Lately I’ve noticed an alarmingly increasing amount of people creating new threads in the High End and Sell forums. This, of course, is more than expected with the increased drop rate and quality of weapons. The problem I’d like to bring to attention is that I’ve found, most predominantly in the High End forum, 25% or more of these threads are one of the following,
1. One of Multiple Thread which is against forum rules
2. A Thread which has been Bumped Multiple times within it’s creation and/or 24 hours within the last bump, which is against forum rules
3. High End Only. As stated in the sticky at the top of the forum High End is for 100k+ items only, I’ve seen this rule broken Multiple times Today alone.
4. High End Only. Threads that contain spamming or non bids, which is against forum rules, should not be allowed whatsoever in the High End forum.
Obviously numbers 1, 2, and 3 can be corrected easily as long as a Mod is on and takes actions against said thread in a timely manner but why are threads like these,
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3049410
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3049411
allowed to be kept on page 1 of the High End forum for over 2 hours(and probably the rest of the night) when it is blatantly apparent that both should be closed and possibly deleted?
As I look now, out of the 20 Threads on page 1 of the High End forum, 8 out of the 20 should be closed for violations of the forum rules, and in addition to those, 2 possibly 3 should not even be in high end, such as the thread here
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s....php?t=3049404
I’ve noticed that these threads have become increasingly abundant and believe action needs to be taken to stop the abuse of the High End forum.
What I propose to do is make it MANDATORY for all persons wishing to post a thread in the High End forum to have one item price checked at 100k+ as the only rule is to have one item in your thread that can be considered at least 100k in value. Three price checks that agreed the item can be 100k+ and at least 1 Respected price checker must agreed with the assessment(StueyG, Malice Black, big papi, Schorched buttocks, The Herbalizer, myself, etc). When price checking the item we would give the price check and any other opinions we deem necessary to express and would then include at the end of our post, “High End,” to signify the item could appropriately be placed in the High End forum.
Obviously it would be a problem for people new to the price check forum and/or guild wars guru, to understand who is considered a “Respected and Knowledgeable Price Checker.” This can be fixed as simply as adding a bit of a price checkers union to the Price Check forum. Simply put, we get a title or are allowed signatures that designate us as such.
Threads that are created in the High End forum must post a link somewhere in the original post that shows at least One of the items contained within the originally posted thread can currently be valued at 100k or more.
I understand that it would take much more time to create a High End thread but the extra time and effort put into High End threads would result in an increased quality of said forum and overall benefit not only of the site and High End forum, but also make it easier for high end buyers and sellers to buy and sell, respectively, additionally making said forum more useful to all.
If it is not believed that the above idea is a logical one then I am convinced that the titles/signatures for respected price checkers should, at the very least, be considered and voted on by the people that price check things on these forums all the time. I myself spend a minimum of 3-4 hours every day giving my opinion on other people’s items so that they understand not only what an item is worth but also why it is worth that amount. This is a free service that myself and others give to the community to increase not only the quality of the content on these forums, but also to improve the game we play in. I know many others will agree with me when I say that I’ve seen far too many people price check an item Significantly lower than what it is really worth and then offer to buy it for the above stated amount. This SHOULD NOT be tolerated even slightly. I’m by no means saying that people other than the respected price checkers can give their own opinion. By all means I’m saying they should, but im proposing a way to check and double check others opinions so we can give the best service possible when price checking items.
I’d appreciate if you would consider this idea to be put into action as soon as the best plan could be worked out so it could run as smoothly and efficiently as possible. If you believe this plan could be put into effect then I know that I, and am also sure the rest of the trading community would have a great amount of input that could positively affect the Trading forums in this regard.
Thanks All for your time and any input you may have.
~The Dirrtiest
Problems with High End/Sell Forums
The Dirrtiest
Inde
Well, I'd like to hear other's input on this, but I see problems right from the start from a moderating point-of-view. If people are not currently following the forums guidelines, then imposing more restrictions and guidelines results in the same. There is no way to restrict people from posting in a particular forum. Our moderators perform (literally) hundreds of moderating actions in the sell forums daily. You talk about threads being there for several hours, but I assure you that there is no way to cover every possible thread.
You'll notice though that our moderators deal with most of the problems and while they can't necessarily catch them within 2 hours... they do catch a good amount within 24 hours.
The bigger question is how to get people to read the sell forum guidelines. To read the stickies at the top. Most violations are from people who have recently signed up, or sign up to post their item. That's why we encourage you to "Report Bad Post" to notify a moderator.
I think the idea is interesting, but I just don't see of a way to enforce this.
You'll notice though that our moderators deal with most of the problems and while they can't necessarily catch them within 2 hours... they do catch a good amount within 24 hours.
