Warriors = Overused? - Guild Wars Guru archive powered by Guild Wars Legacy

Roza

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Amsterdam

The War Masters

R/W

20 Nov 2005 at 02:28 - 81

Quote:

Just one more thing especailly to Roza I can see what you are talking about the bad Warriors are the ones who get run to the Forge at low levels and never played to the game to learn their skills and limitions and yes most of them turn out to be W/Mo but is still a good class if you learn it well as 2 Warriors were rushing through Thirsty river with 15 K Gladiators armor on.Yeah they got ran to Marhans.

I admit that it is quite possible that there are good pvp 8 vs 8 wa/mo builds. What I was talking about was the self healing build that is so common in the game, even in pvp. What these players should figure out that the point of a war in pvp is not to last longer than the rest of the team, but defeat the opponent. As a general rule (with exceptions), I would say that any warrior for pvp should take something from his secondary that will help him or her (or the team) to kill faster. The non-monk secondaries do have a lot to offer to wars, I do suggest to wa/mo's to at least try another secondary and see how they like it.

Btw, where I said 'heavy smiting' before, I meant 'heavy spiking'. Sorry.

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

20 Nov 2005 at 03:31 - 82

I guess you really mean War/R aren't you and to Ancient PC i know my history up better in ad not bc and I made that post in a rather hurry but I don't get paid for post on boards or I would use the spell and grammer checker.

Roza

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Amsterdam

The War Masters

R/W

20 Nov 2005 at 05:18 - 83

Quote:

I guess you really mean War/R aren't you

Well, that one is the most used warrior builds for pvp at the moment (probably partially due to IWAY teams) and it is effective. I certainly do not think it is the only effective secondary. I like playing with different variations of the wa/elementalist a lot (not just aftershocker with hammers). War/necro's a popular for a reason too. And war/mesmers can be pretty nasty as well (think Echo and Blackout, for example)...

Do not go for straightforward attack spells though. You need something that either boosts your damage in some way (like faster attacks, or extra damage or aftershock with a knockdown) or something that somehow makes up for the lower energy of warriors and gives your team something extra while at the same time allowing you to use your warrior melee attacks and build up adrenaline for them. Or so I think.

TubamanRH

Ascalonian Squire

Join Date: Jul 2005

Mo/Me

20 Nov 2005 at 16:33 - 84

Quote:

Originally Posted by fmboisvert

All the casting professions relies mostly on the perfect collector's wands and off hand items. Imagine suggesting to a warrior to go buy the perfect +15>50 longsword at the collector's! How insulting!!!

...My warrior uses that sword. Admittedly, if I had one with mods that came close to the collector's sword and looked better I would use it instead, but no one has teasted me about my sword yet.

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

20 Nov 2005 at 16:41 - 85

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sanji

The thing you neglect to realize, Shimus, is that people who rant more often than not try to teach these bad players what not to do. Bad players unfortunately tend to have extremely bad attitudes about being "told what to do".

This isn't about newbie bashing, this is about thick headed jerks who never listen. It just so happens a considerable amount of them play Warrior.

You can't teach an old dog new tricks and you can't teach a scrub how not to suck at video games.

I beg to differ on the last statement. You can teach ANYONE to do ANYTHING if you would just take the time. I could teach a chimp how to fly an airplane!

As for the old dog/scrub comment, if noone teaches other people, the cycle continues, and the game keeps spiraling downhill. We need teachers, students, we have to have a way to spread the knowledge other then the message boards in game. Maybe a /Mentor command like EQ2 <Which I felt, WAS FRICKING AWESOME> =) I loved it.

--The Shim

Sanji

Wilds Pathfinder

Join Date: Jun 2005

Mo/

20 Nov 2005 at 20:04 - 86

I'd love to teach a lot of bad players what not to do. The problem is that most bad players aren't they way they are due to inexperience with the game, but because they are not only stubborn, crippled by poor social skills and authority issues, but also tend to lack common sense. (IE: Focusing fire is good, killing stuff with light armor is easier, running off on your own is bad)

It's kind of hard to help someone when they violently react with stuff like "STFU NOOB U CANT TEL ME WUT 2 DO". So yeah, it's not worth teaching most of these 'free thinkers' out there when they refuse to acknowledge that their playstyle is nothing but a liability to their party.

