New Class Idea: Strategist

um... we are discussing the strategist here, not looking at your suggestion, which imo is quite different, and has its own threads, and you try to hijack other threads with it too. i dont mean to offend, but i'd like to continue to discuss the original proposed profession. thanks.

Edit: concisely: your post has no relevance to the thread, and doesn't add to it since they are totally dissimilar

The strategist is an intriguing idea. It could use a different name, though - wouldn't it be rather odd to have a "strategist" class, but the "tactics" attribute in a different class?

Regarding the "duelist" aspect of the class, while I agree with the goal of making a caster-primary with melee abilities that's more effective than */w's currently are, I'm not sure this is the way to do it. There should remain some reason to take warrior as a secondary. I also think that any melee attribute should have at least a few adrenal skills, or else skills like Soothing Images would be devalued.

Adding an extra pip of energy regen at a certain attribute level strikes me as a bad idea. All that's going to do is ensure that every single primary strategist has at least that level, and I think it's better to encourage variety. And many of the specific skill suggestions are terribly overpowered, but that's been addressed by several people already...

Gripes aside, this is probably the best new-class idea I've heard yet. While there's a bit of overlap with warrior in certain ways, and necromancer in certain other ways (see: orders), it does go into as-yet largely uncovered ground in terms of skills, which is a lot more than can be said of the perennial suggestions like rogues or shapeshifters. And military-officer-themed armor sets would be totally cool.

WE WANT TO USE 2 SWORDS (axes) AT THE SAME TIME !!!

Your honor, I propose that everything banishd said be ignored and stricken from the record. Exhibit A, see above. Exhibit B, see any post from Anet about their plans to add new classes. Nothing further.

Its has some potential, if it can be balanced...

As for the ambush skill, make the invisibility last 20-60 seconds and end prematurely if the invisible player attacks or casts a spell - the invisible player also moves with a 90% speed penalty.

The main use would be that an invisible spellcaster could set off one spell without getting interrupted before becoming visible - and defenders will be able to attack attacking groups from behind if they time it well.

ii think 20-60 s is still too long, 60 seconds to run out of battle zone =D

90 % for 10-20 seconds sound good, maybe even add immun to healing or 25% heal points from ally, still take damage from aoe.

Highly overpowered in some areas, but all in all I like it.

Not bad but all in all its way to complicated with all the little details and everyone will want to use it as it seems pretty powerful

Did I ever imply in my post that I was trying to hijack the thread? Sorry if I did, but it relates to the discussion of this 'strategist' in that many are discussing the idea of a melee character but based more around casting.

If I thought it had no relevance to the thread I wouldn't have posted it. I don't know why you think the two are totally dissimilar because they are both blatantly melee-caster based, and have skills similarities. I wasn't trying to demote this new idea, in fact I think this new idea is much better as the creator has thought through skills entirely and developed better attributes than I thought of.

So would I, in fact I was trying to join in the discussion by posting on this thread. Thanks.
I saw that when I entered the thread. I read through this new profession idea and found it thoroughly interesting and realised it was much better than mine. Looking at the two, I believe they are not different. They are similar, but have their differences, the new one being the better. I didn't post in this thread to try to make everyone look at my idea - I did that on another thread because no-one had replied when I posted it on another thread.

Thanks for the comments, but they weren't justified.

btw if you want to not get such a reply as that don't make comments on forums about people 'hijacking threads' and that 'the post had no relevance to the thread at all'.

i thought of an interesting add on...if your primary strategist dies...the party will suffer a morale loss :P

Symeon, discussing a type of class is irrelevant in a topic already devoted to one class. Your fighter/caster idea might fit the generalities of Rieselle's idea, but it's wholly different because of it's attributes and proposed skill set. If you want serious consideration, make your own topic - if you don't get replies, ask yourself why.

On the original subject - echoing the responses of some of the people before me, I think it would be great to incorporate environmental effects beyond walls and bow range/terrain. Controlling the field of battle would be a great way to add some more complexity to PvP.

Nah don't worry my idea isn't so good

Twas just something that went into my head through one ear but I really couldn't think of how to develop it and it came out the other

Btw I like this class idea a lot, especially some of the skill ideas

Yes, in a different way than the ranger spirits already change the field of battle. Although at the same time it should be somewhat like those - maybe constructs or something. You could have a skill like:

Circle of death - Create a lvl 1...12 construct. No creature coming within range of the construct can leave this area until the contruct is destroyed. The construct breaks down after 10...120 seconds.


It would be like laying a trap to prevent or at least delay escape.

This is an interesting suggestion, and although many (all really) of the skills are far too powerful to be implemented, its a pretty creative idea. Just think about a trapper team with one of these as secondary mesmer using mimicked glyph of renewals to keep "prep the battlefield" up as long as he had energy (of course at +10 regen from a battery nec, with +30/-2 energy wand/focus). You could lay down like 50 traps in a matter of a few seconds...

