asdar - thing is, Assassins cant take hits very well.
And People use assassins like alternate warriors - which they arent.
Assassins tend to die ...Alot... if they dont know what they are doing.
For PvEers: Introducing the New Wammo!
Former Ruling
Siddious
Its not that assasins are useless, its that the players are!! There are the few who actually know how to play the assasin, who I feel sorry for as they can not get groups 
, but it seems about 85% of the assasins in cantha seem to think they are some kind of tank, when they are not!!
, but it seems about 85% of the assasins in cantha seem to think they are some kind of tank, when they are not!!
shinja
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Originally Posted by Dahl
Good, I'm glad you all hate the assassin.
That just means I will shock and surprise people in tombs and gvg, and that is what leads to victory. Yes, it's true that assassins only suck if the player sucks. Yes, it's true their armor is sorta bad, but they have much higher melee power than warriors. Not long ago I played the lead warrior role in one of the higher up guilds. Then I got on the preview on the assassin and entered 12v12. The other assassins were idiots, they had no idea what they were doing, and used poor skills. I really was an assassin. I dropped players faster than I ever could on a warrior. |
Corinthian
I won't even bother healing an assassin, they take too much damage.
Hockster
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Originally Posted by Siddious
Its not that assasins are useless, its that the players are!! There are the few who actually know how to play the assasin, who I feel sorry for as they can not get groups
, but it seems about 85% of the assasins in cantha seem to think they are some kind of tank, when they are not!! |
WetWookie
It doesn't help that there seems to be as many assassins as all the other classes put together. I started an Rt and in the early missions found myself in groups of 5 assassins, another Rt and a healer hench, just because there was no diversity to be had.
hunter
On my last mission, an assassin was always charging ahead of the two warriors, doing all pulls, and was always the first to start attacking. Oh yeah, i also don't remember him ever pulling out of the fray.
This is basically one of the typical scenarios with most of the assassins during missions. Therefore don't blame the community for not liking assassins. There is an 85%+ chance that the assassin in your party is a damn who doesn't even have shadow step.
This is basically one of the typical scenarios with most of the assassins during missions. Therefore don't blame the community for not liking assassins. There is an 85%+ chance that the assassin in your party is a damn who doesn't even have shadow step.
Takeko Nakano
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Originally Posted by Carth`
Noobs who don't know how to play as assassins ruined it for those who do. Really hard to get a group now
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Cymboric Treewalker
I am enjoying my assassin, but I am stressed that I died three times... I wanted the survivor title.
I am running around at level 11 in Tyria...
Death One = got wailed on by three enemies exploding.
Death Two = got wailed on by two rits doing their attacks and one exploding corpse... went from 100 health to 0... ouch.
Death Three = running from Lions Arch to Beacon's Perch got body blocked by LAG-o-MATIC and could not retreat from enemies.
So much for the survivor title.
Then again I play a Mesmer and a Ranger -- so I am used to being avoided when it comes to groups... and I am used to playing characters that have nuances.
I am running around at level 11 in Tyria...
Death One = got wailed on by three enemies exploding.
Death Two = got wailed on by two rits doing their attacks and one exploding corpse... went from 100 health to 0... ouch.
Death Three = running from Lions Arch to Beacon's Perch got body blocked by LAG-o-MATIC and could not retreat from enemies.
So much for the survivor title.
Then again I play a Mesmer and a Ranger -- so I am used to being avoided when it comes to groups... and I am used to playing characters that have nuances.
hunter
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Originally Posted by Takeko Nakano
The same applied to mesmers - no one would trust them to be decent enough. And it is true that many assassins refuse to play differently from Paladins - sometimes they don't even take healing/damage avoidance skills.
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Mesmers lack firepower in general. They are more of a PVP character based around counter. For PVE you want to dish out dmg quickly and move on to hope and get the bonus done. Therefore its not the player thats disliked, but the class alltogather.
Assassins on the other hand aren't trusted because there are high chances that the player behind them sucks. So even though that class has a very high damage dealing capabilities, they are simply not worth risking a party wipe due to a noob player.
Former Ruling
I too, as a ritualist restoration healer, do not waste my energy on Assassins that have entered the fight beside the warriors and refuse to try to help themselves.
Especially the Assassin henchies...
Especially the Assassin henchies...
Rayne Nightfyre
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Originally Posted by hunter
Mesmers lack firepower in general.