It's not just a Warrior issue and I will admit that being a melee class makes it more obvious when a Warrior is doing something that endangers their party than a caster. However, even considering that, in my experiences Warriors seem more prone to ignore called targets, make a beeline for tanks instead of casters (thus making the enemy's job easier), run off, cause adds, and otherwise make it painfully clear that they don't care to contribute to their group. This is the unfortunate mindset of a solo player in a team game.

I hate to say it, but the stereotype that Warrior/Monks tend to be scrubs has been more reinforced in my year (I played in the open Beta) of playing Guild Wars than debunked.

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

20 Nov 2005 at 20:25 - 87

That is all Nnice Roza but you have to watch your energy and most Mesmer spells cost more than Necro.I did make up a War/N and a War/Mes they were good builds my War/N was my first build in beta I played great with him soloed all around Ascalon and the Northern Wall mission in beta.When I redid this build in retail and went into the breach it wasn't bad either.I made up a War/Mes and that to was good build although it just stayed in presearing yes useing conjure then seeing their health bars going down and then going for the kill in nice.I made those build before making a War/Mo most of the time I don't have faith in Alesia to keep me Alive yes Necro can steal life but it cost more energy than they put out it is similiar to the R/N I made up I don't use hardly any skills from the Necro side.
There is only one person or profession who does the ressing in Tomps and possibly GvG and that is a War/Mo with restorelife and it is the only one who does it not the Monk who should carry no res Citizen over at The Guild hall did a write up on Monking in PvP.There is a big difference in playing in PvE when playing W/? something else if Alesia healed up like real playing Monk and stay at the back and healed up sure it would be fine and didn't res in battle she is a little better but still no where near like real Monk player.I ressed Alesia with my Warrior counrtess times to res the rest of the team. I can't do that if I played W/? but in PvP it is different with exception random arenas who knows if there is going to a Monk on your team.

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

21 Nov 2005 at 01:36 - 88

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sanji

I'd love to teach a lot of bad players what not to do. The problem is that most bad players aren't they way they are due to inexperience with the game, but because they are not only stubborn, crippled by poor social skills and authority issues, but also tend to lack common sense. (IE: Focusing fire is good, killing stuff with light armor is easier, running off on your own is bad)

It's kind of hard to help someone when they violently react with stuff like "STFU NOOB U CANT TEL ME WUT 2 DO". So yeah, it's not worth teaching most of these 'free thinkers' out there when they refuse to acknowledge that their playstyle is nothing but a liability to their party.

It's not just a Warrior issue and I will admit that being a melee class makes it more obvious when a Warrior is doing something that endangers their party than a caster. However, even considering that, in my experiences Warriors seem more prone to ignore called targets, make a beeline for tanks instead of casters (thus making the enemy's job easier), run off, cause adds, and otherwise make it painfully clear that they don't care to contribute to their group. This is the unfortunate mindset of a solo player in a team game.

I hate to say it, but the stereotype that Warrior/Monks tend to be scrubs has been more reinforced in my year (I played in the open Beta) of playing Guild Wars than debunked.

1. The people who violently react to that, are, in essence, the majority of the people I wasn't referring too. I'm not saying those spoiled little rich PVP brats or anything, but in general, the population that speak like you quoted don't deserve to be teached. If, and only IF, I should have specified, someone asks for help/what to do, THEY shouldn't be the ones to get the violent reaction, is what I'm saying.

2. ^ As mentioned above, the people who tend to ignore called targets are the lot of people you called on 'violent reactions'.

3. Because of the population of GW W/Mo's the majority have given the minority <like myself, and others> bad names if what you say is true. Granted, 50-60% of the "new" population of W/Mo's ARE the 'violent reactors', so I can begin to see where you might feel disdain for my class.

