Hate thy mesmer

Charcoal Ann

Charcoal Ann

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

In a World of BADGERS!

Eternal Flame Brotherhood

a mesmer is almost a must on the missions during and after the desert (with all those bosses).

my newest char is a mesmer. when i seared i was teamed with a ranger and Orion and Stefan. the other side had an ele and a fighter (both higher lvl than me or my team mate) as well as Alesia and Orion.
i has full on shut down. the i cast backfire and empathy on those who needed it and let them kill themselves. our team, no healer won that 9-0. i was ignored and so they basically had no casters and the warriors self destructed. easy.

as all my other chars i am always happy to see any class in my team. i am just as happy to see a mesmer as i am to see an ele.

long live them Mesmer!!

Maiyn

Maiyn

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: May 2005

Canada

I Excentrix I [PuNK]

Well, they get hated on from the opposing teams because they are just so damn effective. They shutdown so much.. they're just crazy to be honest. I fear them when I see em in pvp (I am a caster, but then again anything is vulnerable to a mesmer)

I think some people are just dumb jerks and don't talk at all. I have the same thing occur when I"m in a party with another monk and we're trying to figure out what elites to bring. You ask them numerous times but they just don't answer..

Dunno why, just shy or whatever I suppose.

I personally love mesmers. If I'm playing Pve, I MUST have one in my party. Pvp I normally have been playing a spiker lately so no need for a mes, but if I was in just any team. I'd definitely want one.

00039

00039

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Jun 2005

Me Want Snuu[Snuu]

D/W

I loathe fighting mesmers. When I encounter one they always become my first target since they cause the most trouble out of everything.

Kalysha Katana

Kalysha Katana

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Aug 2005

Me/Mo

All this angst/ignorance etc against Mesmers is easily solved. And something that ArenaNet should have done from day one.....that is, put in a combat log. Problem solved. Everyone knows then who is doing what damage

My first (main) character in this game was Mesmer. I still play her even after trying all the other professions out. Still find Mesmer the most challenging of all. But very rewarding. I very rarely group or PvP these days simply because of the ignorance show to the class...

At the end of the day, those that don't understand how valuable a Mesmer can be in battle or in a mission, then it's their loss.

Nightwish

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2005

Same here. My mesmer gets targeted "before" monks in most matches. The warriors will chase me until either their team loses or mine.

As for defenses, mesmers do not have alot to back up on. Many times I entered a battle, I will get all these:

1. Spammed with hexes (even with hex breaker)
2. Ganged upon by warriors
3. Zapped by eles

The amount of attention given by the enemy team is almost rediculous.
Unless I bring all types of defenses, I'll mostly likely the 1st one to go down.

Numa Pompilius

Numa Pompilius

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

At an Insit.. Intis... a house.

Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF]

W/Me

Like I said: a class that both is annoying and easy to kill = mesmers get a lot of TLC from the enemy.
I find mesmer the most fun class to play, it's just so rewarding to royally screw up some poor caster on the opposing team in various inventive ways, but in random arena, where there's usually no monk on the team and the other people don't see it as their job to keep you alive, mesmers tend to die a lot. And quickly.

Still, we actually won a couple of matches because the other three on my team could gang up on one enemy while the three other enemies were chasing me around the map, Benny Hill style.

2_fingers

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2005

Mo/W

People underappreciate mesmers because they arent tat many of them. Thinking about the pvp arena, pre patch, nature renewal and ur hexes have a big problem being casted.

When i was a mesmer, i couldnt get into a party unless i told them i'd play my secondary(monk) more than my mesmer. I had to sell out my mesmer because of the snobbish attitudes of ppl. I'm generalizing here but in pve, for a party, there must always be 2 monks, 2 warriors, 2 elementals perhaps another ranger or warrior. Mesmers don't even figure into the equation.

Strangely though, many of the missions (think asscension) become eazy with a mesmer. Someone who can disable a monk boss (Thirsty river) Interupt Glint etc.