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by hunter
They are more of a PVP character based around counter. For PVE you want to dish out dmg quickly and move on to hope and get the bonus done. Therefore its not the player thats disliked, but the class alltogather.
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Seriously though... Takeko is right; Assassins, like Mesmers, will take a degree of skill to play that the general population of players does not have. Just like it's easy, but not effective, to spam Conjure Phantasm on every enemy, good Assassins will have to learn how to evade bad situations by striking and then retreating if necessary - instead of standing their hacking away like a Warrior. So good parties will have to be more selective, and make sure their party members know what they're doing.
lg5000
So the answer would be.. whatever you do, don't play an assassin or a mesmer. Pitty I have one of each (and finding it hard to get into groups with my tyrian mesmer in cantha). Tyria has no problems with mesmers anymore, consequently, I'm not used to the problems of not taking a group.
As for the assassin, I plan on getting him max armor and leaving him alone for a few weeks, till there are less assassins around, then picking him up again.
Incidently, the skills which allow an assassin to teleport away from danger seem to be missing from the training island.
As for the assassin, I plan on getting him max armor and leaving him alone for a few weeks, till there are less assassins around, then picking him up again.
Incidently, the skills which allow an assassin to teleport away from danger seem to be missing from the training island.
felinette
Also, everyone and their aunt is playing an assassin right now, so it's possible that there was already an assassin or two in the groups calling for no assassins. Just about every group I've been out with had at least two assassins in it. In one group, it was me (mesmer), monk, and four assassins.
As for groups not wanting mesmers, I'm not finding that. I've had no problems grouping, and I've been in some areas where groups are calling for a mesmer. Given the number of opponent casters, I think interrupt mesmers will be extremely valuable in Cantha. I know I never get a moment's peace when my mesmer is out there. She's constantly in motion--very rare to face a mob with only warriors.
As for groups not wanting mesmers, I'm not finding that. I've had no problems grouping, and I've been in some areas where groups are calling for a mesmer. Given the number of opponent casters, I think interrupt mesmers will be extremely valuable in Cantha. I know I never get a moment's peace when my mesmer is out there. She's constantly in motion--very rare to face a mob with only warriors.
Cymboric Treewalker
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Originally Posted by hunter
Not entirely true.
Mesmers lack firepower in general. They are more of a PVP character based around counter. For PVE you want to dish out dmg quickly and move on to hope and get the bonus done. Therefore its not the player thats disliked, but the class alltogather. Assassins on the other hand aren't trusted because there are high chances that the player behind them sucks. So even though that class has a very high damage dealing capabilities, they are simply not worth risking a party wipe due to a noob player. |
Mesmers are not lacking for PvE firepower.
Assassins are similar to two things:
1) W/Mo in the old Tyria -- everyone is playing them and most players are not good or at least not good yet.
2) Me/Xx in old Tyria -- alot of people tried the class (it rips things up in pre-searing) but found it frustrating that Conjure Phantasm didn't scale with the bad guys... (in pre-sear it was almost an "I Win" button).
SpeedyKQ
I haven't tried assassin yet but I kind of feared this would happen. For the last couple weeks, whenever I put together a sample assassin build, I'd ask myself, why wouldn't I rather just play a warrior?
Anyways, if the right way to play a sin is to duck in and out of combat, does it become neccessary to have a secondary that lets you to do damage while you are on the back line regenerating? Maybe mesmer, necro, or ele?
Anyways, if the right way to play a sin is to duck in and out of combat, does it become neccessary to have a secondary that lets you to do damage while you are on the back line regenerating? Maybe mesmer, necro, or ele?
Hunter Sharparrow
The assassin is a power house but to balance this they take more damage. However they do have very good healing skills and I've had no problem taking on mobs of 4 or 5 nagas solo when I was level 5 to get the 250 fangs. I even took on the level 9 oni and level 12 yeti near by to finish each run. Again it was no problem as long as I put most of the points in my healing skills. Didn't have a secondary yet either.
you just can't tank with them like a warrior, it takes a whole new style of play to tank successfully.
you just can't tank with them like a warrior, it takes a whole new style of play to tank successfully.
