Is teamwork really a thing of the past?

Why is it every time I partner up with some yutz, no one wants to listen to my advice. I've played with random people on several occassions and most of them seem content to hack & slash over careful planning. When I play with people like Eternal Tempest, we spend about 2-5 min planning what type of skills and henchmen we may need for an area. Besides Eternal Tempest, are there any other players out there that believe in skill balancing and preperation?

its like a disease in GW. take this for example.

getting a group for infusion run together. i was using a necro fiend master. we had one ranger so i told him to bring favorable winds. about 15 minutes later we have the group together and everything preped. i asked is everyone rdy? just about to hit the button with the ranger dropped. i msged him why did he drop we are leaving now. he said "you are a noob." "you want me to bring favorable winds but we only have 1 ranger and you just wasted 15 minutes of my life."

now i only play when henches and guildies. since i wouldn't want to waste 15 minutes of someone's life planning.

Um... to be honest, I wouldn't know. Teamwork was out the window for the majority of people when the game first went live. Then I got bored for a couple months. Came back 2 months ago. Joined a PUG. First one told me to get out coz I wasn't doing only the bonus (uh... hello? I was party leader, advertising for MISSION and you tell me to get out of my own group... yeah) so now I won't PUG. I'm sure there are plenty of random people out there who aren't yutz'.

I for one however, am sticking to guildies, boyfriend and other people online that I knew before GW. I mainly play with the other online friends; we do a lot of skill prep and even choose our chars based on what someone else in the group is doing.

simple answer = yes
scary answer = yes

go figure.......

Majority of PvE is so easy that you don't need teamwork, so once you encounter parts where some cooperation is actually needed, lots of people fail to do so. Miserably. THK is prime example. It's extremely easy with henchmen, yet you will lose again and again with real people.

Sigh... the story of my online gaming.

Oh well, I generally use henchies b/c they care about more than just themselves. It's kinda sad that AI seems to be smarter than other players. It's funny, but even I understand that you need your meat sheild, healer, and some other combination of status infecting as well as status enhancing players. (or you can have a nuker and a ranger... depending on the situation)

Either way, it is my opinion that only a noob would fail to plan.

Just out of curiousity why would you tell a ranger to bring FW on an infusion run? Only to drop the spirit and run out of its range? If it got used at all, seems like you guys would be to busy running.

If you have to strat for PvE than you're doing something wrong. PvE is very easy.

NOt entirely. There are parts in PvE where you need strat. Not only is it difficult when you're at lower levels, but you should also use Strat b'c every time a player dies, they get a negative against them.

With Henchies, PvE is much easier (in most cases). Some henchies just don't work with N (i'm finding)

just because he said run didnt mean he ment to "run" to the location. I say hey lets get a Uw or a FoW run together. means were goign there and gonan go through it, not necessarily run through it.

and for a fiend master, favorable is godlike as they are technically rangers.

Its called death penalty and no, you dont need to strat for pve if you know how to play guild wars. Before the faction update when I would grind UW for skill points I would wait till America has the favor, get 7 other people who dont think pets are good, and play underworld. Its not that hard.

if your talking about that... does FW even effect fiends? the description says "arrows" move faster... blah... blah...

nvm though... the ranger was even more stupid, there is no reason to even mention it.

but i did...
oops

Some parts may be easy, but after acension you need some strategy, even with experienced players. If you dont take the time and say who your attacking or make some sort of plan, you'll die. And Death penalty in a group should not occur often, Personally i think your a fool but when you beat FoW doing solo, give me a call, ill say sorry.

Making a solo farmer does not make you good at guild wars. But when I lose to pve, ill give you a call. If you want a challenge try pvp'ing against good teams.

EDIT - and no, winning tombs does not qualify as beating good teams. GvG please.

EDIT - Sure the first time you play end game pve you may have to think a little but after that it should be very easy, simply because pve does not change, its the same thing every time.

we also did mission. infusion run is only half of the mission.

in pve, i hate dealing with random pugs...*gags*. my monk is stuck in thunderhead to this day simply because no one listens, and runs off to attack everything. i cant heal you when you are all running around like chickens with their heads cut off...sheesh. i think im pretty much going to have to wait for my small guild to get large enough so i dont have to deal with random people ever again...