When i pvp, a mesmer is welcome - provided it fits into the general composition i;m interested in. Personally though, when i play a mesmer, i have more trouble entering a pve mission than a pvp areana.

Mhydrian

Academy Page

Join Date: Jul 2005

R/Me

Mesmers can destroy melees and casters alike with ease. And the Fragility build is leaving alot of people with a bad taste in their mouths. I really think the fragiliy build is the real culprit. One shotting people has no place in PVP, the fragility build can be cast by a complete retard and easily own, the rest is running around and trying to get energy to set up another frag.

Chase the Sky

Chase the Sky

Academy Page

Join Date: Aug 2005

www.serpents-guild.com

[Serp]

Mo/A

I want to kill mesmers first. A good mesmer on the other team is way more of a pain then a monk on the other team.

Amused Observer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Morganas
Amused, you're quite off on the pve aggro concept. They're not attacking you because of damage, they're killing you because you get too close. Make sure to keep the front line warriors out of your aggro circle until all enemies have engaged on them, or else they'll prioritize low armor targets.
Is that so? In fow, the Ws and beasties come after me, and I stay well behind the tanks in my group. Heck, I stand next to monks, and my Mes still get targeted first. *shrugs*

Amused Observer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

But on this third and last day of the pvp event, I noticed that a lot of teams in tombs are calling for Mes now. Perhaps the previous 2 days of pvping have changed their view on Mesmers.

Amused Observer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yen-lo-wang
The nice thing about E/Me's, at least from what a guildie of mine has told me, is that you're targeted late in the game, so you can either go as a straight Mesmer in disguise with a TON of energy, or as an Ele with a couple skills from the Illusion line to supplement your skills.
actually, I find this true of E/Mo as well. I noticed that a lot of them rely heavily on the monk skills (heal, protect, hex/condition removal, smite) and use the E side as support (glyphs).

Kai Nui

Kai Nui

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

Behind you with a knife

Celebrity Gangsters [FamE]

Me/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Amused Observer
Is that so? In fow, the Ws and beasties come after me, and I stay well behind the tanks in my group. Heck, I stand next to monks, and my Mes still get targeted first. *shrugs*
Same here. I seriously think mesmers need better armour because they're going down way to fast. And since I am one and I've devoted all my time into one... there's not any getting out of it. I've died way more than the normal person, refunds just get in the way because I constantly have to swap since I want skill points on my main character, etc... I dunno but mesmering is being a pain. I think every time I go out there I am the first to die. First thing I see is a warrior chasing me and I have to run, and the best running technique requires me to stop to cast it then cripples me after it's done. It's really pathetic. There needs to be some more running skills, armour, or something, I hate to have a warrior countering build, but I have to have it if I even want to play. I love interrupting spells because it comes easy to me, but when I'm dead in 2 seconds, I'm just a walking dead-man.

Theos

Theos

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jul 2005

River Dancing

Eternal Treachery [TimE]

Me/E

Like necros, mesmers do not need better armour. They have to lose out somewhere to be balanced.

The rise of demand for mesmers, in my opinion is not that people have awakened and noticed that mesmers are key to any team, but that they have realized that a Mes/X (i prefer Me/N) can effectively shutdown smite. Two would be overkill. The other reason is that like Ele, mesmers can be covert healers/prots/nukers/necros/etc...

Amused Observer

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

Actually, I just take my lumps and mutter a prayer that the healers notice my health bar going down rapidly. LOL If I end up dying so that the enemies' monks go down, so be it.

Kai Nui

Kai Nui

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Aug 2005

Behind you with a knife

Celebrity Gangsters [FamE]

Me/

Yay now everyone realizes that mesmers are weak, so lets be sure to kick their ass first. Yay.

Savio

Savio

Teenager with attitude

Join Date: Jul 2005

Fifteen Over Fifty [Rare]

If they aren't targetting Mesmers first, they're pretty bad. Mesmers are targetted after or even before the Monks for their skills. You're a Mesmer, figure out how to stop them. Price of Failure, Distortion, etc. You can be anti-warrior too you know.