CrispyCritter
It's quite simple, really. People are wary of Assassins because Assassins are the new W/Mos. I play an Assassin and it's pretty damn effective. I do tend to die a lot with henchies, but not so much when I'm in an actual group. I always bring healing and defensive skills, and I can kill stuff without too much trouble.
lg5000
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Originally Posted by felinette
Also, everyone and their aunt is playing an assassin right now, so it's possible that there was already an assassin or two in the groups calling for no assassins. Just about every group I've been out with had at least two assassins in it. In one group, it was me (mesmer), monk, and four assassins.
As for groups not wanting mesmers, I'm not finding that. I've had no problems grouping, and I've been in some areas where groups are calling for a mesmer. Given the number of opponent casters, I think interrupt mesmers will be extremely valuable in Cantha. I know I never get a moment's peace when my mesmer is out there. She's constantly in motion--very rare to face a mob with only warriors. |
felinette
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Originally Posted by lg5000
I must be doing something wrong then... got my mesmer into Cantha and due to what I was facing, switched my domination build to a illusion build, which is nice and effective, especially as many enemies seem to be assassins and rangers.
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ETA: And I envy you, being able to switch builds like that. My mesmer is a Canthan mesmer. As such, she has to buy her skills and has focused on domination skills. If she wanted to switch to illusion, she'd have to lay out some serious cash. My Tyrian mesmer, OTOH, won't have that problem.
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| As for the group thing, Missions are a pain to get into as a mesmer (this is without announcing my build to anyone, I generally don't unless asked). Mind you, I'm only at the third mission in Cantha so.. who knows if the later part (outside the city) is more mesmer friendly. Can I hope like fire island type friendly? |
Burton2000
The assasisin is really a hit and run class that i can see be very effective in spikes in pvp.They could also be very good for guild battles.You could just send an assasin round to there base and kill off archers etc as they can shadow step in or what have you and have some decent healing skills.
MelechRic
I think it's too early to tell of Assassins are "good" or "bad" as a class. Even speculating on that seems like jumping the gun. I remember not too long ago (1yr) that people were saying Rangers were gimped or Rangers didn't do enough damage. Then came Spirit Spam and Ranger Spike and people ate their words.
Now the community seems to be doing the same with Assassins. Granted that most of them are horrible because most of them are new players AND all of them are new to the class.
I agree that there's a Wa/Mo Rambo mentality with Assassins, but they may prove themselves to be very valuable.
As for not inviting them into my group... I'd never do that. I MM a lot and they provide valuable corpses for me when my team is fighting things that don't leave corpses.
Now the community seems to be doing the same with Assassins. Granted that most of them are horrible because most of them are new players AND all of them are new to the class.
I agree that there's a Wa/Mo Rambo mentality with Assassins, but they may prove themselves to be very valuable.
As for not inviting them into my group... I'd never do that. I MM a lot and they provide valuable corpses for me when my team is fighting things that don't leave corpses.
ExDeity
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Originally Posted by Dahl
Good, I'm glad you all hate the assassin.
That just means I will shock and surprise people in tombs and gvg, and that is what leads to victory. Yes, it's true that assassins only suck if the player sucks. Yes, it's true their armor is sorta bad, but they have much higher melee power than warriors. Not long ago I played the lead warrior role in one of the higher up guilds. Then I got on the preview on the assassin and entered 12v12. The other assassins were idiots, they had no idea what they were doing, and used poor skills. I really was an assassin. I dropped players faster than I ever could on a warrior. |
Cymboric Treewalker
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Originally Posted by ExDeity
Is there anyone who wasn't impressed by this self-pompous monologue of assassin righteousness? Anyone?
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Ruby Lightheart
Well here is how i see it. Some players were under the assumption that Assasins would be tankish like professions. But if they had played the preview weekends they would have discovered this to be untrue. Assassins have to be nimble and quick and cannot be weighted down with heavy protective armor. So in my opinion the assasins are as they should be.
The problem with grouping is something that has long been felt by rangers. They are one of the most underappreciated professions ingame. And yet they are ranged tankish professions, grant you not as good as the warrior in tank ability but if coupled with certain secondary profession skills, they can be high damage output killers. Assassins fall in the same catagory.
Keep in mind we are also dealing with some players whom want instant gratification and think they have to finsih a game in a matter of a week. But they miss out on adventures with other classes.
All in all, give it a couple weeks and the number of noobish assasins and ritualists will reduce and the real profession players will emerge and show jus thow the new professions are to be played
The problem with grouping is something that has long been felt by rangers. They are one of the most underappreciated professions ingame. And yet they are ranged tankish professions, grant you not as good as the warrior in tank ability but if coupled with certain secondary profession skills, they can be high damage output killers. Assassins fall in the same catagory.
