Stop putting bosses at the end of missions - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

bilateralrope

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2005

New Zealand

Xen Of Onslaught (Xen of the Pacific division)

07 Jun 2006 at 07:14 - 41

Well, the Rt and 'sin bosses dont spawn in Sunjiang explorable. Here is the relevant quote from guildwiki

Quote:

A better way to capture their skills is find them in their alternate locations. The first six bosses can be found in Sunjiang District (Explorable) after completion of the mission (before completion, they will be in the area sectioned off). The Assassin's Construct can be found in Silent Surf and the Ritualist's Construct can be found in Morostav Trail. Still, if you wish to capture during the final fight, make sure your party does not kill the boss you want to cap from last.

So, currently I can't think of any cap that is only at the end of a mission.

Joh

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2006

Sweden

Lucid Dreams [LD]

07 Jun 2006 at 10:45 - 42

/signed

I didn't get any assassin elites til Ferndale cause of this.

MithranArkanere

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Nov 2006

wikipedia.org/wiki/Vigo

Heraldos de la Llama Oscura [HLO]

E/

23 Nov 2006 at 17:31 - 43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joh

/signed

I didn't get any assassin elites til Ferndale cause of this.

There are a lot of them, starting from Kenshi Steelhad.

Most of the skills from bosses inside missions can be captured elsewhere. And any of the end boss skills can be captured elsewhere.

So why to fix what is not broken?

Bane of Worlds

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Mar 2006

Meadow

Rt/

23 Nov 2006 at 17:43 - 44

Despite how long it takes to cap certain elite skills and THERE are alternative areas I'll still sign but it is a waste of time for the devs to take their time for something like this as there other areas to cap most elite skills. Also, another advantage of having combined GW chapters is to have more alternative places to cap those pain in the rear elite skills that appeared at the end of missions.

---Follower of Grenth

gameshoes3003

Forge Runner

Join Date: Feb 2006

23 Nov 2006 at 18:49 - 45

/signed
Barrage is easy to cap from Markis, just don't attack the Jade Armors and rape Markis first. Then yes I do hate it that I can't cap the last boss at the end of the mission. In Thirsty River everybody knows that the monk boss there is the hardest and so he's the last. And guess what he has? Word of Healing. I had to do that mission 3 times (The 3rd time was badly executed bu I got it). It's pretty annoying.. Also, I was trying to cap Aura of Faith in the Ring of Fire mission and the monk boss was last. HA! can't cap! And I haven't been able to get Aura of Faith since then....
But enough of my babbling, to sum it up: It's just damn outright annoying when you can't cap the last boss.

Twonaiver

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2006

S??o Paulo Brasil

R/

23 Nov 2006 at 19:40 - 46

/signed

i had a hard time to cap barriae from markis too, like 10 times the same mission until i convince everyone to kill him first lol

Maximumraver

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2006

The Netherlands

Twisted Revenge [TR]

E/

23 Nov 2006 at 20:26 - 47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cymmina

I thought ArenaNet learned their lesson about putting bosses at the end of mission in Prophecies, making it impossible to cap certain skills (like Barrage from Markis).

I got Barrage from Markis... after hes dead a few more jade armors spawn that you have got to beat.

Quote:

Originally Posted by shadowfell

RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO

And wtf does this mean anyway?

mwpeck

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Feb 2006

Gameamp Guides [AMP]

W/

08 Jan 2007 at 04:15 - 48

ok, I know this is a little old, but:

/Signed

I personally thought up this idea earlier today, of giving us 10-20 seconds to "finish up" after you complete the mission, but before you go to the cutscene. And of course add a [READY] button or something so if no one needs a cap, you dont need to wait the full 10-20 seconds.

Sol_Vie

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

Boston, MA

Blood Of Orr [BoO]

08 Jan 2007 at 04:20 - 49

/notsigned

There are very few skills that you can't get elsewhere. Bosses have always been a staple of end of mission or end of dungeon events in RPGs of any kind.

Yeah, it sucks that sometimes they can be hard to cap but all in all, it's not that bad.

Vinraith

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Dec 2006

08 Jan 2007 at 04:35 - 50

/signed

Just give a pause, or better yet a "click when ready to move on" sort of button.

bam23

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Feb 2006

08 Jan 2007 at 04:37 - 51

/signed

I just did Abaddon's Mouth to try and cap Restore Condition from that Dryder Boss, only to find that he didn't spawn 3 times in a row.