Nightwish

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jul 2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Savio
If they aren't targetting Mesmers first, they're pretty bad. Mesmers are targetted after or even before the Monks for their skills. You're a Mesmer, figure out how to stop them. Price of Failure, Distortion, etc. You can be anti-warrior too you know.
You are correct. I apply some of the def skills you mention, savio. But most of the time, its not very useful unless you equip all of them. Why? Because every single player on the other team targets you...yes, its that scary.

Rangers keep pelting you, eles nuke you, warriors chase you nonstop. Sometimes with so many of them focus on me, I end up doing olympic runs instead while wondering what my teamates are up to =/

Numa Pompilius

Numa Pompilius

Grotto Attendant

Join Date: May 2005

At an Insit.. Intis... a house.

Live Forever Or Die Trying [GLHF]

W/Me

Even as a mesmer, I target other mesmers first. Especially Me/N | N/Me's, as they're often/usually/always fragility+virulence spikers who'll otherwise kill the warriors within seconds.

It seems like mesmer fragility spikers are the new aeromancers.

Color It Red

Color It Red

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Dec 2005

Philippines

Third World [PH]

Me/W

Aeromancers??

Quote:
I overheard a conversation in the outposts stating that mesmers were totally noob and only noobs would choose that class. And the sad thing was... there were so many of them agreeing on that.
Hahahaha. Why do you think they said that?

Quote:
So, did you experience similiar things?
Uhmm... I don't think so. I just do RP then when I'm lvl 20 I could go to PvP.

dont feel no pain

dont feel no pain

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2005

Uk,Wales

Mermsers are freaking awsome and usualy the most valued players in a pve where it is him that takes out caster bosses and not to mention in pvp shutdown is just sweet!!

strcpy

strcpy

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Jul 2005

One of Many [ONE]

This is the problem is "support" builds in general - both real life and online. Unless you are directly contributing to something you are useless for many people, it takes either someone who had done thier time or an astute person to see.

Ever work in System administration? It can be frustrating - "There hasn't been a major crash ot security break in months - what are we paying you for?". "Umm - to not have those events?" isn't a valid option for many companies. Yet it is true. Many of the bad to mediocre companies go through spells where the IT department is God and Useless - even though thier role and impartance never changes. A good SA will never be seen doing anything or ever be noticed - if you are comprimised you are either not so good or the attack is very good/new.

Same with mesmers and other support chars - others just die really quick when you do your job. No little numbers or big drops in health occur based on what you are doing. Spike damge people get the kill - yet it is because us "support" chars made it possible.

Eh, just what you have to live with if you choose that path. When things are good they are really good. Your team will protect you (or you salary is good in real life) and the enemy team realises you are why they are loosing and targets you. When things are bad you are pretty much alone saying "you guys are going to suck" - take solace in that you are correct.

Xenrath

Xenrath

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

W/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by dont feel no pain
Mermsers are freaking awsome and usualy the most valued players in a pve where it is him that takes out caster bosses and not to mention in pvp shutdown is just sweet!!
er no? mesmers are probably the least picked class out of all for groups in PvE at least, despite what they can do to casters/bosses... i've one and most others i've encountered that i spoke with had the same experience. monks, warriors, eles always get picked, necros/rangers and then mesmers are right at the bottom of the "pick me!" chain it seems...

anyway back on topic, they probably get targetted early because they can shut down the other team's healers/casters etc which can then result in problems for the whole team

dont feel no pain

dont feel no pain

Forge Runner

Join Date: Sep 2005

Uk,Wales

Quote:
er no? mesmers are probably the least picked class out of all for groups in PvE at least, despite what they can do to casters/bosses... i've one and most others i've encountered that i spoke with had the same experience. monks, warriors, eles always get picked, necros/rangers and then mesmers are right at the bottom of the "pick me!" chain it seems...
u know all of those hard spots in pve

e.g strong bosses 4/6 casters 1 mesmer can completly mes them up and fast

Hockster

Hockster

Banned

Join Date: Jul 2005

Why do people feel a need to resurrect 4 month old threads?

chippxero

chippxero

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: May 2005

norfolk

Super Anti Rabbit Squad [SARS]

Mo/Me

If it's relavent disscussion it's better than starting a new thread.

