Domination Build for PVP. Need YOUR input!

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Hey everyone,

I had great comments from my last post so I hope to get the same results again.

Here is a Domination build I want to run for TA/GVG so hopefully this is viable.

Ill post the build and give a few comments at the end.

Me/E
Fast Casting: 11 - Minor (+1)
Domination Magic: 15 - Superior (+3)
Illusion Magic: 0
Inspiration Magic: 11 - Minor (+1)

SkillBar:
Cry Of Frustration
Shatter Enchantment
Shatter Hex
Drain Enchantment
Inspired Hex
Diversion
Res Signet

Now here is what I cannot decide on. The the Elite, should I run Glyph of Renewal or Ether Prodigy?? Im really not sure what is best in this sort of situation. I figure one of them would be a good choice and I see a lot of Dom mesmers running the Glyph so Im just curious what is the best call for this type of build?

This is really my first attempt at a Domination Build, so if its total trash just let me know and Ill start from scratch. Basically Im just looking to make a very good Dom build that I can have fun in PVP with. I already have a very good Ineptitude Build that I play with now but I really really love playing a Mesmer, and I have a hard time getting into the other classes the same way. So I figured I'd take another spin at one.

Let me know what I can change to make this better!

Thanks a ton for the feedback

Dragannia

Dragannia

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

Venatio Illuminata [VEIL]

Me/N

Well, you really need to specialise, for one. The skill set you made doesn't really suit any part; it's not a pure shutdown, interrupt, etc. You really need to specialise to be the most effective you can be. I'd drop Shatter Hex or Inspired hex, and the same with Shatter Enchantment or Drain Enchantment. Diversion is fine, however.

If you want to be a shutdown, it's best to either go Diversion spamming (with Arcane Echo, Echo or Mantra of Recovery), and skills like Backfire. Other good Domination skills which are generally good for all situations include Empathy and Energy Burn.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragannia
Well, you really need to specialise, for one. The skill set you made doesn't really suit any part; it's not a pure shutdown, interrupt, etc. You really need to specialise to be the most effective you can be. I'd drop Shatter Hex or Inspired hex, and the same with Shatter Enchantment or Drain Enchantment. Diversion is fine, however.

If you want to be a shutdown, it's best to either go Diversion spamming (with Arcane Echo, Echo or Mantra of Recovery), and skills like Backfire. Other good Domination skills which are generally good for all situations include Empathy and Energy Burn. I agree completely... I really don't have a clue what Im doing with Dom Mesmers.

So Ill search the boards and see if I can find a good Dom mesmer, change it up a little and post that. I think I would like to focus on shutdown/skill denial. Im not sure if thats the best option, but thats whats in my head at the moment.

NatalieD

NatalieD

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

I agree with Dragannia, except I find nothing at all wrong with packing two enchantment removals. It's fairly unlikely that you won't be able to use them both as fast as they cycle, given the number of boon prots around these days.

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Hey everyone,

I had great comments from my last post so I hope to get the same results again.

Here is a Domination build I want to run for TA/GVG so hopefully this is viable.

Ill post the build and give a few comments at the end.

Me/E
Fast Casting: 11 - Minor (+1)
Domination Magic: 15 - Superior (+3)
Illusion Magic: 0
Inspiration Magic: 11 - Minor (+1)

SkillBar:
Cry Of Frustration
Shatter Enchantment
Shatter Hex
Drain Enchantment
Inspired Hex
Diversion
Res Signet
Drop fast-casting a touch, and up Dom to 16. Shatter Hex is awesome in builds with 3~ warriors where it can be a conditional nuke due to it's AoE. In builds with fewer warriors, you will probably find it far less usefull, with non-melee mid/backline characters taking more of the hexes.

I don't believe Inspired Hex interacts properly with Glyph of Renewal, not entirely sure though, I tend not to actually play mesmer. Power Drain is very strong with it though; if you are low on energy just Glyph it and hit two spells, boom, back to full.

Glyph of Renewal is a good call, I do love Glyph Mesmers.