The bigger question is how to get people to read the sell forum guidelines. To read the stickies at the top. Most violations are from people who have recently signed up, or sign up to post their item. That's why we encourage you to "Report Bad Post" to notify a moderator.
I think the idea is interesting, but I just don't see of a way to enforce this.
big papi
/signed
i really like this idea heopfully somehow this can be enforced becausing it has become increasingly frustrating when trying to sell items here on the site
even if only some people follow this plan i still think it would benifit the majority
i really like this idea heopfully somehow this can be enforced becausing it has become increasingly frustrating when trying to sell items here on the site
even if only some people follow this plan i still think it would benifit the majority
The Dirrtiest
While I understand that many of the violations in the High End forum result from new posters, half, if not 3/4ths of the violation I viewed last night were by persons who have been using these forums for over a month. I'm just as, if not more, frustrated with people not reading the forum rules. But, to be honest, when I first joined this site, I did not read the forum rules either.
While I also understand a major overhaul of the High End forum rules would be a long process to undergo, what we should be looking at is not what the forum would look like a week from now, but what it would look like 1-2 months from now. Obviously like any rule it would be broken but once set in place it would benefit the High End forum greatly. Much like any other violation of the forum rules, not posting a link to your price check would result in a thread closure. It should go without saying that while we were getting this rule in place a simple reminder would be placed in the forum.
I'd also like to hear what you think about the Price Checking Title. Today a person made over 10 incorrect price checks and was the only person to give his opinion about many items. Understandably everyone gets it wrong by a little some times, he was excessively inaccurate in giving his opinion. On one item alone he was Over 200k off of what the items lowest value could have been.
The Price Check forum is a service given to the community. I ask you why can't we make this service the best it could be?
While I also understand a major overhaul of the High End forum rules would be a long process to undergo, what we should be looking at is not what the forum would look like a week from now, but what it would look like 1-2 months from now. Obviously like any rule it would be broken but once set in place it would benefit the High End forum greatly. Much like any other violation of the forum rules, not posting a link to your price check would result in a thread closure. It should go without saying that while we were getting this rule in place a simple reminder would be placed in the forum.
I'd also like to hear what you think about the Price Checking Title. Today a person made over 10 incorrect price checks and was the only person to give his opinion about many items. Understandably everyone gets it wrong by a little some times, he was excessively inaccurate in giving his opinion. On one item alone he was Over 200k off of what the items lowest value could have been.
The Price Check forum is a service given to the community. I ask you why can't we make this service the best it could be?
Lasareth
There's a large number of issues with forcing a price check on someone's auction, most of which are from our standpoints of enforcing the rules, some of which are among users themselves:
First is the problem of enforcing the rule. The workload by moderators in that forum is already excessive, as hundreds of threads are made per day, and at least 10 threads move up and down each minute on the busy parts of the day. As it is we already have difficulty removing every high end forum that starts at less than 100p by the own creator's starting bid, so having the load of doing both that and checking the associated price check thread will burn out moderators extremely quickly.
Second, the proposed official price checkers cannot be on in a way that covers the forum 24/7. This would cause a significant delay and, resulting from which, a significant amount of complaint that the system doesn't work. Likewise, among the other price checks, someone may just ask a buddy to price check an item at a price so that they have an excuse to put it up.
I'm not saying the sell forum should stay the same. It's definitely full of violators and we should be constantly evaluating it to see what we can do better. I like the idea of having a trusted group of price checkers, provided they remain honest for the entire time that they were to fill the positions. But I'm not sure if it's in the best interest of both the staff and the community to impose the proposition of required price checks onto each high end thread.
Of course, we'd love to see more people using the auction system, as we work out every kink in it. It's a lot better and has much less of a problem with high end or sell bumping
I appreciate the feedback, and do look forward to any type of possible improvements we can make
First is the problem of enforcing the rule. The workload by moderators in that forum is already excessive, as hundreds of threads are made per day, and at least 10 threads move up and down each minute on the busy parts of the day. As it is we already have difficulty removing every high end forum that starts at less than 100p by the own creator's starting bid, so having the load of doing both that and checking the associated price check thread will burn out moderators extremely quickly.
Second, the proposed official price checkers cannot be on in a way that covers the forum 24/7. This would cause a significant delay and, resulting from which, a significant amount of complaint that the system doesn't work. Likewise, among the other price checks, someone may just ask a buddy to price check an item at a price so that they have an excuse to put it up.
I'm not saying the sell forum should stay the same. It's definitely full of violators and we should be constantly evaluating it to see what we can do better. I like the idea of having a trusted group of price checkers, provided they remain honest for the entire time that they were to fill the positions. But I'm not sure if it's in the best interest of both the staff and the community to impose the proposition of required price checks onto each high end thread.