Keep in mind we are also dealing with some players whom want instant gratification and think they have to finsih a game in a matter of a week. But they miss out on adventures with other classes.
All in all, give it a couple weeks and the number of noobish assasins and ritualists will reduce and the real profession players will emerge and show jus thow the new professions are to be played
Cymboric Treewalker
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Originally Posted by Navaros
After extensive experience with Chapter 1, I have come to learn that there is a fundamental problem with the concept of "Co operative Online RPG".
That problem is: when you ask (by way of game design) an average joe player to do something even marginally complex or skillful, the average player will be unable to do so because he lacks that ability. This is simply reality. Therefore, whilst there may be some good Assassin players in Chapter 2, there is little doubt that the vast majority of them will always suck. Hence, it makes all the sense in the world to not allow Assassins into your party. Not allowing Assassins is not a statement that the class as a whole sucks. Rather, it is simply an acknowledgement that there is a high probability that any Assassin player who you do not know personally will suck with an Assassin. Definitely won't be joining or accepting any Assassins who I don't know into my parties in Chapter 2.  |
Lexar
I use dead assassins in my party for Iway and everyone else is amazed by my awesome tanking skills 
Linkusmax
If All else fails my W/A with Axe/Tactics/Shadow Arts is a great Tank because its so easy to gather up all the agro, Pick a target at the back of the mob(usually a monk) and activate Deaths Charge and suddenly there all attacking you so you teammates can move in and put up the real DPS, Additionally you should have Triple Chop and Cyclone Axe with a Zealous mod for pretty damn good DPS as well.
MSecorsky
It's going to take a little time for the faux-assassins to float on down the Canthan sewers whilst the rest of us give this powerful class a better reputation. I'm not great at it yet. Not by a long shot. But I also don't die every battle. I don't tank. I'm getting the feel for hit-and-run techniques... and I like it. My other primary characters are Ranger and Mesmer, so maybe assassin is also something designed for my style of mentality.
I guess my point, if there is one, is that you shouldn't discard all assies because many suck. If that were the predominant philosophy, you'd be rejecting every class, because face it... the majority of people suck at the majority of classes.
EDIT: Visual spellcheck ftw!
I guess my point, if there is one, is that you shouldn't discard all assies because many suck. If that were the predominant philosophy, you'd be rejecting every class, because face it... the majority of people suck at the majority of classes.
EDIT: Visual spellcheck ftw!
calamitykell
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Originally Posted by Cymboric Treewalker
Well,... just one question for ya - mr. even if I stink I get invited because there are so few monks - how will you meet any?
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by MSecorsky
I guess my point, if there is one, is that you shouldn't discard all assies because many suck. If that were the predominant philosophy, you'd be rejecting every class, because face it... the majority of people suck at the majority of classes.
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Originally Posted by Xenrath
I think people are really overreacting to this. Bear in mind it's only been a few days. There are going to be floods of Assassins and Ritualists because many people will have been playing 4 other classes or so for ages and wanting to try something new.
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Ken Dei
I've played an Assassin intelligently, hit and run, hanging back, all that nice anti-whammo style play.
I still got my ass handed to me as an A prime. They are just to EASY to kill. I know it's nice to pretend most Assassins are wammos and get themselves killed, but that's just an excuse to cover up their real flaws.
Oh and glass cannon? Give me a break, I don't know what A.Net did to the skills but I used to be able to kill a caster in 3 hits with 9 Dagger Mastery.
Now I have 12 DM, and 11 in criticals and it takes me much longer even with a completed chain.
I stopped playing the Assassin for the most part.
I still got my ass handed to me as an A prime. They are just to EASY to kill. I know it's nice to pretend most Assassins are wammos and get themselves killed, but that's just an excuse to cover up their real flaws.
Oh and glass cannon? Give me a break, I don't know what A.Net did to the skills but I used to be able to kill a caster in 3 hits with 9 Dagger Mastery.
Now I have 12 DM, and 11 in criticals and it takes me much longer even with a completed chain.
