why do more people PvE than PvP??

I'd like to expand on this.

I'm not bashing PvP, just giving another reason as a pure PvE player;
in PvP, getting slaughtered and made fun of doesn't exactly fill that accomplishment cup. People (or pros, that is) always say "Oh, you learn from getting killed!" I think this is so untrue, and I just wanted to get that out.
Also, It feels as though there is very limited PvP missions to do, like 5 or 6 or something. but there are like 50 (all 3 campaigns) missions and... too many quests to count you can do on PvE.

Losing is never fun. Why would you expect it to be any different in PvP?

PvE has an easier learning curve than PvP does. It takes zero skill to make a character and join a group in PvE. PvP on the other hand is not the easiest thing to get into. Alot of people think "I want to PvP so ill go to HA", well that just doesn't work really. It is tough to get into groups for higher level PvP if your not experienced and if you don't have the skills to run the builds you will need.

In PvE you can pretty much throw some skills on your bar and most times nobody will even ask you to ping your bar. It is extremely easy to jump on the web and grab a build and just go use it. For PvP you can still go grab the build but it takes more knowledge on how to use it. Generally to be into higher level PvP takes the support of an experienced guild that is willing to take in new players and help them learn. Without a guild to back you up and help out it is a slow and tough grind to gain the experience and knowledge needed to be effective. PvE is just easier and you dont have to deal with the extreme amount of bad mannered players that just come with the competitive nature of PvP.

PvP winning feels kinda stale. You win, and then... that's it. PvE winning it feels like you're doing something, helping that one dude out and whatnot. There's a story to PvE, which helps you relate to things and makes what you do feel worthwhile.

I personally don't have any trouble with grinding, inventory clutter, or such things. Grinding never was a problem, I always had more than enough points for whatever i needed. I guess I'm just more organized than you cause my inventory is ordered, and I have no problem finding what I need. I know my friend has a crazy inventory though, but he really isn't that smart so... (no offense if you read this... but you admitted it yourself so...)

Of course, you learn from getting killed, but only if you pay attention to how you got killed and think what you can do about it before hitting "enter mission" again. Also, not everyone makes fun of new players. I, personally, don't... (However, I do trashtalk shitty gimmick builds religiously) Sure in 10 seconds before you're kicked out you can't really comment on the fight, but if somebody is interested enough to PM me and ask why I think that IW is a bad skill, for example, I'll gladly explain.

PvP is created by players. PvE is created by anet. Yes, the PvP "missions" are fairly limited in number, but there are a lot more possibilities per mission than in PvE, where you're going through programmed content and it will always turn out to be the same way.

I play PvE because...
1) It's fun.
2) My wife hates PvP of all kinds in all games, including GW. Since I play GW with my wife, that pretty much eliminates PvP as an option.
3) Not specific to GW, but just in general, for PvP, I prefer shooters over RPG's. It just doesn't feel right to me if I don't have to aim.

The only thing about this is that in HA you need to get in to a PuG group that is no different than one on in a coop mission unless you are Ranked but no big deal and Ra well that is all random.
When it does come to PvE in a coop mission you can't just through some build together anf hope it works and a lot of players want you to pig your nowadays.PvE does require skill and the more you have the easier it gets.

As stated many times, you have some serious gamers in PvP. However, the.. er, disposition that is displayed there isn't as bad as has been exaggerated. However, I will say that 75% of the time people are rude when they beat you or just ignore your "gg's".

Maybe this is just coming from being a monk... Shucks I tell you! ><

I will also agree that PvE is so much easier. You can be a great player in PvE and die in a snap in PvP. Also, it's so much more complex. PvP is where you actually have to pay attention to builds and complimenting each other in parties whereas in PvE it's just "LF tank" "nuker" or whatever.

I like playing PvP but it gets to the point where its really just 'blah...'

original poster---

hmmm the thread is getting off topic (with my help ), I responded with a defence on pvp because in this thread, almost 6/10 of the people that respond give complaints about PvP, and i was adressing those ppl. 2/10 (which you were adressing) are like "ppl pve b/c they sux at pvp" , and i won't lie, that thats the prevalent feeling about in the arenas.

But the other 2/10 respond with what the topic is about: whats so great about pve that a HUGE majority of ppl prefer it to pve. From the posts flaming pvp... i just retrieved that they pve b/c they apparantly hate pvp . But from those who addressed the topic, i obtained that people pve because they like to play open ended quests that rewards some tangible reward. They also like to be able to log on and achieve something, unlike pvp where you can go on losing streaks and burn a lot of time.