Of course, we'd love to see more people using the auction system, as we work out every kink in it. It's a lot better and has much less of a problem with high end or sell bumping
I appreciate the feedback, and do look forward to any type of possible improvements we can make
Inde
Please, don't take this from the standpoint this idea has been shot down! I want to see if there is something that we can make work. I would love to see the high-end forum as accurate. That if people are willing to fork over that kind of money they can indeed be assured that it's a high end item and worth that amount of money.
Keep the ideas flowing and we will see what we are able to do.
Keep the ideas flowing and we will see what we are able to do.
The Dirrtiest
I understand the concern for "honest" price checking but my above stated idea about price check titles should bring to an end to any worry about dishonestly price checking an item. I don't believe it would be a problem for us to price check honestly as we all already do that.
The problem about asking a buddy to price check an item at 100k+ just so it would be allowed into the high end forum would simply not exist since one of the respected price checkers would have to approve the assessment.
This resolves any kind of user problems the idea would have that i can see at the moment.
I've thought for a few hours on how to address the over worked moderator issue. After thinking it over for awhile I've decieded to step up to the plate and give the only answer I thought of that wasn't flawed from my standpoint. The current mods continue to check as they normally would and I would check to make sure all the links are valid. While I understand you may think its an overwhelming task for me to do alone, the other respected price checkers could assist in making sure items were correctly price checked. If the item did not belong or was not properly price checked then we would be able to move it to sell and/or warn the person that a price check is needed to allow the thread to stay in High End. If a proper link to the price check was not added within a certain time period, then the thread would be closed.
I also understand the need for 24/7 price check coverage since it would now be required. I can honestly say I see close to every thread that is made in the price check forum. Some times I choose not to be the first person to price check an item because I am not 100% sure of its value. This still would seldomly affect whether an item could be considered High End material or not, since an exact price is not needed, as long as it is believed an item can sell for 100k or more. I understand that having price checkers on 24/7 would be close to impossible, but I believe it would be possible to respond within 6 hours of the price check thread being made. Understandably this may cause inconveniences for many of those wishing to create a High End thread, but with the current state of the forum and the OVERWHELMING amount of users choosing to not follow the rules, these inconveniences are brought about not by us, but by their own actions.
I'm sure you'll say, "Why punish everyone for a few people's actions?" We all know the answer to this question and it's not a FEW people, it's OVER HALF of the users making High End threads.
I'd also like to point out that there are two issues up for discussion. One being the question for what to do about the High End thread, and the other being the ability to distinguish who is considered a respected price checker. I believe the first issue can either be implemented or thrown away. While I believe the second is simply something we have to do as inaccurate price checks are getting out of control. The point being, while the first idea would take hours of work and numerous people to function, the second idea is as easy as a title change for five or six individuals.
I refuse to let this thread die before a means is established to designate Respected Price Checkers. If we are going to provide the service to the community then it needs to be, not only a respectable service, but also one that works. For example; If we built cars rather than forums and threads, who would you want building your car? Some one who knows what they are doing and has done so for an extended period of time while gaining the respect of his co-workers, or a twelve year old who couldn't tell you the difference detween a four door sedan and a two door coupe?
The problem about asking a buddy to price check an item at 100k+ just so it would be allowed into the high end forum would simply not exist since one of the respected price checkers would have to approve the assessment.
This resolves any kind of user problems the idea would have that i can see at the moment.
I've thought for a few hours on how to address the over worked moderator issue. After thinking it over for awhile I've decieded to step up to the plate and give the only answer I thought of that wasn't flawed from my standpoint. The current mods continue to check as they normally would and I would check to make sure all the links are valid. While I understand you may think its an overwhelming task for me to do alone, the other respected price checkers could assist in making sure items were correctly price checked. If the item did not belong or was not properly price checked then we would be able to move it to sell and/or warn the person that a price check is needed to allow the thread to stay in High End. If a proper link to the price check was not added within a certain time period, then the thread would be closed.
I also understand the need for 24/7 price check coverage since it would now be required. I can honestly say I see close to every thread that is made in the price check forum. Some times I choose not to be the first person to price check an item because I am not 100% sure of its value. This still would seldomly affect whether an item could be considered High End material or not, since an exact price is not needed, as long as it is believed an item can sell for 100k or more. I understand that having price checkers on 24/7 would be close to impossible, but I believe it would be possible to respond within 6 hours of the price check thread being made. Understandably this may cause inconveniences for many of those wishing to create a High End thread, but with the current state of the forum and the OVERWHELMING amount of users choosing to not follow the rules, these inconveniences are brought about not by us, but by their own actions.