I stopped playing the Assassin for the most part.
gabrial heart
Nah, half my guild has assasins and they've tweaked thier builds to be almost untouchable add a ritualist with spirits and OMG. With all the evade and teleporting skillls, they have managed to jump in/combo/kill/jump out with hardly a heal. Assassin are trouble!:P Warriors on the other hand are still heal hogs You just need to find combos and stealth moves that work well together which is what the assassin is all about..
You just need to find combos and stealth moves that work well together which is what the assassin is all about..
Mustache Mayhem
it's pugs.. take people you know or hench it- I gave up on pugs after I made my first character just too much hassle.. if you want to blame things on a class w/mo assassin mesmer whatever your probably just as bad.. the armor is pretty low from what I've seen in pvp but being able to pop on top of a target when they're low on health to spike is where they really become useful (everyone has thier thing- like I prefer ranger to this but that's just my opinion).. what you ranting about is you want a tank with uber damage for pve- well figure out a build and make it then.. you'll never stop chocolate chip cookie face from playing the game- it has no subscription fee so your going to have those guys in your average pug.. there's no way to stop those guys
Valerria
Assassins are the Real Ultimate Power! They freak out all the time and kill people! The other day an assassin killed a little boy just for opening a window!
If you take the +15 while attacking armor and maybe Watch Yourself you'll be equal to a warrior in terms of AL. The nice thing about assassins is the ability to spam attack skills, because the added damage on attack skills for the most part are not reduced by the armor level, so +40 is the same on a monk or a warrior.
If you take the +15 while attacking armor and maybe Watch Yourself you'll be equal to a warrior in terms of AL. The nice thing about assassins is the ability to spam attack skills, because the added damage on attack skills for the most part are not reduced by the armor level, so +40 is the same on a monk or a warrior.
Swinging Fists
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Originally Posted by Valerria
If you take the +15 while attacking armor and maybe Watch Yourself you'll be equal to a warrior in terms of AL.
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They need to get in, combo attack, get out, regen, and repeat. Live longer that way.
Instead of comparing Assassins' AL to that of a Warrior, how about comparing it to that of a Monk ? The base levels are within 10AL and each has various bonuses relating to the specifics of the profession. The two comparisons are fairly equally applicable.
Personally, I went with the +energy armor and so far I haven't regretted it. I've been able to get off lots of attacks, using Repeating Strike or whatever it's called, and then get out with plenty of health. We'll see how it goes later in the game and as we learn more about playing these new professions.
But one thing we should already know - Assassins are not tanks.
RandomEngy
I'm still trying to figure out the role of my assassin in PvE. I like the idea of killing a caster and getting out, but in a henchman team that tactic just fails. When you start going after that caster, your whole henchman team will do so, killing him before you can help out much and screwing up the tanking so their warriors can go after my casters. And using Blinding Powder on their warriors or rangers is similarly frustrating because of the henchmen's single-minded focus fire on a target that is no threat.
Morgana
Quote:
| There should have been 3 classes available to new characters at original launch: Ranger, Ele and Monk (so all Wars in early game would have been NPCs or hench). In order to unlock the other classes you have to play through one of these for a certain amount of time. To unlock Warrior, you have to play through Monk for a while. To unlock Mesmer, Ranger and Ele both. For Necro, Monk and Ele, etc. For Assassin, Ranger and Warrior (which required Monk). |
As for Assassins, I think the main problem is the way they're marketed. They're ninjas. The only thing that can kill a ninja, as everyone knows, is another ninja. Because ninjas are totally sweet. Now, in all seriousness, I love ninjas, but in an online game, it's about the worst thing they could do short of a pirate class.
Now, though, I agree with whoever said this will die down a fair bit as people either get used to the Assassin, or get mad and ragedelete theirs because it can't tank.
calamitykell
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Originally Posted by Morgana
ins, I think the main problem is the way they're marketed. They're ninjas. The only thing that can kill a ninja, as everyone knows, is another ninja. Because ninjas are totally sweet.
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Seriously, people see the assassin and think they automatically have a 75% chance to block or evade attacks simply because they're an assassin. It's just completely retarded.
Vargs
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Originally Posted by RandomEngy
And using Blinding Powder on their warriors or rangers is similarly frustrating because of the henchmen's single-minded focus fire on a target that is no threat.
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felinette
If you switch targets by tabbing and only cast at the new target (don't attack it using spacebar or clicking on it), the henchies will stay on the original target. Though I'll be the first to say that this is awkward, and there should be a simple way to tell the henchies to stay on target until the target is dead or you assign them a new one.