I never seem to have mesmers in my group i'm normally one of those last minute monks that joins seconds before we go out, I want a mesmer character but i can't delete my other ones as too much time and effort went in to them and i still use them for different things.

IMO mesmers are a must for PvP as most group builds rely on a caster or spells at some point and mesmers are the one class i hate so see on the other team.

hilkos

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Dec 2005

The keeper Assassins

Me/Mo

i play mesmer in both PvE and PvP. I love it and indeed it can be hard to find a group in PvE. Once in the group, it helps to show your skills, so people actually see what you are doing. I have gotten nothing but nice replies to that and many times compliments.
In PvP it is a different story since people don't seem to understand something very important about mesmers: As a mesmer you have to switch between targets all the time. This way you keep the ENTIRE enemy group crippled almost all the time if you play your skills and energy management right (Thats right, people, that is how awesome the mesmer is !). However there are always people complaining about the mesmer not following target calls.
So allow me for once here to vent my frustration about that:
A mesmer that blindly follows target calls and therefor doesn't work all the enemies, is a HORRIBLE mesmer ! That is why you always should have only 1 or at the most 2 in your group ! 1 mesmer can keep all enemies handicapped all the time !

thank you

Loch

Loch

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Sep 2005

Quote:
A mesmer that blindly follows target calls and therefor doesn't work all the enemies, is a HORRIBLE mesmer !
Well put. Backfire a caster, Divert a boss, get Empathy on a Ranger, then Shatter Enchant on the current target. That's how a Mesmer does it!

I know in PvP, the biggest challenge of playing a Mesmer is knowing when to bounce around to different targets, and when to spike the current target.

Teufel Eldritch

Teufel Eldritch

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Apr 2005

Shadar Logoth

The Legendary Majestic 12

N/

Mebbe it's just me.... mebbe I'm just attuned personality-wise to the profession but...I dont find playing Mesmer difficult. I find it easier to play than a Necro or Monk thats for sure.

hilkos

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Dec 2005

The keeper Assassins

Me/Mo

you can make every charactre as difficult or easy to play as you like, so in a way it is just you
If a sprinter is not exhausted at the finish, it means he could have run faster. It is the same here. If a charactre is easy to play for you (any charactre) it means you can get more out of it.

jibikao

jibikao

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

R/

I've been doing ranom/team arena for quite some time now and I actually hear more nasty things about Rangers than Mesmer.

The comments I saw are "gay interruption", "I can't cast ___ thing", "___ runners", "I hate Rangers!!!!, "____ Rangers"


Most people who complained are Casters who got interrupted so many times by Ranger.

I got a great nasty comment from a Mesmer because I use Disrupting Lunge to disable her Illusionary Weapon TWICE. lol It was pure luck. I spammed it right before she casted it. Oh man, was she pissed. She was like "FFFFFFing Ranger".


Then my friend and I started a 3 R/N touchy team + 1 with Dark Aura. We owned so much that a Monk was yelling "____ Ranger!!!!" lol Oh god, that feels good.

Then since I am a beast master and I use an Elder Strider, so many people say "That bird is so annoying!!!" lol I can't help it that I killed them with my big bird. Oh god, that feels good.

Monica Angelina

Monica Angelina

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2005

Hot Original Elementalists

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kai Nui
Same here. I seriously think mesmers need better armour because they're going down way to fast. And since I am one and I've devoted all my time into one... there's not any getting out of it. I've died way more than the normal person, refunds just get in the way because I constantly have to swap since I want skill points on my main character, etc... I dunno but mesmering is being a pain. I think every time I go out there I am the first to die. First thing I see is a warrior chasing me and I have to run, and the best running technique requires me to stop to cast it then cripples me after it's done. It's really pathetic. There needs to be some more running skills, armour, or something, I hate to have a warrior countering build, but I have to have it if I even want to play. I love interrupting spells because it comes easy to me, but when I'm dead in 2 seconds, I'm just a walking dead-man.
Try thinking outside the box...