I'm sure you'll say, "Why punish everyone for a few people's actions?" We all know the answer to this question and it's not a FEW people, it's OVER HALF of the users making High End threads.
I'd also like to point out that there are two issues up for discussion. One being the question for what to do about the High End thread, and the other being the ability to distinguish who is considered a respected price checker. I believe the first issue can either be implemented or thrown away. While I believe the second is simply something we have to do as inaccurate price checks are getting out of control. The point being, while the first idea would take hours of work and numerous people to function, the second idea is as easy as a title change for five or six individuals.
I refuse to let this thread die before a means is established to designate Respected Price Checkers. If we are going to provide the service to the community then it needs to be, not only a respectable service, but also one that works. For example; If we built cars rather than forums and threads, who would you want building your car? Some one who knows what they are doing and has done so for an extended period of time while gaining the respect of his co-workers, or a twelve year old who couldn't tell you the difference detween a four door sedan and a two door coupe?
Malice Black
i have to agree with these 2 on this point
alot of the "old timers" have moved on to new things and the current bunch aint up to scratch
the whole "official" price checkers thing is worth a shot imo because alot off ppl have no idea what they are talking about. Im not saying i know everything but i can give all ball park figure to just about any item and 95% of the time it will be correct give or take a few k
perhaps once auctions is up and running 100% with no kinks then i might be best to close sell/high end all together?
alot of the "old timers" have moved on to new things and the current bunch aint up to scratch
the whole "official" price checkers thing is worth a shot imo because alot off ppl have no idea what they are talking about. Im not saying i know everything but i can give all ball park figure to just about any item and 95% of the time it will be correct give or take a few k
perhaps once auctions is up and running 100% with no kinks then i might be best to close sell/high end all together?
StueyG
Is there any way to make it where anytime someone trys to post in sell or high end it brings up the rules first, and they have to click "agree" before posting? And then any violations after clicking agree would result in a warning first, followed after by a two week ban? If they continue to violate that is. Kinda like how it is now but being that they have seen the rules it would be quicker to ban.
The idea of the auction service only sounds good too, but it's quite flawed still as I have won items and never got e-mails or anything (one guy said my IGN wasn't working even though no one else ever had a problem) and ended up with bad feedback because I couldn't contact the buyer/seller in time.
The idea of the auction service only sounds good too, but it's quite flawed still as I have won items and never got e-mails or anything (one guy said my IGN wasn't working even though no one else ever had a problem) and ended up with bad feedback because I couldn't contact the buyer/seller in time.
Mr D J
It's a disaster... people bump ever 20 minutes and get away with it... lots of flamers everywhere... crazy
Racthoh
You could always hit he reported post, giving the reason that the item is below 100k, email is sent to every sell forum moderator and they can move it if someone hasn't already.
All we would have to do is check to see if the reported post is from one of the group that you've suggested (should the admins decide on this "Official PCer" status) and make the necessary changes.
All we would have to do is check to see if the reported post is from one of the group that you've suggested (should the admins decide on this "Official PCer" status) and make the necessary changes.
The Herbalizer
Well I see way too many people violating rules in the high end even single people violating multiple times in one thread.
The wtb thread should be treated the same way as the sale threads but people are bumping every few minutes. To report each individual violation takes forever especially if you open each report in a new window so you dont get confused as to which ones your are reporting.
The price check thread is a nightmare. People are again bumping every few minutes. There are people who price checks are just crazy. One of my favourite ones was someone who price checked an item at 400 ectos (I think about 2.5 million at the time) while it was worth about 400k. Then there are people who price check perfectly decent items worth sometimes small amounts such as 50k to higher amounts such as 200k and say ill give you 10k will you sell to me? There are also people openly insulting people who are trying to help them.
I think maybe have a system similar to user notes. A person who seriously messes up a price check either on purpose or accident through not being aware of the real value and should not be doing it in the first place should get a warning. If they get say 10 warnings in a month they cannot post in the price check forum. At the end of each month it is reset.
This would encourage people to only post if they actually know the value of an item and keep the people who lowball on purpose away. Dont ban them but impose a temporary price check forum ban on them for say a month. Let them still browse the forum but not post. This would give them the opportunity to improve their knowledge and hopefully assist others when they can post.
Yes it is a free service but there should also be standards for it.
The wtb thread should be treated the same way as the sale threads but people are bumping every few minutes. To report each individual violation takes forever especially if you open each report in a new window so you dont get confused as to which ones your are reporting.
The price check thread is a nightmare. People are again bumping every few minutes. There are people who price checks are just crazy. One of my favourite ones was someone who price checked an item at 400 ectos (I think about 2.5 million at the time) while it was worth about 400k. Then there are people who price check perfectly decent items worth sometimes small amounts such as 50k to higher amounts such as 200k and say ill give you 10k will you sell to me? There are also people openly insulting people who are trying to help them.