TheSonofDarwin

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

The Black Hand Gang [BHG]

Mo/

08 Jan 2007 at 04:48 - 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by bilateralrope

So, currently I can't think of any cap that is only at the end of a mission.

/not signed until someone names an example ^^

If you are repeatedly doing Sunjiang, you are just nuts. Go out and kill the boss in the explorable! Miss WoH at Thirsty? Well you've got two other missions that you have to do where you can cap it. Barrage isn't an issue any more, they did fix that. If you are doing a PuG to cap at Dragon's Lair, that's just silly unless you like redoing it.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

08 Jan 2007 at 09:12 - 53

/signed that its bad to put bosses at the end of missions for capping purposes.

But cant you attain most elite skills in alternative locations?

I've never had issues attaining any elite spells for my elemental because any elites I had to cap from mission bosses were attainable in alternative, easier locations.

I dont see anything wrong with putting bosses at the end of missions, because thats just the way computer games work. You do the mission and kill a big strong creature at the end. Thats a given. Otherwise the mission doesnt feel very accomplished.

All they need to do, is add an NPC at the end of missions where they have this issue, so it doesnt end until you speak to them.

Nexus Icon

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Aug 2005

Natis Ignigena

Me/

08 Jan 2007 at 10:17 - 54

/signed

Oh, and for all those people saying that it was easy to cap Barrage from Markis, there was a time when all of the Jade Armours appeared before Markis was dead. This often resulted in Markis being the last to die, therefore denying Rangers their Barrage cap, possibly the most important cap for the majority of Rangers.
It wasn't always easy.

Sophitia Leafblade

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2005

Dragon Slayer Guild [DSG]

R/

08 Jan 2007 at 10:30 - 55

I never had an issue capping Barrage (or any other elite) all that long long time ago, i got it very 1st time i did the mission with a pug and i didnt even know about the skill till i had capped it. all u do is leave 2 Jades alive, let them run around doing there thing, the party monks can easy cope with just 2(or 1) of them.

/notsigned

Bosses are great to finish a mission, granted the bosses are completely over powered in factions and nightfall but once u do get by them it feels like u are a hero, uve just taken how a huge massive dragon that can do 200+ damage a hit.

Curse You

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Apr 2006

South Pole

The Magus Order

N/Mo

08 Jan 2007 at 10:43 - 56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maximumraver

And wtf does this mean anyway?

These forums will automatically (?) censor certain words, and in their place it puts "RED ENGINE GO" which tend to get stuck together as "RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GO"

I really don't see how people are still having problems with Markis. There are two Jade armours that must be killed that only spawn if you kill him.

The constructs at the end of Sunjiang District? Annoying. Yes. Getting the elite that you want? Not so hard.
All you need to do is make sure that your group knows that when you get to the bosses, you want to capture the elite, and check if anyone else wants a certain elite too.
This game is based on team co-ordination after all.

Dimitri_Stucoff

Academy Page

Join Date: Dec 2006

08 Jan 2007 at 11:59 - 57

I like the idea, having a 20 seconds or so to clean up loose ends before the mission ends is always nice. If I recall correctly the mission that allows foriegn characters into elona has this feature so I do not see why it would be too hard to implement as it is a feature that already exists.

Another idea to this would be if you choose skip on the cut scene it allows you the time of the cut scene to run around pick up items, cap, etc. This way those who want to see the cut scene can and those who are there for other purposes can well, not have to watch the cut scene.

Aegeroth

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jul 2006

Sydney, AUS.

Sons of Dark Magicians [SoDM]

N/Me

08 Jan 2007 at 13:49 - 58

Some very good points have been shown here...

imo, with the assistance of the opinion of other posters i reckon that;

- The Skill, being Elite, should be hard to get.
- The Boss with this Elite should RANDOMLY spawn throughout the course of the mission so that you don't always get him at the end. However, this would be neglected if the story doesn't permit.
- The Mission should not ubruptly end after the death of the final Boss.
- The Mission should end after 3/4 of the players are content with finishing the mission (3/4, some may be afk).

my thoughts

Effendi Westland

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Dec 2005

Isle of the dead

[DVDF][LDS]

P/W

08 Jan 2007 at 14:14 - 59

What elite can you only get from an endboss and nowhere else?

Show me one and I might sign.