(note that faction drives many pvpers along, as you can obtain any skill, at any time, and it gives you the freedom to expirament with several classes and builds easily... and elites are insanely more attainable)

how did my response to your saying that you're not able to brush off 'abuse' from a kid online go to skill balance?? i must have misunderstood you then, thought you were talking about getting upset because someone said something to you

and if you're still harping on about skill balance priorities, you're clueless because there have been plenty of logical explanations on the forums

I think more people play PvE more than PvP because there's a lower barrier to entry. You can just pick up the game, make a RP character, and start killing stuff and progressing. For PvP, you need to unlock skills, find other people to play with, keep up with the metagame, etc.

Personally, I bought the game for the PvP, but had to go through PvE to unlock skills and upgrades (prior to Balthazar Faction). Then I decided that I wanted to make my PvE chars PvP-ready so that I could just jump back and forth between PvE and PvP without too much hassle (and show off high-end PvE armor in PvP, of course). So that's pretty much why I PvE now...to progress my characters to the point where eventually I feel comfortable using them in PvP...and, of course, to obtain more loot to support armor, weapon, rune/insignia, and skill purchases. It's a good way to unwind when there's no GvG going on or HA groups forming, and there's something satisfying about beating a top-100 guild while wielding an IDS.

And I suppose I am probably one of the 6/10 complaining about PvP. Though you were not one of the ones I was referring too in the part you quoted. Nor do I particularly mean my complaints as flames - in my younger days I would have been in there with them also and had quite a bit of fun.

There is some of that, however the number one reason why *I* do not PvP is the general attitude of PvP'rs that I ran into. 80-90% were quite - didn't hear anything from them and if I did it was short and polite. 1% or so were "nice" - that is actively going out of their way to be helpful. The rest seemed to spend as much time as possible trying to be, well, something not nice. It was a high enough percentage that one could not do that without running into them all the time and they were *vocal*. In order to get into areas and the part of the game where that didn't occur took time I do not have to devote to the game.

Again, not a flame and 100% on topic. In my opinion it is one of the main reasons why PvE is more popular. There are other contributing factors, but I still think that if this were not true then PvP would have a much larger following - in fact if you look at arenas that are popular they are places where you can, to a large extent, ignore and not deal with those people. I look at it this way - the other reasons need to be in combination - rewards, open endedness, etc haven't stopped other PvP games from being popular, the server community kills or maintains it. Those are more reasons why people like PvE than reasons why they do not PvP - if those same people liked both they would play both, the two ends aren't really in competition where you have to choose one over the other.

Note, this isn't things like dancing on my corpse, flexing, or other such things. As I said, you can read through this thread and see the exact attitudes I am talking of. As you stated, you get them in PvE too, just I can safely get away from them and still play the game.

And this is the only thing that keeps me grinding some away in PvP - however once I found out about playing the "training" PvP stuff against the AI to get faction I haven't looked back. I even enjoy goofing with the Zaishen areas and wish it had WAY more builds to play against and it was just as hard as playing against real humans (this isn't going to happen, I do not think that AI can even get close to that point). Personally I would also like to see a "one against many" always up arena where it is just a free for all kill-fest (effectively a PK town/district on the battle isles).

Yet there is massive discrimination about it. Which is the most funny part of it all. It's no wonder why most PvE'rs just purely do that, I understand there is sometimes a negative attitude towards that as well, but the insults aren't as direct or offensive.

HAHA, I love it, great idea. Have a [Records] person and time how long each person can be standing. That'd be hysterical to do, I'd have a blast in that.

Which brings me to my point.

Soloing.

(Okay, it wasn't a close link but here we go anyways)

Another huge reason that I PvP is that I can solo, and solo EFFECTIVELY. I've gotten the Protector title twice (Cantha and Elona, and halfway through Tyria at the moment) and I've done most of it with either henchmen or one friend and the rest henchmen. With the new introduction of Heroes, almost every single completion has been with the same friend (and his heroes) or solo with henchmen to fill in.

Is it sorta "lame" that people can solo and duo through PvE stuff? Does it take "no skill" because our Heroes can take the place of humans (which, by the way, I don't feel is true...skilled and runed up properly, they can do a much better job than many people, it just takes skill and observation from the user)? I don't particularly feel so. My Heroes don't whine or scream at me, they don't complain, and I know that they have the skills, gear, and experience they need to help me through the missions. Extra emphasis on the "don't whine or scream at me" part.

Now, I may be biased because I haven't really gotten into the high-end PvP stuff yet. I'm one of those people who want to "finish" my character. On my to-do list? Protector of Elona, seeing what these "Hard Mode" things are all about, Tri-Grandmaster-Cartographer, and the Elite Skill Hunter title. I'm not in a Top 100 guild; hell, my guild only has two people in it (myself and a friend).

That, however, doesn't mean that I'm an idiot. And a lot of people think it does.

I've worked my tail off to become good at being a Ritualist. I like my character, and I don't particularly care to play a different one. For one, I dislike that PvP folks will require people to play classes they don't like, simply to stay in the group. Let me play my Ritualist or leave me be; I have 90 unused skill points (over 1.5mil exp, I can't keep up with the money), I can buy or capture whatever skill you feel (BELIEVE. IT MUST BE SO.) that I should be bringing along.