I think maybe have a system similar to user notes. A person who seriously messes up a price check either on purpose or accident through not being aware of the real value and should not be doing it in the first place should get a warning. If they get say 10 warnings in a month they cannot post in the price check forum. At the end of each month it is reset.
This would encourage people to only post if they actually know the value of an item and keep the people who lowball on purpose away. Dont ban them but impose a temporary price check forum ban on them for say a month. Let them still browse the forum but not post. This would give them the opportunity to improve their knowledge and hopefully assist others when they can post.
Yes it is a free service but there should also be standards for it.
milan
The most obvious solution would be to remove the high end and sell forums, instead directing people to the Auction system that took time and effort to create.
Another option to prevent self bumping within the 24 hours would be a flood control placed on all threads created by user in those two forums.
Another option to prevent self bumping within the 24 hours would be a flood control placed on all threads created by user in those two forums.
The Herbalizer
Quote:
Originally Posted by milan
The most obvious solution would be to remove the high end and sell forums, instead directing people to the Auction system that took time and effort to create.
Another option to prevent self bumping within the 24 hours would be a flood control placed on all threads created by user in those two forums. the problem with auctions is there are tons of fake bidders. i like high end as when doing trades which run into the hundreds of k or millions you can say i want your ign to see what you have bid in-game if not your bid does not count. with auctions you cant check out the bids in-game and as a result perfectly decent auctions are hijacked. an example, in high a shield has bids up to 4.5 million but when the person went to get the gold they would not pay. it turns out the only valid bid was 1.5 million. the seller was able to check each bid out and use the highest one. but in auctions you cannot check who has bid or if they have the gold to pay.
Another option to prevent self bumping within the 24 hours would be a flood control placed on all threads created by user in those two forums. the problem with auctions is there are tons of fake bidders. i like high end as when doing trades which run into the hundreds of k or millions you can say i want your ign to see what you have bid in-game if not your bid does not count. with auctions you cant check out the bids in-game and as a result perfectly decent auctions are hijacked. an example, in high a shield has bids up to 4.5 million but when the person went to get the gold they would not pay. it turns out the only valid bid was 1.5 million. the seller was able to check each bid out and use the highest one. but in auctions you cannot check who has bid or if they have the gold to pay.
Inde
K, addressing just a few ideas right now. No there is no way to have a user for just one forum section have to click on an agreement before they read. When you sign up for the forums there is an agreement but I can't implement another one for just a particular section.
Second, there's no way to restrict someone in just 2 sub-forums from posting only once every 24 hours. This would affect everyone and all people would only be able to post once every 24 hours regardless of the forum they are in. (This has been suggested by staff before as well.)
Please remember, any suggestions such as these affect the 'entire' forum. There's no way to limit this to only 2 particular forums. In this we are bound by the constraints of the vBulletin system.
Strangely I also just posted something similar to this in the staff forums, but I can't close down any forums right now to direct people to the auction system. This is a system that is currently having problems that we are working to correct but will take some time. We are dealing with email and loads issues over there and while I encourage very very patient people to continue using and to sign up for the auction system, until we can bring this system as close to a 100% as possible closing any forum to direct people there just can't happen.
Second, there's no way to restrict someone in just 2 sub-forums from posting only once every 24 hours. This would affect everyone and all people would only be able to post once every 24 hours regardless of the forum they are in. (This has been suggested by staff before as well.)
Please remember, any suggestions such as these affect the 'entire' forum. There's no way to limit this to only 2 particular forums. In this we are bound by the constraints of the vBulletin system.
Strangely I also just posted something similar to this in the staff forums, but I can't close down any forums right now to direct people to the auction system. This is a system that is currently having problems that we are working to correct but will take some time. We are dealing with email and loads issues over there and while I encourage very very patient people to continue using and to sign up for the auction system, until we can bring this system as close to a 100% as possible closing any forum to direct people there just can't happen.
Mr D J
Do you actually think people read agreements... nah... they push "I accept" even if it says by agreeing to this you will have to jump off the 31st floor...
The Dirrtiest
I more than agreed with closing the Sell forum when the auctions system is up and running, I am strongly against closing the High End forum. Certain users almost always have a High End thread up and it's become a habit to search around and see what new things they have up for sale. At the moment, the High End thread is just a bit messy and needs some cleaning up. I believe that if we put in the time and effort to do so, it will still be a very useful tool for buying and selling high end items.