SaintGreg, that situation would be unlikely, because the glyphs affect spells, and i think that whatever skills the strategist uses would be a new type of skill, or something like a shout... although i'm not sure i fully understand what you mean.

Kng Symeon, I was just reading through the forums prior to posting the other day, and noticed your class idea in more than one other forum. i didn't think you need to post it around that much when it doesnt seem to have had much positive feedback. i was resurrecting this thread, and didnt want to see the original idea forgotten so we could discuss your idea..

NatalieD, I agree about the name "Strategist"... it overlaps with the meaning of "tactics" too much, and when you think about it.. every player of GW could be termed a strategist, all they need is strategy! as for the "duelist" aspect.. i can see what you mean... we don't want to devalue or duplicate any existing skills/attribute lines. for that reason i thought the strategist could specialise in "if... then.." rather than pure damage, much like you might compare a mesmer to an elementalist.

lyra_song... i was thinking strategists could affect morale too. say your team is going down the drain, with DP crazily high and it looks like death is your only choice (this is usually in PvE however may be useful in PvP), maybe a handy strategist could relive the party for a little while.

i had another thought today, which is quite weird since i rarely think about GW in everyday life... perhaps there can be a skill that is continuous, meaning that while you are casting it, and it has no cast time (go figure - a stance with undefined duration), your party or nearby allies will benefit. i'm thinking something like.. battle meditation... or trance. i don't know if this would be exciting or even possible given the system... the idea of a trance is to be focused on one thing. maybe stances that increase your potency over time?

i don't know, but to utilise time and space would be the strategist's specialisation. alot of other skills rely on position to work - AoE etc - why not skills that affect positions too? the closest thing at the moment is Necrotic Traversal / the other necro one, similar, and that is very limited.

In terms of appropriateness to the Guild Wars atmosphere, I think every army would have a few of these.. And for the roleplaying aspect, a secondary Strat would be what you'd call a "charismatic" character.

pyrohex & nighteye... what about skills that slow down arrows in the vicinity? things like that..

oh, and btw, we have concluded that invisibility just isn't going to happen.

anyways, the thoughts have dwindled, thus post ending

1. By forum you meant thread.
2. I posted it on three threads, the first was on one that was already kinda dead so no-one listened, second was on another thread about professions which seemed to be more posted on so I hoped to get more feedback, third was on a thread where I was invited to re-post it there, so I did so while mentioning I had posted it on another thread. People who post ideas generally are looking for feedback, and if they don't get any posts at all, neither negative or positive, then theyre gonna assume the thread is dead so no-one posted on it.
3. On the threads I posted it on I got some positive feedback so I was happy.
4. Here's this thread, about a similar idea of a melee-caster profession. So I, like most people who go on the forums, make a post to contribute to the discussion, concluding that a lot of people would like to see a new melee profession that is based more around casting. You interpreted, somehow, that I was trying to hijack the thread.
5. I didn't want anyone to discuss my idea.
6. I don't see how you were resurrecting the thread since I hadn't done anything to damage it.
7. I really like Rieselle's idea
8. When you've been on the forums a bit you get to know that people who post ideas and get no feedback will often repost it, maybe in the same manner or in a different one.
9. I don't see what your problem is
10. Only thing I agree on with you is lets continue discussing Rieselle's idea

Note: Feel free to continue to argue at me aeronox but you're just further diverting away from the idea of this thread.

this is my last mention about it, Symeon.. and since only a small portion of my last post was directed at you, i dont relaly think i'm pursuing the problem that you think i have with you. i dont care. i was just a little bit annoyed that i'd brought this thread out of the attic, and the first response is of a class i'd seen you post elsewhere, it made me feel sad that perhaps this thread would be diverted from the original post, thus the "hijack" potential. i was in no way meaning to be unnecesarrily narky, just trying to keep a bit of order. class suggestion threads so often go off track! and mainly because of people (and not pointing at you specifically) like to promote their ideas which may or may not be good, many many times. i read these forums a helluvalot.

i am not happy that i posted off-topic... although sadly i have nothing further to add to my previous post, and no new discussion has been made.

now lets hold hands and be friends. want a cookie?

Umm...
Now a fair comment from me: shhh sonny jim, and let this thread continue
dunno whether it will/wont cos of your starting of an off-topic issue

This should be a branch of warrior. All new class ideas should just be branches of already made classes. Like fencer, brawler, strategist as branches of warrior.

This should be a branch of warrior. All new class ideas should just be branches of already made classes. Like fencer, brawler, strategist as branches of warrior.

Like a maintained enchantment of a sort, but while it's up, you're basically a sitting duck; you can't move or attack. I'm not sure how the details would work out, or exactly what it would be called, but you could have one for increased damage, increased armor, an extra pip of energy regen, maybe an elite with increased damage and armor. It's something that would be hard to balance though; making it good enough to be useful, but not powerful enough to make an entire build around.