Here's the Glyph Dom we use in GvG fairly often:

Mesmer/Elementalist
Fast Casting: 9 (8+1)
Domination Magic: 16 (12+4)
Inspiration Magic: 11 (10+1)

- Power Drain (Inspiration Magic)
- Cry of Frustration (Domination Magic)
- Glyph of Renewal [Elite] (Elementalist other)
- Diversion (Domination Magic)
- Shame (Domination Magic)
- Shatter Enchantment (Domination Magic)
- Drain Enchantment (Inspiration Magic)
- Resurrection Signet ()

(And there is no such thing as too much enchant removal. If it works well on the character, and synergises with your build, take it.)

Dragannia

Dragannia

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

Venatio Illuminata [VEIL]

Me/N

Yeah, two enchantment removals rock; it's over twice as effective than just one, but I wouldn't take Shatter Enchantment (I prefer Inspired since it's almost free). Besides, that skillbar looks to be energy intensive, and Shatter is 15 to cast.

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dragannia
Yeah, two enchantment removals rock; it's over twice as effective than just one, but I wouldn't take Shatter Enchantment (I prefer Inspired since it's almost free). Besides, that skillbar looks to be energy intensive, and Shatter is 15 to cast. Inspired Hex is largely trash, due to the fact that 99% of the time you won't get an enchantment you can actually use. It also has a fairly poor energy return. Drain Enchantment is very powerfull energy management, and Shatter Enchant is a very powerfull spike assist skill. Both are extremely strong skills.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Wow, so many good comments so fast! Love this group!

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR-
Drop fast-casting a touch, and up Dom to 16. Shatter Hex is awesome in builds with 3~ warriors where it can be a conditional nuke due to it's AoE. In builds with fewer warriors, you will probably find it far less usefull, with non-melee mid/backline characters taking more of the hexes.

I don't believe Inspired Hex interacts properly with Glyph of Renewal, not entirely sure though, I tend not to actually play mesmer. Power Drain is very strong with it though; if you are low on energy just Glyph it and hit two spells, boom, back to full.

Glyph of Renewal is a good call, I do love Glyph Mesmers.

Here's the Glyph Dom we use in GvG fairly often:

Mesmer/Elementalist

Fast Casting: 9 (8+1)
Domination Magic: 16 (12+4)
Inspiration Magic: 11 (10+1)

- Power Drain (Inspiration Magic)
- Cry of Frustration (Domination Magic)
- Glyph of Renewal [Elite] (Elementalist other)
- Diversion (Domination Magic)
- Shame (Domination Magic)
- Shatter Enchantment (Domination Magic)
- Drain Enchantment (Inspiration Magic)
- Resurrection Signet ()

(And there is no such thing as too much enchant removal. If it works well on the character, and synergises with your build, take it.) JR I have a question on your build (and btw a ton better than mine)

Wouldn't Blackout be a good call for a build so heavy in Domination for skill denial? I would think that blacking out an opponent for 7 seconds (given so many att points) would be pretty good call. All the same, I have no idea what I would take out of your build.

How does this work in your GVG environment? I know I'd need to practice a lot with this which is fine. No build comes too fast (if it does it aint that great of a build IMO). I always PVP in this game, I rarely ever play the 1 player version, so this is where I get my joy. lol! Currently though my guild hasn't really done any GVG as of yet (but working towards it)... so my question is, how do you think this would do in TA?? ATM Im running an Enptitude Mesmer and it is doing quite well... but I want something that I can a) Practice with and b) Be proficient when we get to the GVG Battlegrounds. Thats my ultimate goal with my character. I just find that Mesmer's are a class I can play well and its one I really love out of all of them.

Anyways, thats my little rant, thanks for so much fast replies guys!!!

Dragannia

Dragannia

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

Venatio Illuminata [VEIL]

Me/N

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR-
Inspired Hex is largely trash, due to the fact that 99% of the time you won't get an enchantment you can actually use. It also has a fairly poor energy return. Drain Enchantment is very powerfull energy management, and Shatter Enchant is a very powerfull spike assist skill. Both are extremely strong skills. Inspired Enchantment is trash, yes, but it's a purely enchantment removal skill, with a very low net energy loss. Essentially it's free; good for low energy builds which want two enchantment removals.

LightningHell

LightningHell

(????????????)???

Join Date: Aug 2005

Hong Kong

Guildless

Mo/

I prefer using Shatter Enchantment by a...ton.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

One more thing. JR, you mentioned to put a total 16 in Dom. I am leaning against this for a few reasons.