I'd like to say that i feel the 24 hour bump rule in the price check forum should be changed. I price check a great deal and have found that if people bump their threads once every 24 hours, many of us wouldn't even see the thread for a couple of days. 4 or 6 hours would be a better suggestion in my opinion. Threads are almost never closed in the Price Check forum, so rather then continue to allow the rules to be broken and do nothing about it, change the rules for that particular forum so that it best fits the community.
Five respected Price Checkers have agreed with me on the titles idea and I agreed with Malice, thats its at least worth a shot. If, for some reason, it doesn't work out then they can be taken away just as easily as they were given.
For this idea i propose the following:
1. A Leader, or Official PC'ing Guru, if you will..
2. Respeced PC'ers, 5 or 6 to be determined at the time of making these
3. A title for people who we could look to if it was determined we would need to move someone up to RPCer status
Also I'd like to propose a second title to be added below the above stated title. A title that would show what field each RPCer specialized in. I can price check close to any axe, Herb can put a tag on almost any shield, and Malice can price check just about anything.
I'd like to say that i feel the 24 hour bump rule in the price check forum should be changed. I price check a great deal and have found that if people bump their threads once every 24 hours, many of us wouldn't even see the thread for a couple of days. 4 or 6 hours would be a better suggestion in my opinion. Threads are almost never closed in the Price Check forum, so rather then continue to allow the rules to be broken and do nothing about it, change the rules for that particular forum so that it best fits the community.
Five respected Price Checkers have agreed with me on the titles idea and I agreed with Malice, thats its at least worth a shot. If, for some reason, it doesn't work out then they can be taken away just as easily as they were given.
For this idea i propose the following:
1. A Leader, or Official PC'ing Guru, if you will..
2. Respeced PC'ers, 5 or 6 to be determined at the time of making these
3. A title for people who we could look to if it was determined we would need to move someone up to RPCer status
Also I'd like to propose a second title to be added below the above stated title. A title that would show what field each RPCer specialized in. I can price check close to any axe, Herb can put a tag on almost any shield, and Malice can price check just about anything.
The Herbalizer
oo forgot to add the idea of titles is excellent. i cannot count the amount of times someone who is well respected having someone turn around and say, "and now for some real price checks please", or "you clearly dont know what you are talking about".
big papi
i also agree on the price check title, sounds like a great idea
there has been way to many terrible price checks out there lately
just the other day some sold a nice zodiac axe for 200k under its actual value because of an incorrect price check
with titles people will know which people to look for and what opions they can base the price of their weapon on. its a win win situation for everybody.
please at least give it a shot and see how it works out
there has been way to many terrible price checks out there lately
just the other day some sold a nice zodiac axe for 200k under its actual value because of an incorrect price check
with titles people will know which people to look for and what opions they can base the price of their weapon on. its a win win situation for everybody.
please at least give it a shot and see how it works out
Stockholm
Price check 100K+ by someone with a price check titel and the thread can be moved to High End by said price checker then the person posting can edit the thread to sell if thats what he/she wants to do.
Inde
EDIT: LOL, wrong thread I posted in.
StueyG
I'm for the price check titles too, I'd be glad to help in any way I can also.
As for the auction only thing I'm not really down with it right now as there are stilll alot of quirks about it. My bro has won two items recently and the sellers sold the items to someone else, then left negative feedback when he left negative about them, even though they deserved it. Of course also fake bidders, and all kinds of other problems I've had.
As for the auction only thing I'm not really down with it right now as there are stilll alot of quirks about it. My bro has won two items recently and the sellers sold the items to someone else, then left negative feedback when he left negative about them, even though they deserved it. Of course also fake bidders, and all kinds of other problems I've had.
demon dantes
just 2 days ago i broke a rule lol i bumped earlly but i only did it because there was 1 hour left in the sale. I would have closed the post as soon as it was up. Imediatlly after bumping my post it was closed. Was this some sort of dumb luck that i just happend to catch a admin reading that spefic area and seeing it was an earlly bump? Maybe or maybe my post was reported? All i know is i do beleive the admins are trying there best at fixing the problem. I have not deliberatlly tried to break the rules in a disrespectfull manner. I have also gave admins a bad time about it because it just seems like dumb luck to me. All i know is i can see the admins doing there work maybe other post s and other people do not see it.
I would agree on the fact that i do see alot of people not bidding on a post though. I mean sometimes i have seen some crazy prices for thing like 100k and 50 ecto for a req 11 oni daggers 15 in stance. Now this you just have to laugh at or explain to the OP that they might want to get a price check. The ones i am talking to are the ones were you have 3 or 4 people who have already posted bids and some random guy post s some junk. I think that a tally of this should be kept record and after so many you get banned for a period of time. Just a thought do not know if it could be done or not.
