack to regain energy.
But still, coldfires are a challenge and take longer to kill.
Frankly since we're not using protection at all, the better way would be to refund more and pump into tactics and divine. But that's a waste of refund points as this way works fine as is.
What do you think?
6+3 divine favor
11+4 healing prayers
9+3 protection
9 tactics
Balthazar's Spirit
Protective Bond
Essence Bond
Mending
Vigorous Spirit
Blessed Signet
Bonetti's Defense
Healing Breeze
We pump protection up to 16 and use the +1 staff/focus to get the 1 energy loss protective bond (haven't verified this yet).
Then refund that protection and put it into healing.
With 13 healing, mending gives 4 pips of regen.
With 15 healing, vigorous spirit gives 13 life back each attack.
Peculiar to this new build is that we're not using any elites...who needs them.
We've also replaced the protection tattoo with a healing tattoo, upgraded the major healing to a superior healing, and bought another superior smiting for an additional -100 max hp bringing us to 105 max.
We also picked up a peculiar focus from post-searing old ascalon quests that gives -50 health so we equiped that. These are the items in our hands:
Final max health: 55.
The 4 pips from mending will continue to heal for a good deal even during bleeding from the aatxes. Without bleeding, the 4 pips will keep the monk completely healed from any damage. While bleeding, cast vigorous spirit to gain 13 health per attack, healing for over 20% of your max hp each hit.
You would still need Bonetti's to counter the massive energy drain from the squids though.
Since we're invested into healing now, can take out shield of regen which had a long recast and add in healing breeze. We also took out guardian for vigorous spirit because there wasn't much of a need to block attacks anymore.
In my eyes, this build would work better than the old one. The mending itself would keep the monk alive against smites so they don't have to attack to regain energy.
But still, coldfires are a challenge and take longer to kill.
Frankly since we're not using protection at all, the better way would be to refund more and pump into tactics and divine. But that's a waste of refund points as this way works fine as is.
What do you think?