If I put that extra point there, I really take away a lot of points from the other two attributes.

For example:

Fast Casting: 11 - Minor (+1)
Domination Magic: 15 - Superior (+3)
Illusion Magic: 0
Inspiration Magic: 11 - Minor (+1)


This is just with 15 points in Domination.... is it REALLY worth the 1 extra point to sacrifice a lot in the other two? In addition if I do this I will have 5 points left over that I cannot use (or I simply have to put them some place I don't use)... wouldn't it just be better to have the 15 pts and have the others build up too?

To everyone, thanks for the help. Here is what Im thinking of running based on the comments. Let me know what you think!

Glyph of Renewal {E}
Cry Of Frustration
Blackout
Diversion
Power Drain
Shatter Enchantment
Drain Enchantment
Res Signet

I am not sure if this is really good or not, and I have a bit of a fear for energy management. The good part is I can Glyph Power Drain and drain two spells and get back 23 energy each. So this is nice... might be enough but if not Ill have to look for an additional resource to use.

So what does everyone think? Will this be viable in GVG/TA?

LightningHell

LightningHell

(????????????)???

Join Date: Aug 2005

Hong Kong

Guildless

Mo/

TA, definitely. I'd say Yes in GvG, but I'm no expert on it.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Well I gave this build a try today and I have a bit of mixed results. This was just in TA so please keep that in mind.

So the interupting was awesome, energy management was normally not a problem what so ever... the Glyph was absolutely amazing so I was very happy with that part of it. HOWEVER, this is the big part... I found that because I was so squishy I had absolutely no defense against a Warrior coming after me pounding my face in. With my other build Ineptitude I never had such problems but today I just got manhandled over and over when a Warrior got close to me.

So my question is, how do you survive with no Distortion or Warrior hate? I just dont understand....? Maybe its because Im new to this build and I dont' really know what Im doing. That is definitely true... still that being said it seems as if the other build is far better for TA and this is maybe a GVG type build instead? As I said the shutdown was amazing. I was so impressed how I could take another mesmer or Monk out of the battle. Biggest problem with Monk was they have fast speeds sometimes so you had to be quick. (I was glad to have Blackout on my skill bar, it stopped them from healing for a minute).

So as you can see, very mixed results. Sometimes it was good others not. Definitely not the success I had with Ineptitude...

Anyone have any comments for me??

holden

holden

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2005

[NICE]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
One more thing. JR, you mentioned to put a total 16 in Dom. I am leaning against this for a few reasons.

If I put that extra point there, I really take away a lot of points from the other two attributes.

For example:

Fast Casting: 11 - Minor (+1)
Domination Magic: 15 - Superior (+3)
Illusion Magic: 0
Inspiration Magic: 11 - Minor (+1)


This is just with 15 points in Domination.... is it REALLY worth the 1 extra point to sacrifice a lot in the other two? In addition if I do this I will have 5 points left over that I cannot use (or I simply have to put them some place I don't use)... wouldn't it just be better to have the 15 pts and have the others build up too?

To everyone, thanks for the help. Here is what Im thinking of running based on the comments. Let me know what you think!

Glyph of Renewal {E}
Cry Of Frustration
Blackout
Diversion
Power Drain
Shatter Enchantment
Drain Enchantment
Res Signet

I am not sure if this is really good or not, and I have a bit of a fear for energy management. The good part is I can Glyph Power Drain and drain two spells and get back 23 energy each. So this is nice... might be enough but if not Ill have to look for an additional resource to use.

So what does everyone think? Will this be viable in GVG/TA?
i'd keep this in gvg Valkyries. in arena there's no way to keep warriors and rangers off of you. if there's no monk you'll be the first guy with a facefull of warrior angst.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by holden
i'd keep this in gvg Valkyries. in arena there's no way to keep warriors and rangers off of you. if there's no monk you'll be the first guy with a facefull of warrior angst. Thanks Holden,

That kind of verified my suspections.

I found this really tough to compete with in a 4v4 environment.

Like I said, when a Warrior saw me being a nuisence, they proceeded to smash my face in very quickly. Theres only so much countering you can do without them noticing, then its lights out. Soon as they are done with whatever char they are on, thats it....

