W/Mo Paladin builds pvp and pve

These are the builds I usually use everywhere. Beeing a paladin is the best way to stay alive and help your team at the same time.

The Hero.
1. Sever
2. Gash
3. Galrath's Slash
4. Battle Rage [elite]
5. Bonetti's Defense
6. Healing Breeze
7. Mending
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig.

The Paladin.
1. Sever/Power Attack/Hamstring
2. Galrath's Slash
3. Final Thrust
4. Berserker Stance
5. Healing Hands
6. Vigourous Spirit
7. Live Vicariously
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig.

The Last One.
1. Hundred Blades [elite]
2. Galrath's Slash
3. Final Thrust
4. Shield Stance
5. Bonetti's Defense
6. Vigourous Spirit
7. Live Vicariously
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig.

The Ever Lasting Warmaster.
1. Galrath's Salsh
2. Final Thrust
3. Bonetti's Defense
4. Gladiator's Defense
5. Healing Sig.
6. Healing Breeze
7. Mending
8. Rebirth/Vengence/Res. sig
This build is mostly for FoW....not too good in pvp....

UWill die.
1. Banish / Symbol of Wrath
2. Holy Strike
3. Galrath's Slash
4. Final Thrust
5. Galdiator's Defense / Shield of Judgment
6. Shield Stance
7. Healing Sig. / Bonetti's defense
8. Rebirth
This is the tank's build for UW, the rest of the party, u know it

*edit
The Hero II.
1. Sever
2. Gash
3. Galrath's Slash
4. Final Thrust
5. Battle Rage [elite]
6. Mend ailment
7. Reversal of Fortune / Pacifism / Hex removers
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig.
Spike, not blinded, good damage!
Quote: Originally Posted by qwe4rty
-penetrating blow
-executioners strike
-eviscerate
-frenzy or beserkers
-sprint
-rez sig
-Strength of Honor (+ x dmg)
-Judges Insight (20% armor penetration, and holy dmg) @ 10 smite, it lasts 16 seconds

your 3 attack skills are all adrenaline based, and are very effective especially when you spike them all in a row. W/ judges insight up when I spike, Ive gotten eviscerate up to 194 damage, and executioners to 190.
Thnx for the build qwe4rty.

Quote: Originally Posted by Fenix 10 Protection Prayers
9 Strength (8 + minor rune)
16 Axe Mastery (12 + helm + superior rune)

Penetrating Blow
Executioner's Strike
Dismember
Disrupting Chop
Battle Rage{E}
Succor
Life Bond
Res Sig

Bond your weakest teammate, then, make the call on whether a second lifebonded teammate would be better than giving someone succor. If I get a monk on my team I always put both bond and succor on him. Thank you Fenix.

Yeah, paladin is just frowned upon because the template is considered to be very poor, and most people assume anyone using a W/Mo is using the template. Anyway, here's a paladin build I was using (and found to be quite party friendly) the other day:

Sever Artery
Gash
Galrath's Slash
Final Thrust
Battle Rage [e]
Purge Signet
Succor
Resurrection Signet

Slightly healer dependant if people target you, but most tended to ignore me (other than a few hexes which were easily purged) because I look like the usual paladin, so I ended up taking very little damage. Just give succor to two casters (If there's another w/mo, try to convince them to cast mending on you in exchange for one of the succor castings), and keep rage up as much as possible. Then just pick on whatever target, you should be able to take anything down pretty quickly if they don't heal, or slightly longer if they do. If they run... well, just rage after them. Free criticals and taking someone (effectively) out of the battle is nice.

Could probably be a lot better, but I found it pretty effective. It also has an interesting side effect vs energy denial players, but that's another story for another thread.

Quote: Originally Posted by Stormbringer These are the builds I usually use everywhere. Beeing a paladin is the best way to stay alive and help your team at the same time.

The Hero.
1. Sever
2. Gash
3. Galrath's Slash
4. Battle Rage [elite]
5. Bonetti's Defense
6. Healing Breeze
7. Mending
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig. This one is a mediocre build as far as paladins go, I would say. You just don't do enough damage to really be effective. What I really don't get is why paladins insist on using sword. Just switching to axe would make this build *so* much better, with absolutely no downside. Replace sever, gash, galrath, and battle rage with eviscerate, penetrating blow, executioner's strike and axe twist (for example) and you're good to go. Or if you like battle rage, drop eviscerate and keep the others. The idea with battlerage is that you can keep spamming your high damage high adrenaline skills, but sword doesn't have any. You can only make them bleeding and deep wounded once, after that you'll just be waiting for galrath to recharge.