LOL, well I agree with your solo farming statement. Sorry my guild doesnt participate in GvG, we do more tombs/HoH. Ive beaten the game twice, and yes it does not change but it does change, unless you play the same type of character in PvE all the time..?

Unless we do something, this will continue, then there will be a vicious cycle of hate-hate relationships..and the Guild Wars I once loved will disappear, forever. =/

answer = true
scary answer = True

Go figure, is right, Mistress =/

--The Shim

I only GvG.

I stopped pve'ing after the faction update (I had one warrior and deleted him a few weeks ago =[ ), and I rarely tomb. When I pug Ill get some friends together, someone will use a sigil and make a smurf guild.

EDIT - Ian Boyd FTW
http://www.guild-hall.net/forum/showthread.php?t=32128

Speaking of PvE...

PUGs very rarely are teamwork oriented. I gave up on PUGs. I play with my guildies & friends. If they aren't on I either grab hench or dont play. It's true that there are good PUGs but generally it is not worth the risk to play with a PUG.

I hate PUG groups. I only ever do missions / quests with Guildies, friends or henchies now because you'll be sat asking for a group and someone will just start spouting random abuse at you, because of your profession or something. The amount of immature little boys out there is appaling... it makes me want to move to WoW where the majority of them can't afford the monthly fee :/

On a happier note:

Guildies FTW!

-Adam

You took the words out of my mouth!

Once you find a nice guild with a balance on pvp and pve then you're good to go!

I like my guild!
Just give me call

seriously, THK is an easy mission, and everyone is just afraid of it.

you get into crap PUGs?
go smiter and take henchies! it's not that tough, trust me.
i have 3 characters in fire ring missions, one has comlpleted the game, and yes, i only used henchies in THK.

and im not that good

For the record, favourable winds does not affect fiends since they don't use bows.

Rico

No, teamwork isn't a thing of the past. It maybe rare, but it still exists.

Just this past weekend I had an excellent PUG. We made the run from Ventari's Refuge to Aurora Glade. We had one warrior, and he dropped, so we had to pick up a another one. As I was group leader, I made sure the warrior knew that we were doing mission and bonus.

We probably spent 10-15 minutes planning out the end of the mission and the bonus. Who would be doing what, and what skills were being brought. It was probably one of the best and smoothest missions I have ever done. Two mesmers, two monks, a Necromancer, and Warrior. An unusual grouping, but those often times seem to be the best.

If you want to plan out missions, get your own PUG together, and if someone doesn't listen, kick them. It may take a little longer to get a group together, but you eventually will get a group who values teamwork too.

ya it does affect fiends attacks. at max lvl they do around 25-30 dmg avg with favorable they do around 40+ dmg.

those who say "pve dont need teamwork..." they're the exact kind of people you dont need on a team/pug.

Even on the easy missions where you CAN get by with rubbish/no teamwork... its a lot more enjoyable and faster if you do have good teamwork. And yes, some missions ARE hard enough that without decent teamwork, you're screwed. The game is about fun, PvE especially so (since theres no real competition), and there is no fun in your 8 members all doing their own separate thing and barely talking. There IS fun in watching all your chars meld together and kick serious behind

ya just go kill some hydras in the ember light camp with a crappy PUG.

thier infinite energy + glyph of renewal + meteor shower will rip you apart fast.

Some PUGs are better then others. If you don't like a PUG leave and try again with a new one, or in some peoples cases don't try again. I played through the game with PUGs and found most work out if you have some sort of "teamwork".

I understand what you are saying but are you sure you are telling them in a tolerant manner? I can deal with people not listening, that's to be expected. What I can't stand is a guy who won't shut up about what we should be doing. There is only one leader in the group.

Please don't feel that way! There are still a lot of good players out there, I am meeting them all the time, and when I do we put each other on our friends list. And then we have a great time in the following weeks playing together. So I hope people like you will still give it a go at finding good human players that are not only in your guild!

To remember is that many GW players are very young these days. And with the youth today comes the immaturity that is reflected in their online behavior. The other day we had a really good group in FOW, including 3 very well and nice playing warriors (something that seems rare). I was playing monk. At one point one of the warriors died doing some sort of book trick where we were supposed to heal only him, and his immediate comment was something like "the monks aren't good enough". Rage flashed through my head, I was looking for that non-existant kick button. But after we cooled down and talked a bit, I found out the guy was only 14!