4. Other then that, I agree.

--The Shim

lg5000

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2005

Australia

21 Nov 2005 at 01:45 - 89

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

There is only one person or profession who does the ressing in Tomps and possibly GvG and that is a War/Mo with restorelife and it is the only one who does it not the Monk who should carry no res Citizen over at The Guild hall did a write up on Monking in PvP.

Hmm.. I was under the impression that everyone carried a rez signet, with the possibility of the mesmer using another way of rezzing due to fast-cast, was I wrong about that?

Then again, I have VERY little experience when it comes to pvp.

Roza

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Amsterdam

The War Masters

R/W

21 Nov 2005 at 02:01 - 90

Quote:

Hmm.. I was under the impression that everyone carried a rez signet, with the possibility of the mesmer using another way of rezzing due to fast-cast, was I wrong about that?

Not at all. In tombs, hardly anyone uses anything besides a res signet, because the chance or being disrupted is just too great. Other types of rez are only used for very specific builds sometimes. Monks generally do not have a rez. signet. Peope who do use another form of rez often get the "noob noob noob!!!"-treatment... Tomb players can be a little harsh that way.

naix

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Sep 2005

Oklahoma

Mo/N

21 Nov 2005 at 03:37 - 91

Warriors may be over used, but 50% arent even worth the slot they take up.

Sad but true

lg5000

Jungle Guide

Join Date: Jul 2005

Australia

21 Nov 2005 at 04:05 - 92

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roza

Not at all. In tombs, hardly anyone uses anything besides a res signet, because the chance or being disrupted is just too great. Other types of rez are only used for very specific builds sometimes. Monks generally do not have a rez. signet. Peope who do use another form of rez often get the "noob noob noob!!!"-treatment... Tomb players can be a little harsh that way.

Hehe, there is nothing more fun than interupting res sig though

Roza

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Amsterdam

The War Masters

R/W

21 Nov 2005 at 04:20 - 93

Quote:

Hehe, there is nothing more fun than interupting res sig though

Interupting a rebirth isn't so bad either, though.

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

21 Nov 2005 at 05:38 - 94

Quote:

Originally Posted by naix

Warriors may be over used, but 50% arent even worth the slot they take up.

Sad but true

Sad but true indeed. It's that 50% that gives the other half <like me> A bad name. Half of us try really hard and still get treatment like this basis of the post. If this post was named "Elementalists: Over used" or "Monks: Over Used" people would still have bitched. It's in their nature. =)

--The Shim

DarkSider84

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Nov 2005

Connecticut, USA

JAPS

E/Me

21 Nov 2005 at 05:42 - 95

i'd say with the right build you can still do some serious damage with warrior, and the fact that you're the front line pulling the monsters back after they aoe away, then i'd say they're worth having around. Nukers on the other hand....whats the point of nuking half the time anymore with that update.

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

21 Nov 2005 at 16:29 - 96

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSider84

i'd say with the right build you can still do some serious damage with warrior, and the fact that you're the front line pulling the monsters back after they aoe away, then i'd say they're worth having around. Nukers on the other hand....whats the point of nuking half the time anymore with that update.

Because it wasn't a "Nerf" as many people had it pegged..it simply updated AI imho, of course it made it HARDER to hit, but if you have a knockdown AOE like meteor storm, cast it, then in succession cast another. Simple. Fried enemies. Still works like a charm.

--The Shim

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

24 Nov 2005 at 22:25 - 97

Roza.What would be your ultimate Warrior build.I have tried them all and made builds up of them especially back in beta with UAS.

merciless

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

Sin Squad www.sinsquad.us

W/

25 Nov 2005 at 03:28 - 98

Quote:

Originally Posted by Network

There are so many warriors out there. When warriors go LFG they never get picked. Cause there are so many. Im even thinking of deleting my Warrior because since they nerfed EVERY MONSTER IN THE GAME. There really is no point now. Warriors are so boring.