I was thinking a skill that would arrange your party with the warriors in front and the casters in back, but i don't think i like the idea of moving your party around against their will, since they may have a reason to be up front (touch skills). Even a skill that moves allies with <50% hp wouldn't work, maybe it's a mesmer with illusion of weakness, or a necro trying to plague tough off some poison. Likewise, I don't like the idea of being able to pull another team out of position.

The best I could think of would be skills that depend on a certain party position, like the one that would let an ally benefit from your shield, or possibly a skill that increases the area of effect on AoE spells. This really is an interesting class idea, though. Creates a lot of discussion.

Wow, my thread has been resurrected from the depths and is generating some nice discussion, I'm glad. Nothing further to add at this time :P I'll think about it some more now that there's been some input

i love this
way to think outside of the box!

you say he has 2 pips of energy regen, then you say he has 3 pips, then he gains another pip from x primary attribute.

...

so which is it?

I had a suggestion basically along the same lines before the tactics line was put together--this was before we had full skill list and I was in test, old Guild Hall forum before they switched servers. Basically I called it a "Soldier", but it was really a utility melee class. I gave it a Tactics line, a sword line (I always though there should be multiple sword lines) and a Spear line. Basically it would be heavy on crowd control and area control instead of pure damage, with some strong group effecting shouts (Charge, Shields up type thing). Smash a warrior range, monk type support and ranger style energy management/play style together and you have my Soldier. A "white" character since GW seems to have a MTG approach to skill design.

Basically your profession suggestion and mine (and many other along this line between) are addressing the need/desire for more melee options for utility type players. Assassins are really the opposite of the my soldier, which is great but not addressing the same thing. Considering Anet will want another melee class given their popularity and the fact that top suggestions are currently 2 for 2 (Rogue/ninjas and Shamans have seen extraordinary attention in theses types of threads), I'm guessing that some sort of utility melee is already in the works.

I love this idea The Strategist will definitely add another dimension to the game, and give shouts more playability; much like the Ritualist will breath new life into spirits (pun intended).

I'm not gonna bother with balancing issues (that should be left to the pros); I think each skill can be balanced to work within the game, even the stealth skills.

I'm more interested in counters. The Strategist is basically built around shouts, and so far there is no real counter to shouts IIRC.

To do that, each class would have to have new skills to counter the strategist. I'd like to try my hand at a few since I'm enjoying this concept so much

A suggestion:

Depending on the area of effect; shouts with larger AOF should have a casting period, think of it as drawing your breath before you let out a really loud shout. Shouts like "charge!" that only have a small area of affect are "instant cast". This will give an opportunity for shouts to be interrupted…

First: The Conditions:

Croak (condition): shouts radius is reduced by X%; when a player has "croak" on him, the AOF of his shouts is reduced.

Tongue Twisted (condition): Shout has random effect (it can activate certain emotes to all party members like dance, beg, etc). When a player has "Tongue Twisted" on him, his shouts become jumbled; so e.g. rather than shout "Hold!" he'll shout "beg!" and all players will do the /beg emote. It'll disable the shouter, plus will have a funny effect…

And now, the Skills

Mesmer:

Mumble:
Domination Magic: Hex Spell: For X seconds target foe shouts are disabled, when ends enemy will suffer from croak (condition)

Tongue Twist:
Inspiration Magic: Hex Spell: target foe is interrupted if shouting (assuming certain shouts have a cast period), and all foes adjacent to target become tongue twisted for X seconds (condition)


Backfire (moditication of old skill):
... Shouts give bonus to enemy, and adverse effects on allies. e.g. "Fear Me!" will cause allies to lose energy instead of enemy; "Watch yourself!" will cause enemies to gain armor boost...

Elementalist:

Overwhelming Winds:
Air Magic: Skill (not spell): Disable the shouts of all enemies in area for 3 seconds, causes exhaustion (chance to fail with 4 air magic or less). Enemy can still cast shout, but without any effect, and will lose energy (like "spellbreaker")

Ranger:

Bitter Arrow:
Non-Linked: Bow Skill: If foe is shouting, foe is interrupted, and suffers from croak for X seconds

Deafening Roar:
Beast mastery: Pet Shout: Pet roars, disabling all adjacent foes' shouts for X seconds

Monk:

Tongues:
Smite Magic: Hex Spell: Target foe becomes tongue twisted for X seconds, when ends target foe suffers from croak for X seconds

Necromancer:

Demonic Whispers:
Blood Magic: Hex Spell: Sacrifice X life. Target Foe is possessed with Demon (insert really obscure demon name here), for X seconds random shout is activated; foes within shout AOF suffer from X dark damage each time target foe shouts

Warrior:

Silence!
Unlinked Shout: interrupt shouts of all adjecent foes

Sword Slap
Swordsmanship: Attack: Smack the foe with the flat of your blade, causing no damage. If foe is shouting, foe is interrupted and shout is disabled for X seconds

All in all its an interesting class hehe; and I had fun coming up with these counters

This is exactly like Rise Of Nations with commanders! You have been playing too much RTS.