I feel that in part, the narrow-mindedness of many people in the PvP community plays a very large part in the alienation of "PvE People". If things aren't flawless, if a character isn't as efficient as humanly possible, they're terrible and should never PvP again. Only certain skills should be used. Only certain builds work. Only certain weapons should be used. And if you're not? Either learn to use them, farm the faction to get them, or "go crying to your PvE momma".

Now, I think that a big part of that actually comes from the PvP system ITSELF. Many of the problems are created by the system. The fact that a select tier of people have gotten so skilled leaves very little room for error, and increasingly people are HAVING to require perfection from their players just to make it through. And even if they have perfection, oftentimes that isn't even enough! There has to be a loser! This I feel just leads to frustration and anger, and it's so often pinned on that tiny flaw or imperfection. And most often, in TA or the arenas that "noobs" can feel somewhat safe in, it's pinned directly on said "noobs". And that turns a lot of people away.

Am I saying that perfection is a bad thing? Absolutely not. It's required, I understand this. To a certain extent, it's also required in the upper-tiers of PvE as well. It's downright difficult to get some of those missions done (thank you, DoA!). Do some of us PvE players research skills to find out what is most efficient? Do some of us take the time to "practice" our skills (mostly by just doing PvE...same as you PvP folk, although we solo ours)? Do some of us scrounge up the cash for the best equipment that we need? The answer is yes to all of them.

PvP and PvE both have their areas for eletism. However, in PvE, it's easily escapable, simply because we can solo many of the "easier" things. There are rarely any "easy" moments in PvP (even in the RA, it's hard to keep those horrible builds alive), and once again, that leads to frustration and anger which in turn is pushed onto the new folks...who in turn go off to solo and end up liking the lack of pressure.

Do I wish that I was more into PvP? At times, yes. I'm sure when I start pressing on those Grandmaster Cartographer titles, there will be NUMEROUS times when I'll ask myself if there could be more fun things that I could be doing. However, a few things are blocking me from doing so (I feel). I'm not in a big PvP guild. I don't have very much experience with other classes; I can handle myself, but I truly shine playing a Ritualist. I have Vent, but hate using it because talking to my computer depresses me (old, bad memories of other elitist games). But you know what? Those things can ALL be cancelled out by PvE. I can play the class I want, I can solo or duo just about everything, and I can blast my music as loud as I want in the background. The only thing that bums me out sometimes is not being in a guild with more experienced people. I would love bouncing ideas off the guild and trying some new things; as such, I can do that with my friend, but it always helps to have more friends to arge with, y'know? No regrets though, 'cause there's no pressure to do anything.

So there's my two bucks (I wrote way more than two cents, c'mon) on the whole thing. Thanks to those who read it all. To those who didn't, I'll try to summarize.

PvP demands perfection. When things screw up, people blame the cause. That cause is normally newer people. Who in turn turn to that which does not blame them: PvE.

(apologies for spelling errors)

My favorite quote on the topic is "I'd pvp more, if it weren't for the pvp'ers".

Ditto x1000!

Well, I play both PvE and PvP, just depends on what I want to go for, but most of the time I'm PvEing. Keep in mind this is a MMORPG, hence majority of PvEers.

Yes an RPG not an MMORPG anymore.

I've never really thought about rewards too much as I do not think we will ever see it. There would need to be some type of balance in that a melee-kill heavy build would be roughly as desirable as a pure healer and I'm not sure how to do that without teams. GW is, at it's heart, a team based game and really shines there. I just have quite a bit of fun as a pure solo-farmer and I would like to see a PvP equivalent.

I just know I would spend quite a bit of time there playing around if done remotely decent (and I generally have faith that they could do it so). Though much more than what is said so far belongs in the Sanitarium them hijacking this thread.

While I'm purely PvP nowadays I still remember the good ol' days back when I did that PvE thing, had morals, dignity and common courtesy. PuGs were a happy place. PvE had flowery meadows and rainbow skies and rivers made of chocolate, where the PuGs danced and laughed and played with gumdrop smiles.

Ahh, the good ol' days

Guild Wars, despite the name, is to me a rpg. I never understood the emphasis placed on pvp in this game (I've never played Counterstrike or any of the card games). If I want to play a real strategic fighting, competitive game that doesn't require half of my life sitting in front of a pc, I'ld go play a RTS game (any of the Age of...series game).

I've enjoyed the rpg, pve element of this game and rate it as probably one of the best rpg games. I've dabbled in pvp, but I find it dull, repetitive, thin, restrictive, time consuming, etc..etc... all things that I do not enjoy doing. The only reason I do it now is to unlock skills for my heroes.