A lot of people play as warriors because; people think they are cool, people love that crunching sound when they attack an enemy, and they can make money easily!

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

25 Nov 2005 at 03:31 - 99

Quote:

Originally Posted by merciless

A lot of people play as warriors because; people think they are cool, people love that crunching sound when they attack an enemy, and they can make money easily!

Well, if you think about those statements..it is true... but only for those who are juvenile/have un-original builds to farm things.

Me? I love my warrior for the vanity purposes: He's big, wears armor, unique skills for attacking and easily combinable with anyother class secondary for a fun time. <I currently have all classes skills on my warrior primary, except elites..still working on em>

--The Shim

Divinus Stella

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Nov 2005

Wales

Steel Phoenix

25 Nov 2005 at 03:45 - 100

Quote:

Originally Posted by Akhilleus

i get SO much flak from people for being a w/mo sword war, untill i start dealing damage...and lots of it.

Thats exactly what pisses me off about warriors, this illusion that they do "LOADS OF SUPER UBER DMG WITH COOL FiERY DRAGON SWORD"
I laugh evertime i watch a warr in pvp rambo in with healing breeze on and start attacking the other warrior with his sword.

Now in UW when im healing ive started takin unyielding so i can keep the warrior on a leash, great fun, i may lack the healing of WoH, but i get 10x more fun watching the warrior hit deck when he tries to rambo in.

merciless

Frost Gate Guardian

Join Date: Aug 2005

Sin Squad www.sinsquad.us

W/

25 Nov 2005 at 21:02 - 101

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shimus DarkRaven

Well, if you think about those statements..it is true... but only for those who are juvenile/have un-original builds to farm things....

--The Shim

I don't have an un-original farm build(s)! I am constantly changing secondary professions to farm; I don't keep w/mo 24/7. The warrior has been my main character ever since the game came out, and I like to experiment with him because I love the upclose combat. I just found your post sorta offensive, that's all. (As if you were centering it on me, forgive me if I am wrong)
Come on, I'm sure you have used your warrior to farm!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shimus DarkRaven

Me? I love my warrior for the vanity purposes: He's big, wears armor.....

Atleast you agree that warriors are cool!

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

25 Nov 2005 at 23:16 - 102

Quote:

Originally Posted by merciless

I don't have an un-original farm build(s)! I am constantly changing secondary professions to farm; I don't keep w/mo 24/7. The warrior has been my main character ever since the game came out, and I like to experiment with him because I love the upclose combat. I just found your post sorta offensive, that's all. (As if you were centering it on me, forgive me if I am wrong)
Come on, I'm sure you have used your warrior to farm!

Atleast you agree that warriors are cool!

Nah man, I don't target people in specific, I just reference posts. Take it with a grain of salt. And sure, yeah, I've farmed with him, but I always use builds i feel "are unique" to do so, I was really referencing people who use pre-made builds for farming. That's all.

--The Shim

nic1981

Pre-Searing Cadet

Join Date: Aug 2005

LGH

Me/N

26 Nov 2005 at 01:52 - 103

Great evening in fow a few day ago :
a w/mo, with the sword of grognar ... he was engaging fights with a 1/2 health bar because of the vamp mod on it.
We told him to switch weapon and take grognar sword only at the beginning of the fight.
Answer : Nah, it's the best sword of the game ... I won't switch. Monks have to heal me (even when he wasn't fighting ?), without me you can't survive !

Scown-dog

Lion's Arch Merchant

Join Date: Aug 2005

Canada-nuff said

Peace Machine Grrr [DiE]-with Kanwulf until I feel the boot

W/N

26 Nov 2005 at 02:24 - 104

The population of warriors may be to high, but a skilled warrior is still tough to come by.

jibikao

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

R/

26 Nov 2005 at 04:40 - 105

The answer is YES. There are indeed way too many warriors.

Actually, I don't understand why there are so many warriors. I can probably understand in PvE but in PvP, warriors are just not very good especially in Competition and Team. They need people to babysit them. They can't tank better than Monks. Hell, they are not even the first target at all.