When a warrior is chasing you, you don't have to run, it is both more cost effective and efficient to either slow him down or, even better, make him pay for every hit he does on you. Even when you run and are crippled, again, why not turn that into an advantage? Transfer the crippling on the Warrior! You now have a warrior that is constantly crippled that you can easily run away from and everytime he hacks at you, he dies a little more. Life cant better better for a mesmer than that! Mesmer is so overpowering when played right it better go down fast. I shutter at the thought of an invinci-mesmer! (I think I just gave away a good snare spell chain, though)

It really makes me laugh every time I hear or see people being fearful of a warrior. For me, their only utility is an efficient damage sink. They are not all powerful like many think that they are. Try an Energy Burn on a warrior sometimes, they don't like it. :P

Lastly, I'll go out on a limb on this one: you prolly die way more than the "normal" person because you are out in front (and you shouldn't be as a caster) way more often than the "normal" person is. I cannot stress this enough in all of my play with PUGs. There is a reason Anet put a little aggro circle in your map. It's there for you to know where you are but more importantly, where NOT TO BE. This would be the case for any caster. Yes, that includes those of you necros/ellies/monks that think you can tank and just charge forward blindly. If you are truely a tank build (and I'm not saying they don't exist), then don't bring a warrior.

Lady Erighan

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2005

Defenders of Gods

E/Me

In general, warriors are no match for mesmers. If you keep being killed by warriors, then you're doing something wrong.

Banebow

Banebow

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Aug 2005

[KoA] Knights of the Alliance

Me/

Mesmers are not chosen for groups because the average group does not understand what exactly a mesmer does. You all know about the Warrior/Monk/Elementalist groups, they exist because people can say "warrior tanks, monk heals, elementalist does damage" But they cannot find a place for the powerful shutdown from a mesmer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lady Erighan
In general, warriors are no match for mesmers. If you keep being killed by warriors, then you're doing something wrong.
Besides empathy, domination mesmers can do very few things to a warrior that will keep said mesmer from getting killed. While I am all for empathy, eviscerate followed by executioner's strike does a heck of a lot more to me than the 62 from empathy does to him. Sure, illusion magic can destroy almost any warrior, but I find domination more generaly useful in PvP then illusion magic, so I tend to deal with warriors by throwing empathy on them and hoping they target someone else. Things such as blackout and diversion are great, but even regular swings from that axe warrior hurt more than I care to worry about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monica Angelina
I shutter at the thought of an invinci-mesmer!
I have one. Problem is, it takes enough skills to prevent me from doing much else. By the way, condition transfer from yourself to an enemy is necro-based, and takes a slot. I do not always go necromancer secondary

The real question is, how many slots are you willing to give up to stop a warrior? Two? Three? More than that? At some point you are paying so much to stop that warrior that you cannot do anything else very well. Sure, signet of midnight can stop many warriors in their tracks, but it takes your elite slot. That is all fine and dandy, if you want to shut warriors down, but when an anti-caster build goes up against a bloodthirsty hammer warrior, it does not take much thought to know who wins, if no one else is backing you up. The warrior will just scoff at the energy burn and use his adrenaline knockdown skills.

Del12

Academy Page

Join Date: May 2005

It is quite frustrating to be setup for some mezzing in the arenas, only to have some w/mo on your butt the whole time. And if you have no monk, ether feast just doesn't cut it for keeping yourself alive. Sure you can spec to sig of midnight, spiteful, whatever, but then you aren't really doing mesmer stuff like interrupts/shutdown.