I just really like the skillset. So too bad I wont be playing with it until we start doing GVG but hopefully thats quite soon! Glyph is really amazing. On Paper, doesn't look that great but in Practice its just incredible.

So Ill stick to GVG with this build (which I have a feeling would work AWESOME in that environment) and play my Ineptitude Mesmer for fun TA types. This has very little problem with Warriors so I think thats the better move.

Thanks for all the helpful info. Does anyone have anything to add to my build? Any way to make it better?

holden

holden

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2005

[NICE]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Thanks Holden,

That kind of verified my suspections.

I found this really tough to compete with in a 4v4 environment.

Like I said, when a Warrior saw me being a nuisence, they proceeded to smash my face in very quickly. Theres only so much countering you can do without them noticing, then its lights out. Soon as they are done with whatever char they are on, thats it....

I just really like the skillset. So too bad I wont be playing with it until we start doing GVG but hopefully thats quite soon! Glyph is really amazing. On Paper, doesn't look that great but in Practice its just incredible.

So Ill stick to GVG with this build (which I have a feeling would work AWESOME in that environment) and play my Ineptitude Mesmer for fun TA types. This has very little problem with Warriors so I think thats the better move.

Thanks for all the helpful info. Does anyone have anything to add to my build? Any way to make it better?
i like sig of midnight quite a bit. i'll run mesmer/necro and take plague touch as well. sig of midnight a warrior then run straight to the ranger and plague touch blind on him. it's cheap.

i like spirit of failure quite a bit. at 10 inspiration you get back 4 energy everytime foe's attack misses. 25% chance to miss for 30 seconds at a cost of 10 energy.

mesmer skills are great in that you can just take one or two and ruin someones day. diversion is terrible if you are the opposing caster. someone spamming signet of humility at you every 20 seconds sucks. but 4v4 is a lot different than 8v8. the warriors think they're good in arena and they want to prove it to you.

frickett

frickett

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2006

Shinigami Keys [SHIN]

R/Mo

Why doesnt anyone use power block? I dont have it yet, but it looks like it would be very powerful against an air spiker, or curser necro, or a healing monk.

holden

holden

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2005

[NICE]

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by frickett
Why doesnt anyone use power block? I dont have it yet, but it looks like it would be very powerful against an air spiker, or curser necro, or a healing monk. the spell has a good effect but not great. 13 seconds isn't all that long and the caster can kite away or just hold out and wait. it cost 15 and recharges in 30 seconds and it's elite. there are better elites to choose from imo.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by holden
the spell has a good effect but not great. 13 seconds isn't all that long and the caster can kite away or just hold out and wait. it cost 15 and recharges in 30 seconds and it's elite. there are better elites to choose from imo.
I really agree.

I dont find power block to be all that useful to be honest.

Its good, don't get me wrong but when it comes down to Elites to use, I just think there are way better options than that.

Quote: What do you mean by one skill short? Don't really understand...

You are right though, Im going to keep this away from TA and focus on HA/GVG. Its much better suited there.

Quote:
i like sig of midnight quite a bit. i'll run mesmer/necro and take plague touch as well. sig of midnight a warrior then run straight to the ranger and plague touch blind on him. it's cheap.

i like spirit of failure quite a bit. at 10 inspiration you get back 4 energy everytime foe's attack misses. 25% chance to miss for 30 seconds at a cost of 10 energy.

mesmer skills are great in that you can just take one or two and ruin someones day. diversion is terrible if you are the opposing caster. someone spamming signet of humility at you every 20 seconds sucks. but 4v4 is a lot different than 8v8. the warriors think they're good in arena and they want to prove it to you. In my Ineptitude build I use Spirit of Failure along with Ineptitude, Clumsiness, Phantom Pain, and some other good inspiration skills (Normally Drain Enchant/Inspired Hex/Power Drain).

What I like about Ineptitude so much is that you blind them and do a lot of damage. Plus it really messes with spikes that Warriors tend to dish out. I think you are right though. I really find Warriors are probably the better class in TA. Not to say that the other classes are not good, just they can really dish it out and there is less people to be able to absorb the hit from a Warrior. You really need a good Monk in the group to stay alive in situations like that, where as in GVG, you actually plan your build for each character before you enter. This makes things a lot more balanced and very interesting.