Anyone who finds pve easy or doesn't require skills, try uppping the challenge. Do missions with just three of your heroes, or clear FOW or UW with them. You'll find that with a small party, EVERY single skill you or your heroes use can make a difference. I've been having a terrific time just "perfecting" my heroes, testing, doing FOW/UW/Tombs run with them. I also like not being called a noob when some of the skills didn't work out so well and the party got wiped out by a couple of aatxes.

Well, my heroes rarely call me a noob.

rarely? so they do sometimes?

Has anyone else noticed Koss drawing penises? or is that just me?

He told me they were "canons"

Koss does /point /laugh on you if you die ... sometimes.

Master of Whispers shakes his head at you as if your useless...

One "legitimate" reason I don't like PvP is because I don't like having to kill another player in what I consider to be a pretty formal setting. Don't ask me why...but Aspenwood is different...it's like a "PvE version of PvP"...sort of hard to explain - maybe it's because there are plenty of NPCs around as well. Plus in Aspenwood I generally go for a pure annoyance build. Just slow-down hexes, interrupts and minion stealing . I did try a little PvP a while back and the whole formality of it really puts me off. My brother was begging me to have a Guild Battle against him the other day and I just wont. Only exception I'll make is if he wanted to test out a certain build...so in the name of build testing I'll let him *try* and kill me...

Also, Elites in PvE are easy to get. Granted, the only stumblig block is you have to work you way across the map to where the boss is located and if there are locked gates this means following the storyline.

Guild Wars ss an RPG is mediocre at best.

After playing organised PvP in a good guild for a few months you will see Guild Wars completely differently. Nowadays i can't even spend more than 20 minutes doing PvE. To me it seems so mindless. Killing AI drone after drone ad infinitum. And for what?

Personally I prefer getting my guild in the top 50 and having our name flash up on the favour announcements.

Each to their own.

edit:

and to 'crime.mob'... Say what?! Elites and skills in general are so easy to obtain in pvp it's not even funny. Just from casually playing HA I was UAX within a few months...

And not all of us play just for the grind. I play because I enjoy the competitivness. I enjoy the adrenaline rush from close matches and I enjoy the fame (both Hero fame and the fame from winning halls xD).

Not with me.. he smiles and starts casting raise flesh golem.

I play PVE mostly because I like to create and develop a character. It is fun.
Plus my friends are fun to group with and exploring the beautiful environments is fun too.
I'm not really playing the game to fight people or show off in any way.

For loot... mostly...
For loot, for experience, and for the satisfaction of being able to take down large groups of enemies (of higher level than one's self) without dying. The satisfaction of showing them who the boss really is... in a totally isolated invironment away from the rankings tables which are there to remind 98% of the population that they're the underdogs.
And in counterpoint... I can't spend more than 20 minutes doing PvP.... It seems wholly mindless.... killing random people with stupid names ad infinitum... dying... being resurrected... watching them be resurrected... blah blah blah... rinse and repeat... Nothing gained and time wasted. Thats just my outlook. PvE is different because there is more to gain there... the chance of particularly special loot... of something to change the game around, an axis for a new build... and a whole different way of killing the enemies. And its not the same tactics twice, as there are plenty of areas with entirely different enemies... things that can be predicted ahead of time and effectively prepared for (and thus those preparations tested). It gives a sense of actually existing in the world... rather than just being a sporting event.

Exactly. To each their own.
If I wanted to get my name on a scoreboard, I'd play the Challenge Missions more often.

ahh, but Olias loves enchanting me with Death Nova or Jagged Bones... thats confidence from your heroes!

Wow, teach my Olias to hack too!

plz?

its no. 1 on his skill bar, he spams it like a mofo

[skill]Jagged Bones[/skill]

<.<

yeah, its broken, you can enchant enemies and allies with it, thats why its popular in GVG at the moment

You just have to be Undead. You didn't choose that race upon character creation?

I was always in the middle and liked both PvE & PvP equally. The hardcore PvErs in my old guild had a really hard time with the PvP concept. We tried GvG a few times, but they always took it too hard when they died, and they almost always used their PvE characters to compete. Most of them just didnt have the competitive nature for PvP. I can only speak for myself, but I experienced over time that the value of my PvE characters grew less and less as I played more PvP because my PvE characters limited my ability to PvP quickly with optimum stats & skills. Unless of course you've invested enough time in PvE to gain enough money to pimp out your toons to make them ready to compete in PvP. Its doable, but not practical.

In short:
PvE = non-competitive gamer
PvP = competitive gamer

It really doesn't take much skill to beat computer AI.

It can take a heap of skill to compete successfully against other good gamers in PvP. The only problem is it can breed an unhealthy elitist attitude in alot of hardcore competitive PvPrs.

There, I fixed it for you to reflect what you really wanted to say.