Quote: Originally Posted by Stormbringer The Paladin.
1. Sever/Power Attack/Hamstring
2. Galrath's Slash
3. Final Thrust
4. Beserk
5. Healing Hands
6. Vigourous Spirit
7. Live Vicariously
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig. I think having healing hands, vigorous spirit, and live vicarously on the same character is wasteful, even in pve. If you really want to stay defensive, drop one of them for a defensive stance of some kind. By beserk do you mean frenzy by any chance? Because you can't run beserker stance and healing hands on the same build. Again, if this is designed to be an attack build, I think you need more firepower, either something to speed up your adrenaline, or something to pump out more damage. If you want to bring vigor/vicarous, you should have hundred blades or cyclone axe.

Quote: Originally Posted by Stormbringer The Last One.
1. Hundred Blades [elite]
2. Galrath's Slash
3. Final Thrust
4. Shield Stance
5. Bonetti's Defense
6. Vigourous Spirit
7. Live Vicariously
8. Rebirth/Restore Life/Res. sig. I like this one a little better. For some very monster heavy pve areas, I think this one is workable. If you aren't planning on getting swarmed, don't run this build.

Quote: Originally Posted by Rico Carridan Just switching to axe would make this build *so* much better, with absolutely no downside. I'm sorry to say but, axe has a very big downside, the gap between max and min dmg... 6-28 dmg, the think is u have more chances to fall on the minimal dmg than on the maxed one, plus it has a SLIGHTLY lower attack speed, the skills for axe need much adrenaline and the best skills are elite so.....
I still say that sword is the best think for a warrior....That's how I feel...

Quote: Originally Posted by Rico Carridan I think having healing hands, vigorous spirit, and live vicariously on the same character is wasteful, even in PVE. If you really want to stay defensive, drop one of them for a defensive stance of some kind. By berserk do you mean frenzy by any chance? Because you can't run berserker stance and healing hands on the same build. Again, if this is designed to be an attack build, I think you need more firepower, either something to speed up your adrenaline, or something to pump out more damage. If you want to bring vigor/vicarious, you should have hundred blades or cyclone axe. The paladin build. The 2 hit=life enchantments are a must here, and by berserk, i mean Berserker Stance (sorry, I misspelled it, will correct in the post). In this build you don't use tactics since u have healing hands, so you really can't die vs. warriors nor vs. rangers. I agree that Hundred blades would be useful, but this build is made for PVP (and there you do not have mobs on you....) and PVE.




Quote: Originally Posted by Rico Carridan

Quote: I still say that sword is the best think for a warrior....That's how I feel... Heh, that's a pretty brave comment to make on here....

Personally I agree with the other guy, axes are my preferred warrior weapon, or hammers even in some pvp builds, the damage on swords is just a bit low (cripple on demand with hamstring is ok though) - the minimum damage for an axe doesn't play much of a roll when you have a high rank in the skill

Also for tanking and being defensive with the axe you can combine Vigerous Spirit, Live Vicariously, Cyclone Axe, and Bonetti's Defense - the cyclone axe can quickly charge up the bonetti's if you are surrounded - and you still have room for elites there, eviscerate maybe, I personally think this is the best warrior skill there is

Quote: Originally Posted by Stormbringer

I'm not really concerned with PvE anymore. So I'll just comment on the PvP build(s)......err......where are the PvP builds..??

Problem is like all W/Mo's and the template -- it just smacks of self-healing and defensive stances. You may believe you've got some skills to help teammates but simply put -- you haven't.


You can't take off enchantments, you can't break stances and you don't really do any damage.


Can people still not see why Mending is not worth 1 pip of your energy regen :?

6 HP a second WILL NOT be a game winner -- at most you'll pro-long your own death for an extra few seconds. The same goes for Healing Breeze.

Defensive Stances on a Warrior......again WHY ?? You've got the highest armour class in the game and smart opponents will simply disable you ( through Hexes + Conditions ) and kill you last.


They should really remove the Paladin pre-made -- it's simply aweful. But for the sake of argument -- let's say we do wish to create a "Paladin-type" character -- I'd do something like this:

Protection Prayers 10
Swordsmanship 16 ( 12 + 4 )
Strength 9 ( 8 + 1 )

Rez Sig
Sever
Gash
Galrath Slash
Final Thrust
Frenzy
Sprint
Life Barrier (E)

Weapon Mastery Helm
Gladiators: Chest, Legs, Hands

1x Zealous Sword
1x Sword

Slap Life Barrier on your Monk. He takes 40% less damage. It's far from perfect -- but it's 100x better than any "self-sufficient" W/Mo

Quote: Originally Posted by smurfhunter *loads rifle*

*points at head*

*shoots* Eternal Shield blocks the attack.

sry for posting twice in a row, but I have to say this.
Quote: Originally Posted by Man With No Name

Quote: Originally Posted by Stormbringer

Quote: The Hero and The Paladin are very good in PVP, i use them all the time!

W/Mo with brains will use Strength of Honor over Mending.

Why? Cause dead enemies don't hurt you that's why...

Here's my take on a sword toting W/Mo Knight of the round...