Can't wait to get to GVG!! Wish my guild was more PVP Active.. might have to change that.

Dragannia

Dragannia

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Feb 2006

Venatio Illuminata [VEIL]

Me/N

Quote:
Originally Posted by frickett
Why doesnt anyone use power block? I dont have it yet, but it looks like it would be very powerful against an air spiker, or curser necro, or a healing monk. Personally, I prefer Power Block over Migraine. Take Mantra of Persistence and Arcane Conundrum, then hit the first Elem/Necro with Power Block. Proceed to Arcane Conundrum the Monk, then interrupt him a bit (I plan to use Power Return, just to see how it goes, when Factions comes out). But then again, I'm a weird sort of Mesmer.

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Wouldn't Blackout be a good call for a build so heavy in Domination for skill denial? I would think that blacking out an opponent for 7 seconds (given so many att points) would be pretty good call. All the same, I have no idea what I would take out of your build. In arena where positioning is not important, yes. However in GvG you would have to over-extend hugely to blackout a monk on spike for example. Mesmers just aren't built for that, too squishy.

As for Dom at 16; I really like getting the most damage out of characters as possible. If that shatter kills a target with 1 hp to spare, then it was worth the spec.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR-
In arena where positioning is not important, yes. However in GvG you would have to over-extend hugely to blackout a monk on spike for example. Mesmers just aren't built for that, too squishy.

As for Dom at 16; I really like getting the most damage out of characters as possible. If that shatter kills a target with 1 hp to spare, then it was worth the spec. I notice how squishy they really are after playing many hours yesterday with that new build

Problem was Im so used to being able to take a Warrior on myself with my other build, that with this one I just couldn't handle it. Blackout wasn't so good because I would get owned as soon as I ran out of the backlines. I don't think this build is set for TA, there just isn't enough people and control. However, that being said when I actually had the chance to do control a Monk or another Mesmer they literally had no chance to do anything. Cry of Frustration with the Gylph was just mean... and Power Drain was incredible for getting a ton of energy back. Gylph is almost like an Echo in a way, only its very fast and not much energy. I was comparing the two, which is really the better? Echo or Glyph???

If we take a look at both:

Echo
Enchantment Spell
5E
1S
30 Recharge

For 20 seconds, Echo is replaced with the next skill you use. Echo acts as this skill for 20 seconds.

Glyph
5E
1S
15 Recharge

For 15 seconds, your next Spell instantly recharges.
The huge plus for the Glyph is the recharge time is cut in half. So basically allows you to cast two spells at the same time, more or less. Echo more or less does the same thing since you actually copy the spell. The the advantage I see is that with the Glyph you can pick whatever you want to recharge and basically always keep this active (15 s duration + 15 s recharge).

Is there any other advantages for using one or the other? I haven't really tried Echo, but the Gylph is pretty awesome. Hopefully Ill bring this to GVG and learn how to play. Its very different from my other mesmer build (Which is what makes this game so much fun) :P

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

That is the problem with arena. Highly offensive builds are hugely effective, but you just aren't going to last long enough to do the damage without a fairly competant monk. However, once you DO get on a team with a competant monk you can really have fun.

On the odd occasion that I do RA these days, dom mesmer one character type I love to have on my team, if played well. For the same reason that I prefer Warriors that are entirely offensive, and not packing two or three defensive skills. Whilst they may be more effective on teams without monks, on a team with a monk they will just be a gimp.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR-
That is the problem with arena. Highly offensive builds are hugely effective, but you just aren't going to last long enough to do the damage without a fairly competant monk. However, once you DO get on a team with a competant monk you can really have fun.

On the odd occasion that I do RA these days, dom mesmer one character type I love to have on my team, if played well. For the same reason that I prefer Warriors that are entirely offensive, and not packing two or three defensive skills. Whilst they may be more effective on teams without monks, on a team with a monk they will just be a gimp. I know exactly what you mean. Its like two completely different games.

If you have a really great team, you don't need to have those defensive skills, you can just dish out the damage and rely on the Monk to heal you. Problem is a lot of the time its PUGs and not many people are really aware of what is going on. I cannot even count how often I have to ask for a res after about 15-20 seconds of them still trying to fight them off. Im sorry but you should know right away if a member goes down to res them. 3-4 is such a huge handicap in this game but people just don't get it. Hell, I've only been playing for a month and this was one of the first things I learnt.