I would agree on the fact that i do see alot of people not bidding on a post though. I mean sometimes i have seen some crazy prices for thing like 100k and 50 ecto for a req 11 oni daggers 15 in stance. Now this you just have to laugh at or explain to the OP that they might want to get a price check. The ones i am talking to are the ones were you have 3 or 4 people who have already posted bids and some random guy post s some junk. I think that a tally of this should be kept record and after so many you get banned for a period of time. Just a thought do not know if it could be done or not.
milias
/signed
Count me in!
Count me in!
Arya Nibelrund
Quote:
Originally Posted by demon dantes
just 2 days ago i broke a rule lol i bumped earlly but i only did it because there was 1 hour left in the sale. I would have closed the post as soon as it was up. Imediatlly after bumping my post it was closed. Was this some sort of dumb luck that i just happend to catch a admin reading that spefic area and seeing it was an earlly bump? Maybe or maybe my post was reported? All i know is i do beleive the admins are trying there best at fixing the problem. I have not deliberatlly tried to break the rules in a disrespectfull manner. I have also gave admins a bad time about it because it just seems like dumb luck to me. All i know is i can see the admins doing there work maybe other post s and other people do not see it.
I would agree on the fact that i do see alot of people not bidding on a post though. I mean sometimes i have seen some crazy prices for thing like 100k and 50 ecto for a req 11 oni daggers 15 in stance. Now this you just have to laugh at or explain to the OP that they might want to get a price check. The ones i am talking to are the ones were you have 3 or 4 people who have already posted bids and some random guy post s some junk. I think that a tally of this should be kept record and after so many you get banned for a period of time. Just a thought do not know if it could be done or not. Well I guess you can blame it on the bad luck if I was looking at your thread right then
Still, rules are rules and every violation that I see gets its reward don't worry. Of course it's not possible to check all the threads, we do our best and believe, it's a LOT of time we spend here.
About nonbids, you prob want to see what is happening lately to non-bidders, there's an explanatory sticky thread on Sell section added by a Mod today.
I would agree on the fact that i do see alot of people not bidding on a post though. I mean sometimes i have seen some crazy prices for thing like 100k and 50 ecto for a req 11 oni daggers 15 in stance. Now this you just have to laugh at or explain to the OP that they might want to get a price check. The ones i am talking to are the ones were you have 3 or 4 people who have already posted bids and some random guy post s some junk. I think that a tally of this should be kept record and after so many you get banned for a period of time. Just a thought do not know if it could be done or not. Well I guess you can blame it on the bad luck if I was looking at your thread right then
Still, rules are rules and every violation that I see gets its reward don't worry. Of course it's not possible to check all the threads, we do our best and believe, it's a LOT of time we spend here.
About nonbids, you prob want to see what is happening lately to non-bidders, there's an explanatory sticky thread on Sell section added by a Mod today.
milias
Arya can't get title anymore, cos he's a mod now, muahahahahaha...huh?
Arya Nibelrund
Lol I feel kinda left out Anyway, I'm not really aware of prices lately, I have no time for it. My last PC is a few days old.
Anyway, I'm not really aware of prices lately, I have no time for it. My last PC is a few days old.
Zui
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inde
The bigger question is how to get people to read the sell forum guidelines. To read the stickies at the top. Most violations are from people who have recently signed up, or sign up to post their item. That's why we encourage you to "Report Bad Post" to notify a moderator.
I know there are several fourms out there that have a way to make certain threads in a topic "must read" before posting. Perhaps somthing simmilar could be implimented at guru. It wouldn't stop people from simply opening the thread and then posting without reading, but it would be safe to assume more people would read it, and that would mean less moderating work.
S!carius
I like the idea of switching to using the auction system. The system is well organised and it is easy to find exactly what you want (well, skin atleast). The only problem I have with that is that the auction system is SLOW. It takes ages to load pages. If that problem could be fixed, then that auction system would be good to completely swich to.
The Herbalizer
reasons i hate auction system: -
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=129088/
this item has no pic and is a very very rare sword. person has no trade history either and owner has made some suspicious bids. therefore most probably fake. the highest bid 16 million would involve well over 2000 ectos. the trade window cannot hold that.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=124715/
this item i doubt is not even worth 2 million. the person withthe c/o is the owner of the 15>50 req 8 crystalline sword too...
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=116931/
again not worth what person with no feedback has bid
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=127050/
doubt this is worth that c/o is
conclusion from just the highest bids section on auctions i have found many suspicious auctions. maybe some are real bids but if so they are paying way way more than the items are even worth. if i ever decide to sell anything i own it will not ever be on auctions due to the large number of suspicious/fake bids.
low end and individual sales are okay on there. high end trades where little kids and noobs decide to put fake bids in are a waste of time. an example chaos theory had some perfect magmas shields and a 15 -5 dwarven he had to relist them many times on auctions each time getting large numbers of bids and massive sums of gold. all turned out to be fake so he sold on high end. the bids on high end were half in some cases what they were on auctions.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=129088/
this item has no pic and is a very very rare sword. person has no trade history either and owner has made some suspicious bids. therefore most probably fake. the highest bid 16 million would involve well over 2000 ectos. the trade window cannot hold that.