And you see W/Mo using Healing Hands, Mending and Healing Breeze on themselves when their teammates are dying left and right because all they are doing is to hit a monk who doesn't even acknowledge their existence or chasing a target for 5mins, or the most silly one is to request "1on1 Against other Warriors". Warriors dueling has to be the most boring thing in Guild Wars.... I am sorry. Yes, I've let warriors duel themselves.

If warriors suffer so much in Competition/Team, why do people keep using them? This is the logic I don't understand.

QuixotesGhost

Krytan Explorer

Join Date: Jun 2005

26 Nov 2005 at 05:16 - 106

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sanji

It's not just a Warrior issue and I will admit that being a melee class makes it more obvious when a Warrior is doing something that endangers their party than a caster. However, even considering that, in my experiences Warriors seem more prone to ignore called targets, make a beeline for tanks instead of casters (thus making the enemy's job easier), run off, cause adds, and otherwise make it painfully clear that they don't care to contribute to their group. This is the unfortunate mindset of a solo player in a team game.

One thing that bugs me about playing a warrior in PvE is that people expect me to:

1. Draw Aggro.
2. Hit the Called.

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but for me, these things are often mutually exclusive. Either I hit the monk mob at the back and let thier meleers come pouring through or I stick where I am and hit something besides the called. If I do 1. someone calls me a noob for not hitting the called, if I do 2 the party often gets wiped.

I'll give a common situation.

In Fissure of Woe, there's that one group all the way on the right hand side. 3 Shadow Warriors and 1 Shadow Monk. The 3 Shadow Warriors charge down the hill and the Shadow Monk gets called. What should , in your opinion, a good warrior do in this situation?

A. Block the Shadow Warriors and tank them with stances, ect. while your ranged attackers down the monk.

B. Ignore the Shadow Warriors and charge past them to attack the called monk.

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

26 Nov 2005 at 17:20 - 107

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuixotesGhost

One thing that bugs me about playing a warrior in PvE is that people expect me to:

1. Draw Aggro.
2. Hit the Called.

I don't know about the rest of you guys, but for me, these things are often mutually exclusive. Either I hit the monk mob at the back and let thier meleers come pouring through or I stick where I am and hit something besides the called. If I do 1. someone calls me a noob for not hitting the called, if I do 2 the party often gets wiped.

I'll give a common situation.

In Fissure of Woe, there's that one group all the way on the right hand side. 3 Shadow Warriors and 1 Shadow Monk. The 3 Shadow Warriors charge down the hill and the Shadow Monk gets called. What should , in your opinion, a good warrior do in this situation?

A. Block the Shadow Warriors and tank them with stances, ect. while your ranged attackers down the monk.

B. Ignore the Shadow Warriors and charge past them to attack the called monk.

I couldn't have typed it better if I said it. It's my problem, too, man. You always will get flak for things like this. I always do..but when people start screaming "TAKE THE MONK" and I run, they<shadow warriors> continue to rip a new arse for the nukers, then I get flak for that. No matter what you do as a warrior, people will hate you.

At least in my experience, anyways.

--The Shim

Age

Hall Hero

Join Date: Jul 2005

California Canada/BC

STG Administrator

Mo/

26 Nov 2005 at 20:01 - 108

Well on my 4th attempt at Elons Reach mission it took just 1 War/Mo to just run around doing the mission himself and he was useing mending.What is a Shadow Warrior?

Shimus DarkRaven

Desert Nomad

Join Date: Oct 2005

Titusville, PA <nowhere>

KOD <Knights of the Dragonrose><Guild Officer>

W/Mo

26 Nov 2005 at 22:46 - 109

Quote:

Originally Posted by Age

Well on my 4th attempt at Elons Reach mission it took just 1 War/Mo to just run around doing the mission himself and he was useing mending.What is a Shadow Warrior?

It'll all come in time, what the shadow is/are. I will just says *coughIT'SINFOWcough* ...have a fun time!

--The Shim