That being said, I really cannot wait to get to GVG and play this. I find because I am pretty new to Dom builds that I need some practice and unless I get lucky and have a really good group Ill get blasted by the Warrior.... The Ineptitude build I run solves all that.

Edit:

I have a semi-stupid/noob question. Maybe someone can answer.

Can you see what Enchantment is cast on your oponent? And furthermore what Hexes are cast on your Allies?? I realize the little "Up Arrow" and "Down Arrow" Signals which one is on but apart from actually having the enemy targetted to see what they cast is it possible to know what is on other chars or just yourself? Im just curious, maybe Im making things harder on myself. Sorry if this is obvious

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Can you see what Enchantment is cast on your oponent? And furthermore what Hexes are cast on your Allies?? I realize the little "Up Arrow" and "Down Arrow" Signals which one is on but apart from actually having the enemy targetted to see what they cast is it possible to know what is on other chars or just yourself? Im just curious, maybe Im making things harder on myself. Sorry if this is obvious Other than watching for it being applied, or seeing it's effect (such as the animation around a life bonded person when they take damage); no, you can't.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

heh... thats what I thought but I wanted to make sure I wasn't being stupid! LOL!

thanks for the info... Ill have to pay extra attention.

Ole Man Bourbon

Ole Man Bourbon

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2005

Atlanta

GONG

W/E

In the Arenas I'd bring at least some sort of defensive skill, just to keep you from getting killed by utter noobs. When you get that good monk, you'll only be one skill short, really.

whatnow?

whatnow?

Academy Page

Join Date: Mar 2006

happy enchanted heroes (HEH)

just look at the little yellow up-arrow on your opponent or purple down-arrow on your pary list

LouAl

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

Here's a question (haven't seen it answered yet, but I could have missed something)

What type of mask are you using?
Your attributes are at 11, 15, and 11 and only runes are listed...I would assume that it is a Dom mask but I thought I'd ask

(also too lazy to add up the att distribution to see where it was)


As far as the difference between glyph of renewal and echo:

IMHO Glyph of Renewal works better for spells with a long recharge. You can effectively reduce the recharge of a spell from 60 seconds to 15 seconds and it makes it much more usable.
Echo also works well for this but not quite as well as Glyph. Echo works MUCH better for spells with a short recharge that you want to be able to apply to more people. Also echo (elite) can be used on any skill and glyphs only apply to spells

I like to use echo with spells that I will be able to cast them at least twice with the echo'd copy. A 10 second recharge spell works well because it can be cast 4 times before your echo runs out (assuming a + enchant wep). I like to use glyph on things that I want to use twice and then wait out the recharge and then use twice again (power drainworks well and ethereal burden is fun...)

anyway those are my thoughts, sorry it is so rambling...

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ole Man Bourbon
In the Arenas I'd bring at least some sort of defensive skill, just to keep you from getting killed by utter noobs. When you get that good monk, you'll only be one skill short, really.
just look at the little yellow up-arrow on your opponent or purple down-arrow on your pary list Ya I knew about these but I wasn't sure if I could tell exactly what skill was being used. So I have to try and catch them when they cast I guess!

Also, what do you think is better? Power Leak, Power Spike or Perhaps something completely different. lol! Those were the two I was considering.

Just to recap. Im using the following (JR Was right about Blackout, can't even get close to a Monk with it in HA/GVG. I would get trashed before even getting half way there).

Mesmer
Fast Casting: 11 - Minor (+1)
Domination Magic: 15 - Superior (+3)
Illusion Magic: 0
Inspiration Magic: 11 - Minor (+1)

Health Penalty: -75
Unused Points: 1
(May change it up for 16 Dom but currently playing with this)

Glyph of Renewal
Cry Of Frustration
Diversion
Power Drain
Shatter Enchantment
Drain Enchantment
Power Leak/Power Spike/Something I haven't thought of
Res Signet

Anymore suggestions??