Lady Erighan

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Nov 2005

Defenders of Gods

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banebow
Besides empathy, domination mesmers can do very few things to a warrior that will keep said mesmer from getting killed. While I am all for empathy, eviscerate followed by executioner's strike does a heck of a lot more to me than the 62 from empathy does to him. Sure, illusion magic can destroy almost any warrior, but I find domination more generaly useful in PvP then illusion magic, so I tend to deal with warriors by throwing empathy on them and hoping they target someone else. Things such as blackout and diversion are great, but even regular swings from that axe warrior hurt more than I care to worry about.
Obviously a "shut-down" mesmer isn't going to hurt a warrior "too" much, but why would a domination-heavy mesmer target a warrior when there are higher priority targets? Thus, I was more referring to illusion mesmers. And since sooo many people like to bring warriors and rangers into randoms and tombs, I prefer to bring illusion equipped mesmers to deal with them.

Persistance + Conjure + Phantom + Crippling Anguish + Clumsiness + Gale = FTW!

Epinephrine

Epinephrine

Master of Beasts

Join Date: Mar 2005

Ottawa, Canada

Servants of Fortuna [SoF]

Few people play illusion mesmers, and the biggest problem I find with illusion is that it doesn't manage energy very well (and deals poorly with casters).

You end up needing to grab inspiration to handle the energy side of things, which at the same time limits your ability to use other attributes. Illusion mesmers DO destroy warriors quite nicely though - Ineptitude/Clumsiness/Phantom/Spirit of Failure/Conjure and they don't last long at all, plus you keep your energy up.

Two April Mornings

Two April Mornings

No Luck No Time No Money

Join Date: Nov 2005

Amherst College, MA

Scars Meadows [SMS]

Me/

Mesmers can rock PVP if used well.
Play well with your mesmer and you'll earn respect, even if its PVE.

tigernz

tigernz

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jun 2005

Alberta, Canada

Servants of Fortuna

N/Me

I usually only take 1-2 skills to deal with warriors & rangers: Signet of Midnight & Plague Touch.

Sure it costs an elite slot, but for my money it's well worth it. Plenty of other skills to kill casters with.

I just wish they'd stick Mantra of Persistance into the illusion line because as Epi mentioned, to get the best value out of illusion hexes you're wanting to have MoP in there, which means investing points into Inspiration, so you're pretty much stuck with 2 skill lines unless you choose to drop Ill & Insp down a bit to get 8-9 points in adifferent attribute.

Monica Angelina

Monica Angelina

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Jul 2005

Hot Original Elementalists

E/Me

Quote:
Originally Posted by Banebow
Mesmers are not chosen for groups because the average group does not understand what exactly a mesmer does. You all know about the Warrior/Monk/Elementalist groups, they exist because people can say "warrior tanks, monk heals, elementalist does damage" But they cannot find a place for the powerful shutdown from a mesmer.

Besides empathy, domination mesmers can do very few things to a warrior that will keep said mesmer from getting killed. While I am all for empathy, eviscerate followed by executioner's strike does a heck of a lot more to me than the 62 from empathy does to him. Sure, illusion magic can destroy almost any warrior, but I find domination more generaly useful in PvP then illusion magic, so I tend to deal with warriors by throwing empathy on them and hoping they target someone else. Things such as blackout and diversion are great, but even regular swings from that axe warrior hurt more than I care to worry about.

I have one. Problem is, it takes enough skills to prevent me from doing much else. By the way, condition transfer from yourself to an enemy is necro-based, and takes a slot. I do not always go necromancer secondary

The real question is, how many slots are you willing to give up to stop a warrior? Two? Three? More than that? At some point you are paying so much to stop that warrior that you cannot do anything else very well. Sure, signet of midnight can stop many warriors in their tracks, but it takes your elite slot. That is all fine and dandy, if you want to shut warriors down, but when an anti-caster build goes up against a bloodthirsty hammer warrior, it does not take much thought to know who wins, if no one else is backing you up. The warrior will just scoff at the energy burn and use his adrenaline knockdown skills.
My point of the post wasn't so much so to demonstrate my "1337" skillz as was the very first sentence in the post, to ask people to "Think Outside the Box".

I'll be the first one to admint that I don't profess to be an uber mesmer by any stretch of the imagination. I use Me interrupts as a secondary profession on my Ellie. My primary mesmer is merely level 10 although I am trying (and so far w/o success) to get ascended with bonus.

Care to share your invinci-mesmer build?