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=124715/
this item i doubt is not even worth 2 million. the person withthe c/o is the owner of the 15>50 req 8 crystalline sword too...
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=116931/
again not worth what person with no feedback has bid
http://www.guildwarsguru.com/auction...php/id=127050/
doubt this is worth that c/o is
conclusion from just the highest bids section on auctions i have found many suspicious auctions. maybe some are real bids but if so they are paying way way more than the items are even worth. if i ever decide to sell anything i own it will not ever be on auctions due to the large number of suspicious/fake bids.
low end and individual sales are okay on there. high end trades where little kids and noobs decide to put fake bids in are a waste of time. an example chaos theory had some perfect magmas shields and a 15 -5 dwarven he had to relist them many times on auctions each time getting large numbers of bids and massive sums of gold. all turned out to be fake so he sold on high end. the bids on high end were half in some cases what they were on auctions.
milias
Agreed with The Herbalizer. An auction system does have its advantages, but also many pitfalls. The biggest one I think is the matter of trust and honesty. Without verifiable identities/securities put in place like EBay, it is easily abused, and its effectiveness depends largely on the honesty of people who use it.
Inde
We are working toward identifying buyers, a verification system. So we do have things in the works. Biggest goal right now is to stop the errors and make it run more smoothly. But we do have all this in mind
milias
So umm...when do we get titles?
:P
:P
Peachie
Sorta nowish by the looks of things 
milias
Woot! Thank you thank you :-)
The Herbalizer
thank you
Hemophiliac
Great idea adding the titles to price check guru's, when I first came to these forums I was always unsure who to trust on price checks when viewing them. But after a while you got to know the good price checkers, now the titles will make it easier for all to know when a good price check has been done.
Also would like to add a big thank you for cracking down on non-conforming sales/bump postings. With the new ban rules, I would just add what the punishments are for 1st, 2nd, 3rd offenses etc... so the masses will know. It appears a 1st offense is a 24 hour ban as I wanted to PM a guy about an item but he got banned for bumping under 24 hours. After he served 24 hours of banning time he is now active again. Not sure if that is standard or not but I think letting people know how long the ban is would be a good thing.
Also would like to add a big thank you for cracking down on non-conforming sales/bump postings. With the new ban rules, I would just add what the punishments are for 1st, 2nd, 3rd offenses etc... so the masses will know. It appears a 1st offense is a 24 hour ban as I wanted to PM a guy about an item but he got banned for bumping under 24 hours. After he served 24 hours of banning time he is now active again. Not sure if that is standard or not but I think letting people know how long the ban is would be a good thing.
Dralspire
I addressed the new Mini*Bans™ in more detail in this post.
Malice Black
nevermind
Captain Krompdown
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dirrtiest
I'd also like to hear what you think about the Price Checking Title. Today a person made over 10 incorrect price checks and was the only person to give his opinion about many items. Understandably everyone gets it wrong by a little some times, he was excessively inaccurate in giving his opinion. On one item alone he was Over 200k off of what the items lowest value could have been. I'd just like to say that some of the worst PCs I've seen have been given by price-checking "gurus." People with that title have the power to set market prices and determine people's gaming experiences. I don't see why the titles are used in the first place. It only opens the door for exploitation, mistakes, and lack of discussion/argument.
I think the title should be gotten rid of and that certain "gurus" should be forced to reimburse the helpless guru users who they've screwed over.
NOTE: I haven't been screwed over myself because I keep an eye on the kinds of things that I sell. I just see too many people selling too many good items for half (or a third) of the price they should. There are certain "gurus" whose PC's I automatically double (at least). I've had several conversations in-game with people who feel likewise. Some have been so angered by the disservice of "gurus" that they have attempted to ignore them...which, of course, Guru won't let them do.
I think it's irresponsible of the administrators to distribute power to those who are not equipped to use it productively.
At the same time, there are "gurus" who I consider extremely good and trustworthy. I think there should be some kind of review process through which "gurus" are evaluated. I'm not sure how it could work because the PCs that "gurus" give go such a long way towards determining prices in most people's minds. Most people are happy to get what a "guru" says they should get because they think it's the right price because that's what a "guru" said. If "gurus" can't be evaluated, then they should be gotten rid of. I prefer dialogue to domination.