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LouAl
Here's a question (haven't seen it answered yet, but I could have missed something)

What type of mask are you using?
Your attributes are at 11, 15, and 11 and only runes are listed...I would assume that it is a Dom mask but I thought I'd ask

(also too lazy to add up the att distribution to see where it was)


As far as the difference between glyph of renewal and echo:

IMHO Glyph of Renewal works better for spells with a long recharge. You can effectively reduce the recharge of a spell from 60 seconds to 15 seconds and it makes it much more usable.
Echo also works well for this but not quite as well as Glyph. Echo works MUCH better for spells with a short recharge that you want to be able to apply to more people. Also echo (elite) can be used on any skill and glyphs only apply to spells

I like to use echo with spells that I will be able to cast them at least twice with the echo'd copy. A 10 second recharge spell works well because it can be cast 4 times before your echo runs out (assuming a + enchant wep). I like to use glyph on things that I want to use twice and then wait out the recharge and then use twice again (power drainworks well and ethereal burden is fun...)

anyway those are my thoughts, sorry it is so rambling... Im using Dom Mask yes.

In addition, most things in this build are 25 Recharge. So I'd assume Glyph would be the better call. There is only 1 thing (Diversion) that is 10 Recharge and thats something Ill probably half spam anyways against annoying Spellcasters. Everything else is basically 20+.

So that helps. Ill stick with the Glyph!!

LouAl

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

That is what I'd do...

For a spell that is 25 seconds or so you are MUCH better off with the glyph. With echo you only get to use it once during the duration of the echo'd copy and then you have to wait 30 seconds for Echo to recharge. It turns your second copy into a spell with recharge of 55 seconds

With the glyph you can either keep it at a constant 15 second recharge or go for 2 immediate and then 25 second recharge. Saves 30 seconds over Echo.

But, like you said if you were to use diversion more it would be a good one to use with Echo...since you don't use it tons, well...

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Also, what do you think is better? Power Leak, Power Spike or Perhaps something completely different. lol! Those were the two I was considering.
If you are decent on interrupt, Power Leak is an absolutely brutal skill. Power Spike can be described almost in its entirety by the sound "meh".

Quote:
Im glad it isn't just me!

And I agree with this, I think Edenial isn't the greatest but apparently everyone else thinks they are... and thats the problem. I had similar issues when I played WoW... Let me use my spec its good... then I get the typical "but its not this cookie cutter build that everyone else plays, go change"...

I really think that if played correctly my build will have better distuption. That being said I have seen the ESurger in action and it does do some nice damage (probably more than mine) but as you said you can really only focus on one at a time.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Glyph of Renewal
Cry Of Frustration
Diversion
Power Drain
Shatter Enchantment
Drain Enchantment
Power Leak
Res Signet Looks good.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Ok perfect!

So Ill run the following:

Glyph of Renewal
Cry Of Frustration
Diversion
Power Drain
Shatter Enchantment
Drain Enchantment
Power Leak
Res Signet

I have one more quick question. Is this better suited for HA/GVG or is the ESurge build better? The reason I ask is because in HA I have a hard time getting a group. I say Im a Dom Glyph Mesmer and the only question I get is "Are you E-Surge".. when I say no I don't get a response.

Is ESurge that much better than what I have posted above??

JR

JR

Re:tired

Join Date: Nov 2005

W/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
I have one more quick question. Is this better suited for HA/GVG or is the ESurge build? The reason I ask is because in HA I have a hard time getting a group sometimes. I say Im a Dom Glyph Mesmer and the only question I get is "Are you E-Surge".. when I say no I don't get a response.

Is ESurge that much better than what I have posted above?? The standard ESurge/Burn/SoW mesmer is a solid edenial build. It can plug into just about anything. The difference between a Glyph Dom and a Surge mesmer, is skill.

A mediocre mesmer would probably be far more usefull playing a Surger, because it quite simply is hard to get wrong. They can just find a target, karate chop their keyboard, and still get a fairly good result.

A decent mesmer would probably be far more effective playing a Glyph Dom, because you can cause a lot more disruption if you know how and when to use your skills, and on which target.

Both have a place in HA and GvG, although due to the nature of PuGs and the Surge Mesmer's simplicity, you will probably get into more groups with a standard surge build.

Hermessar

Hermessar

Academy Page

Join Date: Mar 2006

Belgium

We Are Too Cute In [Pink]

Me/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Ok perfect!