Clone

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jan 2006

08 Jan 2007 at 14:45 - 60

Quote:

Originally Posted by capblueberry

well they aren't called ELITE skills because they're so easy to cap, a few elite should b more difficult to cap then others

Please, the "they aren't called ELITE..." arguments are getting old and now absurd. This isn't an issue of not being able to beat the boss. As the OP said, he's DONE THAT ALREADY! This is an issue of hitting the skill cap button and being stopped by a cutscene.

All they really would need to do is give you a little countdown before ending. This is already done some places (Tomb of the Primeval Kings, A Land Of Heros).

Dark Kal

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Dec 2006

08 Jan 2007 at 15:30 - 61

/Not signed

Sunjiang District bosses can be found in explorable areas and Markis has been fixed as two Jade Armors now only spawn after defeating him, although it wasn't that hard to capture before either just by leaving one or more Jade Armors alive.

freekedoutfish

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Jun 2006

E/

08 Jan 2007 at 15:49 - 62

I kinda of already posted, but I thought I should re-itterate a few points;

* Most elite skills can be found in two places in the same campaign or in an alternative campaign.
* Most missions can be explored afterwards and the same bosses are usually present in those explorable areas (except maybe Tyria).
* If you dont know where else to look, read guildwiki.net and look up elite skills.

If its possible to kill the boss and cap the skill, before ending the mission, then do so and ask your team to do that.

But I dont believe Anet would make it impossible to cap an elite skill.

If a boss exists at the end of a mission and you cant help but kill it before you have a chance to cap, then I expect that same elite can be capped elsewhere. Proably in the same area which you can explore afterwards.

If im wrong, then I apologise.

But if not and you havent bothered to do read guildwiki to find out, then do so. It could be that there is an easier way to find the elite you want.

Anet would not purposely make an elite impossible to get. They would fix something like that or give an alternative.

rezabm

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2006

Nightshift Resurrection

R/

08 Jan 2007 at 16:35 - 63

I remember capping all those uber-elite skills in the last missions of the Ring of Fire. With the old henchies equipped with their old crappy AI. Most of these skills are nowhere else to find, and moreover the boss spawns are random too. Now this was fun

/not signed, take it or leave it

Jae Onasi

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jan 2008

Lost Haven

E/Mo

12 Apr 2008 at 23:14 - 64

I had this problem trying to cap Cautery Signet at the end of the Kodonur Crossroads mission yesterday. The boss died, the cutscene immediately started, and I wasted a slot on my skill bar for a cap sig that I could have used for other things. I reported it to Anet and they informed me I should post the issue on a fansite instead of pursuing it with them (which is an interesting customer service approach to be sure), so here I am.

Sure, I could capture Cautery signet in other places. Sure, it's an elite and shouldn't be easy to cap, but that's why the bosses are harder to kill in the first place. I don't think the game should be set up in such a way to make it impossible to cap. That's a design flaw, not a boss challenge. If the boss is present, you should be given enough time to cap the elite skill. Otherwise, that boss is nothing more than a garden variety enemy who happens to be more powerful.

There are other missions where you do have time to cap end-boss skills, so this should not be difficult to implement for all missions--just give people about 20 or 30 seconds between the time the last boss dies and the cutscene starts. Is it unreasonable to ask that all missions be consistent in giving you the opportunity at skill captures?

Kaida the Heartless

Desert Nomad

Join Date: May 2006

N/

12 Apr 2008 at 23:25 - 65

Holy crap. This was the mother of all Res Sigs.

I've never had problems with this.

Tyla

Emo Goth Italics

Join Date: Sep 2006

12 Apr 2008 at 23:28 - 66

Threadres gogo.
And Jae, you can cap it RIGHT at the beginning of Consulate Docks...

I'm not really bothered. I never had this problem before.

Curse You

Furnace Stoker

Join Date: Apr 2006

South Pole

The Magus Order

N/Mo

12 Apr 2008 at 23:31 - 67

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jae Onasi

I had this problem trying to cap Cautery Signet at the end of the Kodonur Crossroads mission yesterday. The boss died, the cutscene immediately started, and I wasted a slot on my skill bar for a cap sig that I could have used for other things. I reported it to Anet and they informed me I should post the issue on a fansite instead of pursuing it with them (which is an interesting customer service approach to be sure), so here I am.

Sure, I could capture Cautery signet in other places. Sure, it's an elite and shouldn't be easy to cap, but that's why the bosses are harder to kill in the first place. I don't think the game should be set up in such a way to make it impossible to cap. That's a design flaw, not a boss challenge. If the boss is present, you should be given enough time to cap the elite skill. Otherwise, that boss is nothing more than a garden variety enemy who happens to be more powerful.