That's one of the benefits of working nights and playing during the day time. Most of the snot nosed little brats are in school or hanging out at the mall. Playing in the evenings is terribly distasteful because of all the immature punks.

THK is only difficult at times because of idgets. It often is easier to do it with henchies. Same with pretty much any other part of the PVE portion of the game. Back in the day Altheas Ashes was pretty challenging, but they carebeared it. The only moderately challenging thing in PVE right now is DNK, but if you get smart players who understand what needs to be done (corpse disposal being a top priority) you won't have too hard of a time with it.

Things of the past: Manners, Common Sense, Corsets, and Teamwork.

Free MMO=The preteen crowd (There I didn't say 12 year olds)=Asshats.

Oh.. if only all people were as smart as you seem to be. I still take the time to go over what we're doing at thunderhead, just to make sure people are prepared, and I will get the monks to sort out what they're doing, and the necros if we have more than 1.. hell.. I'll go as far as getting mesmers to sort out what they're doing too.

Yup, I'm one of the ones who've beaten all the missions with two chars, one of them being a mesmer, so well used to henchies too. I still need to plan ahead, and prefer to take the right skills.

Maybe, I just don't have the kind of memory that you think everyone has though, I can't remember the mission a month after the last time I did it. Hell, I still get lost on a regular basis and end up in strange places I didn't really want to end up in.

However, the best fun I have is playing in a group where we at least know our jobs, and there is a bit of conversation going rather than a lot of placing blame.

To be honest, I try to tailor my skills to be a team player. Mostly area effects and stuff to weaken enemies for the meat shields. What normally ends up happenning is I have my skills open and when I ask their area of specialty, they run out into the field so I can't equip. It's not like I'm telling them they HAVE TO play a certain way, but I do recommend a style of play by making "suggestions". I also listen to what they have and tailor my skill set based on this. After receiving Well of Blood, I shifted my points from Death to Blood so I can heal the party. I'm finding Bone Horrors to be less useful (for the time being). I also make sure to take whatever skills I can to empower my team.

At the moment, I usually team up with N/Me (me is a Me/Mo) for PvE and we do talk about some strategy and take time to prepare - picking skills that complements one anothers. We tend to suggest skills to consider taking, rather than tell/demand one another what skills to take. We know our own character's profession/setup better. Also, agreeing to allow each other to have the final say on our build helps as we're not setting off with any tension between us. If things do go badly then we know to listen to the suggestions next time.

Apart from preparing skills, when we encounter a group of foes we also spend a little time to prepare for combat. For example, (atm this really relates to charrs as we're just doing the Piken Square quests)

1. Identify what we are up against: bows, melee or spellcasters;
2. Identify if there are any patrols nearby, if yes then will they jump us from behind?
3. Decide whether to steam in to attack them all or use hit-and-run tactics and try to split the group;
4. Do we focus on one foe and take it down together quickly, or take separate foes. Whichever, we always call our target(s).
5. Specify the kill zone, where will we try and stand our ground;
6. Specify a fallback area. If the battle goes badly and one of us have to retreat, then this will be the place to go to heal up and recover energy. This way neither of us will run off too far and leave the other up sh!t creek. And if the other decides to retreat shortly after, then we'll be at the same place with a new kill zone.

During combat we're always communicating, giving the status of our target, our own status, calling new target and so on. Even with a prepared plan, it certainly helps if we know what one another is doing during combat.

This might seem abit OTT to some people, but hey, still new to the game. For a N/Me and Me/Mo partnership we ain't doing too bad. We may not have the prefect or even great builds, (still experimenting and trying things out - it's part of the fun and adventure. ) and having some sort of game plan certainly helped in combat - we both know what we're doing and what is expected of us.

Also, I do find the pre-combat planning enjoyable, it helps take away the mentality of just storming mindlessly into every mob you come up against, and pointing and clicking away mindlessly.

if you arent in a team oriented guild you probably just started playing or youre not a team player yourself. youll be picking up similar individuals most likely.

I understand now. You didn't say mission at first so I assumed it wasn't done, because I've always done the run seperate with out mission and it is a foot race. As a matter of fact I got a new pair of gloves for my beastmastery rune to infuse myself.

sadly this is true teamwork is gettting slim, but there are good pugs out there you just have to have faith . As for the quote above when u meet people like that your better off without them. let them go annoy someone else, while u get what u were going for. I bet he prob didnt get a group for a while anyway