So Ill run the following:

Glyph of Renewal
Cry Of Frustration
Diversion
Power Drain
Shatter Enchantment
Drain Enchantment
Power Leak
Res Signet

I have one more quick question. Is this better suited for HA/GVG or is the ESurge build? The reason I ask is because in HA I have a hard time getting a group sometimes. I say Im a Dom Glyph Mesmer and the only question I get is "Are you E-Surge".. when I say no I don't get a response.

Is ESurge that much better than what I have posted above?? Getting the same here.
People just want the e-Denial. However, I played e-denail and I don't think it's really that powerfull, as it doesn't really kill anything. (well it does but not quite as rapid or devastating)
With E-denail you better have a good team to finish the others off. And if there are 2 monks on the opposite team, it's kinde of annoying because you can't really drain 2 monks at a time.
O energy doesn't kill (and thus, completely shut down a monk) while 0 health does.
I'd opt for a build that's a little more damaging and not as "let's go berserk with drain skills".

just my 2 cents

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by JR-
The standard ESurge/Burn/SoW mesmer is a solid edenial build. It can plug into just about anything. The difference between a Glyph Dom and a Surge mesmer, is skill.

A mediocre mesmer would probably be far more usefull playing a Surger, because it quite simply is hard to get wrong. They can just find a target, karate chop their keyboard, and still get a fairly good result.

A decent mesmer would probably be far more effective playing a Glyph Dom, because you can cause a lot more disruption if you know how and when to use your skills, and on which target.

Both have a place in HA and GvG, although due to the nature of PuGs and the Surge Mesmer's simplicity, you will probably get into more groups with a standard surge build. Thanks for the response JR, however thats really unfortunate...

Just because I feel that the Glyph Mesmer is probably even better. Yes the other one is good and takes care of a lot of energy from Monks, etc, but the one I posted above is so good on distruption with Diverson, Cry of Frustration, etc...

I agree that this is harder to play but how can I practice this build when no one will allow me into their team without being an ESurger? Makes it really tough....

Plus, I think if I had to go ESurge I would have to use some skills from here. Mostly Diverson. Its just way too good.

LightningHell

LightningHell

(????????????)???

Join Date: Aug 2005

Hong Kong

Guildless

Mo/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Valkyries
Is ESurge that much better than what I have posted above?? The ESurge is just more popular, that's all. Also, you don't find good Domination mesmers everyday.

EDIT: Since you posted just before my post, I might just well adjust a bit.

IMO, if you have that kind of a problem going in a HA fight, get your Guild to GvG with you.

Valkyries

Valkyries

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Mar 2006

AoM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermessar
Getting the same here.
People just want the e-Denial. However, I played e-denail and I don't think it's really that powerfull, as it doesn't really kill anything. (well it does but not quite as rapid or devastating)
With E-denail you better have a good team to finish the others off. And if there are 2 monks on the opposite team, it's kinde of annoying because you can't really drain 2 monks at a time.
O energy doesn't kill (and thus, completely shut down a monk) while 0 health does.
I'd opt for a build that's a little more damaging and not as "let's go berserk with drain skills".

just my 2 cents
The ESurge is just more popular, that's all. Also, you don't find good Domination mesmers everyday.

EDIT: Since you posted just before my post, I might just well adjust a bit.

IMO, if you have that kind of a problem going in a HA fight, get your Guild to GvG with you. Problem is Im in a pretty small guild (like 15 people) and to be honest, they are not all that active and only 1 or 2 plays PVP at all. So that makes it quite difficult.

Im considering leaving and finding another guild but the members are so nice and friendly and that makes it a little hard as well....

EDIT:

One more thing I thought about.

Is Shatter Enchantment better than Shatter Hex overall? Reason Im asking is because I already have drain enchantment and no Hex removal at all. In addition to that, they are the same Energy cost and the Hex does an AoE burst instead of just the damage to the one foe.... of course the AoE is just people around the char and mostly will have to be used against Warriors.... Just curious what you guys thought.

LightningHell

LightningHell

(????????????)???

Join Date: Aug 2005

Hong Kong

Guildless

Mo/

It really depends on the rest of your group - I mean the Shatter Enchantment/Hex thing. IMHO.