There are other missions where you do have time to cap end-boss skills, so this should not be difficult to implement for all missions--just give people about 20 or 30 seconds between the time the last boss dies and the cutscene starts. Is it unreasonable to ask that all missions be consistent in giving you the opportunity at skill captures?

Or, you could have spent 5 minutes reading one of the Wikis and found out that you can get [[Cautery Signet] from a boss quite early in the Consulate Docks Mission.

There are no instances where there the only boss with an elite is at the end of a mission.

Also, my post from 13 months ago still applies.

Kerwyn Nasilan

Forge Runner

Join Date: Aug 2007

WHERE DO YOU THINK

W/

12 Apr 2008 at 23:36 - 68

You can cap those skills in the explorable area, /unsigned

Sol Deathgard

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Dec 2005

Shadows of the Dragon

W/N

13 Apr 2008 at 00:05 - 69

kill the boss 1st, then cap, or every elite from a boss in every mish can be capped in an explorable zone elsewhere. There are also things called tomes you could use. /unsigned.

MithranArkanere

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Nov 2006

wikipedia.org/wiki/Vigo

Heraldos de la Llama Oscura [HLO]

E/

13 Apr 2008 at 00:15 - 70

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kerwyn Nasilan

You can cap those skills in the explorable area, /unsigned

NOT all of them.

Specially in Prophecies.

Any elite skills that is not available in an explorable areawithin the same Campaign (without having to go to another campign of EotN) should be available elsewhere in an Explorable.

Tyria has many lost bosses areound Kyrta and Maguuma that could have higher levels or that are level 20 and have no elite.
Thouse could bear the elites that are not in explorables.

Malice Black

Site Legend

Join Date: Oct 2005

13 Apr 2008 at 00:29 - 71

One of the reasons l33t tomes were added.

MithranArkanere

Underworld Spelunker

Join Date: Nov 2006

wikipedia.org/wiki/Vigo

Heraldos de la Llama Oscura [HLO]

E/

13 Apr 2008 at 00:51 - 72

Elite tomes are an extra, a bonus. Not something required to have the skills.

freaky naughty

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2007

Mo/N

13 Apr 2008 at 01:32 - 73

/signed put a 30 second timer at the end of each mission.

wanmoke

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: May 2007

In the land of Do Not Disturb

Wind Riders

R/

13 Apr 2008 at 02:21 - 74

Going to go ahead and /sign this.

Sandstorm comes to mind. If you kill the Hunger last, cutscene starts. Next place you can cap it is much further in Nightfall.

Winterclaw

Wark!!!

Join Date: May 2005

Florida

W/

13 Apr 2008 at 02:27 - 75

You can H/H it or buy a skill tome. Or you can ask some friends to help. So it isn't impossible and there are ways around this little problem.

Still I agree it would be nice if there was a timer.

StormDragonZ

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jan 2008

New York

W/R

13 Apr 2008 at 03:57 - 76

This thread makes me think of only one thing:

The Drought from Rilohn Refuge and [skill]Sandstorm[/skill].

Fear Me!

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Nov 2005

E/R

13 Apr 2008 at 04:39 - 77

Quote:

Originally Posted by MithranArkanere

There are a lot of them, starting from Kenshi Steelhad.

Most of the skills from bosses inside missions can be captured elsewhere. And any of the end boss skills can be captured elsewhere.

So why to fix what is not broken?

/notsigned. I agree with above. All elites can be capped in an explorable.

RiceCream

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Oct 2007

Savannah, GA

[MH]

13 Apr 2008 at 04:52 - 78

Quote:

Originally Posted by StormDragonZ

This thread makes me think of only one thing:

The Drought from Rilohn Refuge and [skill]Sandstorm[/skill].

then again..you can cap that elsewhere

Proff

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jun 2007

13 Apr 2008 at 06:39 - 79

Capping wasn't that bad when I did it :/

Fail less?
/notsigned

RedStar

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2007

_____________________ (\__/) (\__/) (\__/)Help (='.'=)(='.'=)(='.'=)Bunny (")_(")(")_(")(")_(")

[Bomb]

E/

13 Apr 2008 at 06:43 - 80

/notsigned

After this, some of you guys will want the same bosses to appear in the same mission at the same place xD.