Jedi Knight build for pvp

Sever
Gash [hey, it's the deep wound that r0x0rs baby]
Galrath Slash
Final Thrust
Frenzy
Sprint
Strength of Honor
Signet of Judgement {E}/Res Sig

Does it need an elite? Well, maybe not. Monk smite elites are very limited and sword elites are just uh... yeah... But Judgment Signet could rock for people trying to get away...

The main reason people really hate the paladin build is because it is so inefficent.

Let me state, if you want to bring healing to your team, play a monk.
monks have more pips of energy regen
all your attributes will be focused to saving people

warriors have only 2 pips of energy regen, a very low energy base, etc

mending and healing breeze are actually very inefficient as well. THere was a post floating around a few weeks ago that showed ALL of the monk healing spells with there hp per-point-of-energy. Mending and breeze were low.

Paladin builds really don't help the team all that much.
Mediocre dmg, Mediocre healing
They try to delve into two opposite functions, and the end result is that neither is very strong.

Trust me, I've tried, I've tried again, I've stopped and come back, and the onlly really ok W/Mo healing paladin is a W/Mo axe farmer that some1 listed above.

Before I list my build that I use, I want to explain several things.
-when attacking a target fleeing you, you get a critical every single time
-frenzy is not necessarily bad. Let me explain. Warriors are usually targetted last, so an increased attack speed that is cheap,and lasts 8 seconds is VERY good.
However, once you start taking dmg, turn on sprint. You can only have 1 stance at a time, so if you are worried about double dmg as they hit u, turn on sprint, and frenzy is turned off
-swords and axes have the exact same attack speed

One argument that many paladins make is that they can keep there allies alive in battle. Sure, this is all well and good, and sure, u may be the one saving people in the absense of a monk, but you may only get a few wins this way, as your damage is going to be really low.
I usually go in as damage, and hope I get a monk, and if not, hope we can kill the other team b4 they have a chance to kill us. While I may not win a few initial ones, the end outcome is I get on a team w/ a good monk, and we get a long streak, rather than a few "lucky" breaks here and there

Here is the W/Mo build that I use, and I will attempt to explain it as best I can.

Axe:15
Smite: 10
Str: 9 (might be 10, i dont remember)

-penetrating blow
-executioners strike
-eviscerate
-frenzy or beserkers
-sprint
-rez sig
-Strength of Honor (+ x dmg)
-Judges Insight (20% armor penetration, and holy dmg) @ 10 smite, it lasts 16 seconds

your 3 attack skills are all adrenaline based, and are very effective especially when you spike them all in a row. W/ judges insight up when I spike, Ive gotten eviscerate up to 194 damage, and executioners to 190.

Strenght of honor adds 7 more dmg for me (not bad) but because it is an enchantment, it fuels my swords and shields that give bonus while enchanted (judges insight does the same, but Str is permanent basically, dont have to worry about energy)

use frenzy or beskers stance to get adrenaline fast, try to keep up judges insight as much as you can. When the enemy runs, I'm not "o shit" im like "O DEAR GOD, YES THANK YOU". vs enemy casters that are running, your doing a crit every single hit, and w/ judges insight, I've gotten it to 87 dmg , a hit, without attack skills. Imagine that you then used eviscerate..... Thats a lot of dmg with one skill.

Even against warriors, just turn on judges insight, and your doing 50 dmg a pop.

Another bonus, vs necs that use the armor that takes increased dmg from holy? guess what judges insight does....

Rather than trying to keep your team alive, leave that job to the monk, and dish out as much dmg as you can.
I used this last week, died the first few times in CA, then got a god awesome group with another monk, mesmer, and warrior, and proceeded to tear apart the team arenas after we got the 10 wins in competition.

After stuff like this, a sword just doesnt compare, the damage is weak. The trying to heal at the same time just limits you.

The only good self heals are the ones that are already in the attributes you are using (ether feast for inspiration mesmers, etc)

Quote: Originally Posted by Stormbringer

Quote: Originally Posted by Yukito Kunisaki

I've built more of a tank than a paladin. I worry more about myself in the healing departmant.

Sever artery
Galrath's slash
Final Thrust
Mending
Remove conditions
defensive stance
shield stance
res sig/res

Actually, paladins aren't nearly as bad as people are making them out to be (IMO). They're pretty much the only type of character that can penetrate an enemy's back line and go chasing after an enemy monk and such.

Quote: Originally Posted by traversc

You're really over-exagerating the loss in attack power to gain a small amount of healing. As a monk player, I'm really not afraid of a single warrior of ANY type. It's only when they focus that they become dangerous. But then, multiple deep wounds from eviscerate isn't really going to help spike, anyway.
When you do go chasing after an enemy in the back lines you really have to make sure that you can get back in case you get focused. Or if you get blinded. Or if you get snared. Of course, a paladin won't be capable of handling all those situations either, but still, a paladin has a much, much longer range, and can also double as a runner.

[QUOTE=traversc]. As a monk player, I'm really not afraid of a single warrior of ANY type.

You must only be playing againist paladins.

Guys, try to keep the topic about the build. No need to harass other players because they may use it.